The following comes from a Jan. 17 story on Zenit.org.
The U. S. Supreme Court granted a request Friday to review the November 2014 decision by the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Sixth Circuit upholding the constitutionality of marriage laws in Michigan, Ohio, Kentucky and Tennessee.
The decision regarding same-sex marriage is expected in June or July.
Archbishop Salvatore Cordileone of San Francisco, chairman of the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops’ subcommittee for the promotion and defense of marriage, responded to the court’s action, saying, “A decision by the Supreme Court on whether a state may define marriage as the union of one man and one woman may be the most significant Court decision since the Court’s tragic 1973 Roe v. Wade decision making abortion a constitutional right.”
…. Archbishop Cordileone also noted, “It’s hard to imagine how the essential meaning of marriage as between the two sexes, understood in our nation for over 200 years, and consistent with every society throughout all of human history, could be declared illegal. To those arguing for a constitutional redefinition of marriage, one must ask: when did the Constitution suddenly mandate a novel and unfounded definition of marriage? To ask such a question is not a judgment on anyone. It is a matter of justice and truth. The central issue at stake is: what is marriage? The answer is: a bond which unites a man and a woman to each other and to any children who come from their union. Only a man and a woman can unite their bodies in a way that creates a new human being. Marriage is thus a unique and beautiful reality which a society respects to its benefit or ignores to its peril.”
Archbishop Cordileone added, “Let us pray that the Supreme Court will be guided by right reason and render a true and just decision upholding the constitutionality of states to respect the institution of marriage as the union of one man and one woman.”
The Supreme Court is expected to hear oral arguments in the coming months.
CCC: ” 1660 The marriage covenant, by which a man and a woman form with each other an intimate communion of life and love, has been founded and endowed with its own special laws by the Creator.
By its very nature it is ordered to the good of the couple, as well as to the generation and education of children.
Christ the Lord raised marriage between the baptized to the dignity of a sacrament (cf. CIC, can. 1055 § 1; cf. GS 48 § 1). ”
CCC: ” 2202 A man and a woman united in marriage, together with their children, form a family.
This institution is prior to any recognition by public authority, which has an obligation to recognize it.
It should be considered the normal reference point by which the different forms of family relationship are to be evaluated. “
The picture above is silly and preys upon the ignorance of others.
It is explicitly attacking a specific Bishop who is doing his job according to Catholic Church teaching.
This is not merely Abp Cordileone’s personal opinion.
If New Ways Ministry wants to attack – it should be the entire Catholic Faith, and all Bible supporting Christians., and Torah supporting Jews, and Quoran supporting Muslims.
Condemned “New Ways Ministry” tries to make it look like Archbishop Cordileone is making up his own Religion.
When in fact, they are making up their own Religion.
CCC: ” 81 Sacred Scripture is the speech of God as it is put down in writing under the breath of the Holy Spirit.
And [Holy] Tradition transmits in its ENTIRETY the Word of God which has been entrusted to the apostles by Christ the Lord and the Holy Spirit.
It transmits it to the successors of the apostles so that, enlightened by the Spirit of truth, they may faithfully preserve, expound and spread it abroad by their preaching. “
Teaching about homosexual acts:
Gen 19:1-29; Rom 1:24-27; 1 Cor 6:10; 1 Tim 1:10; Jude 1:7.
CCC: 2357, 2358, 2359 & 2396.
The above photo is fair criticism, and not an attack at all. It’s presumably (given the its context) taken at a counter protest of the March for Marriage, a political event at which he was a key speaker.
Abp. Cordileone uses his position’s profile to advocate a point of view on social and political issues. He’s intentionally adopting a public profile on divisive issues, and getting as much traction as he can out of it. Civil protest comes with the territory.
I do believe that “New Ways ‘Ministry'” will be a participant in Gomez’s 2015 REC! How many of you are willing to stand with “Concerned Roman Catholics of America, Inc.” against this attack on the Faith?
God bless, yours in Their Hearts!
May God have mercy on an amoral Amerika and His Church!
Viva Cristo Rey!
Kenneth M. Fisher
This “no way” was about “New Ways Ministry” being allowed at the REC; It was not about not being willing to stand against it if it is true.
Even though “New Ways Ministry” may not been an official contributor or vender for the upcoming REC, it will be well represented in many of the “speakers”!
God bless, yours in Their Hearts!
May God have mercy on an amoral Amerika and His Church!
Viva Cristo Rey!
Kenneth M. Fisher, Founding Director
Concerned Roman Catholics of America, Inc.
Keep us posted as soon as you see an agenda.
God bless you MADDIE i agree with you.
If the US Supreme Court forces immoral homosexual marriage on the US population who have voted overwhelmingly against it in almost every State,
then legalizing POLYGAMY
and BEASTIALITY are next.
Polygamy and Beastiality also have to do with “individual freedom” and “no discriminating” – which is the argument given by the homosexual lobby.
CCC: ” 1740 Threats to freedom. The exercise of freedom does not imply a right to say or do everything.
It is false to maintain that man, “the subject of this freedom,” is an individual who is fully self-sufficient and whose finality is the satisfaction of his own interests in the enjoyment of earthly goods. Moreover, the economic, social, political, and cultural conditions that are needed for a just exercise of freedom are too often disregarded or violated.
Such situations of blindness and injustice injure the moral life and involve the strong as well as the weak in the temptation to sin against charity.
By deviating from the moral law man violates his own freedom, becomes imprisoned within himself, disrupts neighborly fellowship, and rebels against divine truth. “
Maddie, the tide of public opinion has turned against those who would stand in the way of loving committed couples who want nothing more than all their straight family and friends. They don’t impose anything more on you than is already imposed by every other married couple on the block. And the American public now agrees. Majorities in the last 4 states to have same sex marriage on the ballot voted in favor of marriage equality. Majorities in every region of the country poll in favor of marriage. It is even true that more Republicans favor equality than believe in discrimination. Catholics by a 2/3 majority favor the right of same sex couples to enjoy civil marriage.
YFC, in the 4th century the majority of the Church accepted the Arian heresy and they were wrong just as the 2/3 “majority” of Catholics who accept sodomite marriage are also wrong. Lies are still lies and sin is still sin even if its popular. I won’t be signing on any time ever…
YFC, elections are more accurate than any polls.
Any Catholic who supports same sex marriage is a heretic, and may not receive Holy Communion.
Homosexuals are just like any other single person and called to chastity.
Fornication, Adultery, and Homosexual Acts are all MORTAL SINS.
You do not love your neighbors if you help condemn them to Hell for eternity by your public support of Sodomy.
“Full beak ablazing” indeed! Something is wrong with this picture. Look at the shamelessness of Abeca’s “well reasoned” friend YFC. Shame on Abeca for calling those who love God “slime” while calling those who invite others to mock God, “well reasoned.” Every region of hell contains those who chose to mock and ignore God by entering the wide gate and remaining in their habitually chosen sin.
