Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 3:39 AM By lisa
I just wanted to say, The Blest Mother does want us to all be Catholic. I have read from the books about Megjugorje that She has told then Visionaries that the closest religion that Jesus taught is Catholic. So my wish is yes everyone become Catholic. I think the world would finally be working together!
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 4:29 AM By Maryanne Leonard
Have to love this man’s thinking.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 6:14 AM By St. Christopher
Good man. How come so many current men of ethical courage are not Catholics? For example, Rev. Hoye and now, Gov. Huckabee (who I believe is a Baptist). The answer is that many (?most?) Catholic spokesmen and clergy are men (and women) of questionable belief and little personal courage. Catholic leadership is mainstream and, along with that, the invitation to the country club is more prized than being attacked by the media for being “homophobic” or “anti-woman” or “triumphalist”. And, as a result, the institutional Church continues to crumble, with most now in ruins. In another few years, there will be few Catholics to speak out against evil; most will be embarrassed — probably like Mormons are today over their history of polygamy — for having been in a Church that did not conform to society’s views of morality and normalcy. But, there will still be many bishops like bishops Brown, Blaire, Ochoa and others to support secular leaders like Obama.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 7:14 AM By JLS
In 1967 a Sac State professor got an article published in major newspapers, entitled “Students are niggers” (sorry for the offensive term here, but that is how it was); he was protesting the oppressive treatment of college students who protested the government. Now, Huckabee is taking up the battle cry, “We are all the persecuted by the federal government.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 7:17 AM By JLS
lisa, Catholicism started long before Medjugorge, and that alleged apparational operation has never said anything that any good parish priest might say, and it has many suspicious elements.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 7:23 AM By JMJ
The devil has had a field day getting nuns out of their wedding gowns and into the rags of the world, away from teaching children about God & His Church, running from the hospitals and taking care of the medical needs of God’s children and all of this for what? Their own personal glory! The Bishops took away the Baltimore Catechism because it was too confusing for them and far too many of them don’t know Holy Scripture or even believe in it. We have a pastor here in Fitchburg, Mass. that doesn’t accept the great miracles of the O.T. and he “teaches” scripture. Now we have almost two generations that are in the dark, and of course, we have seen the fruits of the USCCB come to bloom. THANK YOU OH EVIL ONE, OBAMA, FOR WAKING UP SOME OF THE BISHOPS and won’t it be great when Huckabee and all others will be formally accepted into the Church and all of those fallen away Catholics, such as Glenn Beck will come home again? Pray and believe, my brothers and sisters for this great day. +JMJ+
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 7:26 AM By JLS
It’s all up to the bishops; if they want Hell, they can continue to ignore the call of the Pope to become holy. It is the terrible witness they provide to the world that keeps many from seeking communion with the Church. Why would a person who leads a highly moral life want to subject himself or herself to the likes of the run of the mill bishop? Most converts I think respond to the holiness they find in the Catholics they meet. This holiness is somewhat scarce today … because there are scarce few holy leaders: which is why the Pope is telling the bishops to “become holy”. Jesus says the same thing … why do the bishops ignore it?
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 7:44 AM By peter
“We are all Catholics now.” In this context, that statement is a double-edged sword. Treating everyone as if they were Catholic is one of the main arguments being against the claim that Catholic institutions are required to violate conscience – not everyone who works for Catholic institutions are Catholic.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 7:46 AM By peter
Not to mention that those opposed to the mandate are being deemed “anti-woman”; a tag long associated with Catholicism.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 7:48 AM By Larry
Lisa: I gather you’re not aware that the current and former bishops of the Diocese of Mostar-Duvno (the area in which the alleged Medjugorje apparitions were reported) have over the past thirty years repeatedly and strongly condemned and rejected the “apparitions” as a fraud. Whenever the local ordinary rejects a claim of a supernatural event, that rejection stands as the last word. The web page of the Mostar-Duvno Diocese contains a long list of links to statements (in ENGLISH; which is not the native language of the region) of condemnation over the years by their bishops. The Holy See has neither countermanded any of the local findings nor ordered that the documents be removed from the web site. This imposes a grave responsibility upon all of us NOT to promote this alleged phenomena. Also, it is a grave error to say that “the closest religion that Jesus taught is Catholic.” The Catholic faith IS THE religion that Jesus taught–period. There is no “closest” about it. The Catholic faith IS that religion–all others are NOT. If “Our Lady of Medjugorje” taught that the Catholic faith was the “closest” to what Jesus wanted, that is one more reason to reject the apparitions.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 7:57 AM By TH
It is a contraception issue! I don’t like it when people say that “contraception” is a side issue here. As Paul VI predicted, contraception was the beginning of the “slippery slope” that got this ball barrelling down the mountain.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 8:05 AM By Denise
They all ARE Catholic. They just don’t know it yet. Keep praying that they are converted to the one true faith!
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 10:00 AM By Ray
Larry: You must have read my mind – or I yours. Almost the exact information I was to impart. +AMDG+
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 10:08 AM By k
TH, I agree with you. I wish the Bishops had used this as an opportunity to teach the country why contraception is offensive to God and how acceptance of it led to the unraveling of our moral fabric.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 10:16 AM By k
Larry, how are you today? Your statement on Medjugorje needs to be amended a little. The decision of the bishops of Mostar (that there is nothing supernatural involved with the apparitions) is not the final word. Because of the international impact that the apparitions at Medjugorje have had, the Vatican has set up a commission to study the apparitions. The commission has interviewed the seers and it’s report will be made this year. I think lisa was paraphrasing something in her post. But I think the Blessed Mother would like everyone to be Catholic-and also Holy Mother Church.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 10:24 AM By Abeca Christian
While I have reservations about this man, Gov. Mike Huckabee, I do appreciate his message on this! For their conversions we pray!
