Two days after Kevin Kwong flew home to California from New York Pride, his hands were so itchy it woke him up. He thought it was eczema.
“Everything started rapidly getting worse,” Kwong said. “I started to get more spots on my face, more redness and [the spots] started leaking fluid. The rash expanded to my elbows and my hands and my ankles.”
As the U.S. monkeypox outbreak continues to expand, people who may be positive are grappling with an unprepared health system, while at the same time suffering from debilitatingly painful skin lesions. Kwong’s frustrating experience at urgent care clinics, virtual appointments and two emergency rooms in search of an accurate diagnosis was plagued with dead ends and delays.
“Your body is being taken over by this thing that you don’t understand. And you have nowhere to go, so it’s both painful and terrifying,” Kwong said.
Kwong initially treated the rash himself with the topical steroids he uses for eczema. When that didn’t work, he made his first virtual visit from his home in Emeryville, California. The nurse diagnosed him with herpes, and prescribed an antiviral medication.
Over the next few hours the rash quickly spread to more of his body. Alarmed, Kwong went in person to an urgent care clinic. The doctor agreed with the herpes diagnosis, and added another — scabies.
“My spots were concentrated on my hands and my wrists and feet and elbows, which are prime locations for scabies,” Kwong said.
The urgent care doctor didn’t think it was monkeypox — Kwong’s spots were clustered together and looked different from the monkeypox rash pictures the doctor had seen.
“Depending on where I was with my symptoms, and who I was speaking to, I was getting different answers,” Kwong said. “I’m learning through this experience that dermatologists work like bankers hours. So it’s really hard to get in touch with one if it’s not standard hours.”
Over the July 4th holiday weekend, Kwong frantically reached out to anyone he thought could help get him answers as his symptoms worsened.
“I tried to contact doctors, I knew friends of friends who were dermatologists. And I was scheduling lots of remote visits with my provider to try to speak with nurses and physician assistants. Just trying to get a proper diagnosis of what was happening to me. Because after each time I spoke with someone, I just got rapidly worse. And it was really freaky,” Kwong said.
During another virtual appointment in the middle of the night, a nurse noticed the rash had spread toward his eyes and told him to go to the emergency room immediately. It was there that doctors said Kwong may have monkeypox. But they were unprepared to handle a potential case.
“They were researching while I was in this [patient] room, and back and forth on the phone at the CDC. I expected myself, as a patient, to be in the dark, but I didn’t realize how little information was also given to providers and how unprepared they were as well,” he said.
His lesions were swabbed, but the monkeypox test result wouldn’t come back for at least a week. He spent 12 hours in the emergency room before being sent home. They told him to come back if he developed a fever or started vomiting
“At this point, I was just miserable. I had sores in the back of my throat, in my mouth all over my body,” he said. “I was just delirious because I couldn’t sleep more than an hour or two at any given time.”
He said the pain was inescapable.
“I estimated 600 to 800 tiny sores,” he said. “And it’s just sort of under the surface of your skin, there’s like a small piece of your flesh being taken out and deteriorating. It feels like [when] you stick your hand in water that’s too hot, sort of that feeling but you cannot take it out. And so it’s constant.”
Scared and exhausted as the rash continued to get worse, Kwong broke down crying after seeing himself on screen during a FaceTime call with a friend.
“I was even scared to just go to sleep because I didn’t know what I would wake up to. I didn’t know if my symptoms would progress in a dramatic and terrible way while I was asleep, while I couldn’t watch what was happening to me,” Kwong said.
After days of appointments and very little sleep, Kwong decided to make the trip to the UC San Francisco hospital. It was a tough decision. He had just spent 12 hours in another emergency room that same day. But he’d heard through a friend that UCSF was treating monkeypox cases, and a virtual care nurse had urged him to go.
When he arrived at the UCSF emergency room he was separated from the other patients given oxycodone for the pain, and again swabbed for a monkeypox test.
The next day UCSF infectious disease specialist Dr. Peter Chin-Hong contacted him, after seeing pictures of his rash.
“I thought, wow, this is really, really extensive disease,” Chin-Hong said. “I’ve seen other cases of monkeypox before, but they’re very limited. I would say Kevin is probably in the top 5% of severity of diseases, and most people probably wouldn’t get it as severe as Kevin.”