Douay-Rheims Bible 7:13
Enter ye in at the narrow gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way that leadeth to destruction, and many there are who go in thereat.
1 John 3:10 By this it may be seen who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not do right is not of God, nor he who does not love his brother.
11 For this is the message which you have heard from the beginning, that we should love one another,
12 and not be like Cain who was of the evil one and murdered his brother. And why did he murder him? Because his own deeds were evil and his brother’s righteous.
There is more than one way to murder your brother.
One can murder him by killing him spiritually – helping to send him to Hell via words and deeds.
Those who promote intrinsic evils – Abortion, Euthanasia, Contraception, Homosexual Marriage, Human Cloning, Embryonic Stem Cell Research – do the devil’s work.
JESUS said few will be Saved.
Mt 7:13-14; and Lk 13:23-28.
PETE where do you get such a made up list of “intrinsic evils”. Surely this is not classic catholic teaching.
It comes from the Catholic Church. It is not an exhausttive list.
See the USCCB document on Political Responsibility.
An intrinsic evil is something that is immoral under all circumstances and when done for any intention. It is never permissible. Never justified.
Anonymous, try reading the Bible and the “Catechism of the Catholic Church, second edition” and you will find intrinsic evils.
For an example of “intrinsically evil” of contraception see CCC 2370.
Look at the intrinsic evils (non-negotiables) listed.
Then look in the footnotes for the documents.
” These five current issues concern actions that are intrinsically evil and must never be promoted by the law.
Intrinsically evil actions are those that fundamentally conflict with the moral law and can never be deliberately performed under any circumstances.
It is a serious sin to deliberately endorse or promote any of these actions, and no candidate who really wants to advance the common good will support any action contrary to the non-negotiable principles involved in these issues. “
“Your Fellow Catholic”: Your point is nonsensical. So what? Even if every person polled favors sodomite and lesbian marriage this means nothing to the Catholic Church.
Your side may well win a legal victory, and, in fact, it seems highly probable after Lawrence v. Texas. However, and again, this “win” means absolutely nothing. Sodomy (and by this it is meant all same-sex sexual expression) is a violent affront to God and to His Church.
Do all clergy agree that homosexuality is bad, when expressed sexually? Certainly not. Many Catholic clergy are/were/will be homosexual, so this offense to Heaven is looked upon as a “gift”. Hopefully, soon, Catholic parishioners will withdraw their funding in large amounts and dedicate their money to the truly Faithful.
And to think that Chief Justice Roberts, and Associate Justice Kennedy, who will likely be asked to write the decision violating his Faith, are Catholics. One hopes that the Pope will be strong to avoid giving any Church credibility to such “filth” (to quote the wonderful Pope Benedict XVI).
Pope Francis compares pushing gay agenda to ‘Hitler Youth’ indoctrination
Two thirds of “Catholics” are in favor of homosexual marriage? Those two thirds make about as much sense as Jewish Nazis!
JF- I recently saw a documentary on the Early Homo-Nazi Reich when consolidating its power before the Purge of leader Ernst Rohm and his HOMO-NAZI TERRORIST STORM TROOPERS.
It focused on a lawyer who once tried Hitler for his crimes in the 1920s – and his detention in to ‘Protective Custody’ as an early Concentration Camp – which led to severe beatings and eventually death.
His Sister tried every means possible to rescue / release him – including Posing as a ‘Good German’ and publicly giving the Stiff Arm ‘heil’ Salute, in order to gain sympathy and help.
All that failed in the end – but in the interim She helped shape the propaganda farce that the Homo-Nazi reich was universally supported (Save a few sour grapes) – And ultimately aided the Evil as an attempt of gaining ‘mercy’ for her brother.
Today’s Gaystapo is every bit as Ruthless & Evil – and will use all methods BAMN (By Any Means Necessary) to enforce the Lies propping up their pogroms.
The Homo-Nazi’s Destroyed the Boy Scouts (and Ernst Rohm got to be in charge of the pederast picnic it became) – and We as a Church should not let false mercy promote ultimate evil – regardless of how desperate we are to help those caught up in it.
In the end – it plays in to the hands of the Gaystapo; with which they intend to choke the Church to silence.
Yes of course, if someone doesn’t agree with you just call them a Nazi and then you win your argument. It’s even worse than those on the left who say that if you don’t agree with them you must be racist.
Recently, on a hike I took with my liberal-minded brother, I listened as he oozed compassion for people who love each other. It all sounded so good to him. He thought of himself as righteous, caring, compassionate, etc. He became a bit uneasy when I asked him about his compassion for those of us who would lose our businesses, our rights if we refused to believe in the same “compassion” as he did. What if we demanded the same respect for our beliefs? Of course, he did not have an answer for that. We all know that the persecution that homosexuals could inflict upon those of us who differ from their opinions will be swiftly imposed without thought for our beliefs. Does it matter to the Supreme Court? Does it matter to those who seek to impose their compassion on society? Let’s hope so. Give me the liberty to serve God, or give me death.
Your religious liberties do not include the right to break the law. Don’t break the law and you have no fear of losing your business. Your unfounded fears are no reason to deny others their constitutional rights.
YFC, your gay agenda of man made errors, does not over-ride the laws of God.
After homosexual marriage is allowed, next evil politicians will be legalizing polygamy and beastiality. After all, it is Constitutional “freedom” – yes ?
Forcing anyone to accept the sinful lifestyle you promote against their religious beliefs – violates THEIR Constitutional Rights.
No, YFC! GOD’S LAWS remain supreme! So, according to you, we should be obligated to obey man’s laws all the while having to give up our freedom of religion and obeying God’s laws? That, my friend, is what is unconstitutional and unlawful!!
We will not comply with an unjust law, and we know what side you really are on YFC
You cannot serve God and mammon, YFC. You will have to choose at some point. Everyone does.
The posting advocating the government forcing business people to do what is against their religious beliefs, proves that liberals want to control other people but themselves.
Oneofthesheep good for you for making your friend think. The more we have these honest discussions without have fear to do so, the more we can help them reason well on morals. That is how some of us where able to reach out to homosexuals. We had discussions on areas where we had common ground. A homosexual who believed that God existed. So he was able to reason well on that account but where we differed was that he was heretical in his view on the natural law. He fought the church often in that area. Well we couldnt change his heart to be open to those truths so instead we kept reminding him what the church taught about being chaste for homosexuals. We kept at it for years. Praying and then eventually stopped talking to him. Last i heard was that he broke up with partner and is now living chastely. We can only hope for the best now.
You make a valid point, OneoftheSheep. Yet, your hand, I suspect, are not entirely clean.
I bet you supported the Church’s amicus brief in Lawerence v. Texas in support of criminalizing homosexual acts. In orther cases, the USCCB have filed amicus briefs supporting: 1) the legal rights to exclude people with SSA from private organizations for mere orientation rather than any overt acts, 2) the right to deny housing people who are homosexual, 3) the right of employers to fire people for being homosexuals, and 4) supporting the ban on homosexuals serving in the military.
