Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 4:52 AM By OSCAR
Catholics’ votes should not be up for grabs. The failure of many US Cardinals and Bishops to openly address the mortal sins of SCANDAL, HERESY and SCHISM have lead to the current state of relativism and secularism in the USA. There is nothing in the Bible or the CCC that says we should be ‘nice guys’ and ‘well liked’ but that we should love our neighbors meaning that we want everyone to get to Heaven which includes admonishing sinners as needed. In addition many US Cardinals and Bishops have not actively promoted the reading of the “CATECHISM of the CATHOLIC CHURCH, Second Edition” for Priests, other religious, and the Laity. When people do not accurately know what the Church requires of each of us due to lousy catechesis, anything goes. Please see: “Worthiness to Receive Holy Communion, General Principles” by Cardinal Ratzinger on the internet. It is the resposnsibility of the Diocese Bishops to insure that organizations calling themselves “Catholic” within their Diocese are truly Catholic and adhere to the teachings of the Church. Is there any wonder why there is so much confusion in the Church in the USA ? ? ?
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 5:28 AM By JMJ
Progressive ‘catholics’? Canon 915 should be taught to Card. Wuerl and for him to start using it. It is sad when I hear from some Bishops and Priests that the voters won’t go to hell for deliberating voting for those that are going against the teachings of the Church, of which, came from God. I am not talking about all of those times that we don’t have a real choice in the matter as we will try to vote for the one that will do the least damage as Blessed Pope John Paul II has told us. I know that someone like Romney isn’t someone to cheer about, or here in Mass., we have Scott Brown against Warren; a lose-lose situation for our state and the U.S.. Lord have mercy on us even though we don’t deserve it. +JMJ+
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 6:40 AM By Robert Lockwood
No thinking Catholic would EVER vote for Mr. Obama. He and his administration are against every Catholic principle as well as every principle of the founding of our country.
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 8:12 AM By Bud
Instead of worrying about taxes and exemptions, our bishops must come up with a way also to advertise the truth the the 50% that are Catholics and warning of the pigs in politics like Pelosi, Biden, Sibelius and a myriad of others that the church treats with “kid” gloves and have excommunicated themselves more than a decade already. . If not, O’bama in all of his desceit and lies and ego will win the socialistic rule that must eliminate the Catholic and fundamentalist religions. Protestantism for the most part are just too ambivalent to bother!
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 8:23 AM By Cody in Tucson
The article states “The Roman Catholic Church doesn’t exactly let political operatives walk in the front door and set up shop”. Well yes it does. They are called Cardinals, Bishops, Clergy, Jesuits, Nuns …….. !
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 8:53 AM By MD
We as Catholics have to really work hard to educate our brother and sister Catholics on how to vote. Given the fact that most Catholics don’t regularly attend Sunday Mass, this I believe is a duty and obligation of the lay. Given all the avenues of social media and email, all of us should heed the call and send educational material to everyone we know and encourage them to do the same. A good source is the Priests For Life website that has a wonderful Voters Guide: Google Priests for Life Voters Guide. The election will be here before we know it and we have to ceaselessly defend life and make life the our primary objective from now until November and hopefully achieve a small victory in our culture war for life. God Love You.
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 9:39 AM By MIKE
The organizations listed in the last paragraph of the article are not progressive but heretical. There is no such thing as Conservative or Liberal/progressive Catholics when it comes to our Faith. There are Catholics, Heretical Catholics, and Schismatic Catholics. Lets address all properly. TRUTH is important. Any politican who supports murder of innocent babies, and legally tries to get the rest of us to do the same through our tax dollars must not even be considered. It is up to each Cardinal and Bishop to stop the heretics and schismatics – Catholics United, Catholics in Alliance, Catholic Democrats in his own Diocese.
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 9:54 AM By Catholic Joe
Broady speaking, there is no Catholic vote. As Bishop Sample said, the New Catechism of 35 years ago was unsubstantial. Dissent is still rampant, unfortunately, among clergy. Citizens are no more informed about politics today than they were 50 years ago. Evangelicals are the only ones who are a category.
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 10:55 AM By mrpkguy
The post by MD that says “Given the fact that most Catholics don’t regularly attend Sunday Mass” ……may I also add, who as well don’t go to confession and do not know the teachings of our Church but continue to call themselves Catholics. Why doesn’t the hierarchy weed these people out of the “count” which we know perhaps strengthens their position, but are a scandal. Isn’t it time we started calling Catholics those who ARE Catholics and not those who continue to CALL themselves Catholics, but aren’t?