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 10:57 AM By Larry
K: The web page of the Diocese of Mostar-Duvno contains links to 24 titles of diocesan documents, issued between the 1980’s and recent years, concerning the Medjugorje phenomenon. Readers on this website can and should go there and read for themselves. The documents contain blistering revelations concerning the credibility of the alleged “seers” along with the alleged quotations of the woman of the apparition. There’s no way this Vatican commission is ever going to issue an approval of Medjugorje–I’ll make that prediction flat out. They will either condemn it outright, or (probably more likely) will issue an ambiguous report which supporters and opponents will interpret as they like. In the meantime–the phenomenon stands as UNAPPROVED, and as such we should not be promoting it until such time (if ever) that this commission or the pope issues a wholesale reversal of Mostar-Duvno’s conclusions and places an explicit seal of approval on veneration of “Our Lady of Medjugorje.” It ain’t gonna happen, folks.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 11:20 AM By AA
I spend a lot of time in Medjugorje because I love being with fellow Catholics who are faithful to the Magisterium of the Church. That is what happens when people are converted there It is the only place I ever hear priests speak about the evil of artificial contraception. It is beautiful to see the young people queueing for Confession; hear the testimones of the Cenacolo men healed of drug addiction through spiritual discipline; partake in outdoor Adoration of the Blessed Sacrament with thousands attending; stopping to say the Angelus when the Church Bells ring. The Vatican took it out of the local Bishop’s jurisdiction in 1998. The visionaries are the most successful evangelists for the Catholic faith in the whole world. Over 500 priests have given written testimonies of their finding their vocations through Medjugorje and by far the majority of these are from the US. (I am British). Pope John Paul II spoke to many people recommending Medjugorje. You can see the proofs by googling on Pope John Paul II/Medjugorje. The postulator of his cause,Msgr Slawomir Oder in his book “Why he is a saint” gives extensive proof. Mother Teresa believed and prayed to Our Lady of Medjugorje as testified by Dr Mark Miravalle (probably the world’s leading lay Marian Theologian) in the latest of four books testifying to the marks worthy of a positive declaration.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 11:22 AM By Clinton
@ Denise: Amen to that! I have been a Catholic now for 3 years and I am so thankful to the Lord that He called me to His Holy Church.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 11:42 AM By k
Larry, thanks for that information. Obviously, the lack of approval from the bishops of Mostar did nothing to dissuade believers. Perhaps that is why the Vatican is investigating. I have to say that those things that are promoted at Medjugorje- Rosary, Mass, confession, prayer, fasting, love of neighbor, love of God, surrender to God through the Blessed Virgin-all seem to be good things. I will be very interested to see what the Vatican commission has to say.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 12:18 PM By JLS
Interesting, AA, that the Church has not approved of the apparitions at Medjugorje. Also interesting is that all the conversion success is not unmatched or exceeded among Evangelicals.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 1:14 PM By Larry
“The Vatican took it out of the local Bishop’s jurisdiction in 1998.” What do you mean by “it,” AA? As long as the bishop is in charge of the local diocese, he is in charge of what takes place there–and that absolutely includes investigating claims of supernatural phenomena. “Pope John Paul II spoke to many people recommending Medjugorje. You can see the proofs by googling on Pope John Paul II/Medjugorje.” I understand the veracity of those so-called quotes of JP heartily endorsing Medjugorje are in dispute. The undeniable fact is that the Diocese of Mostar-Duvno condemns the claims as fraudulent–an earlier committee of regional bishops reported finding no evidence of the supernatural–and parishes all over the world are officially forbidden to organize pilgrimages there under Church auspices. It is also undeniable that neither JPII nor BXVI have issued any formal orders overturning the condemnations of the local bishop.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 2:05 PM By John Brecht
The same Mike Huckabee who passed the same kind of law in Arkansas on 2005? huh.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 2:06 PM By WOODY GUIDRY
OBVIOUSLY YOU ARE NOT GOING TO PUBLISH MY COMMENT THAT BECK IS A FALLEN AWAY CATHOLIC. I WONDER WHAT USE YOU HAVE FOR HIM THAT YOU ARE SCREENING FOR HIM. CHEERS TO YOU SICK PEOPLE!
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 2:40 PM By Gene
Now the Orthodox must begin to speak up. They have been riding on Big Brother Catholic’s coattails for far too long on this matter!
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 3:47 PM By k
Gene, they gave a joint statement. It is on the internet in several places.
Posted Friday, February 17, 2012 8:16 PM By MacDonald
Whatever Huckabee’s past, his statement reminds me of that fine community in the Midwest where a Jewish family’s window was smashed because it had a menorah burning. All the Christians in the town put a menorah in THEIR windows as a sign of solidarity that such religious oppression was evil, and not something they wanted any part of! It also reminds me of the speech by Baroness Warsi Feb. 14 at the Vatican: a Muslim diplomat from the U.K., she told those present that Europe must fight to protect its CHRISTIAN identiy and roots.
Posted Saturday, February 18, 2012 1:21 AM By Abeca Christian
WOODY GUIDRY you are hilarious.
Posted Saturday, February 18, 2012 1:55 AM By MAC
This is not only Catholics and Evangelicals. Glen Beck was baptized Catholic as an infant; his mother died at the tender age of 13; he was raised by Mormons. Southern Baptist Leader – Rev. Land, and the well known Rev Rick Warren are all standing with us Catholics for our Freedom of Religion, and said they would be willing to go to jail if necessary. Would each of you be willing to go to jail for your religious freedom?
