The following comes from a November 5 story on LifeSiteNews.com.
A liberal pressure group has accused the U.S. Catholic bishops of breaking tax law by faithfully proclaiming the non-negotiable issues of Church teaching, including the right to life.
These teachings, the organization argues, disadvantage President Barack Obama.
On Friday, Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington (CREW) asked for “an immediate Internal Revenue Service investigation into the activities of the U.S.
Council of Catholic Bishops for using their position as leaders of the Catholic Church to persuade parishioners to vote against Barack Obama in Tuesday’s election.”
The USCCB “may be engaged in prohibited electioneering,” which would require the IRS to revoke its 501 (c) 3 tax-exempt status, according to CREW.
Melanie Sloan, executive director of CREW, used to work with Joe Biden.
The complaint cites letters written by Bishops including Daniel Jenky of Peoria, Nicholas 
DiMarzio of Brooklyn, David Ricken of Green Bay, Edward Burns of Juneau, and Paul S. Loverde of Arlington.
None of the bishops endorse a candidate. However, each reminded Catholics of the importance of preserving religious freedom against the HHS mandate, protecting innocent life, and defending the institution of marriage.
Often portrayed as a “non-partisan watchdog,” CREW’s complaints fall heavily upon conservative and Republican targets.
Executive Director Melanie Sloan served as Nominations Counsel for then-Senator Joe Biden’s Senate Judiciary Committee in 1993.
CREW is funded by George Soros’ Open Society Institute, as well as the Democracy Alliance, the Tides Foundation, and the Service Employees International Union (SEIU)….
Bishops pictured (from top to bottom): Jenky, DeMarzio, Ricken, Burns, Loverde
” CREW is funded by George Soros’ Open Society Institute, as well as the Democracy Alliance, the Tides Foundation, and the Service Employees International Union (SEIU)….”.
Let’s see how long it will take for the far left on the USCCB staff to support the SEIU.
As long as ALL Bishops teach according to the “CATECHISM of the CATHOLIC CHURCH, Second Edition” – they are merely doing their job in teaching the Faith.
(They really didn’t say anything “new”, because its all in the CCC.)
Therefore, any interference by the Obama Administration’s IRS and George Soros is merely harassment.
Support these good Bishops.
How ridiculous! Now that Obama has been given 4 more years to destroy religious freedom and try to undermine all that we hold dear to our hearts, we will have to fight with all we’ve got to try to regain the basic rights we once enjoyed as Americans and as Catholics. If the bishops had indeed worked to unseat Obama, it would have been understandable, and many of us wanted them to! But they did not, and they didn’t because of not wanting to lose our tax exempt status with the IRS – much to the chagrin of so many Catholics! But the bishops did the right thing in protecting our status. Now we will have to spend lots of time and money on attorneys and administrators to get these idiots to go away, time and money that could have gone to serve our higher missions.
Heartily disturbed by such shenenigans!
What is important here is that President Obama won even with these bishops complaining, so, who cares, I don’t!!!! I’m very pleased that far right wing is eating crow this wonderful election night!! It must be God’s will to use the words of the right when they have an election victory!!!
Yes President Obama won but the unborn babies lost because they will loose their lives because of the abortion mandate and President Obamas stand on free abortions and insurance paid abortions. May God forgive the President Obama supporters. Religious Freedom also is a loss for now for all of us. People do not think why so many of the founders of this country died for Religious Freedom and freedom and yet they keep throwing it away with the last two elections. The Bishops did nothing except tell the truth on “INTRINSTIC EVIL” and what it is. No one as far as I know said elect Romney. The Bishops left the decision to good Catholic to know the truth and to vote accordingly.
Sodomy has no God given right….now if this happened it was because more and more people have turned their back on God, it is written in the scriptures, this is nothing new……history repeats its self, in order for God’s miracles need to happen, God’s people will continue to be slaves until their hearts change and this condition of the secular start to aggressively start to eat at their being….maybe then their hearts will have a conversion but in the mean time, Hollywood will continue to normalize gay agenda’s, the media will continue to do it’s work for the evil one, the unborn will continue to be victims of the abortion industry etc etc
We must be grateful for the few faithful because it is their prayers of mercy, their offerings to our Lord, their works, their faith, their sufferings etc that this wicked world is still allowed to carry on, the faithful are facing hard spiritual battles in order to allow more time for another grave sinner to have a conversion before it is to late….how long will our Lord allow this, will it is all in His time! But for now, we must continue to fight the good fight! Regardless if the enemy feels temporary victory. It is our Lord who holds forever victory, those of faith understand this……Lets continue to pray and fast, take action accordingly…etc
Or TEM, it must be just one of God’s punishments on a sinful nation that murders its own children and promotes sodomy.
Thomas –
The devil won this round so don’t get carried away with the celebration.
And, please don’t ever suggest that God lends support to the Godless!
Mr. Miles, why are you so enamored of the most pro-abortion, anti-Catholic President in the history of the United States, Barrack Obama?
It is amazing as to how many antiCatholics have so much time on their hands that they interfere in Catholic streams such as this one.
Here comes the persecutions and the schisms. Drip, drip, drip. Obscure carnival barkers like CREW with no backing other than the money of anti-American Soros. Then the HHS mandate starts getting applied to Catholic institutions. Some will bolt the Church, others will try to remain in good standing with the connivance of wishy-washy bishops which this state is chalk full of. Then the bishops, who have promised nationwide disobdience, will be divided among themselves as some hold the line while the left coast bishops go accomodationalist.
Yes, things could get very interesting in the Catholic Church in the US. All the corruption revealed by the Crisis, the multi-generation collapse in catechetics, the lazy priests, the “professional Catholics” who are in this only for the paycheck and access to an office and soapbox, it’s all coming home to roost. I’ll feel blessed if we retain 20 million of our nominal 70 million American Catholics when this all plays itself out.
Pray your Rosary.
The agenda of Vatican II has come to fruition.
The record speaks for itself.
Baron although I may understand a little bit of your comments but how can we blame this whole mess on the Vatican II? I do recall reading from historical facts back in history when the church also had it’s issues right before Luther began his protestant reformation.
Also Catholics who didn’t know their bible before Vatican II, many of them left the church and became those Jesus freaks from the protestant sects in the 50’s and 60’s…..
Just asking…I am starting to have different points of view these past few months….while I understand that many more new abuses came about during the Vatican II, I also understand that those who are of good faith only grew stronger in their faith because of the evangelizing portion of that. Don’t get me wrong I am against all those abuses we now face today, they are very lukewarm and the watering down of Catholicism in USA probably only made the Vatican II message only worst, I’m sure many had their own interpretation away from the Pope.
I suppose, I can only go by what I know, I did not grow up before the Vatican II to know the difference, I wasn’t even born yet.
Abeca-
It is obvious that you are inspired by faith to seek the truth. Your pursuit of it will be made clear by your prayers and the discipline of objectivity. Delve into Church history and Holy Scripture beyond the distractions of the Devil and the deceptions of his disciples who are cloaked in self righteousness.
In answer to The V2 issue I would encourage anyone to analyze the before and after condition of the Church. It is all there for everyone to witness. You don’t need mine or anyone else’s opinions to cloud the picture.
Go in peace with God and may His love and guidance be with you.
Thank you Baron for your kind and most charitable response. God bless you too and thank you : )
Too little, too late!
Viva Cristo Rey!
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
Viva Cristo Rey!
Que Viva!
