“Provocative act”

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 3:37 AM By Jenny
As stated by Times, the pope’s decision to create an Anglican-use ordinariate was “not because of traditional theological differences” is incorrect. The theological differences are the focus and the main issue as Christians believe that the Holy Scriptures do not sanction same-sex sexual relationships. Christians believe that such sexual relationships are outside of God’s Order. Ordaining a Gay person to the priesthood would be to accept homosexuality as normal. All persons should be treated with respect and God loves each one of us. The Catholic Church is richer with the new Anglican rite, just as it is richer with Greek Catholic, Cope Catholics, etc. Our Lord has opened the door for Christians seeking to live by the Holy Scriptures, be it as an Anglo-Catholic, an Orthodox or a Protestant denomination faithful to the Bible.

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 5:52 AM By Juergensen
Satan hates it when souls return to the Catholic Church.

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 5:55 AM By Mac
Although the bigotry and hatred by the secular media seems rediculous, they know that they can help to shape public opinion of the uneducated. Their hatred of the Catholic Church which opposes sodomy and other moral and sexual sins is clearly seen. It is really none of their business what we believe since they are not Catholic themselves. Lastly, there is no law about separation of Church and State. The US Constitution, Amendment 1 only says: “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof.” Many journalists these days are liars and pushing their own politcal and immoral social agendas.

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 6:01 AM By Warren Goddard
“debates within and among Christian churches”? There no such things as “Christian churches”. Furthermore, there is no religion called Christianity and there never has been such a religion. There is and always has been the Church, and various heresies proceeding from a rejection of some of the Church’s doctrines by men who still desire to retain the rest of her teaching and morals. When St. Peter appointed Ignatius Bishop of Antioch (A.D. 69) the Church was still called but the Church, as in “And he is the head of the body, the church” Colossians 1:18. Bishop Ignatius wrote a letter in Greek to the faithful, and in contradistinction to dissidents existing even at that early time, he addressed it to the Church Universal — the Katholikos Ecclesiam –the Catholic Church. So from then until now there exists but the Colossians 1:18 Body of Christ Church and separate non-Catholic religions.

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 6:07 AM By Harry
My understanding of the events referred to in the editorial is that some Anglican congregations were so disgusted with their Church’s unqualified embrace of everything liberal and secular that they decided to abandon it and seek to join the Church. Whole congregations sought to do this. The Roman Church responded by setting up the ordinariate and an agreement was reached whereby the Anglicans in question could join the Roman Church. That is bitter news for the Times. The belief at that august institution is that everything liberal is good and everything traditional has had its day and lost its appeal – the opposite to what is happening in the Roman Catholic, Anglican dialog. How does the Times explain it? Why the Roman Church is ‘poaching’, engaging in ‘provocative’ acts etc. That she might be accommodating the genuine religious needs of some Anglicans is out of the question.

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 6:08 AM By Sandra
Our Lord continues to “gather” His flock. Together, Christians will be able to turn back the evil that has premeated our culture and our churches. The faithful will band together as His disciples and fight the ‘good” fight!

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 7:25 AM By Bud 
The LA Times article is attempting to interject “separation of church and state” into the “hot button issues”. How stupid can an article be? Catholics and members of other churches are all voters, so obviously would affect public voting as it should. Those that chose to leave the Episcopal Church after some of their members decided to re-interpret their basic moral laws by gaining control of their church and quickly implemented these new interpretations to suit themselves.

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 7:56 AM By Dan
So the culture wars manifest themselves in the Church as well as society at large. Is the LA Times author scared of a little theology, and people acting on what they believe?

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 8:04 AM By JMJ
It seems that this educated person is showing his/her complete lack of knowledge concerning the Kingdom of God & just what does this wonderful event have to do with the artificial “separation of church & state that the ACLU came up with? Not a thing!! +JMJ+

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 8:21 AM By PatC
The secular media loves conflict…. it sells papers and brings in viewers, which in turn sells ad space and generates profits. This stand by the LAT is a no brainer. They are stoking the flames on a “hot-button” issue to get their readers spun up. They are quite good at it and their readers swallow it all.