Posted Saturday, February 18, 2012 10:23 AM By Maryanne Leonard
I’m not crazy about Glen Beck, though he does have a few points to make that should be considered on their own merit as opposed to being rejected out of hand because he’s a Mormon or whatever else one doesn’t admire about him. But I do get a little crazy when we criticize people for being fallen-away Catholics. This country was founded on religious freedom, people! And everyone’s religion, or lack thereof, is extremely important and profoundly person to them alone, am I right? Fallen-away Catholics are our most fertile group of potentially returning Catholics, and Our Lord taught us about a Good Shepherd leaving the ninety-nine and going to find the lost lamb. Please have more compassion for the fallen-away Catholic. Deep down in their heart of hearts there’s an excellent chance he or she is still one of us. Do what you can to bring fallen-away Catholics back into the fold; don’t criticize them even if they can’t find their ways back. Any fallen-away Catholics who are reading jibes against them here on our much-loved site might feel they would not be welcome should they dare to try to come back home, and nothing could be farther from the truth. I will be glad to help anyone at any time who wants to know more about how to come home to the Catholic Church. Check out Landings, Catholics Come Home, or just post here on CCD and I will be thrilled to respond as quickly as I can.
Posted Saturday, February 18, 2012 10:25 AM By ryan
to larry …The Bishop of Mostar does not have proof that the apparitions at medjugorje are fraud I am not sure he even claims they are a fraud . He just does not believe the events to be supernatural. The problem the Bishop has had for so long is he has not a shred of evidence that backs up any claim of fraud or hoax.. it is why the Medjugorje endures and grows..
Posted Saturday, February 18, 2012 10:38 AM By Abeca Christian
Catholics are for Freedom of Religion as long as it does not offend God and natural law, and ultimately leads all souls to salvation in truth towards the the one true Christian faith. We still seek to see everyone convert to the one true church that Jesus established!
Posted Saturday, February 18, 2012 1:08 PM By Larry
Ryan: For a thorough refutation of your statements, you and all the readers should go to the Diocese of Mostar-Duvno’s web site and click into the English-language version of Bishop Ratko Peric’s statement of September 1, 2007. It’s a fairly easy read and it contains a chronological wrapup of the Church’s investigations into the phenomena over the years. There’s no use debating the finer points here when that statement (as well as the 23 others on that site) gives you a pretty exhaustive summary of the case against the validity of the claims.
Posted Saturday, February 18, 2012 2:27 PM By Maryanne Leonard
Abeca, Americans are for freedom of religion, period. The Bill of Rights does not say that among our rights is freedom of religion “as long as it does not offend God and natural law, and ultimately leads all souls to salvation in truth toward the the one true Christian faith.” This is America, and I expect freedom to practice any darn religion I want to, or none at all, and there is no “along as . . . ” attached. Catholics in this country have been seen respecting other religions and even those without faith for well over two centuries now, and we of all people know how hurtful it is to be discriminated against just because we are Catholics and go out of our way to show respect for Jews, our fellow Christians of every sort, and also other religions. Yes, we want to see all souls saved, and we fervently believe, most sincerely, that ours is the one true religion, but we are also quite fervently in favor for freedom of religion in this country, no “as long as . . .” wording whatsoever. I do agree wholeheartedly with your comment that we seek to see everyone convert to the one true Church established by Jesus Christ, Our Lord. Absolutely.
Posted Sunday, February 19, 2012 8:58 AM By MacDonald
I just read in Catholic Culture’s website: “Every Catholic bishop currently presiding over a US diocese has issued a statement condemning the Obama administration’s contraceptive mandate, reports Thomas Peters. Peters, who has been tracking statements from the hierarchy, has a full list of the 181 diocesan bishops who have released statements voicing their opposition.” Finally something every bishop agrees on — a miracle!!!
Posted Sunday, February 19, 2012 1:11 PM By Abeca Christian
Maryanne Leonard ouch!
Posted Sunday, February 19, 2012 9:31 PM By Maryanne Leonard
Abeca Christian, I apologize sincerely that apparently I hurt your feelings – that was absolutely not my intention and never has been. I’m really passionate about the subjects of America and religious freedom. I don’t want anyone telling me what religion I am allowed to believe in and practice, which is what they do in Muslim countries and other repressive nations, or that I can’t have any religion at all, which is what Communist countries do or have done to their citizens. If religious freedom is limited, there is no freedom for anyone. If it were limited to pleasing a Hindu deity, that would be the same result. Abeca, it is pretty obvious from your posts that you are a dear and lovable human being. I am correcting the statement that American Catholics believe in freedom of religion with our own Catholic preconditions attached, definitely not you personally. We might want religious freedom to be for Catholics only, but that isn’t freedom. I know full well how it feels to be attacked personally on this site (or anywhere else for that matter, right?), but please don’t take this as a personal attack against you as a human being, just a strong disagreement with one of the two statements you made in that post. I agree with you completely on the second of the two statements, that we Catholics do want to see everyone convert to the one true Church that Jesus Christ established. I hope you know I feel terrible that you were hurt and have no intention ever of hurting you (or anyone else for that matter) but truly did have to disagree with your statement – that’s all! I hope you will forgive me for any hurt I caused. I wonder how I could have said that without hurting you. Is that even possible in this world in which we are all sensitive beings I wonder? Can ideas be exchanged without disagreement being taken personally? I’m open to suggestions, believe me. I want to be heard, but not to hurt. Again, I’m sorry you were hurt, Abeca.
Posted Sunday, February 19, 2012 10:02 PM By JLS
Yeah, Abeca, that’s almost like safety pinning a diaper to the baby’s skin to keep it in place.
Posted Sunday, February 19, 2012 10:04 PM By JLS
So, MacDonald, what do you think the trade off will be? How many petitions are there in your diocese, one or two? What would the second one be, pray tell?
Posted Monday, February 20, 2012 10:58 AM By Maryanne Leonard
JLS, please be specific as to how I did such a thing as sticking a diaper pin in a baby’s skin when I challenged the correctness of Abeca’s statement that said American Catholics are in favor of a limited form of religious freedom for their fellow Americans. You are saying I am like a cruel adult torturing an innocent baby. I don’t think my challenging her mischaracterization of American Catholics’ limiting view of religious freedom was cruel, certainly not intentionally so, nor do I think it respectful to characterize Abeca as a poor little baby. But if it was like poking a diaper pin into a baby’s skin, please tell me how it was so. Your statement seems to be mischaracterizing me rather inaccurately and unkindly – or is it suddenly now cruel to debate concepts on this forum? If so, you should consider abandoning your own habit of challenging people’s statements as a daily hobby. If not, I think you might consider withdrawing your statement, as I found it painful and clannish as opposed to intellectually honest.