It’s never too late, Kenneth. We may be called to suffer and even die for our faith,but this is all our opportunity to keep the faith and to be a bridge for our children and grandchildren to strengthening and carrying on the faith into the future. After the scourges in England there were very few Catholics left and yet there are now more Catholics there than those who attend the Church of England, which is basically dead as a viable religion. Also, we must continue to uphold truth. Homosexuality is not just a disorder, it is a grave SIN. There are those in the Church, some who’ve slithered their way into very high positions, who say otherwise and are doing their wicked best to undermine what is Holy. These evil and degenerate people should be always refuted and exposed. They do not believe they are evil, any more than pedophiles think what they are doing is wrong. So forget trying to reason with them for they are beyond reason and completely incapable of conversion.If not confronted they will keep pushing their utterly despicable agenda on the rest of us and especially on our children. I’ve run out of patience with the snivelling, whining accusations of certain people here who say they are celibate but are homosexual. If your mind is corrupt, it makes no difference if you’re celibate. Period!
Dana, hi. I know what you are saying. But behavior is sinful, not inclination to behavior (we are all murderers and adulterers in our hearts, right?). Temptation is not sin. Our Lord was tempted many times. “With God all things are possible”, including the ability to resist temptation for long periods if not a lifetime. So go easy, sister. We are all called to chastity according to our station in life, as you know. Someone with SSA who is living celibately is no worse, inside his head, and thus before God, than someone living without the cross of SSA, who is also living celibately. God sees inside to the marrow and joints. The crosses he gives often bring about saints. To me a celibate person with SSA is an exemplary Christian, frankly an astonishing one: for love of Christ the human will go against all that would otherwise draw him, including the totally overwhelming impetus of the sex drive, the drive in both the physical and psychological senses. For love of Christ. Stay strong, yes, but go easy on your fellow man. God will go easy on you when the time comes. “For I desire mercy…”
I agree, totally, Brad. In this particular post, I was being very specific but as to what you wrote, I couldn’t agree more, my friend. God bless!
Behavior is both internal and external. A celibate ssa person is to be expected in Catholicism, not to be an exception. Resist the devil and the devil will flee. So, why do ssa people remain in that condition if they are really resisting? Sounds suspicious to me.
If by “remain in that condition” you mean the SSA remains, why would we expect a cross to be lifted from us just because it’s heavy or old?
When our Lord told us about various states of life in Mt 19:12 he told us to accept it. He didn’t tell us that if we accept it, he would remove what pains us. St. Paul would have been first in line for his thorn removal.
Jesus told us and tells us today to we are to be transformed, and this means that we are not supposed to accept various states of life. Catholicism transforms people … if you are not experiencing transformation, then why are you calling yourself a Catholic?
I’m sure that confessors hear repetitions of the common sins from a wide variety of people. Look to the log in your own eye…
Brad, I never wanted to kill anyone. Never been that angry.
I’ve never wanted to sleep with another woman’s husband.
You’re posts would be more effective if you don’t use the word “ALL” or “EVERYONE” unless you can prove it.
Further an SSA person who does not give into temptation is no better or worse than someone else who does not give in to fornication, adultary, or pornography.
Perfectly correct, Dana. If I even allow a lurid image or thought to break through the fog in my mind, I find myself reflecting it somehow, and somehow it seems people around me “see” it. Paranoia? Or, reality? Wisdom Book says nothing is secret from God, as a little bird will take it to Him. Extrapolating: A bishop who is not holy will have all sorts of defences set up to hide it from others; yet the fruit he bears will not be worth a euro. Right now the fruit of the bishops is rampaging homosexuality, child molestation, substance abuse, poverty, war, abortion, all four horses of the Apolypse on the loose. It all starts with the bishops … if they refuse to get holy, then Holy will do them in.
With Obama’s reelection, true Catholics who love Our Lord and His Holy Church should prepare for persecution and ultimately martyrdom. The New Roman Empire is in full effect. May Our Lord strengthen us. +JMJ+
Would the removal of the tax-exempt status be such a bad thing? Has it been good for the Faith here or elsewhere? I just hope the USCCB doesn’t grovel.
Philippe,
Isn’t it interesting that only the Catholic Church is being sued? I mean how about all the black protestant church’s that were much more forceful in supporting Obama? This is nothing more that a transparent attempt to stifle Catholic free speech.
In my opinion the USCCB needs to grow a backbone and start teaching the faith.
Your wish is correct but you must know that the USCCB has no intention of doing what you suggest.
The spirit of Judas Iscariot has permeated the hierarchy on a Global basis. Our Lady at Fatima and La Salette had predicted all this to occur and you see the Bishop vs Bishop scenario taking place before our collective eyes. A true believer cannot deny this fact.
Well said Baron, you are spot on
Mike Malone, in this country we have two standards: One applies to white people; the other applies to minorities. According to the government, all minorities are victims, and all whites are oppressors. You must accept this or you will be branded a racist. Merely raising the issue, and asking the question you asked, identifies you as a dangerous individual. With your attitude you could easily be denied a promotion or risk being fired. In any modern American corporation you would be required to take classes in diversity studies, which is our equivalent to the re-education camps found in totalitarian states. Black preachers advocating the election of a black official are shielded from criticism; a Catholic priest (black or white!) advocating the election of a white politician would be savaged in the press and invite an IRS audit. This is the world of affirmative action racism we live in. Corruption writ large.
Anton,
Only in the minds of bigots. By they way bigots come in both genders and all races. I follow the words of the great Martin Luther King, “I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their Character”.
Oh…and I’m white.
Mike: I do remember the speech as if it had been yesterday. Those were optimistic times. Times of hope and high expectations. Martin Luther King would be shocked by the race hustlers and race baiters of today. They have defiled his legacy.
Anton,
Martin Luther Kind was assassinated during these more moderate times if I remember. His words transend time….it was he fervent hope that in time the races would come together. I believe that time comes closer all the time.
Anton, I agree with you. This country is becoming so bigoted and prejudiced again, only this time it is ‘old white folks’ who have to go. I see it online all the time. Ironic, isn’t it? Also, as little o is as much white as he is black, I don’t know how he gets away with presenting himself as some sort of victim as he went to fancy private schools all his life, his grandparents had a nice home in Hawaii etc. Somehow all these people are presenting him as someone who had to struggle against prejudice and poverty. haha. He may have had some bad hangovers from too much pot inhalation, however. It is he who is fanning racism and this attitude that the gov’t owes people something, or that for some reason they don’t have to work but must be supported by the rest of us. It’s going to lead to some long ugly struggles over the next four years.
It’s mourning in America.
The 47 % voted their usual way with the help of women,hispanics,and young people.
How many catholics voted for Potus Obama????
Is socialized medicine in our future????
Will the catholic bishops cut a deal with potus Obama to preserve their perks and prestege or will they go for the Greater Glory??????
The country seems to be split culturaly half and half and that may last for a decade or two.
Put on your seat belts,it’s going to be a bumpy ride.
You may be right in somethings but our biggest problem is ‘labeling’ people, I am Latin, Spanish/Italian, hispanic has never been in my vocabulary…I was born in Cuba of grandparents from Galicia, Spain and Rome, Italy….I consider myself , white Latin (Latin means= Spanish, Italian, French, Greek…etc. non Anglos)…no about who voted for Obama, the evil one…all the ‘kids’ (yes kids their parents are paying for their studies),
all the blacks (American, Jamaican and Haitians), and many Spanish from Central and South American…now these are description of ‘Nationality” not race…BUT IF EVERY CATHOLIC (like me) WOULD HAVE VOTED WITH THEIR COSCIENCE…OBAMA WOULD NOT BE
RE-ELECTED….so the blame goes on the CATHOLIC, which I did not have to say it for I am a practicing Roman Catholic….
PLEASE LET US NOT FIGURE THIS MESS OUT AND BLAME THIS ONE AND THAT ONE….
LET US ALL UNITE TO DEFEND ‘GOD’ AT HOME AND IN THE PUBLIC SQUARE….AND PRAY AT ALL TIMES….
