Washington D.C., Jun 26, 2013 (CNA/EWTN News) — The U.S. Supreme Court ruled today in a 5-4 decision that a key part of the Defense of Marriage Act is unconstitutional, and the federal government must recognize “gay marriages” accepted by individual states.
The 1996 Defense of Marriage Act – known as DOMA – “violates basic due process and equal protection principles applicable to the Federal Government,” said Justice Anthony Kennedy, writing for the majority.
In a June 26 ruling, the Court said that section 3 of DOMA, which defines marriage as the union of one man and one woman for federal purposes, violates the U.S. Constitution’s equal protection guarantees.
“The avowed purpose and practical effect of the law here in question are to impose a disadvantage, a separate status, and so a stigma upon all who enter into same-sex marriages made lawful by the unquestioned authority of the States,” the court declared.
In a lengthy dissent, Justice Antonin Scalia rejected the majority’s assumption that the law had as its purpose to “disparage,” “injure,” “degrade,” “demean” and “humiliate” gay individuals.
Rather, he explained, DOMA “did no more than codify an aspect of marriage that had been unquestioned in our society for most of its existence – indeed, had been unquestioned in virtually all societies for virtually all of human history.”
“It is one thing for a society to elect change,” he said, “it is another for a court of law to impose change” by pronouncing those who oppose “enemies of the human race.”
Those who oppose “gay marriage” have voiced concern about their ability to abide by their beliefs if marriage is redefined.
Already in states that recognize “gay marriage,” Catholic adoption agencies have been forced to close for their insistence on placing children only with a married mother and father. Other non-profit agencies and private business owners have also faced pressure and mounting lawsuits to recognize same-sex unions as marriages against their religious convictions.
The majority opinion acknowledged that its ruling could have sweeping implications, as DOMA affects “over 1,000 federal statutes and the whole realm of federal regulations.”
On the same day, the nation’s high court also dismissed an appeal on California’s Proposition 8 on grounds of standing.
After a California court had ruled that “gay marriage” must be recognized in the state, marriage defenders launched a campaign to amend the state constitution to recognize marriage as the union of one man and one woman.
The amendment, Proposition 8, was approved by voters but quickly challenged in court. A lower court had ruled that the proposition was unconstitutional, and the case was appealed.
The Supreme Court’s dismissal on technical legal grounds rather than the merits of the case means that the lower court’s ruling stands, and “gay marriage” can be recognized in California.
Under the June 26 rulings, states may still choose to define marriage as they see fit. In states that choose to legalize “gay marriage,” the federal government must now recognize these unions. Currently, only 12 states and the District of Columbia recognize “gay marriage,” although marriage defenders have warned that political pressure is mounting in an attempt to force a redefinition of the institution.
This all gets back to Catholics electing IMMORAL politicians and judges.
And immoral politicians appointing immoral judges and other immoral appointees.
Elected persons appoint those of like mind.
Catholics are REQUIRED to VOTE. (CCC 2240)
Those who get elected at LOCAL, STATE & FEDERAL levels can be changed if Catholics vote with a “Catholic” conscience – as assisted by the Catechism of the Catholic Church, Second Edition”.
Members of the Supreme Court are not elected. They are appointed by the President and confirmed by Congress. The decision of the Supreme Court was on the basis of the US constitution. Clearly, DOMA was unconstitutional. End of story .
Aaron Ashcroft –
Therefore Roe vs Wade was also constitutional. Right?!
Roe v Wade was a court case. Court cases themselves are neither constitutional nor unconstitutional. Laws are constitutional or not. Perhaps you can clarify what you mean?
Of course not. Show me anywhere that the underpinning of Roe v. Wade, the imaginary “right to privacy” is in the Constitution. You won’t find it there. But many who are so outraged over NSA spying on Americans refer to that same mythical right. If you want it in the Constitution, you need to amend it. Until then be consistent. Complain about the spying and shut up about Roe V. Wade or vice versa.
“The Declaration of Independence” includes: ” We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness….”
(It does not state like in Roe v Wade that unborn babies have zero civil rights.)
Regarding right to privacy – “US Constitution, Amendment IV” –
“The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probably cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized. “
The Declaration of Independence was adopted into law by
Congress in 1776.
US Constitution Amendment IV – was also adopted into law by Congress in 1791.
There was no Congress in 1776. There was no United States in 1776. The Declaration of Independence is not a law.
To Anonymous below – –
” There was no Congress in 1776. There was no United States in 1776. The Declaration of Independence is not a law.” – quote of Anonymous.
Where did you go to school?
The Declaration of Independence is one of the two founding Documents of the USA.
The Continental Congress adopted both –
1) Declaration of Independence. (July 4, 1776)
2) The US Constitution.
The Declaration of Independence is called the “definitive American statement of the conditions of legitimate political authority, the ends of government, and the sovereignty of the people…the fundamental Act of Union of these States” – James Madison.
MAC, OK if you mean the Continental Congress. I looked up whether the Declaration of Independence is law and it depends on how you define law. SCOTUS does not include it in the laws of the United States, however it is viewed as part of the organic law, or guiding principles of the US, by others.
MAC:
Where did you go to school? The Constitution is the Constitution. The Declaration is a founding document, but has no force of law. Consider this: Laws can be changed by legislation and the Constitution can be amended or even replaced in a constitutional convention, but there is no way to revoke the Declaration. That alone tells you it is a statement of principles, not law. Nobody has ever argued a case before the Supreme Court based on the Declaration.
Madison’s statement was about natural law, not political law.
Uhhh Ted, there’s a little difference between the NSA spying and the Roe v. Wade decision.
There IS a specific amendment that directly addresses the NSA spying. It’s called 4th amendment:
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
Thus, the ONLY acceptable constitutional exception is if you obtain a 1) warrant 2) from a court 3) by oath or affirmation that 4) probably cause exists that a search will uncover evidence of a crime.
So, Ted, even a textualist such as yourself can be against the NSA spying and object to Roe and still be intellectually consistent.
Oh yeah, what your search must be identified with specificity in the warrant. No blanket warrants.
The Decision of the USSC was based on Misandry – the Hatred of Men & Boys, Masculinity and Normal Heterosexuality. Such is the Tenure Track in Law and Academentia, and produced the likes of losers ranging from tony kennedy to the Kagan.
As for Comparisons – I would say that the Dred Scott case provides the best USSC analogy. Scott was a Slave who made it in to Free Territory – only to be returned as “Property” – Under the Constitution.
Like the Free States targeted by slavekeepers, so too the Catholic Church and the Gaystapo. While the Gaystapo has done this kind of dirty work before (Dachau opened in 1933) – they have never had the resources to so effectively control people – as in this new Age of Abomination.
i was thinking the same thing myself, Michael, about your analogy with the Dred Scott case.
In March of 1857, the United States Supreme Court, led by Chief Justice Roger B. Taney, declared that all blacks — slaves as well as free — were not and could never become citizens of the United States. The court also declared the 1820 Missouri Compromise unconstitutional, thus permiting slavery in all of the country’s territories. The case before the court was that of Dred Scott v. Sanford. Dred Scott, a slave who had lived in the free state of Illinois and the free territory of Wisconsin before moving back to the slave state of Missouri, had appealed to the Supreme Court in hopes of being granted his freedom. Taney — a staunch supporter of slavery and intent on protecting southerners from northern aggression — wrote in the Court’s majority opinion that, because Scott was black, he was not a citizen and therefore had no right to sue. The framers of the Constitution, he wrote, believed that blacks “had no rights which the white man was bound to respect; and that the negro might justly and lawfully be reduced to slavery for his benefit. He was bought and sold and treated as an ordinary article of merchandise and traffic, whenever profit could be made by it.”
Referring to the language in the Declaration of Independence that includes the phrase, “all men are created equal,” Taney reasoned that “it is too clear for dispute, that the enslaved African race were not intended to be included, and formed no part of the people who framed and adopted this declaration. . . .”
Abolitionists were incensed. Although disappointed, Frederick Douglass, found a bright side to the decision and announced, “my hopes were never brighter than now.” For Douglass, the decision would bring slavery to the attention of the nation and was a step toward slavery’s ultimate destruction.
By 1948, the United Nations’ new Human Rights Commission had captured the world’s attention. Under the dynamic chairmanship of Eleanor Roosevelt—President Franklin Roosevelt’s widow, a human rights champion in her own right and the United States delegate to the UN—the Commission set out to draft the document that became the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Roosevelt, credited with its inspiration, referred to the Declaration as the international Magna Carta for all mankind. It was adopted by the United Nations on December 10, 1948.
In its preamble and in Article 1, the Declaration unequivocally proclaims the inherent rights of all human beings: “Disregard and contempt for human rights have resulted in barbarous acts which have outraged the conscience of mankind, and the advent of a world in which human beings shall enjoy freedom of speech and belief and freedom from fear and want has been proclaimed as the highest aspiration of the common people…All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights.”
The Member States of the United Nations pledged to work together to promote the thirty Articles of human rights that, for the first time in history, had been assembled and codified into a single document. In consequence, many of these rights, in various forms, are today part of the constitutional laws of democratic nations.
Brilliant Michael! It’s almost impossible to have any reasonable discussion with homosexuals because their whole lifestyle is based on lies and deceit. They’ve wandered so far from the plumb line of God’s Word that their very words are corrupt. And the fellow using Spain as an example of how life goes on despite homosexual unions is utterly bizarre! The whole world has been watching the disaster playing out there and were it not for Euro $ propping them up, they’d be eating mice. Even during the Black Plague of 1348 life “went on” …life has a way of always carrying on but as Jesus told us, He came to give us life that brings joy and fulfillment…the abundant life. Thus lufe is only attainable by sacrifice and self-discipline. Living by one’s sexual needs is shallow, empty and will always lead to death …eternal death that apparently these pleasure seeking hedonists think is a figment of our imagination.
Is it going to be constitutional to allow someone to marry 3 or 4 persons at the same time so their civil rights will not be violated?
What about marrying their dog or cat or horse?
Only if Congress takes it up and It passes both houses, and the president signs it into law. It can still end up in the Supreme Court and to be declared unconstitutional. Bigomy is against the law. Ask Romney about that. His Grandfather had to move to Mexico to practice it.
So, Anonymous, Romney’s grandfather obeyed the law, right? Isn’t that what you just said?
There is no Federal law against bigamy. The U.S. Supreme Court ruled in 1878 that plurality of wives (polygamy), violated criminal law and was not defensible as an exercise of religious liberty. The decision was not based upon civil rights, and therefore can easily be overturned today.
Sodomy used to be against the law in the USA both Federally and by States laws.
One is just as bad as the other.
Btw -Obama, his Czars, and his appointees violate the Constitution all the time with his executive orders.
Oh, please, some states have laws against bestiality and some do not. If you do not think human beings can stoop so low, you had better think again. Some in the LGBT Community have alread seen to that. Except they face the ire of PETA in some cases. In thoses cases, I am on the side of PETA, although PETA does go overboard sometimes about meat eating.
This decision will not lead to anyone marrying their dog, cat, or horse.
