The following comes from an Oct. 9 story on LifeSiteNews.com.
In an exclusive interview with LifeSiteNews, Cardinal Raymond Burke has responded to a controversial presentation by an Australian couple before 191 of the Catholic Church’s leading bishops and cardinals at the ongoing Extraordinary Synod on the Family this week.
During their intervention, which has turned out to be one of the most widely reported interventions at the Synod, the Priolas asked and answered a question about what parents should do in the case where their son wants to bring his homosexual partner to a Christmas dinner where their grandchildren will be present.
The Pirolas’ response, which they held up as a model for the manner in which the Catholic Church should deal with same-sex relationships, was that parents should accept the participation of the son and his homosexual partner knowing “their grandchildren would see them welcome the son and his partner into the family.”
Westminster Cardinal Vincent Nichols revealed afterwards that some Synod fathers responded to the short intervention by the couple “very warmly, with applause.”
Speaking to LifeSiteNews on a short break from the Synod yesterday, Cardinal Burke, the Prefect of the Vatican’s Apostolic Signitura, called the Pirolas’ question a ‘delicate’ question that needs to be addressed in a “calm, serene, reasonable and faith-filled manner.”
“If homosexual relations are intrinsically disordered, which indeed they are — reason teaches us that and also our faith — then, what would it mean to grandchildren to have present at a family gathering a family member who is living [in] a disordered relationship with another person?” asked the cardinal.
Burke added, “we don’t want our children” to get the “impression” that sexual relationships outside God’s plan are alright, “by seeming to condone gravely sinful acts on the part of a family member.”
“We wouldn’t, if it were another kind of relationship — something that was profoundly disordered and harmful — we wouldn’t expose our children to that relationship, to the direct experience of it. And neither should we do it in the context of a family member who not only suffers from same-sex attraction, but who has chosen to live out that attraction, to act upon it, committing acts which are always and everywhere wrong, evil.”
He added, however, that “families have to find a way to stay close to a child in this situation — to a son or grandson, or whatever it may be — in order to try to draw the person away from a relationship which is disordered.”
Cardinal Burke’s concerns were shared by Voice of the Family, a coalition of 15 major pro-life and pro-family groups from every continent, who called the Pirolas intevention “damaging.”
“The unqualified welcome of homosexual couples into family and parish environments in fact damages everybody, by serving to normalise the disorder of homosexuality,” said Voice of the Family spokesman Maria Madise in a press release.
In an interview with Aleteia, Father Paul Check, the head of Courage, the Catholic group that works to assist those with same-sex attraction to live chaste lives, responded to the question, noting, “We can never be more pastoral than Jesus.”
He added, “To welcome people into the Church, into our homes, into conversation … to ‘accept them’ in an authentic Christ-like way would never call for a compromise of the truth.” An example of that comprise he said, would be to “say to someone in some form, ‘Well, that’s the best you can do.’”
To read the full interview, click here.
Thank you Cardinal Burke for your witness to the faith. Loving people does not mean affirming them in sin. Thank God, Thank you dear God, that my parents loved me no matter what, even when it meant they could not affirm me in my sins. It is their witness that brought me back to the faith. I had doomed myself to hell but for their strength and love which loved me but didn’t accept my sins. Blessed be The Lord, the God of Israel for he has come to His people and set them free. May I, by God’s holy will, persevere.
Cardinal Burke is absolutely right, and he will be persecuted for it. So will you if you dare to publicly disagree with secular morality. Christmas is a religious holiday, the birth of our Lord and Savior, don’t discount that fact by fretting over whether sinful relationships should be welcomed at the dinner table. What good is personal morality if you refuse to publicly proclaim it? Be strong Church Militant!
This is a contentious issue sure to spark a lively exchange. The Pirolas also said “he is our son,” which, although they got it backwards, is precisely the point. It is precisely because he is your son and you love him that you must not appear to condone something that is harmful to him. If he were sticking a pencil in his ear, would you condone that, too, because, after all, “he is our son”? Unconditional love is a two-way street. If the son loved his parents unconditionally, would he oblige them to contradict their religious beliefs to the point of scandalizing innocent children? Cardinal Burke is, as usual, correct. Without Truth, there is no charity. To be “more pastoral than Jesus” is false mercy. Father Paul Check understands that. Would that more did!
SYNOD info –
Confused, Contradictory Chaos in Rome 10-13
https://www.churchmilitant.tv/daily/?today=2014-10-13
Gloria.tv
https://www.gloria.tv/media/NrmPc5Am4Qv
UNOFFICIAL Translation
https://press.vatican.va/content/salastampa/en/bollettino/pubblico/2014/10/13/0751/03037.html
ROME, 13 October 2014: An international coalition of pro-family groups has rejected the mid-way report of the Extraordinary Synod on the Family, calling it “a betrayal”.
Voice of the Family responded to the report (relatio post disceptationem), published this morning and presented by Cardinal Péter Erdő (See “Synod on Family: Midterm report presented, 2015 Synod announced“, Vatican Radio, 13 October) The report has been welcomed ecstatically by liberal Catholic commentators.
https://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2014/10/pro-life-and-pro-family-group-synod.html#more
SYNOD correctly being called SinNod.
“SinNod Interim Report Soft-Pedals Mortal Sin To The Eternal Detriment Of The Sinners”
https://restore-dc-catholicism.blogspot.com/2014/10/sinnod-interim-report-soft-pedals.html
” CALL to DENOUNCE the SYNOD ”
” Today, the first official document of the Extraordinary Synod on the Family was released. Suffice it to say that the document doesn’t even bother in the least to present Catholic teaching on the family. The whole document is an exercise in modernist tactics of doctrinal ambiguity and persuasion by means of unsettling that which is settled. But the most sinister passages depart clearly from the Catholic Faith. First, the document opens the door explicitly to holy communion for those who are publicly living in objectively adulterous unions:
46. In the same way the situation of the divorced who have remarried demands a careful discernment and an accompaniment full of respect, avoiding any language or behavior that might make them feel discriminated against. For the Christian community looking after them is not a weakening of its faith and its testimony to the indissolubility of marriage, but rather it expresses precisely its charity in its caring.