REALLY HE IS WATCHING US….WE NEED TO PRAY AND WHO KNOWS GOD IS IN CONTROL WE DON’T KNOW WHAT MIRACLE COULD HAPPEN…
this election was not about one party and the other, it definitely was not about think about what is best for our Country….it was about
GOOD AGAINST EVIL…and it is here to stay until the end of time…
The bishops were too late and too timid. Their voter guides were again ineffective. They were worded so as to offend no-one. They were full of abstractions and phrases that made the eyes glaze over. Only a handful of bishops came right out and told their flock: “DO NOT VOTE FOR POLITICIANS WHO SUPPORT ABORTI0N AND SAME SEX MARRIAGE!” And we all know whose party platform screamed these precepts to high heaven, while trying to strike the word GOD from it not once but thrice! The bishops failed us again. It is no secret that many of them a life-long democrats aching to bestow the blessings of socialized medicine on this nation. They should be wise enough to recognize that one cannot bargain with evil, as they tried to do regarding the health-care mandate. Obama reneged on it before the ink was dry.
Congratulations to the USCCB on Obama’s re-election.
Indeed, the Catholic Sentinel is reporting that “the majority of the Catholic vote went for President Obama”.
The USCCB’s “Faithful Citizenship” = The Gift That Keeps On Giving
shame on you….what about the many Catholics that voted for him,
we cannot blame the Church we know what is good and bad….
blame ourselves for allowing the crosses be remove and prayer not allowed and Christmas not celebrated and Easter Vacation changed to
Spring Vacation…..blame ourselves….and don’t think that I don’t believe that everyone could have done much more including you and I and everyone in all the walks of life….Rabbis, Pators, Priest, teachers and most of all parents…..
let us all pray from now until God takes us back home so that maybe
we can now work together to proof that this man is very evil, liar, and an American hater…with a chip on his shoulder to destroy our country…
lets defend our constitution get involved you and I all of us….
God Bless American for we are One Nation Under God cause In God We Trust….
idc believe Juergensen, he is right. He has nothing to be ashamed about, but only the church leaders who have mislead their flock, and yes we also hold personal accountability but believe it or not there are many mislead Catholics who have a liberal view of what a Catholic is and that is because some of their priests have not only edified them in their bad will but have also done it with their water downed messages that they give from the Pulpit!
Soros is a stooge of Satan, and Obama is an agent of the devil. God will not be mocked. God is very angry with the United States; that is why Romney lost the election. God is punishing us for abortion, birth control, ponography, homosexual practices, so as He did in the past with Israel, He is now doing with America. To an extent, Rev. Wright was correct: “Not God bless America, but God…………..!” Because we have turned away from God we will be chastised. Look at Europe, it is pagan, and is becoming Moslem. America is just a few years behind. The fact that Soros and the ACLU have been able to yield so much power shows that America has been rotten for some time. Only God can save us, and until we realize this, and turn back to him, we will continue to self destruct. Our Lady of Fatima said that nations would .perish, and her prophecy is coming true because we have ignored the call for repentence and conversion.
Dear Editors: In my opinion you should edit comments that say President Obama is an agent of the devil. I realize that some people still haven’t gotten over that the country elected a black/bi-racial man as president. I feel such a comment is very offensive to blacks and African Americans.
Mark frm PA,
Since when does a reference to satan take on a racial component? I’ve seen many people of all races compared to satan…Asians, Whites, Blacks, American Indians etc. What you are proposing is to censor those that oppose Obama. Very un-American.
A black/bi-racial man for president is not the point the point is how many unborn babies black, white etc. has he sentenced to death. How much debt has he put this country in? How he has turned our health care system by Obamacare into Socialized Medicine and taken away our right to be free in implementing that. How he has condoned people to come into this country other than the normal waiting list by turn. How President Obama has disregarded Religious Freedom that soldiers have died for since the beginning of this country. The list could probably go on.
That’s you interjecting race into Fr. Karl’s writing, bro.
Mark, no one said anything about Obama’s ethnicity. We are all speaking of his past actions and what his next 4 years will have to offer! Anyone who can be so pro-abortion to the extent of leaving a live baby who survived the attemp to murder him, in a closet to die, has but one master that he serves, and that would not be GOD, so it must be someone else!!!! Also, remember that not so private conversation Obama had with Putin? Yes, America has much to be concerned about. She will be humbled and brought to her knees!
Mark, Fr. Karl didn’t say anything about his race, and Obama is evil supporting evil in murder of children and homosexuality. If that is not evil, by someone of any race, then I don’t know what is.
Mark is never interested in what people have to say, Sheila. He’s got his own agenda and like the current administration, has no ‘hunger for truth’ but rather is intent on perpetuating what passes for truth in this age. His true father has always ruled him and he will always be sympathetic to the obamas, the rahm emmanuel’s and the Van Jones of the world. You’d be better served by trying to convince your cat that Fr.Karl didn’t say anything about race. Or better yet, try telling my cat Gracie, for she is black and white. She might listen to you. haha
Dana I like your cat…it is smarter…
Mar-
I find that your implications of good Catholics voting with such intent to be extremely offensive. You have no sound evidence of such an accusation. Besides, no one here prefers your fascist approach to silencing those who do not agree with your viewpoint on socio/political issues.
Dear Editors: In my oppinion you should NOT edit comments that say President Obama is an agent of the devil. Obama is an agent of the devil because he does the devil’s deeds. When will PA realize that this country has NO problem witht the fact that Obama is a “black/bi-racial man” but it is Obama’s satanic works that we have issues with. I feel Obama’s beliefs and values are very offensive to Christ, Christ’s Church, and all true Catholics.
RR, I have friends in the South and they tell me that a lot of the people there have big problems with the fact that Obama is a black/bi-racial man. Romney carried the white vote in the South by a landslide. Without the Latino Catholic vote, President Obama would not have been re-elected. I have a degree in History and know well that none of our presidents were perfect men. All have had their faults but in calling the President an agent of the devil one shows disrespect for the office of President.
PA explain how you reconciled voting for Obama and be a so called faithful Catholic when he is without a doubt the biggest supporter of killing babies in the history of the presidency?? I really want to hear it
PA: I don’t have a degree in History, but it doesn’t take one to see the satanic beliefs of this President. Why do you think that just because you have a degree in History that it makes you all knowing about presidents and the rest of us are ignorant? Are you the History police because of your degree where you think that just because someone called your precious President satanic you can silence them? PA, I will go one further and add to the fact that his president is an agent of the devil and say that he is also a TYRANT! He is trying to destroy the Catholic Church that you supposedly love so much and he wants to wipe out ALL things of God in the world! If you don’t see that fact, then I really feel sorry for you. BTW: Of all the posters who responded to you, why did you choose me to respond to and ignore the others?
Mark–knock off the crap, okay? Speaking for myself–some years ago in the Senate race between Barack Obama and Alan Keyes, I VOTED FOR KEYES! Yes, whites did go for Romney and blacks for Obama–but I submit that it’s just as likely to prove that the blacks are guilty of racism as the other way around. And as usual, you are guilty of being tiresomely predictable. I don’t think any of the white people on this site voted out of race. Let’s put that to bed.
Mark from PA, you should be offended instead that President Obama does not care that most Planned Parenthood abortion facilities are located in black and Hispanic areas. If he and other like him had had their way, one of my own brown-skinned grandchildren would have been aborted since my grandchild was not born “perfect”. Please save your crocodile tears for those children.
RR, sorry if I come off as the History police. Please tell me which of our presidents have been agents of the devil. I never learned this in all my years of school.