Animals lack legal capacity to contract—thus, they can’t give valid consent to marry.
Now, unless we can somehow show animals to possess legally recognized sentience, you can’t even consider a human/animal marriage as remotely possible.
what a lie to think it won’t lead to other types of marriage…..there are a few wacho’s who did want to marry their pet(and as we have seen…people are loving their pets and actually calling them their baby sister or brother etc) I laughed when a woman introduced her two sons and then their dog as their sister….I think there was also one who left millions to their dog.
Well that is irrelevant perhaps….the truth is yes anything goes now that marriage is being redefined. What I found sick to my stomach was when I saw a reality show on polygamy….that one guy had several wife’s and lots of children. They called themselves sister wife’s…now that same sex marriage is already coming into play in some states, this stupid reality show also came on the spotlight. I was disgusted. Those women, I can’t believe how brainwashed they were to sharing one man…of course the pervert sure is enjoying it. Talk about kinky….truly disgusting.
The gay activists lie…they have said that it was just about their rights to marriage…..then it became in their own world “gay rights”…so with that came gay adoptions, teaching kids about homosexuality being normal in schools, only a few stories on them harassing even church’s for not accepting their rights, now they are even bullying people who offer reparative therapy….a person is not free if they are not able to form their own conscience or have a choice to make their own decisions…..I keep wondering why are they so threatened by a person seeking to find answers away from homosexual lifestyles or more….why to the extent that they are violent, threatening etc…..it is definitely a good indication of a spiritual battle there….one that is very demonic….we need our faith to not back down or else how are we going to stand up this evil Goliath….
even my brother in law, who is truly wrong, kept defending the homosexuals and their right to marry, back many years ago…just this year he started to say “I am getting tired of the gays, they actually want to force their lifestyles on us and our children”….wow and to think all these years he hated us for trying to tell him that….now he gets it (but still says its OK to redefine marriage just to make these activist happy) but it is too late….the gay movement has already gained more power. They want you to think, they are only a minority….but their movement doesn’t spell that……people’s complacency is now enslaving them to sinful ideals.
A “lie” Abeca?
Pretty casual about violating “Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor” aren’t we? I guess following little things like commandments are a pretty trivial matter so long as you are a “good” catholic that likes the TLM.
This is my legal opinion that marrying your dog, cat or horse is not at all implicated by U.S. v. Windsor. It’s based on the notion that “capacity” is a fundamental concept behind the theory of contract and Windsor does nothing to change that.
Are you saying that I am so besotted by evil that even an opinion must necessarily be a lie? Hey, gosh, you caught me, I was sent by space aliens to make you all marry your goats.
That way, the population of the earth will be much less when we come to take over.
My, you’re clever.
Aaron Ashcraft where did you go to school.
Of course the US Supreme Court members are appointed by the President and confirmed by Congress.
Please go back a reread the top post by MANY.
QUOTE – ” Elected persons appoint those of like mind.” – UNQUOTE.
Evil begets evil.
Catholic voting has caused many of the immoral problems at Federal, State and Local levels.
Catholic catechesis has been lousy over the last 40 years.
Instead of reading the Bible and the CCC, heads get filled with garbage and brainwashed from today’s entertainment and media.
“Charity, patience and tenderness are very beautiful gifts. If you have them, you want to share them with others,” Pope Francis wrote from his account on the microblogging website Twitter…an important message for angry CCD commentators.
Pope Francis also said, “Don’t dialog with the devil.”
Those who promote and advocate mortal sins are not to be treated with patience and tenderness.
Jesus Himself threw the money changers out of the Temple, and overturned tables and benches. He also said chastised evil-doers, and those who purposely lead others to sin.
When it came to promoting serious sin and scandal, St. Paul was no wimp either.
Please read your Bible in full.
If you cannot treat people who promote and advocate mortal sins with patience and tenderness, it is a deficiency in you. Imagine a doctor calling a patient a name for getting injured or ill. It is your job as a Christian to be patient, to be loving. Matthew 9:12-13
Anonymous when you and a few others try to confuse people and drive them from the Church -and into Hell, you deserve my disgust.
(The Bible quote you used had nothing to do with this. I checked it out.)
Read: 1 Cor 5:11-13. “……Drive out the wicked person from among you.”
Anonymous –
The tolerance of evil is evil.
OSCAR, I regret how I phrased my previous post. I did not mean it personally to you. Impatience is a result of being human. In an encounter with one who promotes and advocates mortal sins, we must pray to do as the Lord wills. He may, at that time, ask us to be very assertive; He may ask us to be gentle. It is important to realize that how one speaks may have an influence or not; that we leave to God. Harsh words are always remembered, but may not get the results we want. If someone is car surfing we may tell how dangerous it is and give examples of how some have been killed doing it. If it is our child car surfing, we are probably going to have a reaction based on fear and we may say something inappropriate. The child may remember “Dad called me stupid” and it may inhibit his choices in life, work, marriage etc. So, too, the person we wish to admonish (which is to educate not to bully) may remember that a Christian called him an offensive name and never hear that there is a great Love that is available to them but is being held back by their behavior.
Thank you for your apology, but still everyone, please read: 1 Cor 11:13.
I do pray daily for the poor Souls in Purgatory. However, I’ve come to the conclusion that those who choose Hell due to their own actions must be excommunicated (if unrepentant) while still on earth so they don’t drag others to Hell with them.
Jesus told us in more than one passage that everyone will NOT be saved, even though He told us to love others. Mt 7:13-14; Mt 7:21-23.
We are at war with the Devil, his followers, and sin.
There are a couple of people who post on this site who are not our brothers, and hate Christ’s Church. You can not educate evil, they already know the truth but choose the devil instead.
OSCAR did you mean 1 Cor 5:11-13? But, of course, to follow this would be good. It says not to associate with someone who claims to be a brother or sister and is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or slanderer, a drunkard or swindler. (It does not deal with excommunication. It says that when Paul comes the one guilty of incest will be handed over to Satan for the destruction of his flesh; thereby saving his soul. The whole of chapter 5 is instructional.) His advise to not even eat with them is interesting too. He does make the distinction that this is about those of the brethren, not those outside the Church. I think we should take it very seriously. I see where you are coming from now. Your first post did not indicate that you meant those in the Church and I still think we should pray about what to do. Some in the church are very much needing instruction and may accept it. I think if they continue after admonishment, then you need to refer them to the church (to a priest) and then if they do not repent, avoid them. Since those who slander are on the list, too, we better be careful about what we say. (Some translations say revilers which is using abusive language so we should be careful of that, too.) I think you have made an excellent point and we each need to do as St. Paul says. We should remember the entire list and make sure we are not on it. Thank you for the instruction.
OSCAR BRAVO!!!! I completely agree with you and yes you are right on!
If you’re not angry about this latest court ruling then perhaps you should spend some time in prayer and reflection! Our Heavenly Father got very angry throughout the Old Testament and Jesus got angry at the money changers and the Pharisees. The problem with those who see anger as a bad thing is they lack a sense of holiness… The more you care about something precious the angrier you become when it is violated. We are called to not sin in our anger, and I don’t see anyone here doing that. The true scandal is that too many Catholics are not getting angry at the depredations against our beloved Church by heathens, liars and reprobates.
AMEN DANA! yes I am angry and the powerful weapon the Lord gave me is prayer. of course action too by voting or doing what I can to help protect what we hold sacred.
Well no matter what these bastards impose on the people of faith, we have a moral duty not to follow because that is the only time we can break the law, no law can tell us to sin or help others into sinning…..directly of course, some things we can’t help especially on how they spend out hard earned taxes. God have mercy!
Prayer is a terrific way to vent anger, Abeca. lol You go girl! A few years ago I dealt with some real frustration by picturing the Lord as a rock and I would drop my various anger and grievances on to the rock and they would shatter in a million pieces and disappear and it was really pretty satisfying…so much so, that they would not come back. What a relief! What a joy and a comfort that our Lord is bigger than the biggest problem we could possibly face and He never seems to mind when we give them over to Him. Hmmm. I wonder what would happen if I pictured a certain politician?? haha Nope, still there!
Dana my anger is not coming from a worldly way..or definition or from internal but I hope it to be the righteous anger from our Lord, that leads to true action not enslavement or complacency, or bitterness.
When our Lord was angry at the money changers and other instances in the bible…it was a great example of what true righteous anger is….not the one that one may think it to be but one that comes from those who fear the Lord. Not easy to describe….but this anger also leads to meekness and humility in our convictions in Christ…it does not stem from worldly pride but pride in what we hold sacred.
You must be careful on how you use your terms. What does immoral mean? In the Catholic tradition it means “that which does not give life, does not promotes living the in the image of God, and/or does not promote a relationship with God.” Secondly, what is this Catholic “conscience”? We as Catholic are not to be of one mind, following numbly or blindly the rules that are set forth in the Catechism of the Catholic Church. We are to understand them, learn them, see how they apply in our lives and how they work to live out what image of God means to the world. As in the documents from Vatican II state, “we are to follow our well informed conscience and act on it, even if it goes against what is stated in the Catechism.” I believe that Jesus would be pleased with the decision handed down. Jesus would never have wanted discrimination to occur – we as Catholic sometimes follow the rules way too much forgetting what our true call is “be image of God to one another and love one another as Jesus did.”
Julie,
In the end, God will practice the ultimate discrimination for those who die in Mortal Sin, when he says “Depart from Me ye accursed……….”. You forget the times Jesus acted very violently against evil such as in the Temple!
Kenneth M. Fisher
How about in the old testament…..
Modernists think that the Old Testament isn’t relevant anymore, Abecca.
Or they think most of it is composed of symbolic myths and stories to teach the Jewish tribes as most of them couldn’t read or write. One of the most fantastic ‘stories’, Jonah and the Whale and saving the people of Ninevah were referred by our Lord as actual occurences. How do they explain that? Dr. Scott Hahn and many other very learned and brilliant scholars certainly believe that the Old Testament is based on true events, especially Adam & Eve. Faith is a gift. I’m so grateful, aren’t you Abeca? It takes imagination of a rare kind to believe in evolution and that things ‘just happened’ by ‘chance. Now that really takes some doing! I look at my fingers typing on the keyboard…all the result of planning on every level. oops. Now I’m shrinking into nothingness, small enough to jump from key to key…I must be reverting back to being a subparticle. Byeeeeee.
Dana huh….I didn’t know that about the Modernist. good to know. looking back in my early pre-teen/ teen age years…I read the whole bible, the old testament taught me of how powerful God was….made me fall more in Lord with God and to fear him better…then wow…..it prepared me for the coming of Jesus…..then the New Testament gave me hope and more love.
Julie, you are dead wrong. The “Catechism of the Catholic Church, Second Edition” includes all the Doctrine of the Catholic Faith including from Vatican II.
If you violate the CCC you have formed a WRONG conscience and also are misinterpreting Vatican II docs.
On the net please go to: – ” What Catholics REALLY Believe SOURCE ”
for more info. Has more quotes from our latest 3 Popes about the CCC. Links to the Vatican web site etc.