Certainly, OneoftheSheep, its pretty clear the Church—and I presume you—-are all for compelling homosexuals to behave in conformity with your religious beliefs, no matter that some faiths (including Christian sects) have accepted the validity of homosexual relationships.
While I did not agree with the well-known case about the caterer punished for refusing to offer their service to a gay wedding, it’s nothing that hasn’t been done to homosexuals for 100’s of years.
Christian Faiths follow the teaching in the Bible.
Whether Catholic or Protestant – these verses regarding the EVIL of homosexual acts are the same. They are clear and not parables.
Gen 19:1-29; Rom 1:24-27; 1 Cor 6:10; 1 Tim 1:10; Jude 1:7.
There are some heretics in every Faith, including some high ranking clergy.
Leftist fascist at their best
Canisius, “leftist fascist” is an oxymoron! Which did you mean?
Good for Archbishop Cordileone.
Now we need him to close Most Holy Redeemer, the homosexual parish. He needs to not only talk the talk, but walk the walk.
Not close Holy Redeemer, just make certain it adheres to Sacred Scripture and the CCC.
And to the “Letter to Bishops on the Pastoral Care of Homosexual Persons:.
Those with same sex attraction can get to Heaven if they live according to God’s will, and not the devil’s will.
Bill K welcome aboard. So far ive been appreciating your comments. You speak like a true Holy and faithful warrier for Christ. Its a breath of fresh air. St. Rita, St.Padre Pio pray for us and thank you Lord for prayers answered. Jmj
There is no question in my mind that marriage is between one man and one woman.
However, and thank the good Lord, we live in a free country, and civil law may differ between Church and State. So if same sex couples live together under so-called marriage vows, so be it. That’s their problem. The AB of San Francisco has been very friendly to MHR Church particularly the money received from collections, etc., so nothing will be done. Like most Church leaders, the AB uses big words but takes no action!!
The LEGALIZATION of same sex marriage is the problem of the entire society.
It undermines morality and promotes sodomy and immoral sexual conduct.
It negatively affects other laws such as the adoption of children, etc.
It also states to children and other impressionable persons that the homosexual lifestyle is a good and normal lifestyle.
If homosexuals want to be “together” in the privacy of their own home, that is their own business. (They have the free will to choose Heaven or Hell.)
When they force their sinful lifestyle to be accepted by the rest of society it affects everyone.
Those with same-sex attraction can get to Heaven if they live according to Sacred Scripture, and the “Catechism of the Catholic Church, second edition”.
This includes a life of Chastity.
We need to stop the sodomites and protect our boys:
There are two kinds of LOVE– human affections, based on human needs and desires– and GOD’S DIVINE LOVE!! Christian Marriage between one man and one woman, is not based merely on human affections and whims. It is based upon rock-solid Divine laws! Christian Marriage is a SACRAMENT!! It is meant to be a lifelong, unbreakable union, from which children will naturally come, at the hand of God! Marriage is PERMANENT– in good times and bad, in sickness and in health, a LOVE based on GOD, much higher and more mature, than the mere passing delights of human affections, or human love! Unnatural “LGBT” affections, as well as sick, wrongful, unnatural sex perversions– are NOT based on God’s Laws for human beings!! People who cannot properly marry, should give up on foolishness and self-delusion, and truly seek the Will of God, for their lives! God loves them, and He has a Divine Plan for their total happiness and sanctification, so that they may hope someday, for Salvation, and Heaven! For true success, our Archbishop needs to clearly establish the group Courage in his Archdiocese, for the suffering “LGBT” people. Then, he also needs to establish a rock-solid catechetical program, for all of his parishes and schools, to clearly teach and establish the Catholic Faith and morals, in everyone!
Abp Cordileone already does.
He is one of the “good” guys.
Here is the link on his San Francisco Diocese web site for “COURAGE”.
I agree PETE.
We should all deny gay families. Remember, to love the sinner, but hate the sin. Sometimes tough love is necessary, especially when a tough sinner is obstinate about cracking and giving into the will and law of God.
If the LGBT people, think they are suffering now, wait until they reach their after-life without true contrition for their sins! The fires and pains of hell are forever, and if Desmond Tutu prefers to go there than obey God’s laws, so be it for calling down his sentence upon himself.
Thank you Harvey. I agree with you.
Those who stand in the way of love will themselves have a “difficult” afterlife. Just remember that.
There is true love that only comes from Christ, which saves souls but the man made love created by sinful men, does not save souls.
That, Abeca, was a heretical statement. What you write might sound good, but Scripture is clear that all love is of God, and that God IS love. To say that man creates love is to make man a God, which is the sin of idolatry.
No Anonymous, you do not understand. Man creates his own love, false love. Love of money, love of idolatry, love of porn etc. Man creates his own love, man made love, like same sex marriage, like polygamy etc. I guess we are saying almost the same thing but in different examples. Perhaps you do not understand what I am saying. Does not matter to me. Just keep you focus on God. God bless you.
It seems that you are trying to say that people make false idols out of things like pornography. Is that what you are saying? So, yes, you could make an idol out of the concept of same-sex marriage, but if two people are in love and get married, that is not idolatry, and because it is love, it is of God.
1John 2:15-16 Do not love the world or the things in the world. If any one loves the world, love for the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh and the lust of the eyes and the pride of life, is not of the Father but is of the world.
Linda Maria, there already is a chapter of Courage in San Francisco. I can say that I have never ever once met a member of Courage. I don’t know where they meet because, ironically, they lack the courage to state publicly when and where they meet, but I am assured that there is such a group.
Seek and you shall find, YFC. But if one supposedly looks for something with their eyes closed and daggers out, chances are they will find nothing but their own agenda. Much like you have here.
AM, I pretty sure the expression “seek and you shall find” refers to the Kingdom of God, not to the local Courage chapter. I’m pretty sure the keys given to Peter were open the Kingdom of God, not to the local starbucks where courage probably meets.
Again, YFC, not a very good example of the charity you demand of others in understanding your particular circumstances.
True enough, YFC, but even Peter had to have the courage to use said keys instead of denying Christ by embracing human weakness in lieu of fortitude when he denied the Lord 3 times. Little steps, friend. Perhaps the ‘key’ you need is the Courage group – even if it is held at a lowly Starbucks.
God bless those true men who are humble enough to ask for each other’s aid in denying the flesh. That is true love and friendship.
Ann Malley, I’m confused by your first statement about using keys and embracing weekness and the threefold denial. But as to your second paragraph, we are agreed. My point is, if you have courage, then you would let you light shine and not hide it under a basket. Which is what courage does. Even twelve step groups publish their meeting times.