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 11:22 AM By Elizabeth
REAL Catholics did not vote for Obama in 2008 and will not do so this year either!!! I pray that a miracle witll occur and we will hear at all Mass’ what a Catholic is to look for when she/he votes!!!
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 12:38 PM By Abeca Christian
It will be the liberal, heretical, lukewarm Catholics, and even the misinformed, who will vote Obama in once again.
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 1:26 PM By k
The link above has a link to a Gallup Poll that separates the views of church going Catholics and nonChurch going Catholics. on the moral acceptablitly of various morally unacceptable behaviors. The percentage of church going Catholics accepting immoral behavior is really high, not as high as the non-Church goers but truly alarming. The immoral behavior that churchgoing Catholics show the lowest acceptance of is abortion with 24% viewing it as morally acceptable. The one exception on the list which is not considered morally unacceptable by the Church is gambling.
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 1:47 PM By MD
mrpkguy-I don’t think we need to weed anyone out of the Church, but educate people and get them back in the pews. The problem is, from not going to Mass regularly, the only examples of faith nominal Catholics have are those in the public eye who espouse their own ideology as Catholic teaching. We need to find a way to reach Catholics in new ways and get them interested in their faith again. God Love You.
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 2:02 PM By Gordon Campbell
These are the lukewarm Catholics AND CLERGY that Christ,“….will vomit from my mouth.“
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 3:26 PM By Kenneth M. Fisher
The USCCB should make Fr. Christopher Heath’s sermon mandatory at all U.S. Parishes. If they did that, Obummer would not have a chance in Hell of re-election. God bless, yours in Their Hearts, Kenneth M. Fisher
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 3:32 PM By Kenneth M. Fisher
I have come to the conclusion that the Devils greatest ongoing victory was the “Protest-Ant Revolution”. Had that not happened, we would all be under One Shepherd, there would not have been a Protestant influence over Vatican II, and Obama would never have happened except maybe in some writers scarry fictitious stories. God bless, yours in Their Hearts, Kenneth M. Fisher
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 4:04 PM By JLS
There is one holy apostolic and catholic church. There is a sodomite catholic church and also an abortional catholic church. The bishops need to separate these out, one from the other.
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 4:56 PM By Abeca Christian
Mr Fisher you may have something there of truth. I am seeing more and more Protestants water down the sin of sodomy for false compassion. God have mercy on us all.
Posted Monday, May 21, 2012 5:16 PM By max
KENNETH the protestants are not the problemm. just watched THE BORGIAS and there was enough catholic corruption going on to fill volumes.
Posted Tuesday, May 22, 2012 6:50 AM By JLS
max, good observation that the problem is not the Protestants. The problem has been identified and addressed by the Pope recently, who has told the bishops to “become holy”.
Posted Tuesday, May 22, 2012 2:36 PM By sam
Why oh why do some ppl persist in blaming the USCCB for the sins of the individuals laity & priests – who persist in their sins? USCCB – are not responsible for the sins of individuals; most individuals including some on this website persist in sin themselves by accusing their brothers/sisters yet fail to realize that in this they themselves are sinning.
Posted Tuesday, May 22, 2012 3:29 PM By Kenneth M. Fisher
max, Do you believe that God always brings about good from evil? Have you ever heard or read of St. Francis of Borgia, the nephew of the errant Pope? Try looking at the positive more often, and you will realize the beauty of our Faith in spite of the many who have failed It, including some Popes! God bless, yours in Their Hearts, Kenneth M. Fisher
Posted Tuesday, May 22, 2012 8:19 PM By JLS
Good point, Kenneth. Catholicism creates individuals, unlike in the non-Catholic community. In another thread Gravey mentions “personality cult”. This sort of cult is a mockery or wannabe type thing that mimics true personality which is developed in individuals through Christ.
Posted Tuesday, May 22, 2012 8:26 PM By JLS
sam, there is a distinction between accusation and turning on the light. Jesus called the devil “the accuser”; whereas, St John called Jesus the Light of the World. Read up on how St Paul instructs the faithful to go about their lives in this world … find out what Church authority consists of. While you’re searching for references, let us know if you find any.