“ The Catechism of the Catholic Church, which I approved … and the publication of which I today order by virtue of my Apostolic Authority, is a statement of the Church’s faith and of catholic doctrine, attested to or illumined by Sacred Scripture, the Apostolic Tradition and the Church’s Magisterium.
I declare it to be a sure norm for teaching the faith and thus a valid and legitimate instrument for ecclesial communion. “ – Pope John Paul II. (CCC pg 5)
” “Through the harmonious and complementary efforts of all the ranks of the People of God, may this Catechism be known and shared by everyone, so that the unity in faith whose supreme model and origin is found in the Unity of the Trinity may be strengthened and extended to the ends of the earth.” – Pope John Paul II (CCC pg xv)
” “In this Year of Faith let us ask ourselves if we have actually taken a few steps to get to know Christ and the truths of faith more, by reading and meditating on the Scriptures, studying the Catechism, steadily approaching the Sacraments.” – Pope Francis, May 15, 2013.
Good job MIKE
Julie, please tell me where you got that definition of immoral. Also, I can find nowhere in the Vatican II documents where it says to obey your conscience even if it is against the Catechism. Jesus is never pleased when man abandons His law to make one of his own. It is not discrimination to have marriage between a man and a woman. That is what marriage is.
Thanks for the laugh, Julie! You just told us what Jesus would think! Actually, that is never difficult to do if and when you cease to do so yourself.
The reason that so many bloggers continue to harp on reading the CCC is that it is failing to make the grade. It’ll be collecting dust in a decade, and the Bible and the writings of the Saints will continue as they always have. The irony in it is that highly educated and intelligent people see it for what it is, a bureaucratic concoction and they have better things to do; whereas, the not so well educated and not so bright minds see it as some sort of miracle cure. The lesson is really made clear in Samuel Clemens “Tom Sawyer and Huckleberry Finn” (not written by panels and committees of bureaucrats).
Skai I don’t know about that one….but for now…it is a tool…not many people know their faith today……
Skai, that was really an off-the-wall allusion. Though I loved Huckleberry Finn and its marvellous satirical prose, I always read it with an understanding that Twain was a very bitter atheist (and that’s when I was a liberal, back in the day) , I know many very intellectually keen people who not only read the CCC but enjoy it for it’s brilliant insights and faithfulness to the Bible, another book Twain loved to ridicule. I don’t quite understand your aversion to it as it doesn’t detract from the teachings of Christ or keep us from a relationship with Him, unlike so many worldly things we take part in.
I suppose you”re more enamored with our new pope’s rather rough and ready style which you should probably welcome as you won’t be hearing anymore about using the Catechism from that source, nor the year of Faith, nor the monthly intentions, nor sacred music, nor_______fill in the blank. Yee haw, cowboy! ;o) (and since when has being educated made anyone smarter? Good grief, if anything our current educational system creates people unable to think or reason for themselves, and they find logic an enigma inside a puzzle wrapped up in abstruse and inexplicable boxes. Just some minor exaggeration. ha) I majored in generalizing and minored in exaggerated prose.
Can any Catholic who voted for Obama really claim they didn’t realize this would be the result of his appointments to the Supreme Court? Can they really be surprised when Holder wouldn’t even send anyone from the DOJ to defend marriage? You get what you vote for. You will be held accountable for what you vote for as well….the day will come for each of us.
Our priests and Bishops will be persecuted and made to look like bigots when they refuse to marry homosexuals or hire them to teach or children.
The gay lobby is celebrating today, saying this is all “for the children.” What children you say? the ones born by artificial mean, or adopted from Catholic agencies who are forced to place innocent children in the home of homosexuals.
Heaven help us.
Justice Roberts is a Knight of Columbus, I hear
So was John Fitzgerald Kennedy. So are many other liberal Catholics. Joining the K of C requires only that one be a “Catholic in good standing”. The latter remains undefined.
Liberal Catholics? Do you mean Catholic heretics and schismatics?
The latter is not “undefined” – see Canon 915 and 1399 – Code of Canon Law on the Vatican web site.
The Bishops need to do their job.
Chris,
To liberals, nothing is definitive accept their liberal ways!
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fishe
Chris: Thank you for enlightening me on this point. Unfortunately, applicants for membership in the Knight of Columbus are average men, not versed in Canon Law. To the question: “Are you a Catholic in good standing?” they give a common sense answer “Yes”. The question fails to refer the applicant to the Canons you quoted.
Justice Roberts, Scalia, Thomas and Alito voted in favor of maintaining DOMA; voted against the lawsuit to repeal.
Anna: Anthony Kennedy is also a Catholic. He failed us miserably!
Bwangi Kilonzo,
If you have evidence of Roberts being a Knight, please give us that information.
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fishe
I like their hats.
Alice, many so-called “catholics” were perfectly aware of what they were voting for.
What you see is the end product of a half century of Vatican II programming.
Fortunately you did not indulge in the Kool-Aid.
I agree that Catholics know EXACTLY what they are voting for.
I also agree that most US Bishops and Priests do not catechize accurately according to the CCC.
Therefore Catholics do NOT vote with a good and Catholic conscience.
Real Catholic Agencies WILL NOT BE FORCED TO PLACE CHILDREN FOR ADOPTION IN SODOMITE HOUSES BECAUSE THEY WILL REFUSE!
The Ghost from Hell of Presidente Calles is alive in Obama!
Viva Cristo Rey.
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
thank you dear lord, you have allowed me to live 75 years on earth and to see this day, you created me gay for a purpose being gay for all these years and having endured being bullied and other things i always knew in my heart you are on my side because i strive to be a good person god bless the united states of america BORN FREE thomas nawn
No one in the Catholic Church advocates “bullying” of SSA individuals. What we do defend is the truth of marriage between one man and one woman. If one is a Catholic and SSA, you are called to live a celibate life, just as my heterosexual adult daughter who is unmarried is called to do. This has been a very difficult burden for her as she wanted a marriage and children, but it just never happened for her. However, recognizing the difficulty with living a celibate life, cannot be confused with condoning those who choose to act on their SSA (or single heterosexuals who choose to act on their attractions). There is nothing in the SCOTUS decision today that is an indication of the will of God. It is true that God loves each and everyone of us. That does not mean that we are free of sins against Him or that SCOTUS has any clue about what constitutes sin. Abortion is legal in this country, but it is an abomination! The women who abort their babies can be forgiven and we cannot judge or condemn them, but we do not support the sin of abortion. Same sex marriage may be legal in some states, but it too is an abomination. The people who live that life-style can be forgiven and we cannot judge or condemn them, but we do not support the sin of same sex marriages.
I think Cansius would advocate bullying. He says that we “have it coming to us”. He said this in the context of violence against us.
Jesus “bullied” the money changers. Bullying is often used for good and holy effect.
Skai,
To them, bullying and admonishing are the same things!
We will see what these so called Catholic sodomites will do when their friends in government start arresting and persecuting true Catholics including priest and religious because they refuse to surrender to Satan’s lies.
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
Yes, Skai, Jesus drove the money changers from the temple using a whip (your favorite biblical passage, along with the destruction of Sodom and G0morrah. I’m sure you are probably very fond of God slaying the all the first born of Egypt as well).
We can learn as much from what Christ DID NOT do in that circumstance as from what He did.
The money changers were presumably exploiting the trust of people coming to the temple to pray in common worship before God. Thus, Christ expelled them from the Temple—by force.
Christ did not preach that all money changers were evil. He did not ban the profession of money lending. Nor did he use his divine power to end their lives on the spot.
Nor did our omniscient and omnipotent Son of God strike every money lender in the world dead at that moment. Nor did Christ create a “standing miracle” that would cause any userous money changer from expiring on the spot when he offered an ilicit bargain.
Christ used a quantum of force available to mortal men, I believe, to provide an example of how we must punish. In this case, Christ caught them in the act of exploiting others and stopped the immediate harm. He also expelled them from the Temple in order to prevent them from exploiting others.
However, the text does not say that Christ banned them from the Temple for life. He did not move against them other than to stop the immediate harm they were inflicting upon others.
That is an example of how we must use force when it comes to earthly rule—the least amount needed to protect against the wrong.
Notice that the omnipotent Jesus, who knows more about the harm these men would do in their future than anyone alive today, respected the money changers’ free will to possibly choose a Godly path and thus did not inflict more permanent punishments.
Oh, but Jon J. read in the book of Acts, chapter 5, in the New Testament where Ananias and Saphira, his wife, were struck down dead when they lied to St. Peter the first pope. St. Peter told them they had not lied to men but to God, and they fell down dead. Also, the same St. Paul who wrote the book of Acts said that men who practiced sodomy would be delivered over for the destruction of the flesh. Evidently, AIDS, anal cancer and so forth was common among homosexuals and some heterosexuals back then too.
Anne, I am unfamiliar with that passage of Acts.
Off the cuff, I wonder if that passage is allegorical. I am also aware it’s all too easy to dismiss inconvenient passages as “symbolic”. Since I have my own biases that limit me, let’s presume for a moment that this passage is literal.
Even then, I would not take this as an example for mankind to follow. In that, I do not possess divine power or omniscience. Trying to “strike” someone dead because I think they have lied to God or gainsaid his will is way beyond me.
The bottom line is, that kind of act should be left to God.
Human government’s should not attempt such thing, because it is arrogance to think we can reliably identify such a lie to the accuracy that would make us comfortable striking someone dead). Any such attempt would be a mockery based on hubris.
The idea that an omniscient and omnipotent God would need a limited human to defend Him, seems faintly ridiculous.
I also admit that I didn’t much like St. Paul when I was young. He seemed a bit wacky with respect to his ideas about celibacy and that marriage is only tolerable to prevent people from burning up with animal lusts.
This struck me as kind of a drama queen type of faith. You know, the type of individual who is an extreme hedonist who suddenly flips a switch to become an over the top Christian. While overtly contradictory, these two positions inject a lot of melodrama into one’s life—which is what I think the drama queen type of faith is based upon rather than true devotion.
However, I expressed this suspicion with an acquaintance who reminded me that Paul lived in a time when Christians were an actively persecuted minority.
In such a circumstance, an evangelizing christian would be putting his wife and children in the position of getting tortured by authorities as leverage against him. Since Paul’s rational mind likely considered that unacceptable, if he got married it would indeed be about him succumbing to his animal lusts.
I’d like to re-read acts in that light.
Well, after being beaten as a child by a lesbian as he was, who are you to sit in judgment on him.
His past treatment does not permit him to act with violence against innocent people. It is both illegal and immoral.
You are not so innocent, Mark PA and YFC as you two both have advocated children being adopted by practicing homosexuals and lesbians. If I had been in Canisius’s position as a child what you two encourage would make me very angry too, especially since Mark PA throws in Canisius’s face what a wonderful mom and dad he himself had. Nevertheless, Mark PA would deliberately rob other children of the same. Canisius has not advocated the killing of anyone from what I am read of his posts on here.
Anne T, and I was ridiculed and humiliated by my catholic classmates at my catholic school.
Does that mean you won’t sit in judgment of me either?
