Whose newspaper is this?

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 12:56 AM By charlio
Administrative prowess isn’t the only criterion of Episcopal ability. (Nevertheless, Chiesa Espress Online says in “At the Helm of the Barque of Peter, in the Storm”, “Benedict XVI is criticized for weakness of leadership. But it isn’t so. All of the great conflicts of this pontificate have emerged from his executive decisions. Strong and unconventional.”) My Diocesan Ordinary is resolute & powerful; yet even after presenting to him, (through proper channels), evidence of new age articles in the Diocesan paper, the long-standing editor remains in place.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 4:42 AM By Life Lady
It appears that people were willing to support religious but as noted there was no mention of what issues caused the Vatican to seek reform. But we all seem to understand that the secular media will not truly represent the facts surrounding this issue. Once again, prayer seems to be the only answer. We are dealing with the enemy of the Church. Pray for those sisters in error.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 5:21 AM By JMJ
The blind leading the blind. Those red shoes (that bled during the rain storm) was GIVEN to the Pope and how many of those, what-used-to-be “nuns” wear black shoes nowadays. It is all about OBEDIENCE and in the case of these poor excuse of nuns: LACK OF OBEDIENCE!! Our Holy Father has helped to feed far more of the poor than all of those confused ‘nuns’ have in done in their entire lives collectively. How many people have been led into hell because of their misguided actions as they support birth-control, abortions, homosexual activities? Why are these ‘nuns’ so ashamed of being know as Catholics? All of us will have to face Jesus one of these days, face to face, and, sadly, for many, it won’t be a happy occasion. +JMJ+

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 5:57 AM By St. Christopher
If this is truly from the Diocesan newspaper, then the bishop should personally write an apology and state the Vatican position. He should also warn the staff that they must reflect the Vatican position in its reporting, and that the Pope must be respected, not mocked. (It is likely, in any event, that Catholic staff on such things are probably not very Catholic in their beliefs.)

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 6:08 AM By Robert Lockwood
Just as predicted in scripture that the forces of evil will overcome good and we are seeing our social society disintegrate and now our religious society follows. Unfortlunately for us and our children we can only pray as our leadership is failing us. Just try and find a parish where there is more than one Mass celebrated where where the celebrant speaks english understandably, the celebration is holy, the music director hasn’t taken over the liturgy, and the homily teaches a valuable lesson.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 6:59 AM By max
strange thatt when our u.s. seminaries were being investigated by the vatican, there were no rallies with signns proclaiming “we are all seminarians.” when something goes wrong (for instance, seminaries not enforcing celbicay enough or teaching true doctrine; for instance, the LCWR taking positions that clash with church teaching), OF COURSE the vatican is going to intervene! this is why the legionaries of christ are being remodelled; this why the sspx guys got themselves excommunicated; this is why romancatholicwomenpriets were excommunicated when they ‘ordained’ females. we’re a hierarchical church, not some nilly-willy collection of loons doing and teaching whatever seems convenient at the moment.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 7:23 AM By Francis
Thank you, CCD for bringing this story to our attention! I am pleased to see that in the several decades since I lived in Oakland, decades of increasingly escalated political positioning and vitriol that passes in our country for “discourse,” the Voice hasn’t lost its voice of integrity. It reports what is real, what matters to the diocese without twisting facts into what anyone thinks they *should* be. No integrity, no credibility, and what’s the point of printing a paper nobody believes? The FACT is that most of Oakland loves and supports the Sisters during a difficult time. This is about gratitude and support, not obedience or disobedience. The diocese (read: those in the Chancery Office and those in the pews) already knows what the Vatican position is. “Whose paper is this?” you ask. It is the paper of the Roman Cathodic Diocese of Oakland, a diocese of people who look and act different and yet hold fast to their common Catholic faith. Across Lake Merritt stands my old home parish of Our Lady of Lourdes, where many of my former neighbors participated peacefully in Occupy Oakland. A few miles more to the East stands St. Margaret Mary’s Church, celebrating the Extraordinary Form of the Mass every day, where altar servers are still “Altar Boys.” You ought to visit Oakland sometime, and check out the variety of parishes. It really is possible to get along with people and even worship God with people who aren’t all identical to us.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 7:29 AM By grampsc
Why do Wacko events in the Bay Area continue to be reported? Leftist tendencies of the church on both sides of SF bay are more than obvious, we get it, kumbaya etc., please get on with some real news.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 7:45 AM By lisag
There are many stories about kind and caring Sisters. That’s not the problem. Sisters and nuns are supposed to work with the poor, sick and dying. The problem is when as an organization they support women priests, abortion, and new age practices. A problem arises when their organizations support Obama care that clearly will pay for abortion, contraception and euthanasia (end of life counseling). There is a problem when government monies and programs become the main goal for Catholic hospital organizations run by a Sister, who cherished the pen Obama signed the bill with. The funny thing is that all of these troubling anti Christian ideas are parroted by many priest orders and leaders. When will their reigning in occur?