PA: If you read what I actually wrote I was speaking ONLY of Obama. If you reread my post I was speaking of THIS president(Obama). Nice try at the switcheroo game, PA! Did you not notice I was using the pronoun, HE(Obama)? Now that you lost the game please respond to my post. Why do you continue to support THIS evil president(Obama) who is crucifying the Church you supposedly love so much?
RR, I know you were speaking only of Obama. I wonder if you felt that way about any past presidents. I remember you saying once that when you were in school that you didn’t like Social Studies (History included?) So maybe you aren’t as critical of past presidents.
Any politican who supports INTRINSIC EVIL is doing the devils work.
INSTRINSIC EVIL includes but is not limited to: ABORTION, EUTHANASIA, HOMO-SEXUAL MARRIAGE, and forcing people to pay for abortafacient drugs, contraceptives, and voluntary sterilization against their religious beliefs.
Yes, Obama is clearly doing the devils work. Therefore he is an agent of the devil.
It has zero to do with his skin color. Alveda King (Martin Luther Kings neice) is pro-life and doing God’s work. She is also black if you have not noticed.
Mary, would torturing suspects in order to elicit confessions be “intrinsic evil”? What about executing people for not having the correct religious opinions?
All right, JonJ. Which presidential candidates have publicly advocated the death penalty for adherents of any certain religion? Which have advocated torture? I’d like to know, because I sure wouldn’t vote for them!
JonJ,
What is torture? Psychological……physical? What. Is sleep depravation torture? Is playing loud music torture? Is water boarding (used by our special forces as a training techinique torture?
I think some comparisons need to be made….was cutting off Nick Berg’s head torture? Which do you think is worse cutting the guys head off on YouTube or waterboarding a guy to planned the 911 attack.
Sorry……but intense interrogation techiniques are worthwhile as proven by some of the invaluable information extracted from waterboarding some terrorists.
Mike, I mean physical torture designed to inflict pain with the express intent to elicit criminal confessions. Is that an intrinsic evil? Also, we must note that inflicting torture under such circumstances is highly likely to lead to false confessions in order to make the pain to stop.
You might want to talk with the Muslims…..Our ‘official’ enhanced interrogation techniques did not include pulling out of fingernails, breaking of bones, hanging people by their elbows, beating them with iron bars, tossing them off roofs, setting them on fire etc.
Also, is it moral to execute people for not having the correct opinions about the nature of God?
Mike, I wasn’t refering to muslims. I was actually referring to the use of torture by eccelsiastical courts over hundreds of years during the middle ages (including the spanish inquisition). It used to be accepted procedure to inflict pain through torture to elicit confessions in eccelesiastical courts. During the Inquisition, torture was used against suspected heretics in order to obtain confessions. BTW, you can find references to this on numerous catholic websites, and in the vatican’s own documents. Of course, I look at this past history in a hopefull manner. Even though the Church bureaucracy participated in a pattern of intrinsic evil for centuries, (as well as executing heretics for not having the correct opinions about God) they eventually turned away from this practice—as we hope secular governments will someday turn against abortion
JonJ: The Church bureaucracy has been participating “in a pattern of intrinsic evil” since the night Judas sold the Lord to the Sanhedrin.
Mark from PA –
No member of a free society condones a retort by use of fascist censorship in response to one’s freedom of opinion.
Bravo Father…..how right you are and I fear that the chastisement of the U.S. is only beginning.
Mr Editor see it is already happening PA and other supporters of Obama are already asking for our freedom of speech be taken away and be edited. Please do not submit to PA’s suggestions because at least give us a little bit of dignity here….the enemy may have won the secular victory but in the end it is our Lord who wins them all
It’s not a question of whether we feel that Obama is doing the work of the evil one, that is not the issue because we all know that he is and I pray very much for Obama’s conversion but the real thing is that we should not allow anyone to bash our Pope! That is when we should be speaking up, Defending our Pope. But to defend an evil president, that that to me tells a lot about a person.
President Obama had the nerve to visit out Pope and continued to Mock our Pope with his evil deeds…..so calling the president for what he represents is not wrong but disrespecting our Pope is the real issue here..that we should never allow anyone to disrespect our Pope…the rest who are disrespectful to religious freedom, well they are fair game!
Dear Abeca Christian: Your statement that President Obama’s dinner with church leaders had an “evil’ intention or was a “betrayal” is really only your opinion, isn’t it? Yet, you state it like some absolute truth.
Big Dee,
Wow even your name…well I must be a lady but you have to be a funny fellow….I’m not going to dance with you…not a big intention but only a big problem of our church leaders to dine with Obama while it airs on national TV, let me guess…..the lukewarm liberal Catholics really were edified in their decision to vote for Obama again…..so say what you will…I don’t care what you think, I was right about Obama being voted back in because of the misleading message some of the church leaders where contributing to.
What is happening is globalization. The govt has to manage hordes and hordes of people such as we saw in the Occupy movement. It cannot do this well unless it becomes tyrannical. The bishops of course are among the weakest in history, which does not help the cause of Christ much. The Pope wants the bishops to become holy … because there is no other way to promote the cause of Christ. Simple to say; bloody hard to do.
Amen! Fr. Karl. They will try to close your mouth, but you speak the truth. They did it to the Von Hildebrands during the Nazi era. Ask Alice von Hildebrand?
Fr. Karl, I do not see how you can argue that God is punishing America with Obama’s election. God did not vote in this election—American citizens voted. If anything, America is punishing itself by electing Obama. Obama’s election is yet another iteration of God allowing human beings free will, even if humans use that free will to choose evil. For, if we are denied free will by God, how are we to spiritually grow? If we are denied free will, then we are denied the opportunity to choose God. This, I believe, is the clearest reason why God allows evil to exist. If God did not permit evil, then he would also prevent man from freely choosing God.
jonj just admit it, you defy the church in many areas
So what, Abeca? That’s not pertinent to this issue. Fr. Karl is making the argument that God is punishing America for abortion, gay marriage, ect. by somehow making sure Obama is elected. I’m sorry, but that’s an unsound idea. Fr. Karl’s contention is no different from Pat Robertson trying to claim that various natural disasters or 9/11 was allowed to occur due to America’s sin. First of all, if we believe in an omniscient, omnipotent, and omnibenevolent God, how are we to believe that his aim is so poor that he would choose punishments that harm the upright and innocent as well as the guilty? Second, Fr. Karl is correct, then God would have either 1) be influencing voters to pull the level for Obama who otherwise would have voted for Romney or 2) God is somehow changing ballots to change votes in order for Obama to win. In either case, Fr. Karl is postulating that God is propagating these evils by putting Obama in charge, then turning around and punishing us for these behaviors—which would be a completely arbitrary and capricious act. Basically, you have God taking away our free will by determining the outcome, then punishing us for the results. I’m sorry, but that’s not behavior that’s consistent with Catholic beliefs about God. Basically, Abeca, you’re using an ad hominem attack and ignoring the merits of my point.
The Bishops did do so & they had no influence. Aside from the small minority of orthodox and traditional Catholics, many ‘Catholics’ voted for the incumbant.
Ohio & Virginia are probably gone from the grasp of the red party. With that, a blue White House may be perpetual. Georgia barely gave the majority to Romney by just a few. With anemic economic growth and almost 8% unemployment, people sided with ‘likeability’ instead of a record and positions.
Conservatives have talk radio and liberals have the media and colleges and may I venture to say many Catholics, too?
America, we have a new reality–in the Year of Faith, what are we to do?
you are so correct…
and I am a practicing Roman Catholic….did not vote for him before and of course never on the second time, I did my homework and prayed that the Holy Spirit would guide me and all of us….you see my husband left me cause I refused to have an abortion…I believe in the right of the unborn to live…and in our freedom….I was not born here but adopted to it although it was not easy at first….like everything in life it is a ‘rose’ with thorns….