Jon J., and Mark PA. I am going to be very honest with the two of you. I have never admired weak men. Why? One woman psychologist wrote a book called “Strong Fathers, Strong Daughters”. Although my mother and father were divorced when I was a child, I had a strong grandfather, and so were most of my ancestral fathers. My grandfather was a soldier, a small town sheriff, a lumberjack, a locomotive engineer and a beater room worker. The heat in the beater room was so strong that the men could only work down there 15 minutes at a time before they would pass out. He was an old man by then. Being a lumberjack now days is very dangerous, even with the power saws they now use. It is easy to loose a limb or even ones life. Back in my grandfather’s day it was worse. He was only about 5′ 4″ tall, but he and another man cut trees down with just a two man saw. My grandparents had a picture of him riding the logs down the river. Riding logs involved standing on one with a long pole guiding the logs down a moving river. If one fell off, one could be easily crushed to death. Many men lost some of their limbs if not their life. My ancestral fathers were farmers, blacksmiths, etc., and they brought me up to be strong. I guess you would say it is in my genes. Even though I am only about 5′ 3′ myself now that I have shrunk with age, I was in such good condition physically that I almost had my children before the doctor got there. Giving birth with only a little gas but mostly without any type of pain killer was a piece of cake for me. I once worked in a binder jogging down paper 14 hours straight on the weekends with just a fifteen minute break about four times during all those hours. Now, YFC, and Mark PA, do you see why I have a lot of trouble listening to you whine about being victims. I am a strong daughter from a strong grandfather. I have taken a beating in life and still survived it, so can you.
YFC you presume gays are innocent, I know you are not, call me immoral, ha… coming from man with a “partner” tell me YFC are you celibate, if not keep your trap SHUT
Well, Anne, I guess you must not like Canisius much because he was weak enough to let a lesbian beat him up.
Guess he can get over it, too. Right? He shouldn’t be letting himself advocate unbalanced violence and hateful acts due to the past. Again, the fact that no one here called him out on outrageous statements like saying gays were like cannibals shows how little you adhere to the faith you profess to believe when confronted with those you do not like.
Back when I started cutting and pasting things said about gays into a thread about gluttony, everyone jumped on me about my cruelty. Yet, everyone suddenly disavowed your own judgments when I revealed what I had done.
Really, how much clearer could it be that much of your “faith” is about your side “winning” and holding onto status than following moral precepts? Again, we have another example that your supposed disgust about “weakness” was simply a way to rationalize contempt for those you don’t like.
It’s very telling that no one here learned anything from that clear moral lesson.
YFC, even the Lord of Hosts says that sin has its consequences, or in the words you’re trying to place in the mouth of Canisius, “you sodomites have it coming”; it’s called Hell. The late Johnny Cash called it “hear the whistle blowin’ “. Ernest Hemingway phrased it in the title of his book, “For Whom the Bells Toll”. Your number will soon come up, YFC; you’re in the batter’s box now. If you’re not concerned with death, then you haven’t seen much of it … respect it now or later, your choice … practice your line for when you stand at St Peter’s Gate … no, forget that, they won’t be interested in perverse fantasies there.
Skai, and St. Peter won’t be impressed by ad hominems, either.
You won’t insult your way into heaven. Your vicarious need to compel others to act according to your will means you have the heart of a totalitarian dictator without the capability to match.
Lack of ability won’t excuse you when it comes to final judgment. Your will is what will determine your moral standing.
Also, about two years ago I went through twelve hours of surgery for cancer reconstruction with two teams of doctors. Part of the reconstruction was the repair of four hernias that I had from a life time of hard work. By the way, my wrist size is only six inches, extremely small.
I think its really time for some folks here to examine what it is they write. Unsubstuanted criticism of whole swaths of society (saying things like gay peoples whole lives are filled with deceit) is bearing false witness. We constantly here others drone on about the eternal damnation of gays, yet when your own sins are pointed out you justify each other instead of admonishing each other. Really take a look at what you post. Let it sit for an hour, pray about it, before you hit send.
Now there you’ve scored a hit, YFC! You’re so right and when those hot button topics are featured, those of us who are stabbed with recognition and self-recrimination will find another topic to discuss! See, that’s where you make your mistake, YFC. You should be addressing a host of other issues, then we wouldn’t upset you and you could avoid having to confront unpleasant truths…and as I said before, you sound a very nice and loving person. Can you not take it all so personally? And if I were in a room and someone gave you the cut direct because you were gay, I would certainly defend you without blinking an eye. Can you not see the issue on a different level? Can you separate what is being said here as a condemnation of you personally? If all these radical political changes weren’t taking place, I would never address this issue as I feel it’s none of my business! But because these rainbow fanatics are out for revenge, changing the entire moral and legal system to the detriment of our children’s future, and the future of our Church, then yes, I’m going to speak out and am not going to mince words, just as you don’t. But I’m sorry if I said anything to hurt your dignity or feelings. I will really try to be more circumspect. Please forgive me if I’ve been unfair. I can’t speak for anyone else, but I truly do not want to hurt anyone personally.
YFC no not at all….
YFC you advocate bullying on Caniusas…..bullying anyone with strong convictions in the Lord. If you want to make it fair….
The gay activists have to ask themselves at what point does it seem that they have exhausted the excuse that those of faith on a Catholic website are bullying them. It is an abuse to say such things while they are taking away the real bullying happening to real victims. It’s not different when someone plays the race card unjustly. On this website Canisius is only practicing his freedom of speech.
You do have it coming YFC, you want acceptance of your perversions and you will eventually use the State to get what you want….
Just to let people know, living a celibate life as I have done for several years, is not so terrible as people think. It does come with its rewards as I have found out. I can’t explain it very well in words, but there is a sense of purity and dare I say pride from living a chaste life. It is a part of myself that I have given to God, and brought me closer to Him.
Candace that is the case with many people, especially as they get older and have more medical problems, even married couples.
Anne T, it’s okay you don’t like weak men. I must confess, I bear no affection for stupid, ugly, and hypocritical women.
BTW, Anne, funny how you see Canisius as a “victim” and offer sympathy for being beaten by lesbians. But, because I was ridiculed and humiliated by Catholics means that I deserved it because I was weak. Why don’t you talk to HIM about how you don’t like weak men?
The answer is very obvious. You agree with his opinions—therefore Canisius was a poor victim. You don’t like what I have to say, consequently I deserved to be bullied because I was weak.
BTW, I’m not exactly a weak man. In grade school, I took martial arts. I eventually fought in 6 national level judo tournaments—despite substantial athletic shortcomings in coordination and endurance.
The biggest reason I was picked upon was that 1) I was half-asian in an all white school, and 2) I was almost a walking parody of the “Jap” stereotype from WW2 cartoons.
I had big buck teeth, and wore thick glasses due to a degenerative eye condition. And, I had a high, piercing voice that was admittedly so shrill it made you want to smack the speaker just hearing it. Oh. and I had a tested IQ of 155, with dyslexia. So, despite scoring high on standardized academic tests, I was consistently put in the “dumb” group in grade school.
This combination a traits will not make you well liked no matter what you do. People acted like they had the god-given right to humiliate me. When I verbally ridiculed them in return, inevitably I’d get physically confronted as if being bigger and having friends gave them the right to throw me into the school garbage bin.
Are you trying to tell me that I suddenly became more morally worthy when I learned martial arts and put a stop to it?
I very quickly learned that all those blatherings about how people of faith only care about what kind of person you are was a blatant and ridiculous lie. The blunt reality is that people don’t want to associate with those who make them look bad—they care more about their perceived status than all of that stuff they pretend to believe when in Church.
Didn’t matter how many fights I won. Losing to the geekiest, weakest looking kid in school was socially embarrassing. Guys who lost fights to me would get so much crap, they’d inevitably come after me again—partially because I used judo techniques and so losing a fight to me ended up in a pin that didn’t inflict much damage.
When we hit puberty, girls used to sit around making jokes about who could come up with the most ridiculous circumstances in which they might consider dating me—right in front of my face.
By the time I was in 9th grade, everything changed. By that time I had gotten rid of the glasses and buck teeth (braces), and started playing football. Because I was a hyper-aggressive corner that regularly blew up running plays in opposing backfields, I suddenly became popular. Funny how my classmates liked the vicarious association with a little kid who plowed into blocking wedges and running backs.
So, Anne, you’re very common. And a hypocrite. Whatever happened to “blessed be the weak”?
What is even more pathetic is how you enjoyed the opportunity to label me as “weak”. Amazing how so called “mature adults” start acting like children when someone tells them they can’t kick gays anymore. But, faith and religion tell you that the weak and scorned should not be abused—even if they commit sin.
This just shows how your “faith” is simply about belonging to the social group rather than actually living what was taught. I have no problem with you believing homosexuality is immoral and teaching others this is true—as long as you treat the “scorned” in a proper manner.
However, I have big problems with you labeling those you don’t like as weak at the first opportunity to do so, then running off to snicker with your girlfriends about what losers “those people” are.
All of this doesn’t mean that I don’t recognize that social backlash can now work the other way. Gays (and their supporters) can be as abusive as everyone else once they grasp social power.
I am against such behavior. You, apparently, still think the weak deserve to be abused because they haven’t fixed their weakness—unless that weak person validates your beliefs. Then they are a victim.
Jon J, I am sad for all you suffered. People can be mean. Some people never grow out of it, but learn more socially acceptable ways to dish it out. Or at least ways that allow them to feel OK about themselves. They label people sinful or even the devil so they feel justified in their abuse and even believe that God supports them or that they are doing a good deed. It is sad. And evil.
Excellent! God bless you Candace!
Sodom and Gomorrah won the majority vote too but remember the outcome.
The Gospel of Luke Chapter 18: And the Lord said: Hear what the unjust judge saith. [7] And will not God revenge his elect who cry to him day and night: and will he have patience in their regard? [8] I say to you, that he will quickly revenge them. But yet the Son of man, when he cometh, shall he find, think you, faith on earth?
your god is not the true God…so you must be praying to an idol…be careful…your soul is at stake here…I find it insulting to our our Lord on what you just posted….Sodom and Gomorrah also embraced homosexuality and our Lord was not pleased. You need to seek out the one True God in the Holy Trinity…not your man make god that accepts homosexuality. Idolatry is an immoral sin!
yeah right…sodomy is now a virtue…NOT!
You must thank the Devil if you want sodomite marriage.
Sodomites (who do not repent) go to HELL.
All sodomites are condemned; if a sodomite repents, then they are no longer a sodomite.
God NEVER created anyone homosexual (gay).
God allows all kinds of various temptations due to original sin (read your Bible).
Some people do have the temptation of Same-Sex-Attraction, while others have different temptations.
Temptations do not send anyone to HELL.
Only your bad (and unrepentant) ACTS will send you to HELL.
Do not blame God for your own BAD ACTS.
amen thomas, amen
Folks here you have it….this man that calls him self YFC…..he is no fellow Catholic not at all. Be careful who you choose as your friends….people like this are truly your enemies and the enemy of all that is good! Don’t be fooled by them…they are no friend of our Lord’s that is for sure!