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 7:57 AM By Ed
Check out the Oakland Cathedral bookstore and you will see it is stocked with dissenters books,

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 8:53 AM By Canisius
Francis you from such a tolerant and diverse world, one where all things are equal and there is no such thing as sin (except homophobia of course) It must be wonderful place to live where all problems of the world are solved with warm hugs and smiles. Where the most evil thing to occur is judgment,,, and where the rainbow flag proudly waves in the air,,, God in Heaven please bring down your wrath and cleanse this corrupt culture of liberalism and “progressive attitudes”… Francis you would not have last 2 minutes in my world and I have complete contempt for yours

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 9:13 AM By JLS
I always like the part where people say, “I’m grateful”, or “I’m thankful” and where they never provide the object of their gratitude: Because they do not believe in God; they are extolling their emotional state, self worship.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 9:18 AM By JLS
Why do bloggers continue to spell “reign” when they mean “rein”? “Reign” refers to rulers; “rein” refers to horses. One “reins” in a horse, by applying pressure to the reins attached to the bridle of the horse; a ruler “reigns” by applying pressure to brides of his or her reign. Is it clear now? Remember that writing and speaking are two different, although related, acts. Where spelling and grammar reign in writing, yet in speaking one must rein in one’s tongue.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 9:21 AM By JLS
Francis, a brief history and culture and religion lesson for you here: Many loved Ghandi, Mohammed, Buddha, Michael Jackson, Elvis, Barabbas, Nero, Mao, Mae West. So, the wisdom and charity of your point that the heretical nuns are well loved is ???

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 9:24 AM By JLS
max, the SSPX is not excommunicated.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 9:26 AM By JLS
I see the issue as charlio expresses it (note my apologetic tone here?).

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 9:32 AM By FrMichael
Oakland: the stopped-up septic tank of the Catholic Church in NorCal. All garbage flows to it and then backs up.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 9:46 AM By Nick
Among the protestors with signs personally insulting Bishop Cordileone were Fr. Brian Joyce of Christ the King-Pleasant Hill and Fr. George Crespin. There were many “Religious” Sisters and feminists present. About half way into the demonstration, Sister Rose Marie Hennessy (Mission San Jose Domincan Superior and former Superintendant of Schools) arrived with another Sister to applause. While I moved about the crowd, I was able to speak with many nice people who have been clearly manipulated. So sad. There were many holding old pre V2 photos of habited Sisters. Like the newletter of most of these Congregation, it seems the only reference point they have or can make relevant to people comes from what they USED to be.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 9:57 AM By goodcause
Our nuns are by and large pretty good souls who care deeply about the laity. There are going to be a few radicals here and there but making sweeping generalizations that all nuns are ultra liberals that need “correction” from Rome is unfair. If many nuns are in favor of birth control, they have joined the 80% of US Catholics who support birth control, too. A majority of US Catholics also support some type of accomdation in civil society for homosexuals. In much of this, the nuns are simply reflecting the laity’s changing positions on these issues.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 9:58 AM By Thomas Edward Miles
The guy has a point with regard to the red papal shoes, however, they are NOT. Prada, they were hand made in Northern Italy by a local cobbler as a gift to the, Holy Father, he received two sets. Cardinal Burke, eat your heart out!!!