Because the rash was close to Kwong’s eyes, if left untreated it could have caused him to go blind. Dr. Chin-Hong said the case was so severe the hospital okayed a prescription of TPOXX. That’s an antiviral that’s been given special clearance by the FDA to treat monkeypox only in certain circumstances.
“I was shocked by how fast Kevin improved. It was almost like he was a turbo rocket on the way to recovery,” Chin-Hong said.
Kwong said he likely contracted monkeypox from a guy he hooked up with during New York Pride. That man did test positive. Despite Kwong’s quick turnaround on the antiviral, he still hasn’t tested positive. Chin-Hong says health workers may not have rubbed hard enough to get live cells for the monkeypox test….
The above comes from a July 22 story on LAist.
Let’s pray for all those affected by illness and disease–physical, mental, and spiritual. May the Lord Jesus teach us to be caring and not judgemental.
What’s wrong with making judgments? Your post implicitly judges people who make judgments, so you condemn yourself. Self-righteousness and holier than thou never makes it through the day.
Yes, the tu quoque fallacy is a slippery one.
No, he earned this, maybe he will re-evaluate his sinful activities.
Ah not really it is way past time to judge… their behavior is spreading this disease.. and it MUST BE CONDEMNED
You would be all sorts of judgemental if a smoker got Lung Cancer.
Perhaps this experience will inspire him to contact Courage, repent and start living a chaste life.
It’s spread almost exclusively through gay sex. This is a gay sex pandemic. Any child who gets monkeypox should be reported to child welfare for investigation of possible sexual abuse. It’s the gays. It’s only the gays. They think gay is neutral; it’s not. Nature is showing you that it’s disordered. And since God created nature, well, connect the dots.
Not true on several accounts. This US outbreak is 99% among men who have sex with men. But it isn’t necessarily sex that caused the transmission, as any skin to skin contact, or skin to sloughed off lesion contact, can spread the disease. In other parts of the world, and here in the US if this continues, it will not be a gay disease. To say that children who acquire this virus should be reported to child welfare for investigation of possible sexual abuse is vile, ignores the science, and puts at risk kids and adults needlessly.
Oh, because when two gay guys hook up all they do is shake hands. Get real. Why do you defend the indefensible with lies?
Because he does not accept the natural moral law
I don’t know one way or another. I’m not a monkeypox expert but I understand that skin to skin contact is the way the virus is mostly spread. Obviously, sex involves a great deal of skin to skin contact. How much is needed, I don’t know. All I know is that it is not always spread sexually. And as the poster King Kong below says, it is best to avoid behaviors that lead to monkeypox. But we can’t do that if all we want to do is blame gay sex.
It also can spread from close contact like kissing and cuddling. It can spread from touching an infected surface or clothing of an infected person.
the wages of sin is death
Is that what you said to the two American infants who contracted the same disease this year?
Innocents always suffer from the sins of others.
And that does not bother God in the least?
Do you object to free will?
As a society, might we have the honesty to acknowledge that promiscuous sex is not healthy?
Social security used to called the third rail of politics. Now, sexual restraint seems to be the third rail of politics, education and media.
May God heal and deliver Mr. Kwong and all in bondage to sins of the flesh.
No duh, huh, Deacon. What went unsaid in this story is that he didn’t get the malady from merely attending a parade even a homo parade. He got it from… well we know how.
You know what I pray for this fella, Deke? I pray he is self reflective and says “huh, maybe my behavior caused this to happen to me?” Contrition?, Amend meant of purpose, reparation to others he gave this mess too? Sin? I won’t hold my breath.
I don’t disagree. But, the story does say how he got the disease, from “a guy he hooked up with.” For boomers, like me, that didn’t always have a sexual connotation, but for millennials and Gen Zers it does. And, like you, I won’t hold my breath. But, I won’t give up on him either. I hope you don’t. Let us sincerely pray for his conversion.
We are glad for his quick recovery from a scary disease.
Monkey Pox is the least of his problems…and yes, we pray for him and all of those addicted to sexual disorder to be delivered and saved. May the protective mantle of the Blessed Mother surround him, may they be covered by the Blood of her divine son that they may receive the protection and healing that flows from His passion and cross.