47. As regards the possibility of partaking of the sacraments of Penance and the Eucharist, some argued in favor of the present regulations because of their theological foundation, others were in favor of a greater opening on very precise conditions when dealing with situations that cannot be resolved without creating new injustices and suffering. For some, partaking of the sacraments might occur were it preceded by a penitential path – under the responsibility of the diocesan bishop – and with a clear undertaking in favor of the children.
CCC: ” 675 Before Christ’s second coming the Church must pass through a final trial that will shake the faith of many believers.
The persecution that accompanies her pilgrimage on earth will unveil the “mystery of iniquity” in the form of a religious deception offering men an apparent solution to their problems at the price of apostasy from the truth.
The supreme religious deception is that of the Antichrist, a pseudo-messianism by which man glorifies himself in place of God and of his Messiah come in the flesh. ”
Lk 21:12; Jn 15:19-20
2 Thess 2:4-12; 1 Thess 5:2-3; 2 Jn 7:1; 1 Jn 2:18, 22
I agree with Cardinal Burke! Something that people of today need to face– is mature thinking and action, even causing strong discord, by quietly and firmly stating Christ’s Truth! Tell your son that you love him, and always will! But gay sex acts, are WRONG!! ESPECIALLY AT CHRISTMAS!! Maybe your son and his gay buddies need to do something else, for Christmas– away from the family! “Please, son, know that we love you– but do not hurt our family, especially the children– at Christmas, the holy day of Christ’s birth!” Then, I would arrange a private meeting, with a meal, and bring along a Bible, Catechism, and some “Courage” resources, and spend a little time with the wayward son, and his gay partner, evangelizing them, and also, extending Christ’s love to them– privately, NOT with the whole family! Just the husband and wife, and the wayward son, and his partner. Sometimes, we have to boldly state the truth and know, there may be a HUGE confrontation– and LIVE WITH IT!! You CANNOT HAVE A FALSE PEACE– by COWARDLY ACCEPTANCE OF A LIE!!
Regarding the “SinNod” interim document –
What is most telling about this document is what it doesn’t say:
nowhere are the faithful warned of the temporal and eternal consequences of sexual sin;
nowhere are homosexuals, adulterers, fornicators, or those who commit other sins against Christian marriage called to repentance and conversion;
nowhere are those in irregular “unions” called to live chastely in order to receive holy communion;
nowhere are the faithful given the hope of being delivered from their sins and living in a state of grace;
nowhere is the salvation of souls included as a priority.
Clearly, the whole thrust of this document is to weaken the Church’s resolve in opposing the forces of modernity in redefining the family, even at the expense of doctrine.
This document must be repudiated
by good Catholics everywhere and at every level,
and this train-wreck of a Synod publicly denounced. ”
Code of Canon Law 212 #3
Under OBLIGATIONS and RIGHTS of ALL the CHRISTIAN FAITHFUL –
” §3. According to the knowledge, competence, and prestige which they possess, they have the right and even at times the duty to manifest to the sacred pastors their opinion on matters which pertain to the good of the Church
and to make their opinion known to the rest of the Christian faithful,
without prejudice to the integrity of faith and morals, with reverence toward their pastors, and attentive to common advantage and the dignity of persons. “
I have no opinion to offer…this is quite over my head. Here are too posts I read today…one written by the president of Catholic lawyers and one in Crisis magazine. My local paper ( and I would suppose all of the rest of yours ) has an article today making it sound like the acceptance of divorced/remarried couples and acceptance of homosexuality is already a done deal. This is just how the heretics absconded with Vat II . Mother Angelica would be seeing red!
https://www.crisismagazine.com/2014/advice-for-the-pope
Reader discretion on this one…
https://www.remnantnewspaper.com/web/index.php/articles/item/1125-the-secret-synod-freak-show-brought-to-you-by-pope-francis
Haha oops. Here are TWO pats!
CCC: ” 675 Before Christ’s second coming the Church must pass through a final trial that will shake the faith of many believers.
The persecution that accompanies her pilgrimage on earth will unveil the “mystery of iniquity” in the form of a religious deception offering men an apparent solution to their problems at the price of apostasy from the truth.
The supreme religious deception is that of the Antichrist,
a pseudo-messianism by which man glorifies himself in place of God and of his Messiah come in the flesh.”
We must pray that we remain faithful throughout these times.
Pro-family Catholics reject Synod mid-way report, calling it ‘a betrayal’
’Patrick Craine, Voice of the Family’s North American spokesperson, said that the report “is not a faithful representation of the Synod discussions. Many Synod fathers have valiantly defended Church teaching inside and outside the Synod hall, yet their position is hardly reflected in the document at all.”
“The report is right to call for pastoral outreach,” said Craine, “but as Cardinal Ratzinger emphasized, outreach can only be done in the truth. As it is, the document undermines true pastoral care and can only do grave damage, in this world and the next, to those it purports to help.”
“It would be a false mercy to give Holy Communion to people who do not repent of mortal sexual sins,” said Voice of the Family coordinator Maria Madise, who said the report undermines Catholic families. “Will Catholic parents be forced to falsely tell their children that mortal sins like the use of contraception, cohabiting with partners, or living homosexual lifestyles have positive attributes?”