Then if your issue is with Courage’s lack of publicity, perhaps, considering your own situation, you could aid them in posting times after doing a little research. Help the ‘light to shine’ if you will, YFC. Don’t throw stones at those courageously encouraging each other to deny the flesh, something Christ calls all men and women to do. Otherwise you come off as a detractor.
Since, however, my posting ‘confused’ you, I suppose I’ll have to dial back the dialog a bit. But you did say you were a professor. I wonder how you get along?
Ann Malley, the point is that they won’t tell people who just randomly call up when and where Courage meets.
If you write more clearly, instead of using vague and convoluted sentences, that would help everyone understand your meanings.
…thank you for the editorial advice, YFC, but I’ve found that those with hidden agendas or just plain blinders on are the ones who are confused regarding what I post.
That said, your direct posts indicate that despite your seeming intention to poke fun at the peripheral of communicating meetings times/places, your real intention is to mock the Courage group. Since you’ve also posted incessantly about how you’ve been victimized for your homosexuality, I would gather that the ‘Courage’ group is also accustomed to being mocked for supporting God’s law and fighting the flesh, and likely by such as yourself.
And fyi,courage doesn’t imply stupidity or imprudence. I would venture there is a prudent reason ‘why’ the times/meetings are not as accessible to the general public as you may like. Harassment being one of them.
But again, you, a fellow sufferer with SSA and a purported Catholic, poke fun instead of helping. For shame, YFC. You get five stars for clarity of purpose. But where is your compassion?
Ann Malley, I’m pretty sure you cannot read minds and therefore you would have to read the narrative you made up about me in order to discern any intentions beyond what I wrote. If YOU have Courage meeting times and places, especially for San Francisco which is where I live, please post them. If you do that then this discussion can close and we don’t even have to discuss what my intentions are. But you would prefer to think ill of my intentions rather than deal with the point that Courage doesn’t have the courage to make publicly available their meeting times and places, unlike twelve step groups which are often posted in bulletins, calendars, websites, and church bulletin boards. Post the places and times and we can end this discussion.
…no need to guess at your intention, YFC, you promote homosexual sexual marriage all the time. That’s clear enough for anyone to read.
Your January 26, 2015 at 6:12 am post is right on target. The next thing you would see is large YFC yard signs that read ‘Your Fellow Catholic meet so and so’ with an arrow pointing to the houses of those who would be labeled as “inhibitors of diverse love.” YFC would like to then publicly harass them for being part of the courageous group who privately have no desire to publicly sell homosexuality, same sex marriage and homosexual adoption. These courageous men are only interested in not offending God. YFC is not there…. yet.
“…YFC is not there…. yet.” Well said, Anonymous.
A ridiculous accusation from anonymous at 4:05 PM
YFC, you can help by getting more information on ‘COURAGE’ within your own or neighboring Diocese – if there is a Chapter.
HERE is the web site for “COURAGE”
and for “EN-COURAGE”.
It includes an interactive map of the USA listing those Diocese who have Chapters.
Perhaps you can work with your Diocese Bishop to have him get a COURAGE Chapter started near you.
Helping others get to Heaven is truly loving your neighbor.
Posters have already told you which Bible verses and paragraphs in the CCC apply specifically to homosexuals and those with same sex attraction. So I won’t point them out again at this time.
There are local chapters here, as we’ve said before, but they won’t publish where they meet or when. This is a secret organization that hides itself ind dis-courages membership.
TED is right YFC has been told often and many have also been very encouraging him in what leads to good graces. YFC it doesnt matter if you think courage is done in secret etc. There is a good reason. There are homosexual activists discouraging and depending in the area, want to cause trouble for those who want help.
I’d be willing to bet that at least one of the reasons it is so private is because there aren’t very many people who go to them. There are 400,000 LGBT people in the Bay Area. Surely a successful program will have at least a few hundred people participating, if not a few thousand. If a priest in one parish has a lot of success with Courage in his parish, he’d tell his brother priests about the success they have, and they’d start a chapter. Isn’t it strange that with so many gay people in the Bay Area, there are only 2 priests working in this ministry. If it were so successful, there would be at least one or two public chapters, and dozens of parishes with chapters. Surely at least some of them would want to make Courage so appealing that they would want the ministry to be public and not something to be dis-couraged. Wouldn’t you think?
“…This is a secret organization that hides itself ind dis-courages membership.”
This is a lie, YFC, much like the purporting of your faithfulness to the Catholic Church and what She teaches when you pointedly stir up what you consider ‘homophobic’ dialogue here only to put it on your other website that supposedly exposes homophobia within the Catholic Church.
I would say go peddle your falsehoods elsewhere, but I do not wish your lies and anti-Christ agenda to be sold anywhere as we are called to truly love our neighbors. All of them.
Your Fellow Catholic, if you read your bible, read John 6:52 – etc Jesus the Bread of Life
…52Then the Jews began to argue with one another, saying, “How can this man give us His flesh to eat?” 53So Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in yourselves. 54″He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.…
There where many who walked away because they did not understand Jesus message and they thought how could we eat his flesh. Just like it takes courage to turn away from the sins of the flesh, Sins like sodomy are very serious. Not everyone is ready to seek God. Not everyone is willing to take up his cross and walk with Christ. Do not bother yourself with numbers but remember all it takes is just one person at a time. You sound angry by your comments here? Why are you so angry. Or do you feel insecure about it? Like anything new, anything that is true and good, for some its just difficult. Let Jesus be your true love. Right now, you are still resisting. But I trust in Jesus for your full conversion. I don’t see you as a threat because my trust is not in men but in Christ Jesus and He will take care of all these troubles we have no power over. We trust in His infallible word. His promises for all sinners of good will.
YFC, the Bay Area is probably so infected with people who are proud of sodomy and have zero desire to convert to the Truth. They would rather go their death beds dying of some disease rather than bow down to the Cross.
Thanks for the admonition to read the Bible, Abeca, and rest assured that I do. And I know that the Bible also says this: “You are the light of the world. A city set on a hill cannot be hidden; nor does anyone light a lamp and put it under a basket, but on the lampstand, and it gives light to all who are in the house. Let your light shine before men in such a way that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father who is in heaven.” Mt 5:14-16
My goodness YFC, you certainly can be mean-spirited for one who espouses tolerance and understanding.
We must never TOLERATE Mortal Sin of any kind.
As most posters know, “Your Fellow Catholic” (aka YFC) is a heretic who supports sodomy and gay marriage.
He loves and is married to his sin, and has no intention of changing at this time.
YFC attacks any Bishop, Priest or Lay person or organization that does not hold his view in support of homosexual acts, even in matters that apparently have nothing to do with homosexuality.
Everything he does promotes the homosexual lifestyle and attacks
even when it comes to voting, Courage, traditional dress of faithful Priests, etc.
I’m sorry you are so sensitive.
