The following is a short excerpt from Monsignor Charles Pope’s blog:
Recently, I saw a video produced by the Priestly Fraternity of St. Peter in Los Angeles that beautifully and effectively advocates for the Traditional Latin Mass. It is a great illustration of the kind of liturgical evangelization we must do.
Here are the opening words in the video: “We have something that belongs to you.” What a great line to draw people in! Many Catholics do not know of the rich heritage that has to some degree been denied them by modernity.
I present for your consideration a few principles gleaned from this video as well as some additional insights:
- There is a joyful description of the fruits of the ancient liturgy without any explicit denigration of other liturgical forms.
- Remember that we are talking to fellow Catholics, not enemies of the faith.
- Patience, persistence and encouragement are the keys. People do not always appreciate or understand things at first.
- Even if there are liturgical failings in the wider Church, why not rejoice in the TLM and continue to build based on what is good, true and beautiful?
Full story at National Catholic Register.
Very beautiful! LOVE the holy Tradtional Latin Tridentine Mass! When I was young– it was simply “the Mass”— and it was, for us– the ONLY one!! The center of our holy Faith! Beautiul, timeless, reverent, and HOLY!!
Right, then the Freemasons wedged their way in. Abp. Annibale Bugnini (a later exposed Freemason exiled to Iran by Pope Paul VI), was the prinicpal author of the new Mass (Novus Ordo). The 1983 Code of Canon Law deleted any specific reference to Freemasonry. The TLM was suppressed, and a couple generations of Catholics know nothing of it except to be hostile to it. Even when presented the facts about the Masonic origins of the NO, they still don’t care, they’ve been so brainwashed. My guess is that 99% of Catholics know nothing of Freemasonry, an occult religion of Kabbalistic gnosticism. They won’t even read Pope Leo XIII’s encyclical, Humanum Genus (On Freemasonry) from 1884. It means nothing to the simpletons.
The Real Ralph– I hink ecumenism was the whole point of the Council, and of the New Mass, written under the direction of Bugnini. Our New Mass is very similar to the modern services of the Lord’s Supper, of several mainline Protestant denominarions. I disagree with Bugnini and his six Protestant “observer” theologians. I believe that our Mass deserves its true Catholic identity. If some Protestant groups are interested to learn what our Mass is all about— fine! And they can also tell us about their own religious services — great! I believe the modern ecumenism approach is unrealistic. I think our Church should simply show non-Catholics, Christ-like love and respect.
Linda Maria – you and I are in perfect agreement. The point I often make is to express my dismay at mainstream Catholics who care nothing to learn of the organized evil of Freemasonry and how it has targeted our Church for a couple of centuries. Also, it is baffling to me how few Catholics have any interest in learning about practices and beliefs that they themselves may be involved in which have their roots in Masonic philosophy. No good fruit comes from a poisonous tree. Pope Clement XII in 1737 was the first of a dozen popes to condemn Freemasonry, but in 1969 a Mass authored by a Freemason was instituted. How did Freemasonry know that at a certain point, nobody would care?
Many top Churchmen have belonged to such fraternal organizations as Freemasonery– and Bugnini was one. Our first President, George Wshington, was a devout Episcopalian– and a top Masonic leader. Some political and religious leaders like to belong to local community fraternal organizations, such as Freemasonery– for various reasons, especially to do charity work for their communities. Many laugh at the “secret” ceremonies, and don’t pay any attention to them, nor to their strange beliefs– including anti-Cathlic beliefs. They laugh, and only see it as a silly “game.” Sadly, the original Freemasons were definitely anti-Catholic!
I am not sure how serious Bugnini was, as a Freemason. Good that he wasn’t with Mussolini, an atheist and a Communist! I have also read that Pope St. John XXIII joined the Rosicrucians— another mistake! Freemasonery looks to me like a big “mess” of compiled international religious and philosophical beliefs, to unite members into a global “quasi-religion”– and ecumenism, to me, has the same idea! Many Freemasons, and many Catholics, however– do not take the teachings of either one, seriously. At one time, historically, Freemasonery was a serious threat to the Church, and was condemned.