Posted Monday, February 20, 2012 3:09 PM By Abeca Christian
With that said and without adding more to the views in which I hope to honor God in, I still stand by my comments from Posted Saturday, February 18, 2012 10:38 AM. Blessings to all. Freedom is not freedom way from God but with God, real freedom is being free from sin! We aren’t free if we live in deception and false religions etc.
Posted Monday, February 20, 2012 3:10 PM By Abeca Christian
Maryanne Leonard you didn’t hurt my feelings, I’m much stronger than that. Perhaps you are reading into a bit much into JLS’s comment, he kinda made sense, he was using an expression. Kinda like an Idiom. Why am I the only person here who seems to understand JLS’s humor. LOL It gives a good point though. Maryanne I think that you are taking this the wrong way so I will not dialogue on said subject, to respect your feelings as well, but I still stand by my comments. Sometimes we just have to pick and choose our battles, I decline from this one. No worries, my feelings weren’t hurt. The ouch was just to let you know that you are taking this overboard. But please know, no pun intended, I know what you mean, you are a really passionate person. I can certainly appreciate that. : )So no worries, I hope you expressed what you felt on said subject, you got a taste of mine too but I didn’t go into as much as you. I prefer all lead to one true faith, Jesus Christ and His church, you have another view and that is what it is. Take care and don’t fret over my comments. Nothing personal.
Posted Monday, February 20, 2012 6:01 PM By Maryanne Leonard
Okay, good, Abeca, thank you for clarifying. I always think ouch means “you hurt me.” Glad I did not. Please allow me to clarify again that I too wish to see all souls converted to the one true faith. I just don’t want to do that by limiting the rights of my fellow Americans to worship as they please, and I don’t want my right limited either. Religious freedom? Yes! Religious practice limited to my faith alone? No. Doing my part to help souls come to the one true faith? Yes. We are in complete agreement on that shared vision, Abeca, and in so many other ways. Thanks for your post.
Posted Monday, February 20, 2012 10:57 PM By Abeca Christian
Now on the topic of the ouch. Well if I ran into the wall and said ouch, it means it hurt on the area of where i ran into but not an emotional harm was done, I can get up and recover by rubbing gently on the area, placing an ice pack or such. So the wall didn’t hurt me, I just ran into it, perhaps my clumsiness hurt me more than the wall could ever have. LOL now seriously the ouch was just a way to to empathize that I ran into your comments and I just needed an ice pack. Just kidding……maybe we just want you to lighten up, it’s OK to be passionate about things but lets not forget the real purpose of our faith. God bless you sweets!
Posted Tuesday, February 21, 2012 2:12 AM By MIKE
God gave each of us a FREE WILL, and God gave some of us the special grace of knowing the truth about the Catholic Faith. CCC: ” 1747 The right to the exercise of freedom, especially in religious and moral matters, is an inalienable requirement of the dignity of man. But the exercise of freedom does not entail the putative right to say or do anything.” AND “2107 If because of the circumstances of a particular people special civil recognition is given to one religious community in the constitutional organization of a state, the right of all citizens and religious communities to religious freedom must be recognized and respected as well.” Also read CCC 817, 818, 819, regarding respecting other Christian faiths.
Posted Tuesday, February 21, 2012 9:36 AM By Abeca Christian
Now wait a minute here, why did MIKE feel the need to throw in the CCC on respecting other Christian faiths? Hindu, Buddha etc are not Christian faith. Who is disrespecting who here? I have formed my conscience in Christ, praying for His logic and reason and as the early church doctors of the church taught, they were never watered down version of Catholicism as I see it today.
Posted Tuesday, February 21, 2012 9:54 AM By Abeca Christian
I think that given the modern mentality on faith, why even preach the word and be disciples of our faith, converting this nation, because since it’s a gift and we have to ‘respect” those religious differences, we wouldn’t want to offend them with our Catholicism, why even bother sharing our faith then, right? Lets just throw evangelization away and leave that to the other religious sects, since they have the zeal in their hearts to think that they are the real Christian faith that holds the key’s to the kingdom that have the Rock as Peter, they will evangelize in their own way and taking more fallen away Catholics just for our “respect” of other religions. Whatever happened to the teachings of the early church doctors and saints that taught against heretics and false religions. I don’t recall them preaching about “respect”. I believe they used other words that meant something like that but in a more leadership way, in a way that lovingly converted many to Christianity! I respect our Christian brothers and sisters, I love them enough to pray for their conversion to the true faith, we have the real pearl and there is no sin in wanting to share what we are so blessed with, not only through prayer but also through evangelization! The CCC is not meant to be used to bring confusion nor to attack a simple post due to perhaps misunderstanding! Speak and ask what one meant before an accusation of disrespect is insinuated! See Maryanne I can be passionate too but I’m more for God than to Patriotism(I consider myself very patriotic but first, that I seek to be more faithful in Christ, yes this dysfunctional human being lost without God’s graces, ME.), than to so called respect, etc….
Posted Tuesday, February 21, 2012 3:08 PM By Maryanne Leonard
Abeca, of course we Catholics wish we lived in a world in which all people were Christian. But when we’re talking about the United States of America, thank God above we are also talking about religious freedom. Your position is that you’re all for religious freedom as long as it is Catholic. My position is that is not religious freedom. In fact, if we do not respect religious freedom for all people, we cannot expect it for ourselves. The argument against Obama’s insistence on Catholic and other religious institutions providing insurance to pay for birth control, abortions, etc., is based on religious freedom. If you limit religious freedoms for Americans to only those who share our religious beliefs, you obliterate religious freedom as a principle.