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 10:32 AM By cheryl
Great! Support the sisters who have done so many good things; support the Church who thanks the sisters for their efforts. Those 2 things are not polarizing – thanking and supporting the sisters who have supported us in hard times. It goes both ways. The other issue with the Vatican will sort itself out without unnecessary, angry busybodies venting their venom about something that they can do nothing about and which has nothing to do with them. Save the anger for something important. Unless…being angry gives identity instead of love. The Church needs fewer judgmental Pharisees and more supporting, forgiving, loving followers of Christ.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 10:50 AM By Laurette Elsberry
It was just a few months ago, September, 2011, when the Catholic Voice published a review of radical pro-homosexual priest Fr. James Schexnayder’s book, “Setting the Table: Preparing Catholic Parishes to Welcome Lesbian, Gay, Bi-sexual and Transgender People and their Families”. This “how-to” book on how to homosexualize Catholic parishes, had even been “reviewed” by Bishop Cordileone. The book was an outrage to Catholicism and should never have been published. Yet, the Catholic Voice promoted it and now continues to promote radicalism and apostasy in the Church. Now I notice that in the June 8 edition of Catholic San Francisco there is a column by pro-homosexual Fr. John Catoir decrying, in effect, the Catholic Church’s stand on “gay” marriage. Wouldn’t it be heartening if “Catholic” publications had to prove that they were Catholic?

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 11:14 AM By Warren Memlib
Jim O’Donnell’s sister died in August 1981 and is buried in the sisters’ section of Holy Sepulchre Cemetery in Hayward, California. Her grave marker has both her religious and secular names (“Sister Anthony Edward” and “Sister Betty Anne”). Thus, his picture of her in habit dates from 1981 or (more likely) before.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 11:22 AM By k
I have heard of these protests going on in other cities, too. I am very disappointed in this response. I would love to have someone at the Vatican study my parish or diocese or even my own self and correct what had been misunderstood or teach the truth where false teaching had entered. Talk about refusing to see gift God offers.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 1:28 PM By Kenneth M. Fisher
Could anyone recognize any Religious in the above picture unless they had a name tag on that stated “Sr.”? God bless, yours in Their Hearts, Kenneth M. Fisher

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 1:36 PM By Kenneth M. Fisher
6:08 AM By Robert Lockwood, Re.: “Just try and find a parish where there is more than one Mass celebrated where where the celebrant speaks english understandably, the celebration is holy, the music director hasn’t taken over the liturgy, and the homily teaches a valuable lesson.”, I have little problem with foreign priests who struggle to have us understand them when they give great homilies. As for the other above comments are concerned, you can find good liturgical music, and great homilies at practically any Traditional parish! The homily by our resident Conv. Franciscan priest at Our Lady Help of Christians for the 12:30 Mass was outstanding God bless, yours in Their Hearts, Kenneth M. Fisher

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 1:39 PM By JLS
Not to worry, k, soon an ambassador from the Vatican will be appearing to study you. You will recognize her by the large bold capital “S” (for sister) on the knit sweater, and the cape and special shoes (white tenny runners). Make sure you prepare a small hole in the ground next to your front door where the broomstick can be parked.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 1:44 PM By JLS
To the contrary, cheryl; the Church needs bishops who will act like true fathers and keep the sisters from gabbling their silly heretical heads off, lose their institutionalized vanity, and get real.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 1:47 PM By JLS
Nick is right; the sisters used to be something, and now they are not anything.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 2:49 PM By Mike Arata
Catholic Voice associate editor and staff writer Michele Jurich didn’t bother to mention findings of the Vatican’s (CDF’s) Doctrinal Assessment of the Leadership Conference of Women Religious, including: •”…Sr. Laurie Brink’s address about some Religious ‘moving beyond the Church’ or even beyond Jesus” [2007 LCWR Assembly]. •”…letters the CDF received from “Leadership Teams” of various Congregations, among them LCWR Officers, protesting the Holy See’s actions regarding the question of women’s ordination and of a correct pastoral approach to ministry to homosexual persons, e.g. letters about New Ways Ministry’s conferences. The terms of the letters suggest [disagreement] with the Church’s teaching on human sexuality.” •”…a prevalence of certain radical feminist themes incompatible with the Catholic faith in some of the programs and presentations sponsored by the LCWR, including theological interpretations that risk distorting faith in Jesus and his loving Father who sent his Son for the salvation of the world.” •LCWR’s silence on the right to life from conception to natural death…. •”Some speakers claim that dissent… is justified as an exercise of the prophetic office.” They support “divergence between the Church’s magisterium and a ‘legitimate’ theological intuition of some of the faithful.” •LCWR’s “Systems Thinking Handbook presents a situation in which sisters differ over whether the Eucharist should be at the center of a special community celebration since the celebration of Mass requires an ordained priest, something which some sisters find ‘objectionable.’” This outlook reflects “differences at the level of belief, but also in different cognitive models (the ‘Western mind’ as opposed to an ‘Organic mental model’).”