Yes, so they can continue their acts against nature….
If he were an alcoholic people would tell him to stop drinking. AA would tell him he needs to live a sober life. But because he’s gay, nobody will tell him to stop sodomy, and nobody will tell him to live a chaste life.
without being judgmental,
it’s best to avoid behaviors
that lead to monkeypox
Praise God for all healing comes from Him.
What’s this story got to do with Catholicism in California or just Catholicism in general? Why is it here?
Because it will get a lot of comments. You’ve been coming here longer than I have.
Because Catholicism tells us that homosexuality is aberrant, acting out homosexually is sinful and repentance is required to be in union with God.
I am praying for YFC’s conversion…
While you’re at it, pray for Trads to have a change of heart and embrace the Novus Ordo Mass. They are just as misguided about the Mass as this Kwong guy is about gayness.
Thanks but we wont. .pray for the end of Novus Ordo
Who’s going to pray for an end to Holy Mass?
Peggy thank you, I just pray that you get your facts straight. Catholicism does not tell us that homosexuality is aberrant. Just the latest in your long line of wrong facts.
CCC 2357 Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,141 tradition has always declared that “homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered.”142 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.
She was being kind. CCC says depraved as well as disordered.
She’s right and you are wrong on this subject.
To the contrary, the homosexual orientation is considered and taught to be aberrant, disordered in Catholic doctrine. The orientation itself is not sinful, but it is an orientation toward committing gravely immoral acts and thus cannot be considered a neutral nor much less a good orientation. Homosexuality is a defect in a person’s psychosexual constitution.
As usual, YFC, it is you who have your facts wrong.
If homosexuality were not aberrant, the Church would not have taught that homosexuals should not be ordained priests.
Aberrant means that it is not the usual behavior. It is not a moral distinction.
Selling all your possessions and giving the money to the poor is an aberrant behavior but it is not immoral.
True chastity would be aberrant.
Really following the teachings of Christ is aberrant that is why it is a leaven in the world.
The problem with homosexual sexual acts is not that they are aberrant (which they are). It is that they are immoral.
No, bgs, you confuse “aberrant” with “uncommon”. “Aberrant” connotes departing from what is acceptable or normal, departing from what should be. If something is aberrant, it’s not what it should be. “Aberrant” doesn’t mean statistically infrequent.
But maybe you can persuade the dictionary sites and Wikipedia to change the definition of “aberrant” to suit your preference, as they have done this month with “woman” and “recession” in order to benefit the Dems, 1984 Orwell-style.
Aberrant does not mean uncommon. I accept your definition until the departing from what it should be. At what level does alcohol use become aberrant?. Much higher than what it should be.
At what level does promiscuity become aberrant? Again much higher than it should be. It should not be at all.
My point was the aberration of homosexuality is not the issue.
Read Romans 1.
Then why do we need doctors?
The left lied about COVID, they lie about transgenderism, and now they are lying about monkeypox. The lies are politically motivated. The evidence is that gay sex is the nearly the only way monkeypox is being spread. But leftist health officials won’t caution men to lay off the gay sex for a while. As Rod Dreher pointed out today, if monkeypox were spread by going to church, health officials would have already cautioned people to stay home on Sundays or they would have ordered that churches be shut down. But gay bathhouses? Sure, come on in!
The left lies. They lie. They lie all the time. They do nothing but lie. They trade in lies. They live lies. And some of our fellow Catholics promote their lies and live their lies themselves.
Very well stated! The Left, MSM, CDC, NIH, FDA (all one and the same) lie. If they ever stopped lying, they’d be dead — lying is what keeps them going.
(Lies cont.) And let us not forget the early history of AIDS, still forbidden and totally hidden by the Media. Remember that gay mob that stormed City Hall, some decades back ? Their motivation was based on the denial of gay blood donations by Irwin Memorial, which ban was done because of the fear that gay blood carried AIDS. And these Gay political protests were so strong as to force Irwin Memorial Blood Bank to allow blood transfusions be taken from gays. This was before the cause of AIDS was understood, and what happened then was that some people who got blood donations from gays, developed AIDS. Also, some people who donated blood also developed AIDS, and the cause was determined to be the improper sterilization of needles reused by Irwin Memorial. As a result, Irwin Memorial suddenly totally disappeared, and the fate of those who got AIDS there, is still well hidden. The whole event has been totally blacked out by the Media, and there have been no discussions of this since. It should be mentioned that the Red Cross refused gay blood donations from the start, so they did not have this problem.