Posted Tuesday, February 21, 2012 11:08 PM By Abeca Christian
Maryanne Leonard I guess only in a perfect world. Never is that case, so I will just have to wait till heaven, where all are sure to be Catholic. By the way this has nothing to do with respect, at least that is not at all what I have even brought up, it’s amazing how people assume that there was some sort of disrespect. If that was the case, then the very existence of Catholicism is already a sentiment of disrespect for those who oppose us. : )
Posted Tuesday, February 21, 2012 11:13 PM By Abeca Christian
Maryanne Leonard I am the same person who stood by some of the qualities of the protestants, do you recall the article of Bishop Fulton Sheen? Do you recall how you took offense to Trad Angelo’s comments that a protestant was the one who helped him understand sin or something like that. We were discussing the good about them, as I recall it was you who didn’t like the fact that we were edifying those protestant figures. If you believe in this religious freedom, then why did you take offense to Trad comments? Just wondering, so as you can see, I do not disrespect our protestant brothers and sisters but I do pray for their conversion and journey return home to Christ’s church!
Posted Wednesday, February 22, 2012 11:28 AM By Maryanne Leonard
Abeca Christian, I’m sorry I don’t recall exactly what you are talking about, but I will say I do wish the entire world were Catholic, not just the 1/3 that is – which is great, but still not my wish. I do feel that especially in America, we have to respect other people to believe or not, as they wish, but it makes me sad that millions of people still don’t see that the Catholic faith is demonstrably the one true faith. I take it as my own personal failure that only one person has converted to Catholicism because of me, as I do not know how to put across the wonders and mysterious of our profoundly beautiful faith, so perfectly designed to help us mere humans through life and into heaven. My husband is entranced by my Catholicism and by the Catholic faith but won’t make the transition to joining us. He prefers to go to Mass with me over going to his own Methodist services, which I am not very comfortable attending anyway, and his thinking has become 100% Catholic – but he won’t convert. This is sad for me, and I wish I had the words to convert my dear husband and the whole world. I’m glad that Protestants at least love God, but I think they are sadly missing out on a huge percentage of our Christian faith heritage by not being enriched by our Catholic faith and its incredibly rich faith heritage. I have been able to sell million dollar houses easily but can’t get my own beloved Protestant to consider converting, no matter how much I pray. I should be more grateful for the one atheist who converted, but it was from observing me, not from anything I said to him directly. I am thrilled and humbled by that, but so profoundly sad that the rest of the 2/3 of the world’s human beings still don’t understand what Catholicism offers.
Posted Wednesday, February 22, 2012 2:44 PM By Maryanne Leonard
I meant to say “my own beloved Protestant husband.”
Posted Wednesday, February 22, 2012 4:19 PM By Abeca Christian
Maryanne speaking of husband’s my husband is a convert. He use to be Pentecostal born again Christian. He converted in less than two years after our marriage and before our first born child. You don’t recall what article, it was December 15, 11 titled Documents on way to the Vatican.
Posted Wednesday, February 22, 2012 4:53 PM By JLS
Maryanne, the solution may lie in finding extremely holy Catholics to introduce your husband to … but please do not ask me to find such souls for you. The Pope is requesting the bishops to “become holy” … because it is critical. Seek a holy bishop or priest or monk or nun and visit them.
Posted Wednesday, February 22, 2012 11:15 PM By Abeca Christian
Well folks today we received a text inviting us to a friends baptism. He was born Catholic, we talked to him right before Christmas asking him to get baptized in the church. But NO he chose to go the direction his new girlfriend led him too, he is now getting baptized at a Mormon church! We told him that we can not attend his baptism, we questioned him and tried to convince him that it was the wrong thing to do because their baptism was not valid, amongst other valid reasons etc. Well folks, he FELT DISRESPECTED. There goes respect down the drain, sorry folks, but I don’t compromise my faith, even when I get shook-en up a bit spiritually.
Posted Friday, February 24, 2012 10:30 PM By Kenneth M. Fisher
Abeca, 11:15 PM, I was not there, you may have been more diplomatic, but good for you Lady, keep it up! God bless, yours in Their Hearts, Kenneth M. Fisher
Posted Saturday, February 25, 2012 1:00 AM By MIKE
Abeca Feb.21, 9:36 AM, – – if someone does not adhere to the CCC, they are a heretic or schismatic. (- This is just what Nancy Pelosi does. Her own interpretration of what she thinks Catholicism should be.) QUOTE: ” The Catechism of the Catholic Church, which I approved … and the publication of which I today order by virtue of my Apostolic Authority, is a statement of the Church’s faith and of catholic doctrine, attested to or illumined by Sacred Scripture, the Apostolic Tradition and the Church’s Magisterium. I declare it to be a sure norm for teaching the faith and thus a valid and legitimate instrument for ecclesial communion. “ – Pope John Paul II (pg 5). UNQUOTE. and QUOTE ” “In its very structure, the Catechism of the Catholic Church follows the development of the faith right up to the great themes of daily life. On page after page, we find that what is presented here is no theory, but an encounter with a Person who lives within the Church.” “It is in this sense that that the Year of Faith will have to see a concerted effort to rediscover and study the fundamental content of the faith that receives its systematic and organic synthesis in the Catechism of the Catholic Church.” – Pope Benedict XVI (Porta Fidei, Moto Proprio Data) UNQUOTE.
Posted Saturday, February 25, 2012 4:59 AM By RR
Abeca: He probably felt disrespected because you tickled his conscience a little bit. You are absolutely right in not attending that “baptism.” I would have done the same thing. Also, I think the texting invitation was tacky, too. Why not CALL them. Can’t people talk to each other anymore? People hide behind their cell phones and it drives me crazy. If someone texts me, I call them. Maybe this is also why he texted you. Deep down he probably knew what he was doing was wrong and didn’t want to face you and the truth.