“Real mercy consists of offering people a clean conscience via the Sacrament of Confession and thus union with God,” concluded Madise.
https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/pro-family-catholics-reject-synod-mid-way-report-calling-it-a-betrayal
Catholic Bishop: ‘Homosexual Relationships’ Destroy ‘Identity’ of Man and Woman
October 10, 2014 – By Zoey DiMauro
(CNSNews.com) — Archbishop Zbigevs Stankevis, who heads the Catholic archdiocese of Riga, Latvia, and is attending the ongoing Synod on the Family at the Vatican, said foreigners, including the U.S. government, are trying to impose a pro-gay agenda on Latvia and other East European countries…
The archbishop also said that homosexual relationships cannot be condoned because they are unnatural and destroy “the identity of man and the identity of woman.”
In an Oct. 7 interview with LifeSiteNews at the Vatican, Archbishop Stankevis explained how foreign governments were pushing a gay agenda in Latvia, saying foreigners want to “promote it and impose it.”
“Two years ago we had Gay Pride and next year we will have Europride,” in the capital city of Riga, said the archbishop, referring to two different pro-homosexual parades. According to the archbishop, the past parade in Latvia was attended by “foreigners more than Latvians,” including U.S. and other European ambassadors.
Its Christmas, Easter, Thanksgiving or other traditional family gathering time. Your daughter, divorced from the husband who abandoned her, comes to dinner with her new boy friend. Do you let her in? She comes to the door with her new husband, married at city hall. Do you let her in? Your son comes to the door with his new partner with whom he lives. Do you let him in? You son comes to the door with his partner whom he has just married. Do you let him in? Your granddaughter comes to the door with her college room mate. Do you let her in? Your neighbor, who has always celebrated holidays with your family, comes to the door with his new wife of a civil ceremony. Do you let them in? A niece, never married, comes to the gathering with her two year old child. Do you let them in? Being family is not easy. Who would deny their child? Who would deny a member of the family or a neighbor?
We let them in and we are nice to them, of course.
Then we tell our children to pray for them because they are doing something that offends the Lord greatly and they must repent or they will suffer for all eternity. We tell them of the righteous path and tell them never to stray from it.
And then our children commit suicide because their parents can never understand the torment of having their parents believe they offend the Lord greatly and will suffer for eternity, even if they know differently.
We teach them about the mortal sin of suicide as well.
Well isn’t that a lovely thought. I am sure you have consoled many families whos kids ended their own life. You sound like you have a compassionate heart and a warm soul.
Stop blaming parents, YFC. Stop blaming God’s law, YFC.
You state, “…even if they know differently.” From whence does this ‘knowledge’ come?
For whereas you disparage Anonymous for his/her ‘lovely’ thought, that is all you are presenting. A ‘lovely’ thought that ‘they know differently.’
“The Family Acceptance Project™ is a research, intervention, education and policy initiative that works to prevent health and mental health risks for lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender (LGBT) children and youth, including suicide, homelessness and HIV – in the context of their families. We use a research-based, culturally grounded approach to help ethnically, socially and religiously diverse families to support their LGBT children. https://familyproject.sfsu.edu/
Our team has been putting research into practice by developing an evidence-based family model of wellness, prevention and care to strengthen families and promote positive development and healthy futures for LGBT children and youth. We provide training and consultation on our family-based prevention and intervention approach across the U.S. and in other countries.”
Yes, YFC, wellness based on the secular and negating the spiritual. And yet you advertise yourself as your fellow ‘Catholic’ while hammering Michael McDermott for supposedly lying.
Look to yourself, YFC.
Ann Malley, you are making it up that they are negating the spiritual. Admit it, you just won’t accept the fact that there are people who integrate spirituality into best practices about being gay and raising gay kids. This groups says explicitly that it works with religiously diverse families. Are you calling them liars?
I’m calling you bias, YFC, and intent on seeing only what you want to see to the negation of the reality that surrounds you.
YFC, what was that about?
YFC, teens don’t commit suicide because of their parents Catholic beliefs.
Catholics believe that it is a mortal sin to commit suicide (unless the person is mentally ill – not knowing right from wrong).
Those who die in the state of un-repented mortal sin spend their eternity in Hell.
Thou shall not kill – God’s Commandment.
Yes, Pat, teens very much do commit suicide because of their parents beliefs. Please remove your head from the sand.
If what the parents believe is Truth, YFC, then God bless the parents for cleaving to the Truth and attempting, albeit without success, to their poor child.
What you’re asking is for Catholics to take their Faith away from God and His word and His law based on vague assertions that that which He has said is an abomination is not. According to who? Those tempted to do that which they should not.
Please remove your head from your agenda and discern spirits in truth instead of according to your desires.
No, children often commit suicide because of evil that torments them to commit such vile acts such as sodomy. Those who suffer from these proclivities desperately need prayer.
As in Mark 5:5, a man was tormented and cutting himself. Was it because of his parents? No, it was because he was tormented by demons. Those who suffer need to be shown the right and narrow path, not be validated in the sinfulness. That is definitely not mercy.
Clinton, I hope to God your kids are all straight. You have no idea the torment homophobic parents wreak upon their children.
And you understand the torment you inflict on Catholic parents, YFC, but that doesn’t eek one iota of mercy from you. Why? Are you such a strong advocate for all disordered behavior? If not, why not? Or are you selective with your support to promote homosexual sex as normative?
Ann Malley, you have never ever heard me “promote homosexual sex as normative”. What you have heard me do is promote the idea that gay kids should not be kicked out of their own homes and rejected by their parents. I believe it was you, on the other hand, in prior discussions, who advocated for those parents who kick their gay kids to the street.
You make the parents out to be victims. Really? If this is so, then why is it that there is no epidemic of suicide among the parents of gay kids? Why isn’t it parents who seek counseling for help with their kids? Why is it that PFLAG members (https://community.pflag.org/) don’t feel they are victimized by their children, they feel blessed by them?