Your Fellow Catholic we are sensitive to serious sins. I pray that you will someday be sensitive too. Being sensitive is not a bad thing. Just think, sin is like a strong sting, when we are near serious sins, its like fire burning our skin, it hurts, its makes us run away from it. That is how it is to fear the Lord, because we do not want to hurt our Lord. What hurts Him, hurts us, it pains us to hurt Him and understand what the consequences are, which is the more we live in sin because we choose to, then the more it hurts our relationship with our Lord.
This is worth repeating:
” We must never TOLERATE Mortal Sin of any kind.
As most posters know, “Your Fellow Catholic” (aka YFC) is a heretic who supports sodomy and gay marriage.
He loves and is married to his sin, and has no intention of changing at this time.
YFC attacks any Bishop, Priest or Lay person or organization that does not hold his view in support of homosexual acts, even in matters that apparently have nothing to do with homosexuality.
Everything he does promotes the homosexual lifestyle and attacks
even when it comes to voting, Courage, traditional dress of faithful Priests, etc.”
This has to do with TRUTH, not sensitivity.
Either YFC is a heretic, or is Not a Catholic at all.
He hates the Catholic Faith, Sacred Scripture, and the CCC since belief in them would require him to stop supporting Sodomy and Homosexual Marriage.
So OF COURSE Paul goes personal. He is unable or unwilling to actually discuss facts, opinions, points of view, he has to go right to the jugular and claim that I hate the catholic faith, etc etc.
Let “Most posters know”: I am a catholic. I sit in the pews with you every week. Some weeks, when I get the chance, more than once a week. Many, many people who think the way I do sit on the other side of you in the same pew. We are human beings. We deserve to be treated with dignity, respect, and we will not be deterred by people who say the hateful things that people like Paul espouses. And, most of the people who actually love gay people, who love Christ and what he stands for, who love a participatory Church that engages the modern world where it actually IS instead of mourning some idyllic kodachrome 1950s world, have already left the pews because of clericalism, xenophobia, homophobia, sexism, and sexual abuse scandals that saw a recurrence under Joseph Ratzinger’s tenure in the curia and then the papacy.
Go ahead and mock people like me, but most of us got sick of this Church and left it for dead a decade ago. This causes me much pain.
YFC when I was praying for you last night, I kept thinking that you must feel a lot of hurt and anger when people post truthful comments exposing what you represent about homosexuality. Maybe even leading you to rebel, to grow more in pride? Producing stronger resistance and pride from you because of your inability to comprehend when they are done out of charity. God knows. I guess that it doesn’t matter because someday, when you repent, you will appreciate the warnings many gave you here. I look forward to that beautiful day, there will be a huge celebration for you, when you seek Christ and His ways.
Only our Lord knows your story, if you are really who you say you are? Or something else. Through these blogs, we just have to judge at face value.
Jesus will be with us till the end and those who seek him, either today or tomorrow, hopefully when it’s not too late, will get rewarded for their perseverance in all that Christ is. YFC is true what Paul posted about you and he posted it out out charity. He is not demonizing you, nor is he dehumanizing you either. He is stating facts from what we know here. But only God knows as well what is in the privacy of your home and heart, God is not fooled. Jesus is the truth. He loves you very much but you keep rejecting the many pearls that his beautiful Catholic faith has to offer to all repentant sinners.
YFC, some Catholic Diocese (like in SFO) have Courage information and contacts on their Diocese web site.
Those who have SSA (same sex attraction), or the family members of someone with SSA should call their Diocese office.
SFO Diocese web site:
Of course Archbishop Cordileone is right about true marriage.. God bless him for expressing the truth.
I can’t stand how sinful people think they can change things that are defined by both the Bible and Tradition.
Why, for thousands of years society has defined certain things as right which have worked across almost every culture in the history of the world. The Bible informs us in many passages the rules that apply, clearing showing how this lifestyle is part of God’s design.
Further, almost every society has had this institution and the traditional structure has been proved to work all across the world. Now, we have radical reformers screaming that something society has built for thousands of years is suddenly immoral, unjust and constitutionally unacceptable.
I have no understanding how people could reject the Bible condoned institution of slavery. Some people are better off owned by another. What would the such people who lack the mental faculties to take care of themselves do without a master to tell them what to do?
God, of course, has endorsed slavery in the bible in many passages and even approves of conquering warriors “taking” a woman from a conquered city and having sex with her. If she pleases him, then God allows him to take her as wife as we see in Deuteronomy 21:10-14.
Think of all the wonderful marriages that would never have come into being without the God-ordained practice of turning certain people into chattel? Don’t these radical reformers realize what they are throwing away by willy-nilly change and false empathy?
Don’t count out Deuteronomy quite yet. ISIS is keeping the flame alive by having revived the practices of stoning adulterers to death and slavery (with strict moral guidelines, of course)
Jon J., that law in Druteronomy 21: 10-14 might seem primitive by today’s more New Testament standards, but it was compassionate for its time. It did not allow for selling the woman as a slave if one divorced her as was being done in other societies at that time. You need to read about some of the things going on around in the other cultures around Israel at that time, such as temple prostitution of both women and men, child sacrifice in certain cases to pagan gods and goddesses, and you will find that those “primitive” Old Testament laws were mild by comparison. They put limits on what one could do such as an eye for an eye, instead of an arm and eye for an eye. Look at the laws for stealing in the Old Testament and compare it to some Shariah Laws now where a man’s hand or foot is cut off for stealing. And if you do not believe me, read some of the old pagan writings, such “The Epic of Gilgamesh” or the stories about Aserah or Istar or Baal, and see just how immoral their gods and goddesses and practices were by their own admission. please learn history before you write such misinformed posts.
Well, Anne T, I made the above post expecting to draw a response like yours. Of course you took the only position to defend the church: that the passages in the in Bibl e regarding slavery were an improvement on the prevailing morals of the time.
I must say I have always understood those passages in that light. However, now that you cannot reasonably withdraw from this position, I will now point out that this reality tells us someothing about the Old Testament.
God, clearly, utilitzed the process of “incrementalism” to bring the Hebrews closer to His will, realizing that a more complete revelation would break them. Thus, at least Old Testament rules are not necessarily perfect expression of God’s will for mankind, but communications designed to advance man’s understanding of God to a certain point.
Thus, Old Testment rules are not necessarily expressions of eternal perfection.
You, and apparenlty YFC have missed the point. I structured this arugment roughly like Cordileone’s case against gay marriage. Clearly, this logic did not apply to slavery and thus this argument is hardly definitive.
Your post was a clever one, JonJ, I appreciated it and I am pretty sure I understood it. Thanks for the contribution.
The devil is clever.
That Cordileone used a weak argument based on tradition and conformity to church authority doesn’t necessarily mean he is wrong about gay marriage. But, it does suggest he’s failing his primary purpose: which is to teach God’s truth to mankind.
His “it’s been that way for 2000 years” argument in every society does little to tell us WHY. I despise mindless authoritarianism—because an organization that achieves it usually abuses its power, as the Church has recently shown when it violated the trust placed in it by the faithful with their repeated cover-ups of the child abuse scandal over 30 years.