Posted Saturday, February 25, 2012 8:01 AM By Dana
I’ve been reading the various posts. Thanks Abeca for your staunch support of the faith. If I may say so (if indeed we are in a spiritual war,and using war-like examples) if we were fighting the Nazis would we be scratching our heads like this and worrying about hurting their feelings or disrespecting their views? Losing souls on the battlefield is very serious business and if your re-read your Pauline letters, I don’t think Paul was particularly concerned with the feelings of pagan Greeks, do you? Abeca speaks like a committed warrior who understands what is at stake and who the enemy really is. He is not a mormon,or a muslim for they are they are weak & needy just like us. But he has misled them and is using them as pawns. I suppose I sound over the top, but that’s how I see it. Our weapons are those handed down by the Apostles: the shield of faith, the helmet of salvation & the sword of the Spirit which is the Word of God;pray at all times & stay alert. I’m paraphrasing Paul in his letter to the Ephisians. One of the greatest weapons of satan is political correctness, which is nothing more than having us turn in our guns to a totalitarian gov’t.
Posted Saturday, February 25, 2012 8:06 AM By Larry
Maryanne Leonard: No one but the Holy Spirit “converts” people–all we can do is cooperate to the best of our ability–which you certainly have done–and pray, which I assume you are doing. This does not only mean that we cannot claim credit for “converting” someone else–but also that we cannot blame ourselves if our best efforts don’t seem to bear fruit–so it’s a comfort, really. As long as you’re not driving him away from the Church, it’s not your fault he won’t make the move–and it’s not solely up to you to find either the way or the words. Just pray and trust God. Abeca Christian: “He was born Catholic, we talked to him right before Christmas asking him to get baptized in the church.” I’m a bit confused, Abeca. He was “born Catholic”–but was never baptized? Or he was baptized but is getting “re-baptized” as a Mormon? Or he’s having a child by this girlfriend and they are baptizing the child as Mormon? I don’t quite get what’s going on.
Posted Saturday, February 25, 2012 10:36 AM By JLS
MIKE, the Church was up and running long before the CCC2ned called for “adhering” to its text. Bottom line, Mike: How do you know you can trust what it says, what you think it says, what your bishop says, what the pope says? So far, in my efforts to elicit a response to this question, none has been forthcoming.
Posted Saturday, February 25, 2012 11:05 AM By k
abeca, the Lord will reward you as if you were successful. Human respect is not a virtue; fear of the Lord is one of the gifts of the Holy Spirit. Keep praying…he may still recieve true Christian Baptism. People are persuaded to do things like this when they do not really know the Lord. Mormons are polytheists. If there is time, you might refer him to a website gen215(dot) com. It is the website of Thomas Smith who was Mormon then became Protestant, now Catholic. He has a writing on Baptism on his homepage.
Posted Saturday, February 25, 2012 2:08 PM By JLS
k, Mormons are henotheists, not polytheists.
Posted Saturday, February 25, 2012 4:37 PM By Anne T.
Gee! JLS, just when I thought I knew it all –lots of laughs– you come up with the word “henotheists”, so I just had to look it up. It is one who worships one God while not denying the existence of other gods. I am not sure Mormons are henotheists or polytheists, but your word is interesting.
Posted Saturday, February 25, 2012 6:18 PM By k
JLS, I looked it up and they deny being either. They believe in the Trinity, but that the Father , son and Holy Spirit are not the same substance. They believe that humans (men) become gods.
Posted Saturday, February 25, 2012 10:31 PM By Abeca Christian
Larry thanks for asking for clarity, sometimes I just type away and do not check for lack of info I should of been more clear with. Perhaps because I try to make these posts as short as I can but fail sometimes. This is what we know about him from what he said…he said his whole family is Catholic, he was raised attending Mass etc and from how he said it, we weren’t sure if he knew if he was baptized but if his family is Catholic, maybe he was baptized but he didn’t know, that is why we asked him to get baptized in the church and find out first. Well anyhoo, all that does not matter anymore because he is getting baptized this Sunday. I did my research on the Mormon religion and that is definitely not good! We had more conversations with him and yes we were as kind and tactful as we could of been but now his girlfriend felt insulted and disrespected. We explained to her that since she is not Catholic, she probably does not understand why we had a moral obligation to inform him of such things because of his Catholic upbringing, and also we told her that it was nothing personal and we did not meant to be disrespectful but since their baptism is invalid, as Catholics we can not attend and choose not because we love our faith and stand by it’s teachings! Etc….long story short, she disrespected our faith by telling us how we should of handled things. Oh well, that does not matter. The point is we are not permitted to attend such a false baptism! They feel disrespected anyways not matter what. I will not compromise our faith for false compassion!
Posted Saturday, February 25, 2012 10:32 PM By Abeca Christian
Dana I agree with your thoughts on our faith. We can not compromise our faith anymore like we have done so for so many years. God bless you for understanding that so well. It came to you as a gift from the Holy Ghost!
Posted Saturday, February 25, 2012 10:35 PM By Abeca Christian
RR I agree on everything you said. You understand the spiritual and psychological aspects of the situation as well. Praise Be Jesus Christ! Thank you Mr. Fisher.
Posted Sunday, February 26, 2012 6:30 AM By MIKE
JLS, the Pope’s statements about the CCC teaching the Doctrine of the Faith and from the Magisterium have been posted many times on this web site. Both the first CCC written about 500 years ago from the Council of Trent and the current CCC were written so the Faithful may know the truth without heresy and schism. There have only been the two official Catechisms of the Catholic Church. CCC -“2089 INCREDULTY is the neglect of revealed truth or the willful refusal to assent to it. HERESY is the obstinate post-baptismal denial of some truth which must be believed with divine and catholic faith, or it is likewise an obstinate doubt concerning the same. APOSTACY is the total repudiation of the Christian faith. SCHISM is the refusal of submission to the Roman Pontiff or of communion with the members of the Church subject to him.”