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 8:27 AM By charlio
This goes much higher than The LA Times. (Some famous character asked a train porter for a paper. When given the LA Times, he replied, “I asked for a NEWSPAPER!”) La Stampa’s “Vatican Insider” (“The Holy Office: A seat for three”, 1/16/2012), reports “the Pope is also considering the possibility of choosing an English speaking Prefect [for the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith], which would continue the tradition begun with the appointment of William Levada, an American. This reason for this potential latter choice can be found in the experience gained by the experience gained from CDF, following the publication of the apostolic constitution, Anglicanorum coetibus, towards the end of 2009. This makes possible the establishment of a number of Anglo-Catholic ordinariates, in order to welcome not just single priests or bishops into communion with the Roman Catholic Church, but also entire Anglican communities. There is one English speaking figure in the Roman Curia, who has worked in CDF: that is, the Secretary of the Congregation for Divine Worship, the American Archbishop, Joseph Augustine Di Noia. The 68 year old Dominican was under secretary of the former Holy Office between 2002 and 2009 and so for three years, worked as the then cardinal, Joseph Ratzinger’s, number three man. But it is likely that different possibilities will be taken into account when evaluating potential candidates from English speaking Countries.”

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 8:34 AM By Catherine
Poaching or Wisdom? “The beginning of Wisdom is to Fear the Lord” Sirach 1:14 …In due season there will even be converts poached from the LA Times after they witness what their godless agenda has wrought.

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 9:27 AM By joe
“The culture wars outside (Churches) have come to dominate debates within…” That is the language of the LA Times, NY Times, and SF Chronicle. Here’s the translation: Culture wars = Gay Marriage, Gay Pastors, Gay Bishops, and a Gay oriented liturgy. Since the Catholic Church does not promote Gay Marriage, Gay Bishops, and abortion, they are held to be “provocative” (Translation, the Newspapers mean the Church is evil and despicable). Conclusion: Our so-called community newspapers hate the Church, and everything it stands for. Don’t look for any changes. They dream and hunger for tossing Catholics to the Lions.

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 10:03 AM By Philippe
Why anybody cares about the moanings to come from places like the L.A. Times and their ilk is beyond me.

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 10:07 AM By Deacon Vince
Another reason to ignore The Los Angeles Times view in its politically correct fantasyland.

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 10:34 AM By scub
I don’t subscribe to the LA Times because they are far too liberal for me. I don’t believe in their socialist leanings. I stopped taking the LA Times and now subscribe to a more accurate and honest news source. Yet, the Times continually solicits me to re-subscribe. Episcopals are leaving that church because it has strayed way outside the bounds of accurate Christian theology. As such, Episcopals are returning home to Catholicism, which has managed to stay true to Traditional and Biblical principles. The Catholic Church is not soliciting for Episcopals to come to the Church, but merely accommodating those who wish to join. I’m sure that if the LA Times returned to ethical standards of journalism they would have to establish or expand it’s subscription offices in order to handle the demand of those of us who might wish to return. Other news sources would then refer to the LA Times as provocatively courting conservatives. – I don’t understand how the LA Times writers can refer to themselves ‘journalists.’ With articles such as this, I have another name for them.

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 10:49 AM By MacDonald
Oh, for goodness’ sake! What did they expect us to do when Anglicans wanted to join our Church? Tell them, “Sorry, but we are full?” When a Russian Orthodox Christian joins the Catholic Church, he becomes not a Roman Catholic, but a Russian Catholic, to better respect the tradition from which he comes — we’re just doing the same sort of thing for the Anglicans.

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 10:57 AM By swib
It is critical for the LATimes and homosexual activists to try to stop the “poaching” of Episcopalians who are leaving their churches anyway. By seeing the exodus of Episcopalians from their churches — also Lutherans from the ELCA and others — as “poaching,” they admit their view that they see such congregants as in fact just cattle with brands on them. This is the view of those who dislike freedom, especially the freedom to walk away from that which they do not like. More power to the ordinariates around the world, and, this encouragement comes from a Jew writing you from another country. May you go from strength to strength in this.