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 3:18 PM By Dennis
I would expect nothing less from the Oakland Cathedral.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 4:43 PM By JLS
Listening to heavily accented priests couldn’t be as difficult as what those priests go through to learn English. Pray for the gift of understanding “tongues” so that you can more easily understand the accented sermons.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 4:46 PM By Elizabeth
The current ‘sisters’ such as these…..are NOT your childhood sisters!!!

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 4:49 PM By Francis
Canisius: I’ve noticed that your contempt seems to go beyond the world (you think) I live in, and extends to me and others like me as well. I wonder whether you think your contempt will smooth your entry into heaven when that time comes? I also wonder what your world is like, and why I’d be dead in 2 minutes there. Your hostility suggests that your world isn’t a very pleasant place to live. I hope that isn’t the case, but if it is, I agree with you that my world is God’s boundless gift, and by comparison all the more “a wonderful place to live.” If it is so hostile, why you continue to live in your world?

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 5:32 PM By k
Nick, thanks for the post. Good to hear from someone there.

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 7:25 PM By MacDonald
I’ve already heard that the last two Bishops of Oakland were very “orthodox” (not “Orthodox” as in Russian or Greek, naturally) and VERY strict, yet odd stuff keeps coming from the other side of the bay…must be the water of the San Francisco Bay. Or the proximity of Berkeley!!!

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 7:45 PM By JLS
Dennis, what is the Oakland Cathedral?

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 8:54 PM By Bud 
I wonder at what point in their “holy” vocations did it occur to some sisters that a male and ordained priest is required for saying a Mass? Maybe it’s a post menopausal syndrome? The few pictures touted here and there of “women” priests celebrating a mass is still rather comical in my mind. If they believe that their “ordinations” were valid etc. what’s their problem? Start their own little church or join up with the myriad of others one of which has a pope right here in the US. No problem with being gay and same sex marriage, gay ordinations to any level of clergy at these churches. The “seminary” training is very short to get them onto the path of sanctity!

Posted Monday, June 18, 2012 9:04 PM By Bud 
Just like the “Radical Gay Agenda” that has caught on everywhere, all known statistics in the US and the latest one from the UK can’t come up with more than 1.5% or so as their countries. Up to 70% of gays have no interest in marriage realizing and being honest about their own proclivities don’t want to bother getting legally entangled and have to bother with kids. What’s left? Start with the richest of the bunch the misnomered “Human Rights Campaign” and probably Transgenders. Worse is that we should be thinking of the majority of the thousands of nuns that feel trapped but not agreeing with the “New Age Nuns”

Posted Tuesday, June 19, 2012 4:25 AM By Rick DeLano
Dear Bishop Cordileone: It is demoralizing in the extreme for us to witness you allowing heretics and schismatics to control your diocesan newspaper without a word from you. Please- we need to know that our bishops are emerging from the terrible period of cowardice and compromise with the heretics. This period is already, by far, the worst dereliction of Catholic bishops since the Arian apostasy. It is time to take action, Your Excellency.

Posted Tuesday, June 19, 2012 5:39 AM By Canisius
Francis, yes my contempt for the evil that seeps from modern liberals will smooth my way to heaven, how? by exposing the lies of liberals and modernism. My world was filled with violence and warfare but, it lead me to the Truth of Christ, your world on the other hand seems to think that those who live in this ” I’m ok you ok” live and let live, tolerance and non-judgmental nonsense is going to get you into heaven. Yes my world is hostile and I love, love the fight, I love attacking liberals verbally and if necessary physically, tearing down your rainbow flags from various parishes, exposing the lies of liberalism..to be its better than love..The time is soon coming where you will be called to choose between Christ (the Divine Judge, will you tell him he is being too judgmental) and this world where His Church and His Truth is attacked by people like you with your sugar coated lies…..Rex Christi

Posted Tuesday, June 19, 2012 7:10 AM By JLS
The devil is busy taking every complaint and organizing the complainers. If only people would complain to God instead of to the devil!