Poor Pope St. John XXIII!! It has been said that he was connected to both the Freemasons, and the Rosicrucians! Many European intellectuals, since the 19th century especially– have had flirtations, or connections of various kinds, to popular philosophical movements, some very radical (Communism, Marxism, Fascism, etc.), due to political and social situations of their countries. Whether or not they actually accepted, and believed in certain philosophies, is another matter. The Catholic Church has suffered much, in the recent past, combating horrible atheistic philosophies and anti-clericalsim, as best it could.
I should clarify something in my post of Nov. 11, at 1:27 p.m. The Italian Communists and Fascists, although they were both similar in ideology, and were both anti-clerical and atheist– were enemies of each other. Our Church has been surrounded and infiltrated with many of these kinds of ideologies– very dangerous! Plus, the Freemasons, and other groups, too! And then– we have Protestantism- which has been a great concern for the Church! I think it is a mistake– the official Vatican stamp, honoring the legacy of Martin Luther, on the 500th anniversary of the Reformation!
Well– it is sadly true, The Real Ralph– that some of our Church leaders are confusing and hypocritical! Regardless– we have some shining Saints, to help guide us to the True Christ!
I believe that the ancient, beautiful, authentic, holy Tridentine Latin Mass, is thr BEST!!
There has never been any conclusive proof that the late Bugnini was a freemason, nor was there any conclusive indication that his appointment as the papal nuncio to Iran was an “exile.” A man who is a known freemason would not have been appointed as papal nuncio ANYWHERE! The truth is that this “rumor” that the late Bugnini was a freemason was popularized by the author Michael Davies, a sympathizer of the beloved SSPX, an organization that has every motive to cast aspersions and to smear Bugnini. I mean, the man was already dead when Davies wrote his book attacking accusing him of freemasonry—great timing as a dead man can no longer defend himself!
Of course, jon, no one knows the truth of many top Churchmen, and their true Catholic beliefs! So many of them also have various philosophical and religious flirtations, with immoral or heretical beliefs (such as Fr. James Martin, S.J., with a favored Papal appointment, promoting gay sex relationships, or the Pope inviting abortion advocates to be a part of top Vatican groups), or Protestantism (why the Vatican Martin Luther postal stamp, commemorating the Reformation??)– and such weird items, as Pope St. John Paul II, kissing the Koran, at the interfaith conference, in Assisi!! The list goes on and on and on!!
jon, you will easily find the scandalous photo and news story, of May 14, 1999– of Pope St. John Paul II, kissing the big, green Koran, at Assisi– by “googling” the item, on your computer! Now what do you think?? I think, personally, that he may have been in a challenging situation, and overreacted, and made a big mistake!! But it is all forgiven and forgotten! I think it must be hard to be a Pope! I also think the SSPX is (imperfect) but TERRIFIC!! Read all abut them, go and talk to some excellent SSPX priests– you wil be VERY IMPRESSED!! They are an unfortunate result of modern ecumenical Church politics.
Of course– the Priestly Fraternity of St. Peter is in full communion with our Church, and the SSPX is still in negotiations with the Vatican. LOVED the above news ariticle! The FSSP is WONDERFUL!!
LMaria, as for JP2 “kissing” a copy of the Koran, if—as you claim—all is “forgiven and forgotten” why do you find it appropriate to mention it here as a way of contrasting the saintly John Paul with the beloved SSPX? A sinister way to perhaps disparage one of the newest saints of the Church? This is a typical tactic of the beloved SSPX. Shameful. The truth is, nobody doubts the Catholicity, the saintliness, the faith of John Paul EVEN as he showed respect to Muslims through this gracious and GENEROUS action. Given the very tense relationship that Christendom today has with Muslims, St. John Paul II’s action years ago as a way of reaching out to these descendants of Abraham has something to teach us today and is the reason…
why John Paul is indeed great and a saint. Your failed effort to put a bad spin on this action of a saint is awful.