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 11:08 AM By frcorny
Read it? No thanks. I would probably barf.

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 12:01 PM By Clinton
Heaven forbid the Catholic Church reaches out to bring those separated from Her back home, eh LA Times? In this, the week of Christian Unity, let us pray for those outside of the One, Holy, Apostolic Church to hear the Lord’s call to return to the fold, to return to the Church He founded upon St. Peter. +JMJ+

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 1:25 PM By Canisius
Who cares what anyone at this secular rag thinks, we already know they are enemies of Christ and His Church…..

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 4:01 PM By JLS
The L. A. Times has not been a newspaper for a long time now, but rather a marketing and advertising paper … although a thick one.

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 8:43 PM By cjo
The “Theology” Dept at the LA Times is at it again. This is another example of why we stopped our subscription several years ago !!!

Posted Wednesday, January 18, 2012 10:15 PM By Maryanne Leonard
Poaching Episcopalians is better than frying mackerel snappers, but the combination is divine.

Posted Thursday, January 19, 2012 7:27 AM By Larry
This may be an exercise of the LA Times Magisterium–i.e., the publisher and the editors in union with him.

Posted Thursday, January 19, 2012 8:18 AM By Doc Mugwump
Christ prayed that “they” may all be “one” – the “they” are all the members of his Mystical Body. All Christians are called into a Communion in Christ. This is only possible through the action of the Holy Spirit. We applaud the Holy Father for opening up new channels of communion. We applaud those Chrisitans from the Protestant denominations who see in the Catholic Church their “rightful home”. We rejoice in this unity which the Holy Spirit is bringing about. The enemies of Christ don’t like it because truly it represents a new movement of Christianity in the world; that movement of love and witness to the Son of God which can “set the world” on fire and bring all into the Communion of the Father’s family. Score 10 for the Kingdom of God on this one!

Posted Thursday, January 19, 2012 3:43 PM By Anne T.
I think the LA Times has it backward. They are the ones being provocative.

Posted Thursday, January 19, 2012 7:10 PM By JLS
Communion is effected through the Sacrament of Holy Communion … prayer circles don’t quite make it in this respect, nor do various and sundry legal devices drummed up now and then. To provide an inference that the Holy Spirit unites apart from the Sacrament is an interesting and intriguing concept, and one which Martin Luther and John Calvin and Zwingli made great use of.

Posted Thursday, January 19, 2012 9:10 PM By Doc Mugwump
Christ prayed that “they” may all be “one” – the “they” are all the members of his Mystical Body. All Christians are called into a Communion in Christ. This is only possible through the action of the Holy Spirit. We applaud the Holy Father for opening up new channels of communion. We applaud those Chrisitans from the Protestant denominations who see in the Catholic Church their “rightful home”. We rejoice in this unity which the Holy Spirit is bringing about. The enemies of Christ don’t like it because truly it represents a new movement of Christianity in the world; that movement of love and witness to the Son of God which can “set the world” on fire and bring all into the Communion of the Father’s family. Score 10 for the Kingdom of God on this one!

Posted Friday, January 20, 2012 6:11 AM By JLS
The Holy Spirit urges us towards the Sacrament of Holy Communion, which is the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus Christ; reception of this Sacrament while in a state of grace unites us with the fullness of God. There is no other Sacrament nor no other way that does this, other than perhaps the special case of martyrdom.

Posted Friday, January 20, 2012 7:10 AM By Deacon Chris
As an Australian Anglican Catholic I need to point out a couple of things. First, while unity is an aim for all Christians, it must never be at the cost of truth. Second, while many may see in the formation of the Ordinariates a “coming home”, the current Roman Communion is NOT the same Church which the Church of England separated from. Both have changed immensely, and not all the changes on either side have been faithful. I do truly pray that my Anglican brothers and sisters find the security they are seeking, but one thing is clear: they will no longer be Anglicans, but rather groups of people who are permitted to keep some undetermined Anglican “traditions” under leaders appointed for them. Members of the Ordinariate will be Catholics. Their decision is to leave the Anglican Communion and come into the Catholic Church, in full communion with the Pope.” (Catholic Herald UK Jan 2011) This is certainly not the same as the example given by MacDonald regarding Russian Catholics who join a Byzantine Rite church sui juris in full union with the Catholic Church with its own liturgies and hierarchy – this was specifically excluded from the Apostolic Constitution. The Ordinariates are not a Church, and they are not a “communion” in the Anglican sense. It is a pity that so much misinformation is still published instead of being open and truthful with each other.