Posted Tuesday, June 19, 2012 10:03 AM By Ronnie
Goodcause wrties: “If many nuns are in favor of birth control, they have joined the 80% of US Catholics who support birth control, too. A majority of US Catholics also support some type of accomdation in civil society for homosexuals. In much of this, the nuns are simply reflecting the laity’s changing positions on these issues”…..If a majority of US Catholics believed in say, killing 1 year olds, shouls the Church reflect these changing positions also? The Church’s moral teachings cannot change with the times, not matter how many US Catholics are confused.

Posted Tuesday, June 19, 2012 10:14 AM By k
JLS, or we should listen to God’s complaints.

Posted Tuesday, June 19, 2012 10:42 AM By k
Canisius, exposing the lies of liberals and modernism is indeed a worthy goal. Rather than immorality, it seems to be amorality that you are speaking of. Are you mad at the fence-sitters? Those who do nothing when they see evil? Are you mad that no one helped you when you were being abused? Is it because your mother permitted her lebian lover to hurt you and did not protect you?

Posted Tuesday, June 19, 2012 1:22 PM By k
goodcause, nuns are laity and, like all the laity, they are supposed to reflect God’s position.

Posted Wednesday, June 20, 2012 12:00 PM By Francis
Canisius: Non-judgmental nonsense is a concise summary of the Sermon on the Mount, and a theme which repeats in all four Gospels, isnt it? I very much agree that many liberals lack the personal integrity it takes to appreciate our own sinful nature and still practice tolerance — All too often what passes for tolerance is really denial of serious wrong-doing. Like you, Id rather stand before Christ in integrity than denial. But that isnt what the story in the Voice is about. People came out not to do wrong but to express their love and support of the nuns at a difficult time for them. The story is not about a leader with a megaphone, but about a crowd of Catholics who heard and responded. Not about false tolerance but about genuine love for the Sisters. Not about anybodys political agenda list but about support and standing together. I dont know what forms violence and warfare took in your world, but I do know that God will not hand either one of us a serpent if we ask for a fish, nor a scorpion if we ask for an egg. If you truly love the fight and physical violence, if youd rather tear down flags than build up the Kingdom, what are you asking God for, the fish or the serpent?

Posted Wednesday, June 20, 2012 1:04 PM By Canisius
K, the editors did not print my response so will try again. I have enough anger in me to circle the globe twice, and yes I am angry at the lesbians, but more so with the so called members of my family who say I should forgive and forget, usually the loudmouthed female members. This is then followed by outburst of rage with objects thrown around the room. I cannot give what has not been asked for and I doubt I will after 30 years…Let God forgive them I quite happy with my anger….I will take my chances

Posted Wednesday, June 20, 2012 2:47 PM By Pat Hyde
It was refreshing to read the June 11th article in the Oakland Catholic Voice,a fair and honest reporting of the prayer vigil supporting Catholic Sisters. I attended the prayer vigil and at no time did Father George Crespen or Father Brian Joyce carry signs dennigrating Bishop Cordileone or the Pope. All present recognized the contributions of the Sisters through all the years. and pray they can continue their good work in the future.

Posted Wednesday, June 20, 2012 6:45 PM By Kenneth M. Fisher
4:25 AM By Rick DeLano, Good letter. Have you sent it to Bishop Cordileone? If not, why not? I’ve listed his E-Mail addresses several times on this forum. God bless, yours in Their Hearts, Kenneth M. Fisher

Posted Wednesday, June 20, 2012 8:33 PM By JLS
Francis, your theology is not Catholic. Our nature is not sinful; but is fallen. Catholicism is not Calvinism. Why don’t you declare which religion you subscribe to?