God Bless America….LETS PRAY DAILY…OTHERWISE WE WILL NOT MAKE IT
How can we ask Our Loving Lord to bless this America now…
Solano County, in which the Univ of Calif Davis is located fifteen miles west of Sacramento, voted 80% Obama. UCD has become perhaps the most feminized university campus in history.
What a bunch of doomsayers. I am not a ‘practicing Catholic’ for one thing!! i am a Roman Catholic who believes in God the Father Almighty, creator of Heaven and earth…” I don’t really care for that expression ‘practicing’ Catholic. Witch doctors and new agers practice the dark arts, but we as believers ARE what we believe. We don’t practice it. Sounds like Kathleen Sibelius and Joe Biden, who truly are ‘practicing’ Catholics and at the rate they’re going, will NEVER get it right. I’m glad you got it right ldc. Don’t give up now, you’re certainly on the road to Gloryland!
Dana,
You seem a bit sensitive to the word practicing. How do you describe a Catholic who follows all of the teachings of the Church? Joe Biden, Nancy and those of their ilk have coopted the words practicing, faithful, ardent, conforming when describing their Catholocism. These words coming from these people mean nothing because they are false even before they utter them.
I have no idea of what kind of Catholic you are but if you are not ‘practicing’ the faith by conforming to its teachings, going to mass and taking part in the sacraments…..best think about it because Christ said, “Not every one that saith to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven: but he that doth the will of my Father who is in heaven, he shall enter into the kingdom of heaven.” (cf. Mattew 7:21)
When a beginning violinist practices, he’s practicing to be a violinist. Once he becomes a true violinist he’s a violinist, not a practicing violinist. I am a faithful Catholic, Mike, that’s all. I try in all things to be faithful to the Magisterium, the teachings of the Church and most especially faithful to my beloved Lord. I fail often and often but I would still call myself faithful. I don’t practice it so much as live it. I’m not quibbling about semantics here, Mike. A practicing Catholic sounds like someone who goes through the motions and attends mass, but is that living it? Could you call Kathleen Sibelius a faithful Catholic? Do you think Biden would ever refer to himself as a faithful Catholic? Abeca is a faithful Catholic. Kenneth Fischer is a faithful Catholic. Does that make sense? Anyway, thanks for the perceptive post!
Well then…..I am a faithful Catholic who ‘practices’ the faith by conforming to ‘all’ – ‘all’ the teachings of the Church to the best of my ability. I don’t think the word is important it is the context, it is the person who is making the claim, it is there credibility or lack thereof that makes the difference.
Come judgment day….Pelosi and a whole bunch of those like here will be sitting with the goats unless they repent and go to confession.
We are Catholics cut from the same cloth…
Basically what you’re saying is words do not matter and that if someone chooses to call himself something he’s not, as in the case of men who lie about serving in the military no longer being penalized…it’s perfectly okay these days to lie about pretty much everything, just don’t get caught…and those of us who defend truth and honor are just quibblers and nitpickers, that we must live with the goats until the time of judgment. With that attitude, there won’t be many sheep left to sort out of the goats…what then?
This is an attack on free speech. This is the beginning of approved speech. This is the beginning of the end of conscious rights and religious freedom in the US if this line of reasoning continues in the government and society.
well we all can do something….
PRAY TO THE ALMIGHTY GOD….daily!!!!
and get involved, stand up for our Country, our Constitution and our FREEDOM…read follow all those evil people every move they make and call get your family and friends involved….
if we don’t we will not have the America you were born and the one that adopted me when i cam here…..
We are a Nation Under God, and In God We Trust….
God Bless our Great Nation
PRAY PRAY PRAY
Yes, we must pray, But God gave each of us a free will and a brain for a reason.
God expects us to use that free will and brain for good – that’s how we will get to Heaven.
Follow the instructions of Pope Benedict.
Read the ‘Catechism of the Catholic Church’, and share it with others.
You may be saving Souls.
Those who know their Faith, with vote their Faith.
Okay, so will the bishops NOW declare those “catholic” politicians aligned with Obama to be excommunicated, PLEASE? It is more than obvious now that the Catholic Church has been targeted for elimination by the liberals in this country, that very country that was founded on Chriatian principles. My heart belongs to Jesus, but the IRS owns my earnings, and my ability to make a living. I will be forever grateful to my bishops if they would stand with me, and say “let them take the building, but they will never be able to take my faith in God.”
Write (or email) your Diocese Bishop TODAY,
and ask him to stop the loss of Souls through the mortal Sin of SCANDAL – – – enforce Canon 915 and EXCOMMUNICATE officially when necessary. Quote: 1 Cor 11-13.
Heresy and schism are defined in the CCC 2089. Quote this too.
It does not take a rocket scientist to read this Bible passage and the CCC.
We must let the Bishops know this is important to us and society for the common good as well as for correction of the Soul of the individual scandalizer.
CA has its share of public heretics and public schismatics.
Nancy Pelosi, Jerry Brown, Arnold Schwarzineger, etc.
Name all those who live in your Diocese who make public scandal – to make the Bishop’s job easier.
We each have a job to do, let’s do it.
I will keep this on my lips as we move “forward”…..Viva Cristo Rey and in my heart, y Nuestra Senora de Guadalupe. The blood of many, the innocent, has already been shed, our God sees all. May we listen carefully to Our King and not foment any injustice, that we may perceive, on our own. We will know, will be led, the victory is already ours in the Blood of the Lamb. Viva Cristo Rey.
Closer than ’08 was; in 2016 Hillery won’t have a chance.
Gonna try to find a way to make Church contributions w/o any of it going to the poor, since the bishops are making sure the govt takes care of that end of the deal.
Actually, what we need … maybe … have to check the CCC … is a thoroughly transparent account sheet of where all money handled by bishops goes. That way we could see what their real priorities are, rather than have to depend on what they tell us they are.
ccc — the catechism of the catholic church???
hmm — JLS, i get the feeling you are referring to some OTHER ccc.
maybe the california catholic conference?
Second edition, max: by which I mean it would be good for the laity to study up and find Magisterial ways to hold the bishops accountable for the Pope’s demand that they become holy.
It will be interesting these next four years, seeing which bishops cave to Caesar and which bishops cling to the Lord.
AND YET, all the exit polling data shows that most Catholics voted to re-elect President Obama. Maybe they don’t appreciate the Vatican meddling in political affairs. Maybe they don’t like the fact that churches are becoming less like houses of worship and more like political advocacy groups.
Unless of course the Church is supporting gay marriage and the liberals sacrament of abortion right Chuck…..here’s too secession of the country and the forming of an Am Church were you can attend where sin venerated
Those Catholics probably did not know about “intrinstic evil” and that being for abortion is an intrinstic evil. It is the pastors responsibility to teach about intrinstic evils and the Ten Commandments and what the Bible teaches. If the Bible teaches against certain political activities then the political activity is wrong such as Biden lying about that there is no trouble with the HHS mandate and the church when in fact there are suits against the government by church affiliated organizations that adhere to church teachings. Sure these people are Catholics but how much of their Catholism is real Catholic and how much is non Catholic.
No, brother. It is because fallen man does not like the light of Christ shined upon his behavior, nor does he like to follow the Shepherd on His way of the cross, so hard and rocky, so heavy. Half of Catholics are not on board with the non-negotiables. They vote for politicians who will happily lead them to hell by seeming to make the immoral (according to God) legal (according to man). What woman who contracepts will vote for a politician who is against contraception? That is it in a nutshell, to use only the easiest example.
PS: “half of Catholics” refers not to totally fallen-away, non-practicing Catholics; I refer to half of the practicing pew-sitters. A conservative Catholic has a 50% chance of being strongly rebuffed if he airs his Magisterium-aligned opinions to the person next to him in the pew, even at a weekday Mass.