Posted Sunday, February 26, 2012 10:00 AM By Abeca Christian
Well folks there you have it. My daughter just informed me that a Catholic is attending this friends Mormon baptism. After all we have gone through trying to explain to this Catholic why we couldn’t attend his Mormon baptism, you have a mutual Catholic friend of ours, accepting his invitation. I blame this on this modern day Ecumenism efforts that has brought great scandal to our faith! My daughter didn’t say anything, she was wondering, but mum our friend is attending, why do we have to keep being the odd ones and people get mad at us and we lose friends. I told her that we are the ones doing the right thing by not causing scandal by attending and the other Catholics are. I told her that I know, it feels like we are the bad guys because they say that they are supporting their friend. Well supporting their friend in doing wrong is false compassion, we can not participate in this. It is no different than when a Catholic causes scandal and attends a mock marriage from the same sex scandal! My kids are young and impressionable and believe me, I see that one of my kids struggles a lot in doing the right thing. This is discouraging to me. This is why I fully understand that without our Lord’s graces, we are very dysfunctional! God have mercy!
Posted Sunday, February 26, 2012 10:17 AM By Abeca Christian
Who do we blame when Catholics do not know their faith? How can I blame another Catholic that supports a Catholic friend get baptized in a Mormon church. I can’t! How can I expect my kids to continue being the faith police and keep informing other Catholics that it is scandalous to encourage another Catholic to participate in such things from cults? I can’t because they are young and are still learning their own faith walk, sometimes there are outside influences that give them the wrong message in a way that seems right. Watered down Catholicism, Modern day abuse of Ecumenism efforts, compromising the truth for fear of not being accepted, not like mindedness in our church, the DE-sensitizing of sin and so many more. I pray that the most powerful witness would be of mine to our kids, I hope that they choose well, I have to accept imperfection and mistakes. Sometimes we are too harsh and have unreal expectations on souls who are are growing. This situation has been scandalized on my kids, trying to explain to them often, they think we are nagging. I just wish that our church would be teaching those things vigilantly with love and in ways that attract our youth, because they are depending on us to do so, or else we will find out the hard way what are the circumstances. God have mercy on us!
Posted Sunday, February 26, 2012 11:51 AM By Thomas
It is not true that St. Paul wanted us to be against or rude or disrespectful of non-Christians or other people. It appears some people are making up their own religion. Col 4:5; Rom 12:14-21; 1 Thess 4:12; 2 Tim 2:14-16; Tim 2:23-25. Some need to be more careful what they put in public print – in order that we bring more people to Christ rather than chase them away due to innacurate, or quarrelsome or godless chatter.
Posted Sunday, February 26, 2012 2:07 PM By ANNE
Abecca, no one asks you to compromise the truth, in fact it would be wrong of you to do so. However you must treat ALL persons with KINDNESS and RESPECT in the way that you approach others – “Love your Neighbor”. This does not mean “love only your neighbors who do not sin, or only your neighbors who follow Christ’s teachings. Regarding your children, tell them once at dinner when you have their full attention – no TV or radio or IPODs. There is no need to nag, or repeat over and over. The final answer is that although we would like to go to the wedding, we can not do so because . . . . Lastly, the Church can not possibly teach all of those things that affect various individuals; we each have a responsiblity to know our faith and teach our children accordingly. Children must be taught that we do not condone or tolerate sinfulness even though we love the persons. (Get them the YOUCAT if they are young teens.)
Posted Sunday, February 26, 2012 4:17 PM By Abeca Christian
How many enemies of the faith use the faith against lay faithful, many and many are disguised as faithful servants. How many use multiple names, preaching the CCC and yet they make no sense in their ability to reason!
Posted Sunday, February 26, 2012 7:30 PM By JLS
ANNE, the concept of “respect” differs greatly among people. You pretty much have to define what you’re talking about and why.
Posted Sunday, February 26, 2012 7:38 PM By JLS
Hold on here, ANNE; you mis-read Abeca’s post. This mis-reading of posts seems to be some kind of epidemic. Reading requires paying attention to syntax, grammar and so forth. People should realize how much their reading is affected by having watched TV and listened to radio for years or decades … because it trains people to “think” in soundbites, like “sight reading” which is really not a sufficient level of literacy. When you read, you need to ask questions. It is also good to try and answer questions posed by others. It gets really boring fast when people mal- or mis-interpret posts, and provide “sound bite” replies. Critically, children need to be taught to defend themselves; later they begin to learn how to love neighbors and how to keep from sin. Won’t happen if the kid is taught to be naiive.
Posted Monday, February 27, 2012 5:53 AM By Bob One
Abecca, help me out here. Where does the church teach that it is unacceptable to attend the baptism of another person? It sounds like the days when the priest didn’t want us to attend a wedding in a protestant church, or even a funeral.
Posted Monday, February 27, 2012 12:17 PM By Abeca Christian
To answer best your questions Bob One first of all Mormon Baptism is not a valid Baptism, you would have to do your research on Mormon Baptism, it is cult and the church has always taught not to attend these type of things especially not to help another Catholic leave the faith.
Posted Monday, February 27, 2012 12:29 PM By Abeca Christian
when I went to Mass Last night, I went into the confessional and spoke to our priest, he is a very holy and devout Priest. He advised me to tell those here who use the CCC, as a preaching method, to stop preaching at me because this priest said that I seem to know well the teachings of the faith in regards to this situation, he also reassured me that I was not wrong and that I did not disrespect anyone nor was I rude. I told him all about this thread, he warned me to not waste any time dialoguing with anyone who pawns the CCC on the faithful as protestants do. He confirmed exactly what my suspicions were and feelings were on such posters here who often feel the need to preach unjustly and actually cause more scandal and chaos. He asked me to come to him every time I felt a concern, that he would help me better understand the teachings of the faith. He said I did exactly the right thing in this case and that I need not concern myself what the other posters post. To ignore their preaching because they are not using the CCC in the right manner and instead they are adding more to the confusion. His love and edification gave me encouragement to continue the way I know the faith has always been taught and that these new be’s who use the CCC are not only wrong in this case by throwing the book on me with adding confusion by insinuating that there was some kind of disrespect and rudeness here. So stop your preaching, I know the faith and it is obviously you do not reason well with logic, why else would you feel the need to throw in those sections of the CCC.