It would be a lot better to get away from the Internet than to go to hell or even Purgatory for undermining people’s confidence in Holy Mass online.
I am not trying to silence you, just to get you to think about the spiritual consequences of your actions.
jon— don’t overreact! My whole point here is NOT to harm anyone, certainly not YOU, nor Pope St. John Paul II, nor Pope Francis, nor the SSPX, nor Popes of the past– nor anyone else! I am certainly not a combative person! Instead– when I see our Church leaders do “wrongs,” I have my ow way of viewing the problems– and I stay in the Church, with Faith in Christ, above human failures! Many others certainly do not do as YOU do (acting as “the Fool,” defending a deceptive-looking, possibly “sinister” religion that is BETRAYING YOU!) — instead, they get really mad, and leave the Church!
Gossip is a sin. Willful doubts are a sin.
Linda Maria, when I was young, I went to a Rosicrucian museum and planetarium in another city. It was free at that time, ran on voluntary donations, so it was entertainment I could afford. I bought some of their secular jewelry and some booklets. After I moved, I went back and found some anti Catholic books on its racks. I talked to a priest, and he told me that it was a secret society and not to frequent it. Not all who have been to such places are members. I never was.
When the famous Trappist monk, Thomas Merton, got interested in Buddhist monasteries and beliefs– I remember wondering what the nature was, of his new interest– which he wrote about, enthusiastically! Unfortunately– he died of a freak accident, while on a trip to the Far East, participating in some type of Buddhist-Catholic monastic conference. I once knew a Chinese Catholic priest, who told us that he was invited to a local Baha’i group– and he went back several times– to try to convert them to the Catholic Faith!! He was very gentle, enthusiastic, and perseverent! I admired this! So faithful and true!
Yes, one needs to be careful about such things. If one is not strong in the faith, it can be disastrous. On the other hand, some are strong enough to make converts. Knowing the difference is important.
St. John Paul II kissed the Koran, as he did the other gifts, as a kindly gesture toward the Muslim people and not as a denial of Christ. On the other hand for me to do it would not be right. I think that is one of the things Pope Francis meant when he said to honor a person’s conscience. Don’t force people to do something they think is wrong. At least that is what I hope he meant.
Thanks so much for sharing this video with us.
“I was able to surround myself with people that loved God the same way I did and wanted to do all these things for Him to praise him .”- Ashley Espinosa
Magnificent …..hey USCCB you might learn something from this…..
Beautiful! It seems St. Anthony finally found something we lost. It took him awhile, but he did it.
For those living in the Coachella Valley (Palm Springs area), the Latin Mass is celebrated at 2:30 PM on Sunday at Sacred Heart Church in Palm Desert. The celebrant is Fr. Donald Craig, staff chaplain at Eisenhower Medical Center, and a former pastor in the Archdiocese of Chicago for many years. If you are planning to attend this Mass, I suggest you phone the parish office in advance as there are some Sundays when Fr. Craig is out of town, and the Latin Mass is not celebrated.
The Mass is a High Mass with organ and cantor singing traditional hymns. Booklets containing side-by-side Latin and English languages are provided.
A real and beautiful Mass celebrated by real Catholics.
This is TOTALLY wrong. Catholics who are devoted to the Ordinary Form are just as much “Catholic” as those devoted to the EF. And I am saying this as someone who attends the EF on a regular basis.
jon, you are always quick to make the charge that other people’s comments make unwarranted assumptions. What is wrong about coffee’s statement? Seems obviously true. I don’t see any attack on anyone, as you allege. Why are you so quick to assume that an attack was intended? Why are you so quick to judge in a negative light? Why do you trumpet yourself as a paragon of virtue and faith and knowledge when a post such as this one reveals your deficiencies plainly? Work on yourself, please. Take a break from commenting, please.