Judas Catholics will always be with us as they were from the very beginning. Let the dead bury the dead. As for the weak and vacillating bishops, we’ve got to pray for them. Be strong. Be faithful. Be ready to defend the hope that is within us. There’s no time to be lost, and bitterness and recriminations are a waste of time. I’m going on as I meant to go on before the election. Jesus is the same as He was yesterday and will be tomorrow. This whole country is going to suffer, not just Catholics. We’re so deeply in debt that I doubt even Romney could have done much. We’re facing a far greater threat than this president…we’re surrounded by enemies that grow stronger every day (Russia, China, Iran etc. etc.) and only our faith and trust in God will see us through. “Stay calm and carry on’ as it says on my tea cup, (a quote from WWII England.) May God bless each person reading this with His peace and joy, and may He hold you in the palm of His hand . “Lo I am with you always even unto the end of the age”
The Republican party will return as more pro-immigrant, even more ambivalent on gay marriage and – of course – more supportive of a “woman’s right to choose”. Unfortunately, democracy tends to see elections as settling issues, and dismisses advocates with their party.
Funny I was about to file an IRS complaint against Cardinal Dolan for promoting Barack Obama at the Al Smith Dinner. What a cover if legitimacy the Cardinal gave him that night.
Yes those five bishops of small dioceses stood tall….. but all the big Archbishops were silent silent silent silent after they made some perfunctory noise way back in July.
Make no mistake about it, there are no tears today in the Chancery Office of any Archdiocese in America…. there is a celebration.
The rot, my friends, is in the episcopate.
By the Pope telling the bishops to become holy, which is akin to a boss telling his workers to work, the message is tantemount to saying that the episcopate is rotten to the core. How can a bishop have any validity if he is not holy? Answer: He can’t.
You’re wrong there, JLS. A bishop has “validity” if he is validly ordained and validly named a bishop by the pope–until such time as he is validly removed from his position by the pope. His personal holiness has no bearing on his authority to act as bishop. He may be disobeyed ONLY when he attempts canonically UNLAWFUL actions–such as trying to forbid the celebrating of the Extraordinary Rite or kneeling for Holy Communion. All his lawful and proper actions carry the weight even of the holiest bishop–even if we may believe such actions ill-advised or even unfair.
A bishop who defies God has not only no validity but is an anti-Christ, Larry. We must learn to discern, so that the shepherds do not include the skulls of the sheep with their own when paving the road to Hell. Seek out good and faithful bishops and avoid evil bishops.
Once again, JLS, you’re giving our dangerously bad advice. True, we must not allow bad bishops to lead us into sin, just as we must not allow anyone to do so. That having been said, we are NOT free to declare bishops deposed from their sees because WE believe (rightly or wrongly) them to be unholy–which I submit would be attempting to judge what we are not allowed to judge–the inner state of the bishop’s soul. Rightly or wrongly, whether you or I like it or not, it is up to the pope to fire disloyal bishops, NOT you! If a sinful bishop issues a LAWFUL order (such as suspending a priest from his duties) you and I are not free to say, “the bishop is unholy–therefore he is no longer a bishop and his see is actually vacant–therefore the priest is not really suspended–therefore we can go to that priest for the Sacraments without being disloyal to Christ.” It doesn’t work that way. An order does not need to be wise, prudent and fair in order to be lawful and binding–it simply needs to fall within his legitimate authority as bishop–and it needs to be something which is not expressly forbidden to him by higher authority, such as the pope, canon law, the catechism, etc. Your pride keeps compelling you to give advice to people that may lead them to hell–and at the risk of sounding tedious and repetitive, I can’t let you get away with that!
JimAroo,
In thanksgiving for the help, perhaps Barack Obama will appoint Cardinal Timothy Dolan the new Czar of Hospitality.
I have a wonderful idea for Cardinal Dolan. Why not hold a grand Mass of Thanksgiving for Obama’s re-election in St. Patrick’s Cathedral! Better still–the Cardinal could even privately ordain Obama a priest so that the President may concelebrate the Mass with him! They can even hold hands at the altar while doing so.
I hope that the dinner that our church leaders had with Obama was tasty because…..it was a dinner of betrayal. For those that saw the dinner harmless, shame on you, you are all traitors! Deep down you wanted Obama to win and that is why you saw no harm in Obama’s dinner invitation by our church leaders. Those in the church who used the scripture passage that Jesus ate with the sinners…has betrayed Jesus and His church and used scripture for a great evil!
Now for those that refused to vote for neither Obama or Romney, you have just voted Obama in and please consider not complaining about Obama’s win because your actions may have cost us the election that would of lead us to lesson the slaughter of more unborn babies, it may have lead us to gain favor in more pro-life efforts but now that is all gone because of your negligence to vote accordingly. God have mercy on us all, we must now not give up and continue to educate with a louder message and UN-blind the foolish people who voted Obama back in…We noticed that San Francisco had a higher percentage that voted for Obama…of course, the gay movement wanted this victory….Sodom and Gomorrah here we come!
Thank God our Bishop was a faithful Obama supporter, we do not need to worry about the IRS, we moved to Southern Nevada and our new Pastor threatened to have us arrested, we had a pro life truck on the roadway off Church property, he threatened openly to have us ARRESTED if we dared come on the property with our hand outs on the intrinsic evils of ABORTION. He then forbid our apoligitics group from having our meetings in OUR Church hall because we were out in support of pro-life, this can be substantiated hope you print it..MGB AMERICA
More evidence that there are two Catholic Churches now, one of them authentic.
Systematic religious persecution has begun. It will only amp up.
The Faithful must prepare themselves for the martyrdom to occur in the not too distant future.
St Michael the Archangel defend us in battle…………
The IRS won’t investigate. If they do, they will not revoke any tax exemption. There would be tremendous anti-government push back they don’t want. Like any bully, the IRS will select the weakest to try to use as an example to intimidate others.
But they will not do it – they don’t have the guts.
If a Soros group is starting this, it must be defied in any case. It’s a very, very bad thing to back down from evil. They must be confronted and challenged.
I used to have conversations with a retired IRS special agent, a man who carried a badge and gun held high while storming into offices on IRS business, terrifying the staff who had no idea what was going down. He retired early, he told me, because he had a conscience.
If we are to believe that God is in control , then perhaps it is time to help the now twice elected President achieve some of the gols that he has established. OR , as before , we can be spoiled losers and disagree with everything he is trying to do . And that proves what ?? It is time for this country to put politics aside and put America first . That means Everybody has to give ,,,,,,,,,,like it or not Obama has 4 more years.
No giving, no surrender, no compromise with evil, it is this attitude adopted by the hierarchy in the Church that has led to this catastrophe…I going into bunker mode, cutting myself off from a majority that I detest
I can’t blame you.
“Make no mistake about it, there are no tears today in the Chancery Office of any Archdiocese in America…. there is a celebration.”
JimAroo, I was in my local chancery today for a meeting. The priests were subdued over the election results but it appeared to be just another workday for the lay staff. Of course, seeing a truck in the parking lot with an Obama 2012 sticker didn’t help my mood.