Why is it that 40% of homeless youth identify as LGBT? They constitution about 2% of all youth, yet their homeless rate is TWENTY times higher than for their straight peers. Who is the victim here?
YFC, what I have heard from you is that you do not uphold the teachings of the Church with regard to the nature of homosexual sexual activity. What I have read is you attempting to use children as a vehicle to shame parents and faithful Catholics into giving up the Faith and endorsing your agenda.
Your fixation on everyone supposedly ganging up on ‘gay’ kids and kicking them to the street is highly selective as you, perhaps purposefully, negate other reason why young adults are inclined to leave home. That may have something to do with your own personal tale of woe, YFC, and woe is never easy. But it doesn’t necessarily land at the foot of parents – for each one of us has been gifted with FREE WILL.
You may wish to negate that reality, but Our Lord does not. So continue to bash the Church, parents, natural law, and whatever target you will, you cannot negate the reality of the Faith to faithful Catholics. Or rewrite the gospel. Really.
And thank you for not calling me ‘dear’ this time. That really hurts. But I prefer it :)
Dear Ann Malley, of course you have no information about why kids “leave” home. You just make things up because they sound good to you.
Just today, I read this account of a parent and how she treated her gay son: https://www.huffingtonpost.com/linda-robertson/a-letter-to-the-just-because-he-breathes-haters_b_5971808.html?utm_hp_ref=gay-voices
I must have angered you, YFC, otherwise you wouldn’t be so kind as to call me dear. But that’s okay. The issue is not about how ‘some woman treated her ‘gay’ son’, YFC. As much as you may wish it were. Husbands treat wives pretty shabbily too. Wives treat husbands with equal disdain and unChristian-like behavior. It does no necessarily correspond that we should ban marriage, or redefine it, or anything else.
I take it that that is your solution to the problems you face – overturn, redefine, negate, dismiss, behaviorally restructure – but that is not acceptable when what you are seeking to overturn is God’s law and the natural order. If it were just me, hey, we could chat. But it isn’t. Until you realize precisely WHO you are challenging in all of your furor, you’re doing nothing but spinning your wheels. For in the end, it’s His call, not yours, not mine, and absolutely not the Huffington Posts.
Like I said before, you should vet those better who are using the YFC post i.d. You are not maintaining the tone of a college professor. Sorry.
“Like I said before, you should vet those better who are using the YFC post i.d. You are not maintaining the tone of a college professor. Sorry.” = Very astute observation! God bless you Ann!
We have a YFC poster who once heartlessly stated that the homeschooling family from Germany had no real constitutional basis to expect protection and remain in the U.S…..This very revealing comment pretty much blew the entire pretend cover of another YFC trying to claim that he cared about the welfare of little children.
The children from Germany were almost sent back to Germany to face being torn away from a loving mother and a father for their Christian beliefs. Then there is the YFC who rationalizes, promotes and encourages homosexual adoption because he says he cares about the welfare of all children (except those Christian children from Germany). So it appears that there is also a huge problem with maintaining a tone of consistency..
“Oh what a tangled web we weave when at first we practice to deceive,”
Prayer for All Humanity.
“Bless us all, 0 Lord, we pray, for loved ones, here and near, and far away. And everyone for whom we pray. Keep us safe each night and day, the homeless who have no place to stay. Those who are suffering in any way. The dying, those mourning or grieving and all who need God’s mercy. Keep us safe, Heavenly Father, when we are at home, or travelling on our way, or when we are vulnerable, or in danger in any way. Most merciful Father, hear us as we pray for the souls in Purgatory, or who may be sent there some day.”
Bob One, do you love those you speak of ?
If so, you want them to get to Heaven. – This must be the top priority.
They (and others present who may be influenced/scandalized by their sinful actions) must be told that you love them, but do not approve of their sinful actions.
You must never condone or confirm or appear to approve of the mortal sins of anyone.
By the way, your post confuses (as most liberals try to do) those who may have repented of their sins with a firm purpose of amendment to sin no more,
with those who choose to continue living in the state of mortal sin.
Mt 10:34-39
Bob One, it is a big responsibility, to teach your kids right from wrong, and also, to stand up for Christ– especially at Christmas! Christmas is NOT A TIME for jolly excuses, for thoughtless, cruel, unrepentant sinning relatives— to all crash into your Christian home, destroy Christmas for the rest of your family and children, and grand-children; “make merry,” get drunk, take dope, “shack up,” do gay sex acts, maybe smoke marijuana at your table, go wild– and WALK ALL OVER YOU!! This is: ABUSE!! What you should do, is: have a serious talk with the “offender(s)” beforehand! Let them know your feelings, and ask for their respect! And pray for them! If a relative seems to be heart-broken, or “suicidal,” maybe you can all sit down together with your priest, and have a talk! Then, you should only have your Christmas privately, with those who are truly KIND and RESPECTFUL to you and the rest of your family, and to Jesus! You and your spouse can privately arrange another time, around Christmas– to visit stubbornly “wayward” relatives!
Bob One, something to contemplate prior to Christmas, Easter, and other ‘holy’ days:
Matthew 16:24-28; Mark 8:34-38; Luke 9:23-27)
“37He that loveth father or mother more than me, is not worthy of me; and he that loveth son or daughter more than me, is not worthy of me. 38And he that taketh not up his cross, and followeth me, is not worthy of me. 39He that findeth his life, shall lose it: and he that shall lose his life for me, shall find it.”
Your proposition to navigate life by way of natural sentiment is misguiding both to you and those who you would ‘welcome’.
John 6: 37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
Ann: Excellent response to Bob One’s post!! If you truly, supposedly, and unconditionally love someone you care about that person’s soul too.
Thanks, RR.
This avalanche of sentimentality to get away from the Gospel is nauseating. As if parents back in the time of Our Lord didn’t suffer heartache when their children opted to leave the Faith and follow pagan ways. (As if children don’t have any obligation to respect their parents, the Faith, and the fallout of adult choices.)