Abeca, there are at least two or three posters who are NOT Catholic, hate the Catholic Faith, and are trying to deceive people.
They should start their own web site and leave Catholics alone.
“Amen” should be for Jesus, not for sodomites, YFC. Jesus is the Alpha and the Omega, the Amen. To “amen” a sodomite is to torture Jesus.
Missed you, Skai.
More importantly, Anonymous, is that you missed Jesus. YFC “amened” a blasphemous statement. “Amen” is an ascent to the Lord; making that blasphemous comparison is an act of idolatry. Not surprising, though, since idolatry is one of the steps to sodomy.
yes Skai…it’s worth repeating to what you posted…..”YFC “amened” a blasphemous statement. “Amen” is an ascent to the Lord; making that blasphemous comparison is an act of idolatry. Not surprising, though, since idolatry is one of the steps to sodomy.”
Well, OK, now I’m rethinking the missing you thing.
Anony it’s because you never meant it…..it’s conditional….
is that k? Just wondering…..
Canisius only shares how he feels and has never done any violence. What you hate Your Fellow non-Catholic is that he opposes what you feel. You want censorship and hope to silence those who oppose homosexuality and Biblical teachings. The irony, which you’re incapable of seeing because you’re completely caught up in your lifestyle and high-opinion of your own views, is that you’ve become what you hate, a bully and a tyrant.
Dana you cannot deny that he uses incendiary language. He literally says, over and over again things like “Burn the rainbow flag”, and in the context of physical violence agains gays, “they’ve got it coming to them”. Why do you defend such incendiary language, clearly designed to incite violence.
Well, think about this YFC, you say you are chaste yet you say you have a partner. Chaste people do not have “partners” — friends maybe, roommates maybe, healthcare power of attorneys maybe, but not partners. Also many of us have admonished each other on here and other heterosexuals for their comments or misbehavior, including some decadent Madre Gras festivals, but have you or Mark ever said anything — anything — about some of the decadence going on in homosexual and lesbian parades? Mark PA might be more naive since he lives in a more conservative state, but if you live in California, you have got to know what is going on in some of those parades. Also, I have admonished Canisius at times for going overboard, but have you ever admonished any pro homosexual or lesbian person who has come on here, except perhaps in the case of child molestation? If so please let me know.
People throw away or burn flags, throw away Bibles, Korans, Bagava Gitas and all kinds of literature, religious and non religions, in this country ever day and every hour, and it is their right to do so, but most of us are smart enough not to do it in front of the people it would offend. Nevertheless, the Rainbow Flag has no place in a church, any more than a flag for adulterers or adulteresses or thieves would have, since the Rainbow Flag has been so misused. Keep them out of the churches, and you should have no problem. Putting a rainbow flag up in a church is as incendiary at this time as putting up a KKK banner in a Jewish neigborhood or a Communist flag over the United States flag, unless the rainbow is just used to symbolize God’s promise to Noah, it should not be used in churches, and a Noah rainbow would not be on a flag. The symbol of papal approved organizations such as Courage should be all right to use, though.
Anne – If you notice, I don’t go around writing here about other people’s sin unless I am personally attacked, either directly or via the classes of people I belong to.
I’m not sure any pro-homosexual person who writes here (with one rare poster) attacks others here personally, or engages in the behavior you call outrageous.
We just had Pride weekend here in SF. Yes, I marched, to honor a friend who was named a grand marshall. I saw lots of waving, lots of smiling, lots and lots of hugs, and a few kisses. But by far the most offensive things I saw came from the mostly straight kids who come in from out of town because it’s a big party, get completely smashed, and get into fights. There was at least one gunshot wound taken to the hospital. Yes, this I condemn and admonish. If any CCD reader participated in such outrageous behavior, I admonish you!
Dana, Canisius brags about beating up his lesbian mother’s partner and putting her in the hospital. He says it was one of the most satisfying moments of his life. He had suffered violence from her-including being stabbed in the stomach-when he was a young teen. Canisius often says how he longs for the civil war to begin when the good will defeat the liberals. Canisius has led a life filled with violence. He has not rejected that violence, along with the hatred and anger that breeds it, because it makes him feel strong.
Anne T, you have a right to be offended by some of the things that go on at parades. A small number of people at these events can give all the people a bad name. I am not going to support people doing obscene things in public in front of children. People need to be respectful when children are present and act appropriately. However, please don’t blame an entire group for what a small number in the group are doing. People need to be responsible for their behavior.
Anne T, that comment about the parades was from me. Don’t know why it came up Anonymous. I think people need to behave responsibly at those parades. Mark
Thank you, Mark PA, for your comment.
Anonymous, when one is violently treated, it takes a long time to heal. One young man who was molested by a priest when under aged in California set fire to a church altar he was so spiritually devastated and enraged by it all. Although, I would not approve such a thing, I certainly can understand why he did it if he was telling the truth, and I would certainly take that into consideration when passing judgment on his actions.
I stand guilty as charged Anon, I am not afraid to admit everything you said is true……
Anon one other thing that hate and violence you quote, kept me alive, God abandoned me in those years, those two dark emotions kept me alive….
Canisius, God never leaves you. He does not abandon you. He is not to blame for the sins of others. Your mother put herself ahead of you. God rest your father but he should not have done what he did. At the end of our lives we will understand how the sufferings we have had, brought us closer to God. My head reels when I read of all the things people suffer at the hands of other people. And it makes you wonder why. The Book of Job shows that God allows us to be tested, however, sin is never attributable to God. It is no part of your heavenly Fathers plan that any of these little one’s should come to grief. There is no sword of sorrow that comes to us that does not first pierce the Immaculate Heart of Mary. Jesus suffered with you. Greatly.
Thomas Nawn, are you related to other other pro-sodomites who frequent this site to spread evil venom and lies? You have blasphemed in thanking God for your perversion. At age 75, how many years do you have before your eternal judgment? What priests and bishops have encouraged you in your sin, or failed to correct you? They also will face judgment for having failed you.
God Bless you Laurette Elsberry for speaking out. The time has come for more of God’s faithful to stand up to the Church’s enemies. This is no time for weakness as the Devil’s disciples are growing bolder and now are in a persecutory mode because the corrupt politicians and news media are providing solid backup. Already you are witnessing more interference by them in this commentary thread as you can see above.
I’m sorry you were born gay. If that is true, it is an affliction, a result of original sin – just like every other birth defect. It is a particularly difficult cross to bear as being gay is an inner turmoil that places the person at odds with natural and divine law. No earthly distortion of law can heal you. As long as you embrace this psychological disorder and allow it to define you, you will suffer. Only Christ can set you free. Free from sin, evil, homosexuality and death. You must resist temptation as we expect all to resist fornication outside the intent to procreate children within a sacramental marriage. Or your death will be permanent.
No one is born “gay”.
People are all born the same.
Due to original sin, we all have different temptations that we have to overcome to get to heaven.
Same-sex attraction is merely one type of temptation.
All persons must be celibate if they are not married (one man and one woman as stated in the CCC).
This does not pick on “gays”. It includes Priests, Nuns, ALL Singles, Widows/widowers.
Anony how sick to assume that they were born that way…where you there? Did you ask them when they were little if they liked same sex partners? Anony same old song you sink…false compassion….
The only thing that is a fact is that we are all born with original sin! That is a fact and that is why we need holy Baptism…..
Jesus brought dead people to life. Jesus can change a homosexual to a sinless condition. The idea of homosexuality has been made into an idol, and those fixated on that idol make themselves homosexual. They destroy themselves, and seek to persuade others to destroy themselves also, as exemplified by the blogs of Anonymous.
I agree Skai
I agree with Skai, it’s something they may have to struggle but it’s worth it…they should never give up…especially if they seek eternal salvation plus we suffer here on earth but in Jesus we gain our greatest reward.
Jesus love is so much better that it gives us strength, courage and what more we need to help us deal with our flaws and struggles here on earth. If only they would just persevere with fortitude…
Thomas Nawn: Refusing to accept your redefinition of the word “marriage” does not constitute bullying. No-one and no group of individuals has the right to change the meaning of a word that has been in use for thousands of years. At no point in history has a sexual union between individuals of the same gender been called a “marriage”. Such unions have always been regarded as intrinsically disordered. You have no right to reinvent our language.
God bless, Justice Antonin Scalia and all those who defended marriage. As I said before, “The Lord is sifting out the hearts of men before His judgment seat”, sifting the wheat from the chaff. He is doing it here, he is doing it in England, he is doing it in France — all over the world, but the wealthier nations bare the most responsibility. God help the Faithful to persevere to the end.
Anne T: Scalia voted with the majority that is allowing marriages to return, fyi.
Justice Scalia voted for marriage period. There is only one kind of marriage as far as I and the Lord Jesus are concerned, and that is marriage between a man and woman. Justice Scalia upheld it.
Anne T.
I’m sorry to break it to you. California will begin marrying same sex couples again in about a month, based upon a 5-4 decision of the Supreme Court. The Five justices voting to begin marriage for SS couples are: Chief Justice Roberts (catholic), Antonin Scalia (catholic), Ruth Bader Ginsberg (Jewish), Stephen Breyer (Jewish), Elena Kagan (Jewisth).
Gays will reap the whirlwind of their deeds; they will go down to Hell in happy handbaskets. The supreme court justices delude themselves and are drunk with power … refer to the Book of Revelation to see what God sees of them.
Who cares. Sane people will boycott such “marriage” and the people who back them.
and Ruth Bader Ginsberg, Stephen Breyer and Elena Kagan are going against their own Jewish law. Hypocrites all.
Anne T., it is possible you are right that sane people will boycott same sex marriages. But far more likely, there will be an even bigger rush to get married than we saw in 2008. Over the six months that summer, 18,000 same sex couples got married.
In my opinion – just an opinion – there will be an even bigger rush to get married in August and the months following, and hundreds of thousands of Californians, maybe even millions, will attend those weddings, and those friends and family members will themselves become personal witnesses to the power of a lifetime of love and commitment.
THIS, in my opinion, is why support for same sex marriage is snowballing, growing faster than just about any other social change issue in history. Personally observing and participating in people’s choice to love puts the opposition into stark contrast. When people witness love, arguments about whether they’ll be forced to marry horses get shown for the ridiculousness that they are.
Right now the gay activists are collecting signatures in front of many Target stores….we had the privilege to have a conversation with a few as they stopped us as we were walking out……there were a few who threw the “bully” accusation at us…what jerks, they were the ones harassing us as we walked out of Target. So because of that name calling from them to us…we purposely drove to 4 more Targets around San Diego county area to let them know our disapproval in a charitable way of course….what is due them. Oh well, I prefer now to avoid them all together, we prayed for them as well as we drove away too.
YFC, the whole spectre is exciting, like living within eyesight of the region of Sodom and Gomorrah. If only I could, I’d be glad to send you pics of the big event, although I don’t think email signals reach that deep into the Abyss.