Posted Tuesday, May 22, 2012 8:40 PM By k
In a Gallup poll which measured the moral acceptablility of homosexual relations, 44% of church-going Catholics felt homosexual relations were morally acceptable compared to 21% of church-going non Catholics. 61% of both Catholic and nonCatholic Christians who do not regularly attend church services find homosexual relations morally acceptable. If you follow the link and then click the Gallup poll link in the story, you can see the entire poll.
Posted Tuesday, May 22, 2012 10:02 PM By JLS
k, do you really believe that everyone who receives a Sacrament is a Catholic? What did Jesus say about the weeds scattered in the grain field?
Posted Wednesday, May 23, 2012 11:41 AM By k
JLS, huh? Are you talking about how one can receive the sacrament unworthily?
Posted Wednesday, May 23, 2012 1:26 PM By JLS
k, you should also remove your white skull cap. You are not the authority to define what you are attempting to define. Don’t you know the limits of non-authoritative opinion? Neither you nor any others have bothered to reply to my challenge over your authority in that it takes a bishop to specifically address the situation … and so far none has, to my knowledge.
Posted Wednesday, May 23, 2012 2:07 PM By Dennis
Of all those calling themselves Catholics in the US: 50% don’t know anything about the faith; half of the rest are once or at most, twice a yr Catholics; half of the remaining “attend church at least once a month,” what does that tell you?; and finally the remainder, about 10% know what’s going on, but a majority of those are pick n choose. Need I say more?
Posted Wednesday, May 23, 2012 6:56 PM By k
JLS, what is a white skull cap? Are you talking about the independent chapel thing again? Bishop Brown put bulliten notices in all the Orange parishes saying that OLHC was “not Catholic”. This is according to Christorchaos online.
Posted Wednesday, May 23, 2012 7:00 PM By k
If you are talking about the OLHC situation, I posted it on “Mixed Message” 5/16 1:35 pm.
Posted Thursday, May 24, 2012 3:39 PM By JLS
Well, finally, k, someone has posted an address by a bishop. Do you have his text? AFter all, how many on this site have explained that once a Catholic always a Catholic? Also, what about the Catholic theology that even separated Christian sects are Catholic, since they are baptised and because there is only one catholic church? So, let’s look at the Bishop’s words carefully, shall we?
Posted Thursday, May 24, 2012 6:03 PM By k
JLS, apparently this was in 2006. I have not found a copy of the bulliten announcement. Maybe Mr. Fisher has one. Max called the diocese of Orange and talked with them about it. Internet research is always problematic. The interviews with OLHC priests are 8 years old. One of the persons who recruited the younger preist appears to be a sedevacantist now. All comments online which question the validity of the pastor’s ordination seem to come from sedevacantists who do not accept the ordination of the Bishop who ordained him because it was done in the new rite. As far as I can tell, the sacraments of Baptism and Holy Eucharist are valid so yes, the people are Catholic. Remember how we discussed that people here share the Catholic Faith, but they disagree on their other beliefs. I do not wish to put old quotes from the pastor or priests on this website. It would not be fair to them. The types of beliefs that are discussed in the old interviews would cause people to distrust or fear the Catholic Church.
Posted Friday, May 25, 2012 11:28 AM By k
JLS, when you write that there is a Catholic theology that even separated Christian sects are Catholic, since they are baptised and because there is only one catholic church, I do not know what you are trying to say. It seems like the Protestant idea of an “invisible church.”
Posted Friday, May 25, 2012 1:25 PM By JLS
k, if baptism did not count, then what good is it? If there is only one Church, then why would it not include all those baptized? Understand that there are individual Protestants and there are Protestant theologies, and that these two things are not the same. There are Catholics who are baptised but have not rec’d any of the other sacraments … would you say that these are not Catholic?
Posted Friday, May 25, 2012 1:33 PM By JLS
So, k, you confess that the sacrament of the Holy Eucharist at OLHC is valid. It is the Eucharist that unites man with God, not the bishop; although without the bishop, there would be no Eucharist. That is why an administratively separate priest or bishop does not perpetuate his sacrament of Holy Orders and such organization comes to a sacramental end. Also, St Paul points out that receiving the Eucharist can bring condemnation on some souls. That is what is happening to such public grave and great sinners such as Biden, Pelosi, etc. This is not the case with OLHC, unless some bishop has condemned it in some way. The hearsay you posted about what Bp Brown said may or may not be true; it is his responsibility to make it known.