How is it that our forefathers had to tough it out, remain steadfast, keep the Faith, but somehow, not anymore because we don’t want to lose our children. And now suddenly that trumps the Faith. No wonder younger generations don’t take Faith seriously, the example is, don’t. Being warm, open and loving (as defined by whatever ‘feels’ good) is the way, the truth, and the light now.
Ann: Another awesome post! My thoughts exactly but I don’t have the gift of writing to put it into words like you do. Unfortunately my posts just sound like jumbled up words. Also, did you catch YFC post to Clinton today at 2:15 P.M.? “Clinton, I hope to God your kids are all straight. You have no idea the torment homophobic parents wreak upon their children.” Really? How about: “You have no idea how much torment an ACTIVE homosexual child wreaks on his/her parents!” Does YFC realize how much pain and agony a mother and father goes through knowing their child is going to go to hell if they do not repent and amend their mortally sinful life? YFC is totally clueless!
Ann, you’re such a voice of reason!
And using the words of Jesus! You have such a gift.
RR and Dana: Thanks for understanding. But hey, you’re PARENTS, parents who care deeply for the children and understand that the Faith does come first. What a tremendous gift that is. Even when its particularly painful. (Painful crosses bear fruit – something many want desperately to reject despite the reminder of the Crucifix.)
As for YFC, yes, I understand the guilt trip mode. Why? I used to see my siblings (all 7 of them) use it on my parents who were trying to do nothing more than pass on the Faith. What a head trip for them – my parents. Make it through the depression, WWII, and then have your children turn on you because you have the temerity to warn them about the consequences of bad choices.
And goodness knows the spectrum of not-good goes far beyond sexual activity, if only YFC could lift his head long enough to see as much. But that’s what the culture is all about now.
I’m personally glad that this Synod is showing what has often been hidden behind the veil of secrecy. A devil with horns is like a red light telling one to stop or run the other way. A devil dressed as your pal is the one who gets close enough to kill.
To Ann Malley– very good post! Thanks!
God bless you, Linda Maria. I love your posts too. Truthful, unyielding, and straight to the heart of reality as it is on the ground!
Vatican supporting radical pro-abortion, pro-‘gay’ Communist group?
Charlie Butts (OneNewsNow.com) Tuesday, October 14, 2014
American Life League is calling on the Vatican to sever its relationship with a group that promotes immoral policies.
Michael Hichborn, the host of the American Life League Report, made a recent and shocking discovery.
“Caritas Internationalis, which is the largest Catholic social justice agency in the world, is on the governing body of an organization called the World Social Forum,” Hichborn reports. “The World Social Forum is an international Marxist agency that parades through the streets carrying banners promoting contraception and abortion and homosexuality.”
Hichborn says the organization backed by the Vatican is not shy when it comes to advertising its leftist agenda…
https://onenewsnow.com/church/2014/10/14/vatican-supporting-radical-pro-abortion-pro-‘gay’-communist-group#.VD1pMb7jKfQ
Oh for goodness sake anonymous and YFC. We all suffer. You have no idea what I suffer because I don’t whine about it all the time. I don’t ask people to accept my sins and temptations. I ask them to support me in resisting them. If someone goes to hell it’s by there own choice. God wills that all should be saved but you have to cooperate. You know all this but reject it then blame everyone else’s attitudes and beliefs. Why do care if people can’t accept your choices ? They are your choices after all. Time to own your own behavior and be tolerant of those who disagree with your choice. Maybe you could try offering it up. I hear it’s good for the soul.
I have made the choice to love, yet I am hardly tolerated here on CCD. So please take your self righteousness elsewhere, someplace where you are actually telling the truth.
“… self righteousness elsewhere, someplace where you are actually telling the truth.”
There is nothing self righteous in Simone’s post, rather an honest assessment of the call to carry one’s cross and get on with it. That said, you are absolutely more than tolerated on CCD, but it your assertion that homosexual sex and all that goes with it must somehow be accepted that is not welcome. And that’s not the result of a puffed up personal opinion, but rather God’s law and that’s why you get the reactions you do.
Self righteous? Look inward, YFC, look inward.
Dear Ann Malley, you know I have actually never said on CCD that homosexual sex and all that goes with it must somehow be accepted. You keep alleging this over and over again. Others do too. Yet I dare you to find a place where I refer to homosexual sex that way. In fact, I have actually said that homosexual sex can at least sometimes be mortally sinful. But you forget that, because you always have your own agenda running in your head.
YFC: EVERY time you post you demand acceptance for homosexual sex. Please don’t make me reference every post you have posted. There is word limit to posts. If anybody doesn’t accept homosexual sex you label them as haters, self-righteous, homophobic…. You did it in the post above, and I repeat, “Clinton, I hope to God your kids are all straight. You have no idea the torment homophobic parents wreak upon their children.” You act as though parents want to “hate” their children when it is the total opposite! It is because they love their children that they WILL NOT accept homosexual acts. BTW: Homosexual sex is ALWAYS A MORTAL SIN and deviant when there are two willing participants with full knowledge of what they are doing.
Again, look to yourself, YFC, and your message. It isn’t promotion of Catholic Faith and Morals. That said, you ‘dare’ (I love that OTT gut wrenching sop word) to promote the lie that ‘lying’ is ALWAYS mortally sinful if only to bash others with your homosex agenda.
Your bounty of posts, rife with inconsistency and a crystal clear agenda, speak for themselves. God bless you for your transparency in that regard. For you are no devil disguised as a friend (eve with the misnomer), but rather a clarion bell waking up the tepid to the reality of the absurd going on inside the Church.
So God bless you!