Nobody believes your statistics. We know how the liberal media skews things. Although there were thousands of people protesting against abortion in Washinton D.C., during pro life Sunday, you barely here a peep out of the libeal media, and when you do they always show just a small group of pro lifers around a larger group of pro abortionists. We know all about your lies.
Yes, YFC. But, Scalia made his decision about prop 8 based on his view of “standing”—which is a technical concept of constitutional law that empowers judges to render decisions when parties bring a valid dispute to them for ajudication.
If the parties do not have the “standing” to bring the case, then the Supreme Court lacks the power to intervene—at least in Scalia’s view.
Catherine – Frankly, my sex life is not something I’ve ever talked about in public. Why do you feel it is your right to talk about my sex life in public? Furthermore, I have never, ever, said amen to abortion in general or to a specific abortion, I have no idea where you even get the hint that I have ever done so. You should be ashamed at putting words into my mouth, and by your silence, you approve of others misstating objectively proveable facts..
Someday, you ought to go back over the things you and others have said about me and gay people in the past. The pattern of lies, deceits, false accusations, speculations, ill-will all hint at an animus that the general public can readily see. Frankly, it is this blatant animus that is fueling courts and voters who see it for what it is, and realize we deserve growing civil equality.
YFC writes “Catherine – Frankly, my sex life is not something I’ve ever talked about in public. Why do you feel it is your right to talk about my sex life in public? ”
Why do you openly lie? Let me tell you why. It is the disordered mind of a homosexual that would enter into a faithful Catholic website and disgustingly brag about how he has been living with his boyfriend for over 22 years and then accuse others of wanting to bring up your sex life. There is nothing to respect about mortally sinful homosexual acts but I could at least have respect for your ability to be an honest person who was weak but did admit that you found it impossible to obey the teachings of the Catholic Church. Your’s is a much worse disorder. You not only flaunt sin you want to accuse others of flaunting your sin when YOU are the flaunter and this website is the protector and the defender of “all” Church teaching. Please stop your lowest slithering through the grass and rocks and rise up and cooperate with Christ’s teachings instead of cooperating with the greatest known slithering enemy of God. The choice is yours.
Disordered thinking surely has you hamstrung. YOU are the one introduced your sex life when you flaunted your living arrangements. You had the opportunity to clarify at that time. You didn’t because you are a homosexual lobbyist who lies to himself and fools himself. Others only brought up Church teaching and you now accuse others of wanting to talk about your mortally sinful perversion. Gross! Disgusting! No thank you! Your wrong! Others only asked you if you upheld and supported Church teaching and the reason you would not answer is YOU DON’T. Your initial bragging session about your boyfriend and your sinful lifestyle was a deliberate introduction of scandal. You wanted to test the water to see how well your perversion would be accepted publicly. You know exactly what you are doing and it is worthy of hell behavior. You will not clear up or clarify your agreement with Church teaching because you have founded your own religion. Your soul would be on fire for Christ if you were thirsting for truth and upholding “all” Church teaching. You are only on fire for homosexuality in cooperation with the enemy of God and you are serving the false god of homosexuality which at this present time rules disordered thinking. Your only hope is repentance and sanctifying grace. If your story is true and not a made up opportunity to distort Church teaching on a Catholic website, you and your boyfriend are merrily skipping down the broad road to hell. Since you are the 22 year live-in boyfriend bragger who came to this public website, tell other homosexuals who flaunt their homosexual living arrangements on a faithful Catholic website to repent and save their souls, otherwise you are NOT a faithful fellow Catholic.
Mark F. posted with Catholic clarity. He was honest about his struggle and he upheld Church teaching. You do not. You lie and you obfuscate. You are the one who has reduced yourself to be a recognized purveyor of perversion on a faithful Catholic website.
YFC what people said about gay people? How about what gay people said about the faithful with convictions…?
Catherine: You keep pressing to know about my sex life, and I keep telling you to mind your own business. When I insist that it is none of your business you call me a liar and tell everyone that I slither in the grass. Really? You call this Christian Charity?
YFC, what you leave out is that none of our states actually voted in such “marriages”. Just as in France it was forced on the people by a wicked government.
Anne T., once again you are very wrong, this time when you say that “none of our states have actually voted in such marriage”. Perhaps you slept through the November 2012 election, in which the people of Minnesota voted to overturn their ban on marriage, and in which Washington voted directly to affirm the marriage bill passed by their legislature. Maine voted directly to get same sex marriage.
If we had lost the Prop 8 case, I have no doubt but that California would have gone on to overturn it. In three good polls this spring, 55-60% of registered CA voters said they support marriage licenses for same sex couples.
YFC,
I noticed you never bothered to correct Anne T when she wrote in a post that your were chaste. You have NEVER written that on CCD but you sure didn’t mind it when Anne T mistakingly wrote that. Whatever misconception or deception that facilitates the lie is fine with you. That has been and is your consistent MO, not the consistency of upholding the authentic Teachings Catholic Faith.
YFC, I have also noticed a distinct pattern of conciliatory comments in your posts since the evil ruling of the Supreme Court received the allegiance and stamp of you’re personal “Amen” or “So Be It.”
Homosexual acts blind the conscience. You publicly rejoice in the actions of evil. The Supreme Court also claimed that murdering babies was a right. What mother murders her baby and then says “Amen” the minute the baby is ripped apart in the womb? That is what you did and it is repulsive because you used a prayer to compliment evil. History is repeating itself. You have helped to facilitate evil and rip apart our nation’s continuous show of a lack of morality which has been the downfall of previous civilizations. You should be trembling in fear, but no, you are not trembling in fear, your are proud because you are blinded. You are reveling in mortal sin. You spit in the face of Almighty God and say “Amen” in cooperation with Satan while also trying to appease those who do strive to be faithful and those who do see the evil that this ruling projects and inflicts upon the world. Blessed Mother Teresa was warning us when she said, “The downfall of America will come through the sin of abortion.” Unless you repent too, the skulls of the unfaithful Supreme Court justices who enabled such evil, will also pave the floor of hell.
God’s Justice will reign Supreme over the evil injustices that have been hoisted upon mankind from wicked and unfaithful justices of the Supreme Court.
You are trying to go out of your way to hypocritically appease those who know that this decision is evil. Save your energy for repenting. This MO is transparent. One often tries to salve the the last scintilla of good conscience left when pleased about attaining something very evil at the expense of destroying something that is good.
Definition of MODUS OPERANDI
A method of procedure; especially : a distinct pattern or method of operation that indicates or suggests the work of a single criminal in more than one crime
Anne, if your response above dated today at 9:31 AM was a response to my post of 9:25, I’d respond thusly:
You write “nobody believes your statistics”. I often disagree with you and with several others who comment here, but I would never degrade you by calling you nobodies. Besides which, any fair minded person can get a hold of the polling memos and see how the same pollster, asking the same question over a period of years and sometimes decades, shows the undeniable reality that support for marriage licenses for same sex couples has gone from support in the 20% or lower a decade or so ago, to now over 50% throughout the country. CA has certainly seen similar if not better growth in these numbers. I urge you to undertake that exercise yourself. Start with a conservative poll, perhaps one used by the Republican party or Republican candidates. Maybe even Michelle Bachmann’s pollster has some data for you to look at.
Having said that, you might have noted your own mistake that I pointed out, when you said that voters have never approved giving marriage licenses to same sex couples. Or did the media get that wrong too?
Catherine, he said that he obeys church teaching. He implied he was chaste by saying once to another poster how badly gay posters were treated even if they were chaste. Right after he posted that he was in a 22 year relationship and people wrote to tell him to follow Christ’s teaching, he wrote something like “Why do you assume that I don’t?” You seem to be the only one that hasn’t caught on. No one should call themselves chaste anymore than one should call themselves humble. One could say celibate, but saying you are chaste would invite the devil. YFC supports the CIVIL marriage of gays and lesbians. He has written about the consequences of having the law as it is. I am sure I will become one of your targets now. It seems you pick on people who correct you or who you imagine are part of some gay mafia in the Church.
Yes you are the homosexual lobby writes,
“Catherine, he said that he obeys church teaching. He “implied” he was chaste by saying once to another poster how badly gay posters were treated even if they were chaste. ”
IMPLIED = HOGWASH
Cite the date, the topic and the time where YFC said he obeyed Church teaching.
YFC, Apparently you haven’t caught on that no one is buying your ventriloquist response except other homosexual lobbyists. You are the lobbyist that is targeting the Catholic Church.
Catherine and Not the Gay Mafia, I see my mistake now. Chaste actually means that one is faithful to ones husband or wife. In using the word “chaste”, YFC, could have meant that he only had sexual relations with his homosexual “partner” in a skewed misuse of the term. He should have used the word celibate.
Anne T,
You wrote, “Now I see my mistake.” Anne, I don’t think you do see. It is not about making a mistake. You are missing the point. YFC never wrote that he was chaste and YFC never wrote that he was faithful to all of the teachings of the Catholic Church period. Now YOU are bringing up the word celibate which he never said either. This poster deliberately announced that he has been living for 22 years with his homosexual partner, period. Anne, Have you paid close attention to the numerous posters such as Mark F. who charitably asked YFC if he upheld these important teachings ? YFC would never respond and there is a reason. It is becasue he does not accept or agree with the teachings of the Catholic Church. He has formed his own religion. He deliberately announced his sinful lifestyle so homosexual unions will be viewed as no different that a married woman and man. Please stop helping activists fool others too. You are unintentionally assisting this poster with his homosexual lobbying game of dodgeball. Please notice that the other poster who undermines good priests and enables lobbyists has been silent on the Supreme Court’s decision and silent about what happened to Cardinal George. That is no accident. Homosexual activists on this website might not use or promote the word sodomy but they do not think it it wrong for those who choose to commit sodomy. You can expect a ventriloquist’s puppet to respond with some excuse that distracts attention. Anne, gullibility has assisted the homosexual agenda in society and within the Church. While it is true that we want all homosexual activists to repent and be sorry for their activism, we certainly don’t want to unintentionally enable homosexual lobbying and activism that is targeting the Catholic Church.
it’s strange how a person with the post name “Not the gay mafia” came on here to rescue YFC and we never heard of that post name before…another troll in the making or the same posters changing their identities to keep many busy here….geeze, they never rest do they? Just strange how they just come on once or so….such disordered nature… How can we believe their credibility….shocking….wow….
JonJ: I read the decisions. I know what standing is. I also know that there is no exception in Canon Law for creating what the Church apparently believes is mortal sin. In the eyes of history, Scalia and Roberts will be as culpable as the judges in Roe v Wade. Technicality or not.
Catherine, my memory then served me wrong. I thought I remembered YFC saying that he was chaste. Perhaps it was someone else. I do not have the time to read all the posts on all the articles on these issues, so sometimes I miss what some people say. I should go back to not “dialoging with the devil” as Pope Francis said, meaning do not argue with people who are trying to seduce you or others into sin, as Eve did with Satan, after the person has been warned. They will eventually drag you and others into sin and all involved will be condemned. It is clear that Mark PA and YFC are teaching heresy on the issue of marriage, and I should just avoid even discussing it with them as I did before. Good bye. I am out of here. Same-sex “marriage” is wrong no matter whether the states or federal government okays it or not.