“Real Ralph”: Terrific commentary, except one thing: the simpletons are us! We need to train our Brethren to know the True Faith (or where to find information to know it), and to become devoted to the TLM. The present institutional Church is lost; a generation or two of priests simply believe that everything Catholic started with Vatican II. Time to stop that; challenge priests and bishops, make them sweat. AND, stop giving them money, unless it is earned. Vatican II implementation has been a curse on the Church, which is pretty much done for. Time to go back to Christ.
This “rant” of SChris is totally off-base. He CONTRADICTS HIMSELF. Just as it is wrong (as he claims) for clergy to believe that “everything Catholic started with Vatican II,” (which is a terrible and false assumption on SChris’ part) so it is WRONG to believe that the “salvation” or the remedy for whatever ills SC presently sees in the Church lies in “being devoted to the TLM.” WRONG! Christ is found just as much in the OF devoutly and reverently offered as in the EF. Folks, this is ONE CHURCH, and in the Latin Church, there is ONE Rite in two forms—the EF and the OF—and one is just as valid as the other because Christ makes Himself present in BOTH!
Well, Jon, when you hear a priest say that before Vatican II the priests faced the wall — and I have — it gives one the impression that they have no idea what went on in the Church before Vatican II. If he had gone on to explain why they faced the “wall”, it would have been a whole different matter. Many younger priests do not understand the theology and beautiful symbolism behind “facing east”, Christ the Sun of God over the altar.
I feel that you are very badly mistaken on your evaluation of priests. Everyday they pray the Mass which goes back over 2000 years. They give sermons on the Bible which goes back long before that. They honor saints some who died in long ago centuries. They know the Church didn’t start with Vatican II. Reading the sermons of the Fathers in the Faith is very popular as well as leading pilgrimages to Rome, the Holy Land, Fatima, Lourdes.
You don’t give money to the Church if priests earn it. You give the Lord your tithe (or more.)
Do you not understand what an ecumenical council in the Catholic Church is? And its meaning? And you call it a curse? Are you blaspheming the Holy Spirit? Christ is in the tabernacle of every…
Fr. Fryar has done a wonderful job bringing the Latin Mass to Los Angeles. The FSSP is totally dedicated to the ancient Mass. We should thank Archbishop Gomez for acceding to a request from Una Voce signed by 1400 Catholics from Los Angeles. Before, Una Voce kept the Latín Mass for many years though Fr. Bishop, Fr. Carcerano, and many others. The main FSSP sung masses are Every Sunday at 7:00 pm at St. Victor’s in West Hollywood and 10:00 am at St. Mary Magdalen’s Chapel in Camarillo.
Pray to God to find Him. He is the Way the Truth, and the Life. He always answers our prayers especially when they pertain favorably to our spiritual needs. For the many on the wrong track, God will return you to the true Roman Catholic Church and you will probably be surprised!
Yes, I agree with this slogan that the Extraordinary Form “belongs to us”—to all Catholics, not just to “traditionalist” Catholics. But folks, we really have to thank the Pope Emeritus’ motu propio “Summorum Pontificum” for “liberating” the TLM from the clutches of the beloved SSPX, and giving it to ALL priests to celebrate at their will. For TOO LONG this beautiful Mass was associated with the dissent and disobedience of the beloved SSPX, thereby contaminating its reputation. Well, good Benedict freed the TLM, and now is the time to continue the TLM’s rehabilitation. It will become fully rehabilitated when more diocesan priests (not FSSP or other traditionalist groups) offer it. Nonetheless, we appreciate FSSP’s…
efforts through this slogan.
Jon, Stop deceiving the thousands of readers, that you are culpable for. You twist the truth by making the wolves in sheeps clothing appear like saints. You will have to answer for this and all your deceptions and heretical writings.
Dear Jerald E. What truth have I twisted? What has been my deception? What’s the heretical thing I wrote. You throw allegations that are vague. You will have to answer for that.
jon, you act like judge and juror to anyone whom disagrees with your angelic intelligence
Yes, as I just posted regarding jon’s reply to Covfefe, jon is swift to condemn everyone else and quickly assumes the worst in other people’s statements. Jon found fault with a simple expression of praise for the old Mass and those who attend it by twisting it into a perceived attack on other people. He has a lot to answer for. But don’t expect him to admit his errors nor apologize for his lapses. Egomaniacs can’t bring themselves to do that because it would crush the false self-image they have created about themselves and wish to maintain at all costs.