Never RR, never. Find just one time. I have said what the catechism says, which is that gay people must be treated with respect and dignity. Clearly a parent who provides a hostile home to their gay kids is not treating them with respect and dignity.
YFC writes, “Never RR, never. Find just one time.” = There is MORE than one! If an individual is hellbent on lying then they at least need to take a class to teach them how to better cover their very obvious tracks.
“The trust of the innocent is the liar’s most useful tool.” – Stephen King
“The liars punishment is not in the least that he is not believed, but that he cannot believe anyone else.” – George Bernard Shaw
“No man has a good enough memory to be a successful liar” – Abraham Lincoln
YFC, The most CRUEL & PROFOUND example on CCD of your hatred for God and His Laws was your cold and callous treatment of another homosexual who asked you to clarify and uphold God’s Laws. You were asked several times to do this and your hatred for God’s Revealed Truth prevailed over the love that you should have shown for a brother who strives with God’s grace to pull himself out of the sinful homosexual lifestyle. Even John the Apostle said that if a man says he loves God but hates his brother, he is a LIAR. You showed hatred for Mark F’s courageous posts. Stephen King certainly exposes the cruel tactics that are used by liars. You also prefer fiction over God’s Revealed Truth.
God blessed you with a fabulous recall, Catherine. And His gifts are always there to be used — thank goodness, you don’t hide yours beneath a bushel.
And YFC isn’t fooling anybody, least of all himself.
YFC writes, “I have made the choice *to love*, yet I am hardly tolerated here on CCD”
No mystery there! That’s because birds of the same feather have taught you “TO LOVE” your sinful inclinations first! The real problem is that YOU made the choice “to love” your homosexuality and your homosexual inclinations MORE than you love God. YFC, God never said, “If you love me you will CLING to your sinful inclinations in spite of Me.” God said, ” If you love me you will pick up your heavy cross and follow me.”
How temporally blessed you are YFC to have found CCD which is a faithful Catholic website. God has mercifully allowed the opportunity to listen to the truth because He loves us and He does not want you or the person that you claim to love lose your immortal souls. The choice is yours though because you have also been given the gift of free will.
Discovering or monitoring this faithful Catholic website most likely is your temporal reward for some of the very kind deeds that you have shown to others. Now for the real eye opener! Your kind deeds won’t save you if you die in the state of mortal sin while mocking God’s Laws. You cannot have both YFC! Choose to first love and obey God OR choose to first love your homosexuality when giving yourself permission to act out on those sinful inclinations. Choose to love God or choose to cave into your homosexual lifestyle.
YFC, you have NOT made the choice to “love”.
You have made the choice for your own sexual desires, rather than being chaste.
You are a very selfish person.
If you truly loved someone, you would want him or her to get to Heaven for eternity. – Which means repenting for all mortal sins, and a firm purpose of amendment to sin no more.
When you support sending Souls to Hell for eternity, you will get no support from Catholics who do love their neighbors.
Please don’t all jump on me for saying this, but I believe YFC has said he was in a chaste relationship. If so, he needs our support and not condemnation. Let’s try to be fair. Sometimes I think we’re talking at cross-purposes. I keep getting conflicting views from him. You know I share and support totally the Church’s teaching on homosexuality and adultery, but I support anyone unequivocably who is genuinely trying to live a chaste life though burdened with same-sex attraction. I think he may tend to be defending views that express those of many of his friends who do not live a chaste life but who otherwise are really nice people…I know many people like that because my husband’s friends are ALL atheists and yet are often kinder and more loving people than my Catholic friends. It’s really tough, believe me…especially when my husband’s friends have been helpful in moving, for example, and my Christian friends never even offered. My husband notices stuff like that. :(
Yes, Dana, YFC has said that he is in a chaste relationship. That said, he has also referred to his partner as his spouse. He’s also indicated on threads that homosexual sex isn’t a mortal sin – and not just for those who don’t know better or who are forced. Round and round it goes.
That is why you get the odd conflicting message, at least from what I’ve read. Because in the Catholic world, being chaste doesn’t necessarily mean continent. If one is married, being chaste means limiting sexual relations to your spouse only. So saying, YFC is giving very conflicting messages. And if one were attempting to live in accordance with Church teaching, a man would not refer to his male friend as his spouse.
If you already knew the above, I apologize. But I *DO* absolutely agree that folks should be supportive of those with SSA trying to live a truly chaste life. It is a cross to be sure. Much like a hard marriage can be or infertility or perhaps abundant fertility. As for supporting nice folks, absolutely. But actively working for and promoting civil same sex marriage goes beyond that.
I hear you about the relatives noticing stuff like that. Makes it hard.
I agree Dana, but I don’t think YFC or any other homosexual who is trying to live the faith and carrying this cross should be living with a man if he has any homosexual feelings at all for the other man. This would be a near occasion of sin and he should not put himself in that situation at all.
Thanks Ann and RR. It’s sad because he”s obviously very involved with the Church. I’m reminded to ask God to reveal to me what my blind spot is. What am I lying to myself about to avoid changing a behavior that I want to enjoy? The worst lies are the ones we tell ourselves because we can be utterly convincing to others as well and lead them astray, not even thinking we’re sinning. Alas, poor Yorrick. I hope one of these days homosexuals get a real wake up call about how they’re ruining not just themselves, but our society, our churches, our children…on so many levels they’re just plain bad news. How does it feel I wonder to care so little for others and so much about oneself? Do you think in the far reaches of the night they wake up in a sweat worrying about the bad things they do? I hope so. :) Thank God for priests and confession!!!
Thank God for *good* priests and confession!! I am onboard with that and how, Dana.
That said, YFC seems to take some odd pleasure in promoting parents as being ‘cruel’ in sticking to the Gospel for the sake of childrens’ souls. He apparently has no idea, or doesn’t want to admit how hard it is for a parent to do that which is right – it’s often a form of crucifixion as you watch your own flesh and blood separate themselves by free will from that which gives life. And for what? Transitory insert the blank. (There are any number of non-sexual sins that can be mortal to be sure.)