Posted Friday, January 20, 2012 6:41 PM By JLS
Why some persist in believing that union with God is achieved through legal ramblings remains an astonishing phenomenon. Sacrament of the Real Presence is consumed by the faithful Communicant, by means of eating the Real Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus Christ: God unites Himself with the faithful in this manner. Those who do not comprehend this fact are vulnerable to the “spiritualization” of it by the Protestants. It is critical to believe that Jesus Christ died bodily on the Cross and arose bodily from the grave and ascended bodily into Heaven. “Spiritualizing” any aspect of this grace is wandering away from the path towards Heaven.

Posted Saturday, January 21, 2012 7:24 AM By Larry
Deacon Chris: I’m not sure whether the term “Anglican Catholic” means “Roman Catholic” or just “High-Church Anglican,” so you might want to clarify your self-identification so there is no misunderstanding. As for the Roman Church not being the “same” Church from which the Anglican broke away–it is indeed the same, in doctrine and sacraments. It has changed only in liturgical forms, and the idea behind the Ordinariate is to conceed to former Anglicans the right to a liturgy closer to the one with which they are familiar, rather than forcing them into the Novus Ordo cold turkey. You say that unity must never come at the cost of the truth. Under the Ordinariate, it will not. But I would hope that former Anglicans, with the grace of the Holy Spirit, would be able to make the distinction between form and substance, and not allow differences in form to deter them.

Posted Saturday, January 21, 2012 7:57 AM By jon
Contrary to JLS, the Sacrament of the Eucharist is the Church’s sacrament, not anyone else’s. The Church has every right to regulate the manner, the minister, the liturgy of its Sacraments. It has every right to promulgate Canon Law.

Posted Monday, January 23, 2012 9:55 PM By JLS
jon, try reading what I post more accurately so that you do not falsify what I say.

Posted Monday, January 23, 2012 11:36 PM By Abeca Christian
Some people just don’t listen, their ears are deaf and their eye’s do not work.

Posted Monday, January 23, 2012 11:40 PM By Abeca Christian
From Douay-Rheims Bible: Proverbs 28:9 “He that turneth away his ears from hearing the law, his prayer shall be as abomination. “.

Posted Monday, January 23, 2012 11:47 PM By Abeca Christian
Read St. Augustin’s City of God and Christian Doctrine: Nicene and Post-Nicene … By St Augustine. It is full of wisdom and beauty. You will fall in love with the words that sound like music worshiping and honoring God in everyday! Praise Be Jesus Christ! Sweet love, sweet words! May God almighty open our eye’s, our ears and our hearts to His every way!

Posted Tuesday, January 24, 2012 6:16 PM By Abeca Christian
JLS lets pray for one another so this insanity stops, too many do not speak the same language of truth, why are our words come across as false to them? All this confusion is not from our Lord, it is from an evil rooted in man, SIN. God have mercy on us all, may we weep for the sins we are committing, may our eye’s and ears work properly, spiritually and then everything else will be clear. May we turn to Christ to see through His eye’s and ears, and most of all His heart! Keep on JLS. You are a good gentleman and a soldier of Christ!

Posted Tuesday, January 24, 2012 6:50 PM By JLS
It is only a temporal right, jon. Eternally it is a grace bestowed on the Church, an act of charity given the Church for the shepherding of the faithful and the discipling of the nations.

Posted Tuesday, January 24, 2012 11:13 PM By Abeca Christian
Shed tears oh my love, tears for what we have become without God! Only our Lord will turn those tears into precious pearls when we become what God will’s when we embrace God!