This election is nothing less than catastrophic. We have lost the country. Liberalism has won big. Conservatism–especially moral values–have suffered a terrible loss. We now know that in an all-out fight, using every weapon we’ve got–we cannot defeat the enemy forces. We’re outnumbered. Outgunned. Outvoted. Out-everything. I don’t know what to say. For forty years we’ve prayed to end abortion. The answer to our prayers is a resounding “no!” For forty years we’ve marched to end abortion. We’ve accomplished nothing. We have conscientiously voted for “pro-life” candidates. We’ve accomplished nothing. We’ve demonstrated outside abortion clinics. We’ve accomplished nothing. We’ve counseled and here and there, we are able to save a precious few. Meanwhile, the massacre goes on. We have fought for “strict constructionist” justices on the Supreme Court. They have refused to budge from Roe V Wade. Now we arrive at 2012 and the entire nation has turned decisively against us. We have accomplished nothing while the body count hits 50-million on its way to a hundred million…two hundred million…half a billion… What is there left to do? I can’t think of a thing. Clearly, voting is a useless charade. From now on, all candidates will be fighting each other to proclaim their love of abortion and Obamacare. We won’t have anyone we can vote for. I don’t plan to vote again. I must conclude that there is no political solution. The only way forward is for the Catholic Church in America to rebuild itself from the womb up–and repopulate the culture with committed Catholics. That should finally do the job. I estimate it will take several centuries–probably a good chunk of this half-millennium. In the meantime, the American Republic is a dead letter. It’s finished. Fini. An idea whose time has passed. Its collapse is a mere formality–but we must think now of preserving some semblance of Catholic culture in North America for the next thousand years. Today is a total loss. The bishops’ interventions were a day late and a dollar short. Well done, Your Excellencies. Now go back and finish your after-dinner wine with Katie Couric and the gang. Okay, folks–that’s all I can come up with. I’m grateful that I’m almost 58 years old and in chronic poor health. I won’t have to stick around much longer. But you younger and healthier folks are going to have to dodge the debris from the coming crash-and-burn. I feel sorry for you. If I get to heaven before you, I’ll put in a good word.
It is not a matter of losing a country; it is a matter of creating a Church in the globalizing world we live in today. “Smaller, holier Church” says the Pope. Ok, why cry over spilled milk, when we can go with what he is describing?
Well, perhaps I’m a bit sentimental, JLS, over the Republic which so many fighting men gave their lives to found and sustain over the years. My own late father, may he rest in peace, fought with the Army in the invasion of Saipan in 1944. He and his comrades won their war. Myself and mine lost ours. All right–so be it.
Where did the Pope say “smaller, holier Church”, JLS?
I don’t think he said that, despite your use of quotation marks. What is the source of that quote?
The Pope does not call for schism, he works for all to be in the Bark of Peter.
Well, the vote didn’t come out the way I wanted it to, either. But, I am a 70+ year old white guy decended from nothern european stock. I don’t represent the demographics of this country. The President was re-elected by Hispanics, single women, African Americans, etc. It is also very evident that people with strong religious beliefs are marginalized in a society where less than a majority believe in God and fewer than 25% bother to go to church occasionally. Our Bishops, for all of their fulmanating showed that no one paid any attention to them. On the broad canvas of American politics, abortion and gay marriage don’t show up as even a small blip. The issues are settled in the mind of most people. We may not like it, but that is the truth. If we want to bring about systemic change in this country, it will take a completely different political party that is not dominated by the religious right wing, because we are considered irrelevant by the majority. I think that we all know this if we read the comments that continue to show up on this site. We get all worked up over serious issues that no one else cares about or thinks about. Among the majority of Americans we are all become anachronistic. How do we become influential again?
Bob One, actually a majority of people in our country believe in God. Romney actually didn’t do all that bad, as the election was close. He lost by only getting 7% of the black vote and 29% of the Latino vote. Romney actually carried the vote of white people over 40 and he carried white voters in Southern states by landslide margins. I don’t think the Republican party is dominated by the religious right wing. It is actually controlled by big money, wealthy men, big businesses and corporations. These people don’t really care a lot about social issues, they just want lower taxes for the wealthy. They also want the votes of the religious right wing but they will not do anything to stop abortion. They will give lip service but when it comes to actions, they don’t really care all that much. I hope that when our health care mess gets straightened out and most people have health coverage that this will lead to a sharp drop in the number of abortions.
PA, both political parties are owned by big money. Politicians, like many or even most bishops, answer to big money, sad to say. Moreover, PA, most people answer to big money. All sodomites answer to big money. All abortionists answer to big money. It is not a matter of putting God before money, but of answering to either God or big money. One or the other, PA. The hierarchy of God does not include big money.
PA what a lie!
PA stop your propaganda just tell the truth, you dislike Republicans who do not believe in gay marriage….just tell the truth stop trying to distract others away from the real issues and not on your false ideologies.
Abeca Christian, I have probably voted for more Republicans than you have. (Six if you want to know the number, I actually voted for George H. Bush and George W. Bush twice, but they only count for 2.) So don’t tell me I dislike Republicans.
PA you are naive beyond belief….
You dream…..look to Europe as your future. I’m sorry if you find my remarks disturbing but oh my……you have not concept.
Pretty much sums it up. Except that operating in horrible countries is nothing new to the Church and that it’s servants (including those within its chancery offices) will carry on – just like its another work day – because it is another work day.
“… carry on like another workday …”: Wow, Brian S., you sound worn out, weary of life. St Benedict tells us Ora et Labora, work as if everything depends on you, Brian S., and pray as if everything depends on God. When you get to the bottom of the barrel of ideologies, then there will be nothing there anymore … except for Jesus Christ, Who is the Kingdom of God.
We are workers in the fields of the Lord. That sounds worn-out?
Larry, we’ve faced terrible obstacles before. From a sermon by St. Augustine sometime after the sack of Rome in 410:
“Do not hold on to the old man, the world; do not refuse to regain your youth in Christ, who says to you: “The world is passing away, the world is losing its grip, the world is short of breath. Do not fear,Thy youth shall be renewed as an eagle”
He likened the decline of his civilization to the olive press. Christians who are faithful under pressure yield a higher quality of pure oil.
As Catholics, we’re to be salt and light in a dark world. It’s just that the darkness ‘appears’ to be winning, but we KNOW how it comes out. God has won the war already. We’re just called to fight it out on our watch. I’m not going to give in to a bunch of orcs. Watch the final battle in the Return of the King. I think of the presidency of FDRoosevelt, who was just as radical as obama and even had a communist as a vice president, and many of his policies did much to diminish the power of the church’s influence…and is the primary reason we have this whole subclass of ‘social justice’ Catholics. After Roosevelt and Truman, we had one of our best times in America under Eisenhower. Never give up. Never! We’ve already won, as long as we stay faithful to our Lord and our Church.
Well, as I indicated in my reference to the next thousand years, I don’t have any doubt that the Catholic Church/faith will survive. The question is: can the American Republic survive–one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all–under the 1787 Constitution as amended–in all the territory currently covered by the 50 states and DC?
The answer to that is “no”.
And my answer to you is: “I thought so.”
Larry, my family has been here since 1620, (earlier if you count my native American ancestor) and all I can say is without God, this nation is finished, just as the Jews were in Babylon until God winnowed them a bit. But whatever happens, we must always remember that God is always in control…but I’m so afraid I’ll be too weak when it comes to actually suffering and I’ll lose my trust. This is my greatest fear, that I’m too weak a vessel. I am so weak and needy and so often I forget to call on God in my weakness. I wish I’d been a better citizen and done more to fight against what I knew was wrong, but I was so comfortable and thought it would last forever. I feel like I should be wearing sackcloth and ashes, don’t you? Mitt Romney is a model citizen and even though I don’t care for his religion, his citizenship was/is remarkable. I feel we lost one of our very best presidents with this election. So much loss. So much loss, there are no words, Larry.