It is also ironic that you chose the “eye for an eye” passage as your example. From what I recall from my Comparitive Law course, that passage was paraphrased throughout legal codes in the middle east. You see it in the Code of Hammirabi, Hittite statutes, and the Old Testament (among others). The oldest known source seems to be the Code of Hammurabi.
Perhaps, Anne T, you can enlighten us with your vast scholarship in this area.
Jon J. the simple fact that two men or two women cannot produce a child is all that is needed to prove you are wrong as far as I am concerned. The simple fact that the plumbing does not work between two men and two women is a scientific fact that no fiction nor fictitious law can change. An elephant is still an elephant even if you insist it is a tiger. No man can ever be a mother and no woman can ever be a father. What you and so-called YFC are pushing is just a passing fad. End of discussion.
Correction to the sentence 9th from the bottom: All else is unbalanced and UNEQUAL.
Correction to last post: I meant that only marriage between one man and one woman is balanced and EQUAL. All else is unbalanced. Also, Thomas Jefferson used SOME Christian principals. That’s all.
JonJ, if you read the Bible and the CCC, you would know the answers to your questions.
JonJ also struggles a lot on precious truths. We pray for the conversion of all sinners.
A stubborn man will face badly in the end…A stubborn man will be burdened with sorrow; a sinner will heap sin upon sin. For the affliction of the proud man there is no cure…” sirach 3:17-28
“…be swift to hear, but slow to answer…Honor and dishonor through talking! A man’s tongue can be his downfall. Be not called a detractor; use not your tongue for calumny…” – sirach 5:11-17
“Say nothing harmful, small or great…A bad name and disgrace will you acquire; that for the evil man with double tongue!” -sirach 6:1-4
The ability to procreate isn’t really important to you, otherwise you would also believe that post-menstrual women, sterile men, and women born without a uterus (or had one surgically removed for health reasons) should not be married.
Clearly, the wrongness has to be related to chromosomes—and even that is quagmire, since the whole “God doesn’t make mistakes” becomes a pretty questionable assertion when you realize that genetic mosaics (people with XX cells and XY cells), various intersexed conditions caused by hormonal anomolies en utero, and other mixed anatomical morphologies exist in nature.
But hey, who cares about how God communicates to mankind through the nature of things—that might mean we can’t keep kicking those losers we’ve despised for years.
I feel that it is important to add that God does not judge the slave, for in Christ there is neither slave nor free (Galatians 3:8). Still, slaves should be subservient to their master, so says the Lord (Ephesians 6:5).
” just as Sodom and Gomor′rah and the surrounding cities, which likewise acted immorally and indulged in unnatural lust,
serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.”
While you are at it, Jon J., look up that real cool, cute loving god Moloch too. He just loved children — the ones horribly sacrificed to him.
It was the God of Israel who stopped the practice of Moloch worship. You know the one you think is an old meany.
JonJ, when reading the “Old Testament”, one must take all historical facts into account.
God did not approve the things you stated, but they happened.
In the Old Testament you will find the 10 COMMANDMENTS – which forbids most of the things you posted about. See Ex 20:5 and Deut 5:1-21.
You will clearly find that God punished many who broke His laws. God opposed slavery of the Jews.
* * * * * * There were some human traditions/actions that were CONTRARY to the law of God, and clearly those are not to be followed. * * * * * *
In addition to Gen 19:1-29 of the Old Testament,
in the NEW TESTAMENT you will find Rom 1:24-27; 1 Cor 6:10; 1 Tim 1:10; Jude 1:7 against Sodomy (homosexual acts / sodomy marriage).
Because there are people like you who are very confused, that is why in the Catholic Church we do not believe in Sola Scriptura (the Bible alone).
That is why we have the “Catechism of the Catholic Church, second edition” from the Magisterium which contains the Doctrine of our Faith.
CCC: 2357, 2358, 2359, & 2396 regarding homosexuals.
You might wish that were true. But that interpretation doesn’t wash.
Dueteronomy 21: 10-14 is not a historical book, its part of the Pentateuch. These were laws supposed given by God, This passage says:
“When you go out to war against your enemies and the LORD, your God, delivers them into your hand, so that you take captives,11 if you see a comely woman among the captives and become so enamored of her that you wish to have her as wife,12 you may take her home to your house. But before she may live there, she must shave her head and pare her nails. 13 and lay aside her captive’s garb. After she has mourned her father and mother for a full month, you may have relations with her, and you shall be her husband and she shall be your wife.14 However, if later on you lose your liking for her, you shall give her her freedom, if she wishes it; but you shall not sell her or enslave her, since she was married to you under compulsion.
Here the Bible allows a victorious warrior to rape a woman he has captured.
Either the prophets: 1) got it wrong, 2) purposefully distorted inspiration from God, (probably to serve the King’s interest), 3) incrementalism, or 4) mistranslation at some point.
The Bible, however, clearly purports that this law came from God, thus your “not approved” is simply you refusing to accept an uncomfortable truth.
Why did His Excellency schmooze with the leaders of New Ways Ministry at their Maryland HQ last December (including photo-ops) and do the same with DignityUSA in San Francisco last fall?
New Ways Ministry Builds Bridges with Archbishop Cordileone
Fulfilling a promise he made last summer, Archbishop Salvatore Cordileone of San Francisco met with New Ways Ministry’s Francis DeBernardo and Sister Jeannine Gramick on Monday, December 15, 2014, to help enrich understanding of each other’s approaches to marriage equality and LGBT issues.
To learn about their issues, and therefore the best way to teach them and other homosexuals the TRUTH.
That homosexual acts are Mortal Sins and can never be permitted.
Warren Memlib, ask the Abp yourself.
Thank you for the informative post. From the looks of those happy photo ops It certainly seems that Kenneth Fisher was right about New Ways Ministry probably now being invited to the REC. Our shepherds are not learning from St. Peter Damian. How about a “new way” to remain consistent when condemning these groups that have caused so much ongoing destruction in the Catholic Church? These dissenters are NOT the least bit interested in conforming to Church teaching. They are trying to reform the Church to accept the “gifts” of homosexuality. This ongoing dialogue with these dissenters is ridiculous. Is there also a New Ways Ministry for adulterers to learn a new way of how to finally come out of the closet from living a double life as a serial cheater in order to convince the Church that adultery is really just sharing more diverse love as a “gift” and “quality” and that as another special kind of unique situation this group also needs tenderizing coddling with ongoing tenderizing dialogue to not discourage the proud and the out heterosexual and bisexual adulterer who shows absolutely no remorse or interest in stopping his sinful adulterous behavior. St. Peter Damian, (who courageously spoke the full and hard truth without the need or notion to be tenderized) please pray for us sinners.
Seems like a good move for Abp. Cordileone to meet with New Ways Ministry.
You’re right that they have no interest in conforming to Church teaching on homosexuality, and little regard for it. But that’s equally true of the vast majority of layfolk in the SF Archdiocese.