Now there may be a problem with Monkey Pox. We should all understand that if a similar problem, again due to gay culture develops, it must not be hidden, and the entire problem should be openly discussed, and the Media must be held responsible to present an accurate and objective discussion.
And we must thank Mr, Kwong for his honesty and for the good and open discussion of his Monkey Pox – it was excellent. So this is a question directed at the local newspapers like the Chronicle: Why aren’t you printing stories like this, in your newspaper? Isn’t it very important? Aren’t you interested in educating the local citizens on Monkey Pox, what it looks like, how it can be identified, and what to do about prevention? Isn’t that a newspaper’s primary job, educating the citizenry about current dangerous threats?
And the Chronicles’ answer: “Well no, not really, because Monkey Pox is closely related to the gay culture, and of course, gays are a protected group that should not be questioned or criticized…..So, NO, NO, we will not print Monkey Pox stories like this, in our newspaper”
And, readers, that is why Cal Catholic Daily often shows it is more relevant and important than local newspapers.
ph – nonsense. CCD did not originate this story. The WAY left of center outlet LAist published it. Versions of his story have been printed all over. Monkeypox and its impact on the gay community was today’s headline in the Chronicle. WHO has suggested gay people lay off of it for a while. I suspect we will shortly see more calls like that one, as we should.
Rick, based on the tone of your comment, you need not worry about being in heaven with anyone. It must be difficult to live with such venomous anger towards people you don’t even know and your arms must be so tired from casting stones.
Go join the Fr. James Martin rainbow lovefest on his Twitter feed.
Oh, because the Tone Enforcement Authority won’t let you into heaven.
Marie Anne, half of that is how the saints used to talk. Except for the part where “I don’t want to be in Heaven with them.” A saint would be spending prayers and sacrifices for all those who risk damnation because they know the pain it causes God to lose any soul.
God can’t feel pain. The divine nature is impassible.
Now I am in a faith crisis. Thanks.
I just wasted 30 years of my life trying to please God and He don’t even care.
Thanks for clueing me in. Seriously. A lot makes sense now. A God who can’t feel. That kind of explains everything, doesn’t it?
Wikipedia says that it is Catholic dogma. It gives no source.
I cannot find it in the Catechism or in Ott’s Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma.
there is this article:https://www.firstthings.com/article/2001/11/does-god-suffer
I see a lot more discussion of this among Protestants.
Do you have a source?
In Ott, look at Part 1, Section 17: God’s immutability, which means unchangeableness.
Thank you for the source. It is about God’s immutability which is God is unchanging which is a dogma of the faith. It must be believed.
It does not go into impassibility.
Pain, suffering, disease, and death, are all a part of the human condition– a tragic result of Original Sin, from the disobedience of Adam and Eve. God is pure and sinless. In the Divine, there is all perfection, order, harmony, balance, justice, wisdom, beauty, overflowing, holy love, abundance and goodness, total health, healing, total happiness, joy, and well-being, eternally. In Heaven, there is no suffering, no pain! God is Divine Love– that is His very nature. God has total love and compassion for all suffering mankind. He sent His Divine Son, Jesus Christ, to lead us out of our sin and suffering, back to God. Christ took on our human nature, and lived, suffered and died for our sins, to lead us back to God. Even today, He lovingly heals the sick, comforts those in pain and sorrow, and teaches us all how to live right. And He gives us the grace to live right, and leads us to Heaven, to live with Him forever. Christ is the Answer you are seeking!
Please, nobody be disheartened or crushed that God doesn’t feel pain nor pleasure in his divine nature. That’s quite basic and long-standing Catholic dogma. Anyone with even mild familiarity with the writings of St. Thomas Aquinas would know and affirm its truth.
God is infinite love and loves everything in creation. God has a will for all human beings to be in union with him for eternity, to turn away from the sin that impedes or threatens that union, and God gives grace for the purpose of healing us and bringing us into loving communion with him.