Anne T,
Wait a minute. I thought you just wrote that you didn’t like weakness? Anne T, You even wrote about the courage of your grandfather. Anne T, I did not quit or say goodbye when you mistakingly defended and enabled a dialoguing devil over dialogue which was clear in upholding “all ” Church teaching. Anne, This is not about taking things personally and by leaving one clearly shows that it is not Church teaching that they are interested in defending. It is often pride or envy or lustful feelings and egos that overcome one’s ability to consistently serve the truth. You are a sister in Christ and sisters in Christ are not weak and they are not above hearing that they often through gullibility aid and abet someone who is working to undermine the Catholic Church. Don’t leave or move just follow your grandfather’s beautiful and courageous example and roll on.
YFC, I’m not so sure about your take on Canon Law re: Scalia.
If you read his opinions, he’s VERY much for “judicial restraint”—judges exercising their authority within very limited parameters. He thinks unelected judges with life tenure can easily seize too much power and end up abusing it if they don’t have it—not just supreme court judges, but federal judges at all levels..
Meanwhile, because he ruled on the prop 8 case on standing, doesn’t mean that the case can’t be brought. It means that Scalia thinks you need to find a proper plaintiff. Find that plaintiff, and Windsor makes it pretty clear he’ll uphold prop 8.
Putting the two together, and Scalia probably thinks that enabling power-hungry judges will end up with worse results than waiting for the proper plaintiff for the prop 8 case.
The Magisterium do preach that while abortion is an objective moral wrong, but that legislators CAN morally vote for legislation that allows abortions IF they’re following an “incremental” strategy to limit (and hopefully eliminate) legal abortions.
Arguing by analogy to the moral principles that surround the theology of abortion, it might be theologically acceptable that Scalia rejected the prop 8 challenge based on standing—IF he has a good faith belief that his rulings are part of an incrementalism strategy.
Not interested in how Scalia voted, as he is weak and will be done in sooner or later. These politicians respect fear and act accordingly. A lot of the bloggers here seem utterly naiive about this reality. All governments use as much force as they can muster to get their ways. There are two ways this force is effected, one being violence and the other seduction. The Constitution of the USA depends on something that no longer exists, namely a God respecting and work/property responsible voter. This foundation has been overwhelmed by fools and idiots, lunatics and criminals. Those responsible for allowing this to happen are the faithless bishops, which is why Pope Francis has ordered them to practice what they preach. They won’t; and so Pope Francis has appealed to all of us to rise up and change the condition of bishops which can be described with a loud sucking noise.
Well, Skai, why don’t you leave and help eliminate some of the “fools, idiots, and lunatics”.
The Supreme court just created an injustice and an in house war…..these wicked men…..May God have mercy on your souls.
I truly believe that those who do believe in the true Constitution of this country….a civil war may have to happen to correct the abuses that these courts are now having too much power over. It is unconstitutional, their actions…not only do they want to re-define marriage, they are now re-defining the true Constitution in which this lovely country was truly based on. It is only the voice of agenda’s that are ruling this country, it is not the voice of the people….
Abeca, I believe you are supporting sedition.
All those new words…what’s that mean?
Abeca please, sedition is hardly a new word.
But now that i have you attention perhaps you can tell us the difference between the “true Constitution” onto which we ought to hoist belief, and some other norvo ordo constitution which is apparently to be despised. Please clarify.
Abeca Christian,
Now that you have YFC’S attention please inform him that the word “lying” is hardly a new word. Either is the word “thief”.
YFC’s “true constitution” on this faithful Catholic website has been a succession of lies that are designed to steal the truth away from the authentic teachings of the Catholic Church.
Catherine, please, your ad hominem insults are truly unseemly. They reflect far more upon your character than upon mine.
YFC you are being defensive,….it is a new word for me…I was being genuine in my asking and you reply with anger…..It was an honest question……sorry I asked…If I have time Ill look it up.
But who cares what you think……I know very well what our country is all about…..not what your agenda is trying to do…I may not be a person who knows all those words, especially names that title people with convictions….I could care less…if our Lord commanded us to fight then we shall, If he does not…then we won’t…it is all about Him and not what a word describes a group of people who want to protect our moral freedoms! Especially on ones that are meant for the common good of mankind not a selected group who wants to advance their unnatural ways….the Lord God set before mankind the natural law and we need to defend it….it for the sake of our youth…we can not scandalize them or allow a sinful group that feels bad about themselves to impose it on even children!
AMEN Catherine Ditto ….I;m sure YFC read it….
The Saints of the day, Paul and John, Roman brothers:
https://magnificat.ca/cal/en/saints/saints_john_and_paul.html
” … Julian had returned to the cult of idols and was attempting to re-establish it in the empire. The Christian brothers saw many wicked men prosper in their impiety, but were not dazzled by their example. They considered that worldly prosperity accompanied by impunity in sin is the most dreadful of all judgments, indicating reprobation. And history reveals how false and short-lived was the glittering prosperity of Julian …”
We see wickedness around us seemingly prosper. And yet do we then share the brothers’ consideration of what they saw, the same old sin(s) which we, too, see? We must. Otherwise we are the people whom Malachi bawled out (2:17):
“Ye have wearied Jehovah with your words, And ye have said: ‘In what have we wearied Him?’ In your saying: ‘Every evil-doer is good in the eyes of the Lord, And in them He is delighting,’ Or, ‘Where is the God of judgment?’”
YEAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!…Been sayin’ it all along…it’s a STATES RIGHTS ISSUE…HELLOOOOO!…Think McFly!….YAHOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
Correction, Taipan, it’s a God’s rights issue. But I’m with you on your support of the natural authority of the county sheriffs over the state or the federal state … go dude.
Taipan, how the majority got to that decision was pretty weird. In fact, all of the opinions in this decision had some rather fuzzy reasoning, IMHO.
We shouldn’t really be surprised when it was a manufactured decision from the get go. Washington imposed inheritance taxes on Windsor, even though the Justice Dept’s lawyers agreed with Windsor’s arguments in court.
Obviously, the government was trying to manufacture standing, while then trying to make sure the plaintiff won. Usually, genuine “controversies” give rise to better jurisprudence because both sides bring their strongest arguments to bear since the parties have a self-interest in the outcome.
When you have faux adversarial cases like this, where the one side is really trying to “throw” the outcome, you have a bad process that often yields bad jurisprudence.
JOnJ: If they hadn’t “manufactured” standing, plaintiff would still have won.
Thomas Nawn:
God didn’t put you on this Earth for the purpose of “being gay,” whatever that means. He put you on this Earth so that you could love and serve Him and your neighbors in this life, so as to enjoy His love in the next life. That there are enemies of God, celebrating these twin SCOTUS decisions, who think that happiness in life is found in following disordered sexual attractions like same sex attraction, necrophilia, bestiality, pedophilia, polyandry, and the like is something to be deplored.
To the extent that Christians rejoice in the upholding of perversity is a sign indeed that Devil is a roaring lion looking for victims to devour.
At what point does one abandon their Christianity? For most of these people, a review of the rite of baptism might help them remember that, when they were baptized, they promised to leave their sinful ways.
Bwangi something doesn’t seem right in what you posted…an infant is innocent and is incapable of promising to leave their sinful ways….Baptism is to wash away original sin….it does not mean it washing away free will later on their lives…..there are graces but people’s sins stop them from embracing them.
Abeca,
Read the wording of the Rite of Baptism. I don’t think even the Novus Ordo Rites have taken out the words “do you renounce Satan and all of his works”!
Bwangi is right!
Does that mean that children who have not yet reached the age of reason are capable of sinning, no of course not, but those are the words of the Rite of Baptism.
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
And the godparents answer on the child’s behalf, Kenneth and Abeca.
Isn’t that asked of the parents and godparents…I don’t recall it being asked of the child….so the parents answer for the child…not unless it is an older child or adult…..good to recall and review….
The takeover of our culture by sodomites, lesbians, and abortionists has been abetted by our fiddling emperors, who for 40+ years have failed to stand up to evil. It’s too late for this country. It’s gone.
Our self-styled “great nation” was founded on masonry and deism, mixed in with the ultra-ultra-protestant sect of puritanism. I agree “it’s gone” as long as I can then state for the record that it “never was.”
Brad, you are technically correct, of course. Our country was founded by protestants. But, can you imagine a Ben Franklin or George Washington endorsing an absurd notion like two homosexuals getting “married”? Get a grip! Your argument is a straw man!
Anton, why are you assuming I would think the founding fathers, let alone any layman of the 18th century, would endorse what they would have correctly identified as sin? But that said, what I earlier wrote still stands in terms of who and what founded us. And the rotten seeds bear rotten fruit. May God bless you.
Brad, the Catholic Church includes all baptised faithful and all men of good will who desire God by have not yet encountered Him. Your arrogance sinks souls and provides a false witness to Christ.
In fact, Brad, you probably believe that the bishops typically are Catholic; however, the Pope commanded them to become holy. They refuse; thus, they are not Catholic, but the worst hypocrites on the planet. Hypocrites, according to Jesus, are the worst of the sinners, much worse than the sodomites. Most Protestants are good people … doctrine? Look at the Catholics on this blog who have no sense of what the Church teaches, or those who put forth false teaching. Are these your buddies?
Neither of you are totally correct, at least one of the signers of the Declaration of Independence (Carroll) maybe more, and likewise the Constitution were Catholics. It is very likely that Our Founding Father, George Washington died a Catholic (Read Washington’s vision on TFP’s Website). Get your History straight before writing!
I have seen the magnificent painting of Our Lady that was at the head of George Washington’s bed at Mt. Vernon.
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fishe
Skai,
“the Catholic Church includes all baptised faithful and all men of good will who desire God by have not yet encountered Him”. Where did you get that from? It is not true. Our Lady uses the term “the separated brethren” at and in many of her approved locutions!
That sounds like something straight from “the Spirit of Vatican II”!
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
The Catholic volunteers were persecuted by other Revolutionary War soldiers and anti-Catholicsm was often as severe as the persecution of blacks by the KKK. (who also hated Catholics) Had it not been for George Washington, many Catholics would have been tarred and feathered etc. He was truly a man for all seasons, and we need someone like him now, to be sure! Catholics were only allowed to practice their faith in Maryland in the early years…read about the settling of the Oregon territories how a Catholic convert who had shared his prosperity and know-how to help countless pioneers only to be stabbed in the back and die a broken man. (and not given credit in Oregon history books) Catholics are to be loving and forgiving, of course, but not be stupid about the world. Listen to what Klavan of PJ media had to say about same sex marriage this week…he’s pretty representative of themainstream protestant (in his case, Episcopalian) mindset. We’ll be more and more alienated from this culture as it continues its wild swing into paganism.