“There are no words.” Yeah. I guess not. And from my perspective, no ideas, either. Perhaps this sidebar, though–for what it’s worth–and you’ll have to tell ME what it’s worth, if anything: I was at Costco today to buy lettuce. I always like wheeling by the book stand while I’m there, if only to glance at the covers while I pass by. I saw two nonfiction books about the Civil War era. One was a thick one by Doris Kearns Goodwin–“Team of Rivals: The Political Genius of Abraham Lincoln,” upon which the Spielberg movie “Lincoln” is based. The other a bit thinner–“The Man Who Saved the Union: Ulysses Grant in War & Peace” by H.W. Brands. Without both Grant and Lincoln, we wouldn’t have the Union today. Anyway–I bought three packets of butter lettuce and headed off into the chilly, overcast afternoon.
Some anthropological studies show that Europeans were here before Asians. This means that caucasians arrived in North America before anyone else. That would be about tens of thousands of years ago according to the anthropological system (young earthists may simply shrink the timespan, but leave the order or arrival). That would be ancient pre-history; recently, about a thousand years ago, it is known that Scandanavians reached N.A. But quite possibly they had been doing this for a long long time, since their boats were capable longer ago than a millenium. What I’m pointing out is that when racial groups claim they were here first, what you are hearing is hot air. There is, apparently, Neanderthal genetic material in Indo-European populations, which would include “native Americans”.
Yes, in the middle of Montana.
JLS, I inadvertently found out I have the blood of vikings flowing in my veins…the genetic disease I have came from the vikings when they raped one of my unfortunate ancestors in the British Isles. Alpha 1 anti-tripsin deficiency is a Swedish genetic disorder. Weird!
It also supports my theory that all disease is the result of sin at some time or other.
Larry I understand your sentiments on this current dilemma, but we must not give up hope…I am keeping you in my prayers. Yes please pray for us…God bless you.
Larry offer up your suffering from your ailing health for God’s faithful and intentions…we need all the prayers right now, I am still in denial that this nightmare of Obama is handed to us for another four years, I can only take it one day at a time…..Just last night I went to take my son shopping for basketball shoes, next door to where my daughter works part time, I paused and stared at my kids wanted to cry because I don’t know what persecutions they will have to face if they choose to live their faith faithfully, and I pray that they do what is right by our Lord. As they form their conscience in Christ in what we tried teaching them and raising them with….I pray that they don’t fall into the wrong hands because kids change once they become teenagers, those are the tough years and study shows that they can lose their faith, especially if they attend a secular school and with there being more bad Catholic Universities. The few good private Catholic schools being expensive, we parents are only doing what we can.
I also can not be in-denial anymore that most people have lost their good common sense and good common decency (maybe it feels that way because I live in California, who knows) and most of all they lost or never had it, their fear of the Lord in their hearts, I can say that I blame all this on abortion and the sin of sodomy! These sins have desensitized our society not to mention the modern conveniences haven’t helped either.
Well, Abeca, if I could make a suggestion–and I don’t know what your particular situation is–but if you can–get the (bleep) out of California! That state is in Looney Toonesville so far that when the chaos hits, it will hit there first and hit there hardest. As a matter of fact, anyone who CAN, should evacuate the country altogether–especially if you have young children. Anyone who cannot should join me in singing “Nearer My God to Thee” as the ship sinks slowly into the icy waters of the North Atlantic. Sorry I can’t be more cheerful. And don’t worry–I do offer my sufferings for the Holy Souls and all sinners–especially those going to die soon–and I unite everything with the Precious Blood as offered at every Mass around the world. I’d recommend it for everyone.
Larry I replied to you but it didn’t save the post to post it. Something is wrong with the website, normally it saves it while it waits for approval but this time it didn’t, I hope this one reply works?
Larry, I’ll put you on my prayer list along with Thomas Miles and Ms. Beattie, and Abecca please join me when you can…O God, bless and help Larry in his illness. Please continue to give him endurance and cheerfulness to bear all weakness and pain. Give him a mind a rest and if it be Thy will, grant him full recovery. Lord Jesus, please come to him this day and at this time. Bless him with Thy healing grace. Amen.
Thank you very much!!!!
Dana…to your prayer AMEN!
Jeremiah Right said “God D..n America” and God has permitted it.
Jeremiah Wright appears to be powerful. Suppose he had blessed American instead!
1.3 million abortions per year x 8 years = 10.4 million babies murdered during Obama presidency > 6 million Jews murdered by Hitler
And in both 2008 and 2012, over 50% of “Catholics” voted for Obama?
Worse, is it really true that EWTN News Chief Raymond Arroyo said in 2008 that over 50% of the BISHOPS voted for Obama?
Really is this true? Juergensen where did they get those numbers, are you sure it was over 50% of Catholics and over 50% of Bishops? More than half of Bishops? How could that be? I always thought it was only a few bad bishops but over half? Where did you get that number? If this is correct then how can I question the idea that protestants have about the church being the whore…..
it’s all disturbing to me…maybe all this info is not helpful, it only breaks my heart…what can a person like me do to help our church leaders be held accountable….nothing, I can see why we need to keep them in our prayers daily….this is very sad
Abeca Christian, I believe you are right that some people are posting in for censoring of posts that should not be censored. Sometimes I ask the editors to take off some of my posts, and they have been gracious in doing so, but one was taken off of here that I did not ask to be taken off. I apologized because I thought it was perhaps not written well, but in seeing what Mark is doing here, I think it was taken off because I basically called President Obama’s administration tyrannical, and it is.
Anne T we can expect more and more of censoring that should not be censored to keeping going on because what has become acceptable now days will be protected but different verbal objections to the liberal mind set will not. Bashing of what is good will be more acceptable but bashing of what represents evil will most likely be censored.
Its all about the lack of good common sense…this society has lost it….
I thank the editors for not publishing some of my post submissions. You all might be too, if you were to read them.
JLS you and I seem not in like mind in this scenario. Sorry I can’t speak for your comments but sorry I do not hold the same sentiments.
You said it better than I could, Brad. Except that I don’t believe that most people are murderers and adulterers in their hearts. Hopefully those are only temptations for a few people. You have said that we are all called to chastity and I agree with this.
So get your new book of Mark of PA….being sold where in most liberal stores today….with complementary pictures of holding hands and lets all get along with or without God.
Where we have gone wrong was when man decided to ignore scripture warnings on the sin of sodomy. Many Catholics I meet misinterpret the CCC’s teachings on that particular part of homosexuality, they have watered it down…The convictions that once we had on that subject have become desensitized and have lead to false compassion.
Hang in there, good bishops, hang in there. The world is on the edge of a precipice, and many have already fallen into it and are trying to drag or push the rest of us in there with them.. If we hang on to each other and refuse to budge perhaps we can even pull some of those others out before they end up dead. Who knows? May the Good Lord help us all, give us wisdom and fortitude to know the difference between what is right and wrong and what is tolerance and what is permissiveness and what is liberty and what is licentiousness. Please, Lord, give sanity back to this nation and the whole world.
Please excuse typo errors and spelling in last.I am upset!!! The Catholics SHOULD have banded together on this and sent Obama packing!!! The ignorance is blinding. And at the local parishes where I live the priests are eunichs…afraid they won’t have enough in the collection basket if they say the “wrong thing” Be men!!! Be men for God for God’s sake! Don’t you know that people are thirsting for the truth!!!!! They are emmaciated from lack of food for their souls!!!!
HOW CAN I HELP DEFEND THE CHRISTIAN FAITH?
Good question….In Jesus only
Why was it all right to call Bush every name in the book then but not to utter anything suggesting disapproval of Obama now? Socio/political oppression has certainly set in once people start walking on eggshells.
Christians, do not speak in hushed tones for fear of bullying by fascist minds or you will lose to the devil who inspires them.
Brian – we each have an obligation to evangelize per Pope Benedict and the CCC.
Evangelize means to teach.
We must NEVER TOLERATE SIN. Loving our neighbor demands this.
“Love forgives the sinner, and it hates the sin; it is unmerciful to the error in his mind.” – Bishop Fulton Sheen