God doesn’t change. That should be a source of hope, not a source of discouragement. God can’t change because he is infinite actuality: he is everything and anything it is possible to be in its plenitude. Nothing can be greater than God, and God can never lose anything in his being.
“I love you, O Lord, my strength, my rock, my fortress, my savior!” Psalm 18
What about Divine Revelation of Scripture where He is slow to anger, He is a jealous God, He laughs at the wicked, He hates, He abhors, He loves, He rejoices,
Then once Jesus in incarnate…He weeps. He has compassion.
Why would his unchanging nature mean that these Scripture verses that witness to His “feelings” be invalid?
When scripture attributes feelings to God, it does so by way of analogy. God does not feel any emotions. Scripture attributes human emotions to God to communicate more easily to us what accords or doesn’t accord with God’s will. Saying God delights or rejoices in something is to say by way of analogy that it accords with his will. To say that God grieves or is angry is to say by way of analogy that it is contrary to his will. God doesn’t ever feel any of those emotions because he can’t.
Thank you for writing this. I’ll keep praying over it.
Can you give me a source that affirms that this is Catholic dogma? It would seem to be the opposite but this is a new concept for me. I found it depressing at first and then I found it very freeing. And it explains so much. It explains why God allows so much suffering. And why we need Mary as an intercessor. It explains the parable of the corrupt judge.
It also explains how God can be happy in Heaven while people are suffering for all eternity in Hell.
But then I prayed…And I believe that God suffers when we suffer. Why are there thorns in the Sacred Heart? Why is God offended by sin? Why did Jesus weep when Martha said to him “If you had been here, my brother would not have died?: Why did he grieve over Jerusalem? Feel pity for the widow of Naim? Feel compassion for the hungry crowd? Feel pity?
Did he only feel those things for 33 years and then go back to not feeling?
To those believing that God is free from pain and suffering. You are forgetting the Trinity, the triune nature of God: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. The sufferings of Our Savior, Jesus Christ, are then also the sufferings of the Father and Holy Sprit.
Rick – you give Catholicism a bad name.
Maybe Rick is not a Catholic!
Every Catholic source that mentions impassibility uses the term in relation to either Adam and Eve or the glorified body after the general judgement.
You need to look harder and think better. Divine impassibility is a logical derivative of divine immutability, which is a logical derivative of the divine nature as pure, infinite, perfect actuality with no potentiality whatsoever.
I have no clue what you even trying to say.
America has severe cases of Monkeypox, AIDs, and other gay pervert sex venereal diseases, all because of immoral acceptance of Pride parades, gay sex perversions, and gay “marriage.” God says, “No” to all gay sex perversions! God calls LGBTs to Chastity. And to lead a good and chaste life, will help LGBTs prepare their souls for Heaven, Eternal Life, with God.
God calls everyone to chastity. You must ask for purity.
Chastity alone may not save you from monkeypox. That’s the point.
Chastity is necessary to save yourself from hell. There are eternal consequences for mortal sin.
YFC like most modern Catholics believes no one will go there,
Bohemond I have a reasonable hope that you will be saved
Chastity alone may not save you from hell either. Chastity without love. Chastity without faith. These damn a person to hell as well.
That is not exactly what the Catholic Church teaches but if a Catholic was chaste but committed other mortal sins and did not repent of them, they would go to hell.
What you call love I call perversion…and my Faith in Christ is without a shadow of doubt. I am not perfectly chaste, but I dont demand the Church accept my sins as a sacrament unlike the LGBT syndicate and any failing I have does not violate nature.
There’s something wrong in what “Your Fellow Catholic” is saying there. It needs to be fine-tuned. Firstly, he might be confusing the concept of the virtue of “chastity” with mere “continence” (meaning “no sex”; look up the word, people). If so, then yes, “continence” without love or faith in one’s heart is not “enough to save you from hell.” However, if “Your Fellow” did not mean mere “continence” then he has forgotten the fact that, secondly, the pursuit of the virtue of chastity is the pursuit of how to love in a genuine, authentic way. For example, an unmarried couple who is pursuing chastity in their relationship (not merely continence, but chastity) is “de facto” and essentially training themselves (in mind, body, and soul) on how to love each other more genuinely. They are “de facto” training themselves to attain this virtue of being chaste by abstaining from sex (continence). And given the fact that lust is a very heavy stumbling block for many people in our time (for many people this may be the main stumbling block), then pursuing chastity may indeed “get you to heaven.” Besides, what did Our Lord say? “Blessed are the pure of heart, for they will see God.”