Oh I’m justified in my comment alright. If I have assumed the worst in a commenter’s comment, it’s most likely because the commenter in question has himself/herself assumed the worst in the Church’s own anointed ministers/priests. I refer to the words of the commenter-in-question from the article “US Bishops fire doctrine consultant.” Such irreverence.
“assumed the worst in the Church’s own anointed ministers/priests.” The cover up by the hierarchy of the homosexual/pederast sex scandal justifies this assumption
In matters of governance and administration (such as the handling of abuse cases), I have not commented on anything that the “hierarchy” has done. HOWEVER, in matters of faith and morals and liturgy, I have vigorously defended the teachings of the Church, the Second Vatican Council, the reverent celebration of the Ordinary Form against those in this blog who would trash them! It is despicable. that bohemond and others would use the scandal in order to permit and excuse dissent on matters of faith and morals. Despicable!
Lying and character assignation are sins. Pope St John XXIII was not a Rosicrucian and Cardinal Bugini was not a Freemason. Spreading these falsehoods are an attempt by some to discredit Vatican II and the Ordinary Form of the Holy Mass. In God we trust…all others must have evidence!
So you just deny that Bugnini was a Freemason to let yourself off the hook? It follows that if some proof were sufficient for you, you would then acknowledge the problem with the NO. (I doubt it.) The point is there is plenty of evidence that Bugnini was a Mason, and the most convincing is the Masonic philosophy mirrored in the NO itself. A person who knows something of Freemasonry (you don’t) recognizes these attributes within the NO form, and returns to the TLM. You can’t skate- Bugnini was either officially a Freemason or he just knew the craft well and loved it (the latter unlikely). Why go to his Mass if you have a choice, unless you harbor contempt for Tradition. http://www.realnews247.com/altar_comparison_pictorial.htm
Did you know Bugnini? If you did not, who told you he was a Freemason? Did that person know Bugnini? if not, who did he know that knew Bugnini?
What was his evidence?
What philiosophy is mirrored in the NO?
And no, Catholics know nothing about Freemasons unless they’ve done something they should not have done or are a convert, which I assume you are?
No, actually Catholics have a responsibility to know about Freemasonry, that’s why so many popes have warned against it. You obviously know nothing yourself, as you’ve just admitted, which makes you singularly unqualified to challenge my assertions, much less comment at all. My posts here are to alert people, do your own research, my warnings will be borne out. Again, as I’ve posted before, denial that Bugnini was a Mason gets you nowhere, because a denial admits to an implicit admission that if he were one, there’s a problem. You’re either afraid of the truth or you harbor contempt for tradition. And they don’t videotape the blood oaths, its a secret society, duh already.
You gave no source for your information.
I’ve researched it before and found no substance to the accusation.
He himself always denied it and was very upset at the allegations.
I didn’t know him. I know someone who did, but I am not going to bother him because of some comment on a website.
There’s all sorts of sources for the information, and they’ve convinced many people a lot more learned than you. They’re available to anyone who wants to look for them. For you to deny them because I don’t go retrieve them and list them here because you demand them from me personally, is about juvenile. The fact that you’re not personally convinced amounts to nothing. The fact he may have denied it reminds me of Alger Hiss. Who cares he’s upset, he should be- he ruined the Mass. What are you looking for – again, videotape? Wake up to the fact that the NO is a man-centered ritual. See the Ottaviani link I posted. See the realnews247 link I posted.
The Mass I attend in the Catholic Church is centered on God.
You should be more skeptical and ask more questions. You could not answer or would not answer. I am not looking for a source. I asked for your source and it is not juvenile. You are the one stating something as a fact that probably is not.