Posted Monday, February 27, 2012 12:34 PM By Abeca Christian
I noticed that several posters here misspelled my name and they added two c’s. I hope you are different people. JLS thank you for coming to my defense, as Father was telling me almost the same thing. He also reminded me that Jesus/the church has always warned against false religions. We both agreed that Jesus died and left us with His Catholic church, all the Martyr’s who died for our faith too would not appreciate these scandals that people now a days support. They are mocking the real Christian faith and misleading many souls. God have mercy!
Posted Monday, February 27, 2012 1:30 PM By k
abeca, I sent a post supporting you but it was not posted.
Posted Monday, February 27, 2012 2:42 PM By k
abeca, friends don’t ask friends to do something against their conscience.
Posted Monday, February 27, 2012 2:58 PM By k
About teenagers: When I was a teen I decided not to go to church anymore and to not believe in God. My parents decided I was old enough to make up my own mind. Big Mistake! Huge! I wish someone had tried to explain things to me, I wish I had gone to a priest to talk about it. I am glad that you are holding the line. Your daughter is old enough to read the Bible and I know you are homeschooling. We began our homeschooling day with a chapter from the Old Testament, a psalm, and a selection from the Gospel. We also read from a catechism and read about the saint of the day. I feel these things were very fruitful for both of us. I know you do not need my advice, but I share them with you out of respect. God bless you.
Posted Monday, February 27, 2012 4:12 PM By Abeca Christian
Thank you k.
Posted Monday, February 27, 2012 4:13 PM By JLS
MIKE, the Catechism is not a sacrament, and is not necessary. There is no new doctrine in it. It is certainly a handy reference, however. But all the doctrine is available elsewhere. MIKE, have you consulted all the references listed in the CCC2ndedition? Let me know when you’ve read them all, and any references referred to in those references. Now doubtless some readers will fail to exercise what I’ve explained is necessary when reading, which is to read and not take a few words and then launch into some sort of televangelistic rant. They’ll completely mis read and mis interpret this post. Why? Because they do not care about seeking truth, but only about ranting.
Posted Monday, February 27, 2012 4:21 PM By JLS
Abeca, it is refreshing to read your posts. It also intrigues me that your knowledge of Catholic religious tradition is pretty much the same as the knowledge I’ve gained from searching for it. I do not know why the Lord gave such a hunger, even one that is greater than that of my stomach. BTW, that is not insignificant either, since in 59 days of boot camp only once, not counting the week I was too sick to eat, was I not the last boot outta the mess hall. Also parallel, I burn calories much like I burn posts … sort of until there is nothing left. This is a joy, and it may help explain why I aggressively “nudge” posters to strain their mind, soul, heart and strength in seeking Jesus Christ, the Truth.
Posted Monday, February 27, 2012 11:25 PM By Abeca Christian
JLS you have exactly conveyed what I wish I could have conveyed to MIKE and others who rant on and slapping the faithful with the CCC. I don’t mind if they went about it the right way but geeze, I was only more confused at times. I really want to do right by God and when you have people add more to my intentions, then I start to question myself, I’m sure that it is sometimes a trap from the evil one, because he is the master of confusion and chaos. When I spoke to Father about this pattern every time I wanted to convey something Catholic, they ranted and missed my point. Father told me to tell them to stop preaching at me because I have Father who will let me know if I’m wrong. I feel better now, I was in the beginning of the scrupulous stages and that is not good either, I kept questioning myself and started to doubt the Catholicism I once discovered and grew up knowing due to some of the posters here who preach that they know it all. JLS thank you my friend because you do truly read through my comments. I’ll try to make them shorter though. : ) I’ll try.
Posted Monday, February 27, 2012 11:34 PM By Abeca Christian
JLS you are an honest and genuine person, you are honest with yourself and since you have also grown a faithful love for our Lord, one that is sincere, which in turn would explain why you found many beautiful truths. Fear the Lord JLS and our Lord will reveal more of His truths, I’m sure you are one who is always seeking to be humble, I think that all those great qualities are why graces are easier obtained within your heart and soul, but it is still a great mystery why not all can embrace such graces. Thank you for your kind words of support and encouragement in our Lord and for His church. Jesus bless you always JLS!
Posted Tuesday, February 28, 2012 9:56 AM By RR
Abeca: Sometimes I have found that the CCC is not clear enough on some things. Sometimes what is said in the CCC can be misinterpreted because it is vague in it’s meaning. That is when we, as Catholics, have to go by the tradition beliefs of the Church, which is what you do. I do this also. When in doubt, base your beliefs on the traditions of the Catholic Church. Sometimes I think people get so carried away with rules and regulations like the pharisees. If people pray, live by the Commandments, receive the Sacraments worthily, and live by the CCC with a traditional, formed conscience, then God is pleased and you cannot go wrong. God reads ALL of our hearts individually and are souls are known to God alone. Don’t let anyone bring you down because you live by Sacred Tradition. Keep your head up.
Posted Tuesday, February 28, 2012 1:16 PM By Abeca Christian
RR you are 100% right! Father also brought up those important facts. I felt more at ease when I spoke to him at the confessional. You are stating facts, the CCC can sometimes be vague. You should have seen my shock when I discovered how many Catholics who follow the CCC, how much they have watered down the sin of sodomy all in the name of treating the homosexual with respect. We are speaking of sodomy, it is a sin that cries out to the heavens with vengeance. I don’t buy the watered down message on homosexuality that the current lay faithful are now preaching. It is because of that, that the gay agenda has expanded and still being imposed stronger than ever. I wish the CCC would have a whole page on the sins that go against the natural law but I don’t think there is a complete one there, only a vague one but it sounds like it is more towards false compassion, and maybe it is not but the faithful are misinterpreting that message and discarding all those teachings that were more direct from our infant church. Thanks RR God bless you!
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