Posted Wednesday, June 20, 2012 8:40 PM By max
ANGER, whenn held onto like a beloved spouse, is toxicc for the soul. i pray for those who have hurt me, and try to move on. i hope those of you who have been deeply hurt by jerks can do the same…otherwise, it can drive us nuts. “Colossians 3:8, 12-13 But now you must put them all away: anger, wrath, malice, slander, and obscene talk from your mouth. Put on then, as God’s chosen ones, holy and beloved, compassionate hearts, kindness, humility, meekness, and patience, bearing with one another and, if one has a complaint against another, forgiving each other; as the Lord has forgiven you, so you also must forgive.” it’s not easy, i know, i know, but i’ll keep trying till my dying day, even those who ruined my childhood…it’s so much BETTER than the alternative…

Posted Wednesday, June 20, 2012 9:18 PM By Janek
Take a look at all the “silver” hair, these “nuns” are from the old guard, 60’s radicals, leftists, who long ago kicked their holy habits to the curb. They have little time left on this earth, pay no attention to them and pray for our Traditional sisters such as the Nashville Dominicans, Mother Angelicas good sisters all in full habits and loyal to Rome and Holy Mother the Church. They have waiting lists just to enter, with the average age in the mid 20’s.

Posted Wednesday, June 20, 2012 9:54 PM By k
Canisius, you have one sister that is good to you, right?

Posted Thursday, June 21, 2012 12:11 AM By Catherine
Rome knows how bad it is. They are waiting for the laity to speak up. Thank you Rick DeLano!

Posted Thursday, June 21, 2012 6:00 AM By Bob One
FrMichael, your comments about the Church of Oakland is beyond extreme. This diocese, with 80+ parishes, lots of schools and a large number of members is devoted to “To know Christ better and make Him better known.” The educated people in the faith, they teach children, they care for the poor, the sick and the marginalized. It is not a septic tank. I have to assume that you are not a priest of the Catholic church, because not even the most jaded priest would speak as you do. The priest in the Church of Oakland are, for the most part, very dedicated servants of the Lord who are aging and are overworked. Few are attracted to the priestly vocation today because they don’t want to put up with people no good in anything or believe that no good dead should go unpunished.

Posted Thursday, June 21, 2012 9:53 AM By k
Christine Haider-Winnet, who appears to be the organizer, says that she listed the event on the Nun Justice Project website. From that website: “Nun Justice Project is supported by the American Catholic Council, Association for the Rights of Catholics in the Church, Call to Action, Catholics for Choice, CORPUS, Dignity USA, FutureChurch, New Ways Ministry, Quixote Center, RAPPORT (Renewing a Priestly People, Ordination Reconsidered Today), Voice of the Faithful, WATER Women’s Alliance for Theology, Ethics and Ritual, and the Women’s Ordination Conference.

Posted Thursday, June 21, 2012 10:43 AM By Canisius
max contrary to your prattle my anger has made me strong than I ever was. It is not poison as modernist would claim, anger has become my powerful ally, more than love ever was. It offends liberals too, what more can I ask for… K yes my fraternal twin is probably one few females on the planet that I can trust…

Posted Thursday, June 21, 2012 10:46 AM By JLS
Bob One, when are you going to realize that your blogs are all pipe dreams, all theoretical, no reality? If the Church were as holy as you claim, then why has the Pope called the bishops to become holy? If they are already holy, then there would be no need to request it of them. When the bishops are not holy, that is when we find rampant sodomy, abortion, 1.0374 child families, and immanent loss of religious freedom … say, isn’t that what we are seeing now in the west and in America especially? But not to worry, just take a feel good pill prescribed by a Catholic doctor and your pipe dream will be ok, right, Bob One?

Posted Thursday, June 21, 2012 12:29 PM By Francis
JLS: I don’t understand the context of your 8:33PM comment. Did I write something about sinful nature? Your apparent connection between the Sermon on the Mount and Calvisism utterly baffles me. It would help a lot if, when you critique, you make it explicit what you’re critiquing.

Posted Thursday, June 21, 2012 5:22 PM By Marcum
These dissenters are neo Protestant heretics.

Posted Thursday, June 21, 2012 11:36 PM By k
Canisius, I am glad that you have your twin sister. I think, humanly, it is not possible to love and forgive things like that and it is done by divine grace. I struggled so long trying to be the good Catholic who love and forgave and, in hindsight, it just let the person get away with it and she went on to abuse others. A relative of the abusive person told me that she thought the things she said and did were cute. Abusive females usually deny that what they do is abusive and justify it by citing some characteristic of the victim as deserving of the abuse. There is a holy and justifiable anger. But there is also sinful anger. Keep praying.