Cordileone’s appointment has been seen as a political move, and profoundly ironic… an architect of Prop 8 and someone who spends a lot of his time as an activist for anti-gay causes heading an archdiocese that could not be further from the worldview he represents… It’s like appointing the CEO of Goldman Sachs to head the SEC.
He needs to maintain a dialogue in order to understand and not completely alienate his own archdiocese. Dialogue is a good thing. He’s doing fine.
Dialogue is a wonderful thing, especially when you are not dialoguing with a concrete wall for well over twenty or thirty years. Please click on that photo op and it looks just like the Cardinal Timothy Dolan “doing fine” photo op at the Al Smith dinner. Now I realize that Archbishop Cordileone has never pulled a “BRAVO” and he has courageously stood up in defense of marriage but you can be sure that these big smiling happy photo ops will be used to work in the same way that also helped Obama to be re-elected into the White House and all under the guise of charity and dialogue. There should not have been a big happy photo op session that can be used to cause confusion. Archbishop Cordileone has the authority to say no to photo ops that can be misused.
Our Lord was not political. Do you think it is possible to have a dialogue without the big smiling public photo ops that will be used in ways that the Archbishop might not have intended? Will these dissenters also show these photo ops to the uncatechized and trusting as proof that the Church is moving right along with their Family Synod friends so they can show the great progress they’re making in reforming all of these haters? After all they can tell the trusting, ” Wow, just look at the Archbishop… he’s happily smiling too at all of our progressive suggestions.
Hugh, Why do you think that Jesus said, “But let your ‘Yes’ be ‘Yes’ and your ‘No’ be ‘No.’ Whatever is more than these is of the evil one?” – Matthew 5:37
continued for Hugh
Hugh, I sincerely believe that people respect you much more when you remain firm and steadfast in upholding Church teaching. They may not like you but that is not the goal. Yes maintaining a dialogue is important but what seems like a good move to men in not what is always seen as a good move by God. You can meet and be sincere and cordial in a privately held meeting but to be happily smiling right along in these photo ops is above and beyond the call and I believe that this is Jesus was talking about in that Scripture verse.
“Hugh your right about maintainging dialogue.” = Abeca thinks maintaining dialogue means calling someone “slime” = Not consistent… More flip flopping.
Hugh your right about maintainging diologue especially in those parts where homosexuality is taking over and destroying souls. We need to be ahead a few steps ahead in order to win souls. We need to pray because i can bet that the spiritual battles are tremendously hostile to good people of faith.
Warren Memlib, thank you for sharing that link. It was very infomative. Too many interesting sentences to post.
Please click the link on Warren’s post and read it. Also in the 4th paragraph from the bottom, click on “list of suggestions” to go to an open letter to Cardinal George telling him how to better address LGBT issues.
Crystal Clear Backpedaling
The latest Gaystapo Thought Police target is ironically one of the first actors to play a homo-anal coprophile on TV – Billy Crystal.
Crystal’s replacement as Academy Award MC is Uber-Misogynist / Homo-Anal Icon – ‘Doggie Hoser’ (neal p. harris)- whose incredibly vile misogynistic slurs in the ‘Harold & Kumar’ movie made him a Hollyweird darling.
Crystal latest comments have the celebrity ‘A-List’ lynch mob enraged:
“Billy Crystal thinks gay scenes on TV are ‘pushing it too far’ and hopes shows don’t ‘shove it in our face’
National Post Staff | 1/19/15
You have to wonder what he thinks of Neil Patrick Harris stealing his old Oscar gig… Especially now
Actor Billy Crystal (Academy Awards host nine times) in 25 years…
said at the Television Critics Association press tour… that he believes gay scenes on television are “pushing it” and that “sometimes I think, ‘Ah that’s too much for me,’ ”
…Now, though, Crystal finds he’s become a bit squeamish for how gay life is presented on TV. although he wasn’t willing to get into the specifics:
“Sometimes, it’s just pushing it a little too far for my taste and I’m not going to reveal to you which ones they are,” Crystal said …
“I hope people don’t abuse it and shove it in our face … to the point where it feels like an every day kind of thing.”
YFC and others, there are 13 Chapters of COURAGE in CA spread throughout the State.
Most have Chapters of “ENCOURAGE” as well for the families of homosexuals. This support group is most helpful.
It is important that we help those with same sex attraction get to Heaven.
Pass on the info about “Encourage”.
When and where do they meet, Sidney?
Whom to contact – for when and where they meet is on their web site – specific to their 13 California locations.
Also the SFO COURAGE contact info is on the Diocese web site.
Please read, you have already been provided the links with this information.
Contact information is not the same as saying when and where they meet. This is a secretive group that is afraid to come out.
YFC plan on organizing a mob???
They don’t need to be hassled by the evil and radical homosexuals.
Further, their private lives are absolutely NONE of YOUR BUSINESS !
If you are interested in attending “COURAGE” or “ENCOURAGE” the information is available as posted by others.
The information is not secretive, so stop lying YFC.
No mobs. No invasion of “private lives”. I’m not going to go around from city to city and even check out whether there is anybody in the room.
I’m just guessing that the fact that there are so few chapters, the fact that they are afraid to say when and where they meet, the fact that I have never once met someone active in Courage or Encourage…all these facts lead me to wonder why they hide in the shadows, if in fact, they have Good News to share.
It’s a little like parishes that dismantle the confessionals because people might realize that their fellow catholics commit sin and need forgiveness. Confessionals don’t expose the private lives of sinners, they stand as testament to the mercy of Christ. So why discourage Courage by shoving it into a dark broom closet?
Paul good comments. YFC he is correct. Im just trying to figure out why you feel the need to say such things? Have some respect. You expect respect of homosexuals yet you do not give it to the homosexuals who attend courage or encourage. Stop resisting and seek help for your same sex attraction, if your not ready, then please stop discouraging those who want help and seek to have a loving relationship with our Lord. YFC you are better then this. Turn away from sin. Jesus paid a high price for our sins. You just need to cooperate with graces. Dont let ugly pride lead you. I will continue to pray for you. What seems impossible in our eyes its not impossible for our Lord. Have faith and trust more in our Lord.
YFC you have a lot of anger, don’t you?
No of course I’m not planning a mob. But let it to you Canisius for accusing me of things that are no where in site.
I can’t figure out why you think I am being disrespectful, or trying to stand in the way of Courage. If you read what I write, i think Courage should have the courage to be more public with its ministry. Would I do that if I weren’t respectful or were trying to stand in the way of Courage?
I’m sorry YFC if I misunderstood, Ill pray about it and re-read your comments on this. May I suggest to you to please pray the rosary and then go back and re-read what you posted, asking our Lord to guide you. Just try to take my guidance on being a good pupil and be teachable. God bless you for our Lord is merciful and patient with all sinners. I place you in God’s hands.