The Real Ralph,
Ralph, maybe so but it is true that Protestant Ministers influenced and advised the Vatican what changes with the mass were needed. We can never forget that Vatican 2 was a Pastoral Council and look what it ended up becoming.
That urban legend is getting reworked on the internet. Don’t believe everything you read.
The mystery of Christ is so unfathomably rich that it cannot be exhausted by its expression in any single liturgical tradition. The mystery celebrated in the liturgy is one, but the forms of its celebration are diverse. The diverse liturgical traditions have arisen by very reason of the Church’s mission.
The Ottaviani Intervention
(Contempt for Tradition Exposed)
“I have rejoiced profoundly to read the Discourse by the Holy Father on the question of the new Ordo Missae, and especially the doctrinal precisions contained in his discourses at the public Audiences of November after which I believe, no one can any longer be genuinely scandalized.” Cardinal Ottavani February 1970
Traditionalists love to post the “intervention” but never tell you this.
Even though the hierarchy did everything it could to calumniate and malign the traditional priests, the traditional Latin Mass has been thriving with a large community in the Los Angeles area for many decades, long before the FSSP showed up.
I am a member and am very active within FSSPLA. We have Mass every single day in different parts of Los Angeles. Both Frs. Fryar and Masutti travel many miles to offer this Mass. Dr. Carcerano also helps when needed as well as Fr. Chan Lee (Dioscesen – trained by Fr.) It’s gaining some speed. We are looking for a Church, looking for donors to help us bring it to fruition in Los Angeles.
San Felipe Chapel, East Los Angeles – 10 a.m. (our first home
Mary Magdeline Chapel – Camarillo – 10 a.m.
St. Victor’s, West Hollywood – 7 p.m.
St. Victor’s- 6:45 a.m.
San Felipe Chapel – 7 p.m. w/ conference and potluck
St. Victor’s- 7 p.m.
Friday – 7 p.m.
2nd Saturday – St…
The loss of the Roman Catholic faith in tens of millions of souls is the greatest and most obvious evidence of bad fruit. In Church history, in periods of Her greatest persecution the Roman Catholic Church multipled in great numbers and formed saints because the Holy Ghost was behind Her. How does one then account to today’s great losses of faithful, religious vocations, and closing of parishes, schools, convents, seminaries, and hospitals?
Our Lord said “You will know them by their fruits “. And He also said what to do about them!
Thanks for the unmistakable evidence, Jerald E.
Islam is a pagan religion, that which is in disagreement with Roman Catholic Church teaching, and instituted by Satan himself. Islam is the medEVIL religion of death. The Quran is Satan’s answer and counter to the Roman Catholic Holy Bible. Anyone kissing the Quran, is showing love, honor, and respect to Satanism.
So Bruce, are you asserting that Pope St John Paul II displayed love, honor and respect to Satanism when he kissed the Quran? Surely you understand there will be no peace among nations until there is peace among religions.
The Pope has a responsibility to the millions of Catholic Faithful– and he must set a good example! That includes proper gestures of fellowship between religious leaders!! It will certainly not help to bring about world peace, watching the Roman Catholic Pope childishly kiss the Koran, in public, with TV news cameras rolling, and journalists and historians taking careful, detailed notes!! Ridicuous! Well– then, if the Pope must kiss the Koran, of all silly things– let us see the Muslim leaders likewise kiss a big copy of the Catholic Bible, and all of the religious leaders, can go around and kiss each other’s holy books!! Ridiculous!! A farce!
Ralph, My answer to your question is an emphatic and resounding YES!!!!!!!!!
You and other like-minded liberals seem to think it is better to offend God than sinful man. Oh yea without faith in Gos and world peace, the Unied Natios i.e.man cannot bring peace only God!
Pray the Rosary for world peace!
Our Lord directed the Apostles to go out to all Nations covert and teach them about God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Ghost. He did not say to ecuminize with pagan or protestant heretical matters to appease man.
This post is to those who followed the link that The Real Ralph provided.
Google images of interiors of Masonic temples.
You can see how things can be manipulated to make someone’s point.