Purity of heart is not chastity although that would be a part of it.
Chastity is a big part of purity of heart. Almost every spiritual writer says so. Otherwise, what do you believe “purity of heart” means? Good intentions? Now that is definitely not enough to get you to heaven.
Purity and purity of heart are two different things.
Purity is absence of desire for anything sexual. Not just I resist temptation but I am no longer even tempted.
Purity of heart is a heart focused solely on God. Not God first, God alone.
Jon I don’t understand what you are trying to say but neither purity of heart nor continence is enough to get you into heaven nor to prevent monkeypox infection.
Are you, “Your Fellow” disputing what Our Lord Himself has said? He was very clear when He said: “Blessed are the pure of heart, for they will see God” (Matt. 5:8). He’s describing the beatific vision there: “seeing God” as He is! Heaven. Salvation. If you don’t believe that “purity of heart” (a big part of which is the virtue of chastity) is “enough” to get you to “see God” (that is, “to get you to heaven”) then you must bring it up with Our Lord. And judging from your past comments here, I daresay that your advocacy of homosexual relationships (which is not an authentic expression of chastity and love) could very well be a stumbling block for you. You have been warned by the good people of this commentariat multiple times. You’ve just been warned again.
Just a quick comment on “purity’s” statement up there that “purity and purity of heart are two different things.” I must say that “purity’s” attempt to create a false dichotomy between chastity (which he/she is calling mere “purity”) versus “purity of heart” is futile. She/he is actually proving my point: a heart that’s focused on God alone (“purity of heart” as he/she is defining here) naturally desires to grow in chastity as an authentic expression of love. The two are not mutually exclusive folks. In Catholic spirituality one leads to the other. Again, for instance, an unmarried couple’s decision to refrain from sex (continence) during their courtship must be (must be) informed by and motivated by the desire to pursue the virtue of chastity, so that they can grow to love each other more fully and to love God above all. Otherwise, the task will not only be difficult, but directionless. Why would they decide not to have sex? Because their grandmother told them not to? That won’t cut it. Lastly, “purity’s” definition of “purity” there sounds more like epicuriansim, or stoicism, even the Buddhist pursuit of nihilism. His/her notion of “purity” doesn’t seem to have anything to do with a fuller and richer Catholic-Christian understanding of “purity”.
Chastity is a basic Christian virtue, and a necessity for life in Christ. If you are unchaste, you are not in Christ, not leading a good Chtistian life. In Christ, all the Virtues are important and necessary. To be in union with Christ, and hope for Heaven– we must do as Christ says, and diligently pray for and practice all of the Virtues.
Christ gives everyone the grace to be chaste, to reform their lives of sin, and become a new person in Him. So, no one should get discouraged. In Christ, we can do all things– as St. Paul said. Reject the dishonest, fallen, sinful, secular world, the Death Culture, drenched in sin, ruled by Satan– which gives evil fruits: disease, disorder. suffering, destruction, and death. And follow Our Lord, Who gives us total joy, love, happiness, peace, health, and Life! There is an excellent Catholic group for LGBTs, called “Courage.” Eternal Life with Christ in Heaven, is worth it!
How did monkeypox spread from monkeys to humans? :-o shudder
In some African nations, poor and without resources, monkeys were eaten as food. So the disease was then transmitted to humans.
Like AIDES it probably was first spread when infected monkeys, rodents, etc., bit humans who contacted the disease,
Correction: “Like AIDS ………..”.
jon – I hereby find myself kicking and screaming in agreement with you.
Jon is actually correct more times than the majority here give him credit for.
….. thank you, “right”… or should I say, “you people”. Where’s my laughing emoji when I need one.
Me, too. without love of God (the First Commandment) chastity can mean nothing, although it might save you from diseases, and I think that is what Jon is expressing.
Lord have mercy on his soul, may he repent and stop his unnatural behavior. If having monkey pox doesn’t scare someone straight I don’t know what will.