Speaking of Timely Reporting… It seems that like the Destruction of Scouting in Germany in the 1930s (forcing all to join the ‘hitler youth’…
‘Our’ modern Turkey Baster Creationist Courts are following their lead.
Perhaps a ‘Re-Naming’ is in order here too:
Maybe to the State Senator Mark “Kiddie Porn King” scouters…
Or Perhaps the Larry Brinkin / Terry Bean ‘Boys’.
SEE San Francisco’s Gay Icon Larry Brinkin Guilty of Felony Child Porn Possession:
HOMOSEXUAL HRC FOUNDER ARRESTED FOR RAPING 15-YEAR-OLD BOY
Some California judges object to Boy Scout order
SAN FRANCISCO (January 26, 2015) –
The California Supreme Court’s unanimous decision to prohibit state judges from belonging to the Boy Scouts and other youth groups that practice what it calls “invidious” discrimination against gays came against the wishes of some jurists with children who are Boy Scouts or who are active in Scouting themselves.
The Los Angeles Times reports that several sitting judges wrote to oppose the new membership policy before the court approved it on Friday.
Among them was San Joaquin County Superior Court Barbara Kronlund, who said that as the mother of a Boy Scout the policy would be an “infringement of my right to free exercise of religion as guaranteed by the First Amendment.”
Riverside County Superior Court Judge John Vineyard commented that his being an Eagle Scout and Scoutmaster was in no way incompatible with serving on the bench.
The Boy Scouts of America started allowing openly gay boys to be Scouts last year, but does not permit gay adults to be leaders.
Anne T Crust
It’s clear that the ‘Anonymous committee’ for promoting Gaystapo Propaganda trashing this board has numerous members – many probably sharing the same ‘screen name’…
Partly because they are simply too craven to openly identify themselves (and thus their paymasters / sponsors), and partly so as to keep the stream of (Anti-Catholic / Anti-Scientific) drivel at a constant flow via self admiring tag teams.
The ‘JJ Klown’ is obviously a take on the ‘John Jay University’ boondoggle – costing million$ to produce a ‘study’ whose results were as politically predictable as Sophistry at sunrise in Academentia.
As regards Slavery – pompous pedantic panels of such buffoons notwithstanding – this long standing ‘tradition’ reaches from today’s Boko Haram Butchers – far far back.
For instance Norsemen gone ‘Viking’ (a verb) took slaves from Ireland for sale in the middle east; and some of the earliest slaves in the ‘new world’ were Irish too.
Alas – growing up in cold climates & burning lobster red in tropical sun proved them less suitable candidates than Africans.
Slavery has often been the ‘choice’ of defeated peoples (Jewish Slaves mostly built the Roman Coliseum after destruction of the Temple in Jerusalem) – Vs. say Crucifixion.
“Give me liberty or Death’ is not just an American Slogan, but a reality of the world long before Christ.
Hence – Biblical discussion of Slaves is not endorsement by God, but a reality of the world Jesus dealt with.
Omitting mention would simply mimic other Homosex Hypocrisy here.
Well, I don’t much mind being called JJ Klown. Getting respect from Mikey McDimWitt, who apparently learned durig his so-called legal education that stringing together enough ad hominems makes a substansive argument, would be very insulting.
On the other hand, Mikey McDimWitt’s contempt is like praise from Heaven. (Btw, I indulged in an ad hominem just to demonstrate that it takes no particular cleverness to hurl ad hominems).
Now, Mikey also says God doesn’t endorse slavery in the BIble. That’s a pretty hard argument to make when all throughout the Pentatuech you see many rules that the prophets purport to have been revealed by Yaweh, about how the Israelites were to treat their slaves. If God were against slavery, that would be like God telling today’s doctors the proper way to conduct abortions.
If God does not approve of slavery, then you pretty much have to accept that the prophets got parts of the Pentateuch wrong.
Unless, of course, you want to postulate an arbitrary and capricious God—with which, I suspect, Mikey McDimWitt would have no problem.
Michael McDermott, I do not know what you mean by the “Crust” after my name, but I do understand now what you mean by “JJ Klown” after going back and reading some of his posts again. I also understand what you mean concerning slavery. Many of the Egyptian tombs and so forth have pictures of blonde-haired slaves on them. Some people say they were Jewish slaves, probably of the Northern tribes in Israel, but they could also have been people from the celtic territories who were most likely other pagans at that time.
Crusty Clowning meant no harm.
Ann T – I was simply making a pun (after my own idiosyncratic idiom) with the ‘Anne T Crust’ title, which I thought might liven up the discourse.
I in no way meant to offend you (If I ever do, there will be little doubt) but was making a play on words with the JJKlown and similarities to the agenda and tactics of the Anti – You Know Who.
Admittedly my ‘sense of humor’ can be a bit ‘Pythonesque’ at times (the movie ‘Monty Python & the Holy Grail’ remains a favorite – and even some scenes from ‘The Life of Brian’ still give me a chuckle).
Admittedly Catholicism has never been known for its Humor, which Is something of a shame in that it can be an effective medium for reaching those for whom Dirges and the Like are not on their pop list.
Still – Mockery is always the pitfall waiting (George Carlin has by now found out just how ‘funny’ God viewed his often blasphemous routines) waiting to trap the unwary.
Regardless – Nothing Personal, just a quasi humorous title and a ‘Crust’ to chew on for those hungry for ‘truthiness’ – kind of like rooting around the remains of a depleted pizza box – only without the cardboard.
YFC do me a favor. Can you please rent the movie St. Bakhita. Please watch it then reply. This African flower, who knew the anguish of kidnapping and slavery, bloomed marvelously in Italy, in response to God’s grace, with the Daughters of Charity. https://www.vatican.va/news_services/liturgy/saints/ns_lit_doc_20001001_giuseppina-bakhita_en.html
She was a slave, she understood how it was to be someone else property. The things she had to endure. Just like those who are willingly or unknowingly are slaves to fleshly sins, its hard to for humans to escape or see what their sins are doing with their relationship with Christ but even though she was a slave and was treated badly, she did not let that stop her from getting to know and love Jesus. She chose not to sin and for that, God protected her. God can also protect those who suffer with same sex attractions, if they choose Jesus and not their homosexuality. Choose wifely. God bless you. St. Bakhita pray for us.
“O Lord, if I could fly to my people and tell them of your goodness at the top of my voice, oh how many souls would be won!”
~St Josephine Bakhita
YFC I hope you have time for this.
My family went through so many divorces and separations, it makes my dizzy to even remember it!
But, what I DO remember is the joy my sisters and I had when we had ONE mom and ONE dad, and Mother got to stay home and work there, raising a family, making sure we got healthy meals and holy guidance.
If only EVERY child on the planet could have this blessing: ONE mother, ONE father, and them together until death do them part.
Im sorry for what you had endure. Praise God that you have a good heart, one that understands the importance of children having one mom and dad. Of parents working hard to keep it together.