YFC has no real idea what he’s about. At least, I hope not for his sake.
Well Dana I give you credit for trying to take a new path as you started oct 16 at 9:33 AM.
For the record, I don’t talk about my sex life with strangers. And I’d like to ask each of you, when, exactly, did it become socially acceptable to ask people about their sex lives and then discuss it in public? I think if you all were honest with yourselves, you’d realize that you were raised to believe that such conversation has no place in polite society. Can you imagine somebody walking up to to you in a cafe and asking you if you have sex and if so, with whom? Maybe they want to ask you about which positions you use, how would that be? Then proceed to discuss it amongst their friends while the you are sitting at the next table?? Of course you would be appalled, as you should be. If its inappropriate to ask such questions of a stranger at starbucks, then it surely should be inappropriate here.
Get out of my bed. You are not welcome in it.
YFC, stop spreading lies about parents and what motivates them. You may be too focused on your own agenda – bedroom, bathroom, boardroom? Not the issue – to understand that the majority of parents DO want the best for their children. And that best has nothing to do with your chosen stance on homosexuality despite how often you attempt to psychologically and spiritually abrade parents.
… that said, YFC, if you don’t want particulars about yourself to be ‘out’, then don’t put them out there. Your situation speaks a lot to your confusing position with regard to the Catholic Faith. Exaggerating an imaginary offense to make yourself out to be a victim is a tired trick especially when you attack real parents with real children with real experience in your continued quest to promote your agenda. That’s not about ‘the children’.
I agree, YFC and by the same token, not to you, but to the radical people who are the ones I’m referring to …keep their bedrooms out of our churches and homes! As Christians, YFC, we are all under attack…all this dissension has got to be affecting you too. Also, I know this isn’t a prayer group, but please say a little prayer for my husbands niece who has terminal cancer…mostly that she reconcile with her family and find peace. God bless you all.
Ann Malley, you keep making up things that you think I’ve said and then berate me for it over and over and over again. I have never ever said, thought or written that I think the majority of parents don’t want what is best for the children. NEVER. Where do you get such crap. Oh, you make it up. And then you make umpteen posts attacking me for the position I’ve never taken.
… prayers for your niece, Dana. Please add a good and holy priest to your prayers, too. Just 50 with terminal cancer. And yet a good friend’s husband with stage 4 cancer just tested cancer free at Mayo. Just this week. You never know, Dana.
God bless.
Dana and Ann Malley,
I will keep your husband’s niece and the priest in my prayers.
“Almighty and Eternal God,
You are the everlasting health of those who believe in You.
Hear us for Your sick servant (N…)
for whom we implore the aid of Your tender mercy,
that being restored to bodily health,
he (she) may give thanks to You in Your Church.
Through Christ our Lord. “
Dana I will keep you, your family, and your husband’s niece in my prayers, especially at Mass tomorrow. Thank you for sharing your concerns with us.
I’ve just been on the receiving end of your umpteen posts making things up, YFC, and twisting words whenever possible. (Like attempting to paint all lying as mortally sinful. What were you thinkin’?’) So your latest outburst about bedrooms and attempting to paint yourself on some moral high ground doesn’t phase me anymore.
You can thank yourself for the benumbed response. I thank you too for your persistent attacks against parents and the natural law and God’s law has done nothing but eliminate natural sympathies. You are lying, YFC. That said, look to yourself for stories intended to mislead. You admonished me with regard to my judgment day, and again, I’d put forth the same advice to you as I am considering the four last things very much in my response to you.
God bless you for that.
God bless and thank you, Catherine. And yet this priest’s cross is nothing but edifying to any who know him. It sure is to me.
Thank you so much all of you for your prayers! She’s got so little time left and is going through alot of trauma with family besides being terribly ill. Ann, have had your priest in my prayers as well. God is so good, so faithful, and I thank Him especially for Christian friends.
Thank you, Dana. I pray God to continue blessing you with the gift to discern that which is most important. That said, believe and thank God without seeing, with all confidence – thank Him now for your niece’s conversion/salvation.
At this point, Father is resigned and his spiritual life has never been stronger. God is very sweet to be sure.
Documents on Synod from the Vatican web site:
INSTRUMENTUM LABORIS
https://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/synod/documents/rc_synod_doc_20140626_instrumentum-laboris-familia_en.html
PARTICIPANTS
https://press.vatican.va/content/salastampa/en/bollettino/pubblico/2014/09/09/0620/01369.html
“Relatio post disceptationem” (Report document)
UNOFFICIAL Translation
https://press.vatican.va/content/salastampa/en/bollettino/pubblico/2014/10/13/0751/03037.html
Pander or Perish = the ‘gospel’ of the Gaystapo
“City of Houston Demands Pastors Turn over Sermons
“The city of Houston has issued subpoenas demanding a group of pastors turn over any sermons dealing with homosexuality, gender identity or Annise Parker, the city’s first openly lesbian mayor. And those ministers who fail to comply could be held in contempt of court.
“The city’s subpoena of sermons and other pastoral communications is both needless and unprecedented,”
Alliance Defending Freedom attorney Christina Holcomb said in a statement.
“The city council and its attorneys are engaging in an inquisition designed to stifle any critique of its actions.”
https://townhall.com/columnists/toddstarnes/2014/10/14/city-of-houston-demands-pastors-turn-over-sermons-n1905119?
Audio of Cardinal Kasper’s interview that he denied giving.
https://edwardpentin.co.uk/statement-on-cardinal-kasper-interview/
Statement on Cardinal Kasper Interview
“In response to a statement from His Eminence Cardinal Kasper denying giving the interview that appeared in ZENIT Wednesday 15th October, I issue the following response:”
“His Eminence Cardinal Walter Kasper spoke to me and two other journalists, one British, the other French, around 7.15pm on Tuesday as he left the Synod hall.