Posted Friday, June 22, 2012 7:11 AM By Francis
JLS, regarding your 10:46AM comment and your comments directed at me: Neither of your comments make sense. My comment has nothing to do with Calvinism, and your comment to Bob One is a classic straw-man argument — it answers a statement he never made about holiness with your own misunderstanding of the pope’s encouragement to the US Bishops. All the while completely missing the point of either of our comments. Bob objects to “Fr” Michael’s unacceptable calumny of 9:32 — are you defending slander against the City and Diocese of Oakland? Are you saying his statement that Oakland is not a septic tank is “theoretical”? Your “all pipe dreams, all theoretical, no reality” comment would be best applied to your own statements, not Bob’s or mine.

Posted Friday, June 22, 2012 9:53 AM By Canisius
Francis, in response to your questions I would much rather tear down rainbow flags, attack the gay mafia and liberals in general. I am not asking anything from God except his Holy Wrath. I pray for the day when Our Blessed Mother finally releases her Holy Son’s arm and His Wrath is unleashed, on that day you and rest of tolerance crowd will finally get it. All of those rainbow flags, and endless droning on about tolerance and diversity got you nowhere in eyes of Our Divine Savior. I am sinner and have sinned more than anyone here could know, but you know what I admit them and I called it a lifestyle choice or complained “i am born this way”. I never tried to sanctify sin which is exactly what you liberals do, you don’t like Truth so you change to fit your life, when you should be doing the exact opposite..Rex Christi

Posted Friday, June 22, 2012 12:22 PM By Kenneth M. Fisher
k, 1:22 PM, Please explain your statement above that Nuns are laity. Nuns are Women Religious, and as far as I know, they are not laity! God bless, yours in Their Hearts, Kenneth M. Fisher

Posted Friday, June 22, 2012 1:20 PM By JLS
Francis, my comments are carrot like. If you do not get it, do not worry your silly head about it; instead you’d be best off focused on your short circuit board designs.

Posted Friday, June 22, 2012 1:28 PM By JLS
Francis, the problem is not when you get your coffee break; the problem is more than one million abortions per year in this nation and the institutionalizing of sodomy, oppressive political measures, not to mention the growth of bizarre behavior such as cannibalism. This is the consequence of bishops who have rejected or forgotten that their primary reason for being is to be holy. If the bishops are not holy, then the society will die. Thus, excommunication by the act of free will in choosing the path of unholiness instead of holiness.

Posted Friday, June 22, 2012 1:33 PM By JLS
It is hard to slander the cities of Oakland, San Francisco, and their environs by connecting them with sodomy.

Posted Friday, June 22, 2012 1:36 PM By max
KENNETH, in the church there are two sorts of peoople: the ORDAINED, and the LAITY. ordained people are deacons, priests a bishops; lay people are everyone else.

Posted Friday, June 22, 2012 1:39 PM By max
LAY versus ORDAINED: “Whereas the word faithful is opposed to infidel, unbaptized, one outside the pale of Christian society, the word laity is opposed to clergy.” from NEW ADVENT

Posted Friday, June 22, 2012 1:40 PM By k
Mr. Fisher, The definition of laity is all members of a religion that are not the clergy. The clergy are the priests, deacons, bishops. Nuns are laity. Brothers are laity. We do refer to them as religious and Catholics do set them apart in a separate category. But definitionally, all who are not ordained clergy are laity.

Posted Friday, June 22, 2012 1:41 PM By max
“Lay ministry is an option for those who are unable to be ordained or who do not feel called to ordination.” YALE DIVINITY SCHOOL

Posted Friday, June 22, 2012 1:48 PM By max
“When we turn to the canonical legislation of the Church we find little that is new in the introductory canons that deal with membership in the Church. Both the 1917 Code of Canon Law and the 1983 code state that by divine institution the clergy are distinct from the laity and that both clerics and lay persons may be Religious.” (Toward a Definition of ‘Laity’ by Jordan Aumann, O.P.)

Posted Friday, June 22, 2012 1:50 PM By Francis
Kenneth: All the nuns I know refer to themselves as laity. According to the Catholic Encyclopedia entry, laity means “The body of the faithful, outside of the ranks of the clergy.” Any Catholic who has not received the sacrament of Holy Orders is a lay Catholic. Based on your other posts, I’m SURE you didn’t intend to imply that the sisters ought to receive Holy Orders!