I transcribed the recording of our conversation, and my iPhone on which I recorded the exchange was visible. I introduced myself as a journalist with the [National Catholic] Register, and the others also introduced themselves as journalists. I therefore figured the interview was on the record and His Eminence appeared happy to talk with us. In the end, I posted the full interview in ZENIT rather than the Register. ZENIT removed the article on Thursday in response to Cardinal Kasper’s denial.
His Eminence made no comment about not wanting his remarks published. It depends on the context, but normally in such a situation, comments are considered on the record unless otherwise requested.
The recording can be downloaded below. A couple of the questions came from the other two journalists and I included them as part of the interview. Some of the quality of the English has also been improved for publication.
If there was a misunderstanding, I apologise, but I stand by the interview that was published as a correct account of the exchange.”
***
RORATE CÆLI: Full Text of Cardinal Burke’s Major Interview to Il Foglio on the Synod Date: October 16, 2014 at 2:36:49 PM PDT
https://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2014/10/full-text-of-cardinal-burkes-major.html?m=1
Taken from Father Z’s Blog
¡Hagan lío! Synod Bishops revolt against leadership and get their way – UPDATE!
https://wdtprs.com/blog/2014/10/synod-bishops-revolt-against-leadership-and-get-their-way/
Church Approved Messages of Our Lady of Akita, Japan
It was on Saturday, October 13, the anniversary day of the last Apparition of the Virgin Mary to the three children of Fatima, that Mary gave to Sister Agnes Her third Message, the most important and serious one:
“If men do not repent and better themselves, the Father will inflict a terrible punishment on all humanity. It will be a punishment greater than the deluge, such as one will never have seen before. Fire will fall from the sky and will wipe out a great part of humanity, the good as well as the bad, sparing neither priests nor faithful. The survivors will find themselves so desolate that they will envy the dead. The only arms which will remain for you will be the Rosary and the Sign left by My Son. Each day recite the prayers of the Rosary. With the Rosary, pray for the Pope, the Bishops and the priests.
“The work of the devil will infiltrate even into the Church in such a way that one will see Cardinals opposing Cardinals, Bishops against other Bishops. The priests who venerate Me will be scorned and opposed by their confreres (other priests). Churches and altars will be sacked. The Church will be full of those who accept compromises, and the demon will press many priests and consecrated souls to leave the service of the Lord.
“The demon will be especially implacable against the souls consecrated to God. The thought of the loss of so many souls is the cause of My sadness. If sins increase in number and gravity, there will no longer be pardon for them.
“…Pray very much the prayers of the Rosary. I alone am able to still save you from the calamities which approach. Those who place their confidence in Me will be saved.”
The last Sunday of May, 1982, during the Benediction of the Blessed Sacrament, Sister Agnes was completely cured from her deafness.
YFC says “Clearly a parent who provides a hostile home to their gay kids is not treating them with respect and dignity.” I adjure you YFC, read the gospels and ask our Blessed Lord to guide you. We are not defined by the temptations we have. You are not your sexual desires. No one is homosexual. A human being chooses to be consumed by a desire but that does not make them that desire. If a person says ‘I desire gratification with animals’ does that then make them a beastiesexual, born that way, without ability to reign in the desire or fight such a temptation. By your standard we should not be held to any standard or believe that we can be expected to overcome temptation. I truly pray for you, that you may receive healing and peace. Your arguments are pure sophistry. I would argue that a parent who promotes a child accepting that they are defined by their passions is abusive and shows no love for the person. Rather everyone should know that they are so much more than the sum of their temptations. I place my prayers for you in the immaculate heart of Mary that you might know her son and love Him with all your heart.
Such a condescending post which is full of untruths. I HAVE spent the bulk of my life praying and reading the Scriptures. I AM a “homosexual”, and the Church does not in any way support your statement that there is no such thing as a homosexual or gay person.That is YOUR doctrine which you made up. I am NOT consumed with desire, I am a normal productive member of society. What i write here is not sophistry, but yours surely are because you make things up out of whole cloth. Homosexuality, like heterosexuality, is at its core a calling to move beyond ones own needs and desires and to live for the sake of others.
“Homosexuality, like heterosexuality, is at its core a calling to move beyond ones own needs and desires and to live for the sake of others.”
That is pure gag, YFC.
Our only hope is Cardinal Burke.
All I am hearing from most of the rest of the hierarchy is so against our beliefs as Christian Catholics as well as God’s word and the Catechism,. Now I’ve heard we have to wait another year for the regular Synod and this one was supposedly the extrodinary Synod.
What nonsense and all they want to do is change our doctrines! Well now if Pope Francis doesn’t come out this weekend I may decide to move on.
Without the Catholic Church, what is there Sharon?! This is where you have to be more firm than ever…this pope is just a blip in a 2000 yr history …whereas if we lose our salvation we’re talking eternity. He lost this round ( most assuredly this was his planning) and we need to fast and pray for the Church and unity.
…don’t move on from the Faith, Sharon. Hold your ground. Popes come and go. The Church, like the Truth, will never die.
God bless.
4 And as he sowed, some seed fell along the path, and the birds came and devoured it. 5 Other seed fell on rocky ground, where it had not much soil, and immediately it sprang up, since it had no depth of soil;6 and when the sun rose it was scorched, and since it had no root it withered away.7 Other seed fell among thorns and the thorns grew up and choked it, and it yielded no grain. 8 And other seeds fell into good soil and brought forth grain, growing up and increasing and yielding thirtyfold and sixtyfold and a hundredfold.” 9 And he said, “He who has ears to hear, let him hear.” Mark 4:4-9