Kenneth Fisher, my ancestry in this nation goes all the way back to 1600 on one side, and possibly all the way back to the Mayflower. It goes back to at least the second ship that came over from England with Thomas Standish, one of my ancestors, on it. The blood of both the Puritans and Catholics flow through my veins. Some of them I am sure were Catholics who fled Scotland into Ireland to avoid persecution, then came over here. I pray for them all, and I can tell you none of the Founding Fathers agreed to signing legislation that would have let two men or two women “marry”, including the one Catholic who signed the Constitution. Sodomy was illegal in all of the thirteen colonies, and it was illegal in all the original states. Just consider me a “Samaritan” if you must, but hopefully a good one. I cry tears of sadness for this country, at what it has become, but then it always did have its problems. Yes, I have a devotion to St. George, and I think he just might have helped guide George Washington whether he knew it or not, right along with Fr. George Rutler, one of my favorites. (Lots of laughs through the tears.) I remember when the English and the Mexicans were dancing in the streets together after one Olympics, most often they bring out the best in us for we are so gosh, awful staid and proper at times. St. George’s intercession brought me through a very dark morning one time by the guidance of a Thomas English muffin truck ahead of me leading the way. I truly believe God sent it, through his intercession, to guide me along that lonely stretch of freeway and to bring me safely to my distination. No one but a Catholic would understand. Kenneth Fisher, may God make you truly a fisher of men. May St. John Fisher bless you. So let’s hear it! for God, for country and for St. George. I leave you with this saying, “A lion will never attack a true king.”
Ummm Anne, how, many of those people on the “second ship” have you talked to recently?
Just how is it that you know more than anyone else what they would have supported—other than by inference from the written histories and legal documents, personal diaries and fiction they left behind?
Or, are you claiming some kind of cr0ss-generational information transfer carried in DNA—that you have somehow decoded and are now conveying to us?
An appeal to authority logical fallacy is embarrassing enough because it shows you don’t have the ability to make a valid argument on your own merit.
It’s even more embarrassing when your so called authority is completely artificial.
Brad, I know what you’re saying__ that the seeds of destruction are planted in every protestant heart. You weren’t condemning them but just stating a fact because of the basic heresy of protestantism…as anyone can read in Belloc and many other Catholic historians. Please don’t all start condemning Brad! Also, Benjamin Franklin was really a hedonist, an adulterer etc. as were so many other founding fathers, Jefferson was a deist who cut out all the miracles of our Lord in his Bible, but I believe most sincerely that they were used by God to create this nation and that this nation was founded by God. But we’re likely going to lose it because we’ve indebted ourselves to a Godless, anti-life nation and sold our inheritance for a bowl of pottage. The recent debacles in our elections, the choice of two lesbians on the highest court, the promotion of abortion by so-called Catholic politicians etc. , an abortion, same-sex, anti-God president (the list is endless) are all contributing to what can only be a sad end unless there is an awakening of all people of faith. Unlike the Spanish, we’ll be lucky to be eating rats!
Yeah, Brad, but they masons and the puritans sure as hell produced a materialist civilization bar none, right? Why is it that most college educated Catholics become insurance salesmen, politicians, lawyers and businessmen, and not so much engineers or manufacturing entrepreneurs? Also, isn’t it curious that most great scientific discoveries were made by Catholics (the top couple dozen, not the derivative discoveries made weekly by everyone)? How do you explain this trend?
No its the lack of catechesis by our Bishops and Priests.
When was the last time you read or heard from your Bishop and Pastor to read Holy Scripture and the CCC at home?
Many Catholics do not know their Faith, yet continue to proudly march up for Holy Communion.
Many Catholics (including Hispanics favored by our Bishops) voted for Obama, and all the other evil politicians and judges at Federal, State and Local levels.
Erin,
At Our Lady Help of Christians, Garden Grove, CA we hear admonitions to read our Bibles even daily constantly, especially from a Franciscan who has lately joined our parish. In fact he told me a week ago in confession to read my Bible daily.
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
What if you already read the Bible countless times and have only to go over it in your memory with an occasional reality check?
The big push back begins.
The push back on abortion is on going.
The push back on sodomy marriage is about to begin.
Sodomy marriage is a fight against nature,natural sex between man and woman,the natural family of wife,husband,and their natural offspring.
Man and woman and their offspring are by definition ” homophobic.”
There is a natural argument against so-called “marriage” between two persons of the same sex.
The basis is THE PARTS DO NOT FIT.
This applies to the psychological, emotional, and spiritual aspects—three areas in which a man and a woman do fit.
The other facet is the physical dimension. The sexual-generative parts of the male and female bodies do fit, THEY ARE MEANT FOR EACH OTHER LIKE A LOCK AND A KEY, and this fit is IN ACCORD WITH NATURE. This natural fit also follows a natural purpose, namely, the generation of a human life. The sexual-generative parts of two males or of two females DO NOT FIT and do not fulfill the natural purpose of generating human life.
Bill Foley,
Not only do the parts not fit in sodomite sexual activity, when these poor souls engage in that activity, God sends them a message in the form of an often mortal disease!
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
Neither to the brains of gays fit reality; so it’s not merely that parts don’t fit.
Skai, at least MRI’s can usually find the brains of gay people just as readily as straight people.
Of course, most literature majors never learn to accept the reality that no one wants to buy anything they write.
The so-called “catholic” member of the supreme Court who made this ruling possible should warrant immediate excommunication for siding with the sodomites but, alas, we don’t have a Bishop in sight who has the integrity to uphold Catholic law.
Those Bishops who encourage SACRILEGE, SCANDAL, HERESY, SCHISM, and Relativism by not catechizing and enforcing Canon 915 & 1399 – – –
well I would not want to be in their shoes on judgment day.
The excuses they put forth would be very interesting.
Our 3 latest Popes have asked everyone to read the CCC, yet many Bishops are so full of PRIDE and DISOBEDIENCE that they refuse to pass this on to those in their Diocese even during this declared “Year of Faith”.
I wonder what a repentant Torquemada would be like today.
The thing is though, this idea that those that promote the sodomous lifestyle are interested in salvation, their goal is to self justify. The church needs to focus only on truth and stop engaging in unhelpful discussions with those that wish her Children harm.
See USCCB statement “Tragic Day for Marriage and our Nation”
It all gets back to the lack of proper teaching (catechesis).
Most Bishops do not talk about: Mortal Sin & Hell, Jesus’s words that few will attain Heaven (the side and narrow road),
that we should read Holy Scripture and the CCC at home.
The Bishops can not expect results when they only teach during an immediate crisis.
And Most Bishops ENCOURAGE – SACRILEGE, SCANDAL, HERESY, SCHISM and relativism by not enforcing Canons 915 and 1399.
The Church needs to teach so that Catholics will VOTE in all things with a Catholic and well-formed conscience.
Did USCCB President Cardinal Timothy Dolan say that NY Gov Mario Cuomo should be excommunicated for: working for Abortion, same-sex marriage, living with his unwed girlfriend, etc. ?
Other than compliments has he said that Nancy Pelosi and Joe Biden should be excommunicated?
Did he enjoy yukking it up with President Obama at the Al Smith dinner?
Bishops can not do one thing and say another – this just does not work.
Without being holy, the bishops are salt with no flavor, and should be thrown out (Jesus in Gospel and Pope Francis). Pope Francis asked everyone what to do to help get the gay lobby out of the Church. Pope Emeritus told the bishops to become holy. Your wagon can be loaded with the finest things, but is meaningless without a horse that can pull it.
For the religion challenged, it is holiness and not legalism that pulls the Church forward up the Via Dolorosa to the Glorious mysteries.
I don’t see the CCC as being particularly important, and definitely not critical in Catholic formation. It contains many sections that devolve onto the decision making process of a ladder of clerical organizations, ie it was written by bureaucrats for bureaucrats. The Bible and the writings of the doctors of the Church were written for everyone by saints and apostles. So, which version of Catholicism do you desire, the bureaucratic version or the holy version?
The DOMA ruling says that states have the right to define marriage. The Prop 8 ruling says that the petitioners did not have the right to be heard by the Supreme Court thereby letting stand a ruling by a federal court that nullifies a duly approved amendment to a state constitution that defines marriage as between a man and a woman. Did I read these right?
Anonymous, no matter how you read it, it is not right, but wrong.
Well, at least those states that do not allow gay marriage have been told they have the right to do that.
Annonymous,
The only way that States can do it is to get rid of all Demoncrats and Republicrats!
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
The county sheriff is the highest law enforcement authority in the county, and does not have to enforce a federal or state law. I don’t know how this might shake down with the gay agenda on marriage, and it will be exciting to see it go forth. But legalizing gay activity reduces unemployment by necessitating more medical workers than would otherwise be needed. The odd thing is that despite big money paying for medical school students, there still are not enough being produced to handle the medical load of the nation: the upshot is that the reason is explained by a natural limitation on the intelligence needed to practice medicine. The perverse gay agenda has brought the medical sector of society to its limit, and has pushed society beyond the limit of medical aid. More and more people will get less and less competent medical and health care. Thanks to PA, JonJ, YFC, jon, TEM and their ilk, the wellbeing of society as a whole is beginning to suffer … they are torturing Christ on His Cross.
Wow, Skai, I must congratulate you on your courage.
You again boldly speak out on subjects in which you know nothing about. Yet, you do not allow limited knowledge and intellect to stop you.
Kudos!
AIDs is far from the biggest “drag” on the health care system. Heart disease and obesity are the biggest causes of preventable disease. These conditions are largely self-inflicted outside of a minority who are simply genetically unlucky.
Cancer, too, is significantly impacted by life choices. Smokers and those who pump their bodies full of chemicals (prescription drugs, recreational drugs, and dietary additives) expose themselves to more mutagens.
Of course, the psychology of this is interesting. Skai is either completely unaware of the above, or chooses to ignore it, because he finds the belief that gays are bringing down the health care system as personally satisfying.
While it is convenient and emotionally satisfying to villify one’s opponents with the paintbrush of evil, it is still bearing false witness against your neighbor.
Of course, regular readers of this site are not at all surprised by Skai making up facts. Though, I suppose we should not hold it against him. Back when I was an undergrad, I used to take non-competitive courses like literature to pile up easy A’s. I suppose Skai learned to make up his facts by following this academic path.
Of course, literature courses are largely taught—and created—by people who are unable to write anything anyone wants to read. Since they have failed at being a writer, they attempt to convince everyone else that they really SHOULD have succeeded —except the reading public is too dumb to understand their genius.
Once you understand this, and pander to the professor’s ego, you can pile up A after A without much effort. The only challenge is to figure out what made-up literary ideas tickle the professor’s fancy and apply that to whatever the prof assigns to read. If you can feed it back to the prof in nice prose, you sleepwalk with spectacular grades.
I think you read them correctly.
Regarding Prop 8, the people spoke when they elected EVIL politicians (and evil judges) – at all levels of government. Evil politicians appoint evil judges.
U.S. District Chief Judge Vaughn R. Walker from San Francisco – an admitted and active homosexual struck down Prop 8, all by himself.
He was appointed to the bench.
Walker retired and went off to waste away in his sins.
Annonymous,
You read it right, and it is completely contradictory and they know it!
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
Two very significant rulings by the third branch of our government, one of which does not support the beliefs of the Catholic Church and many other churches and the other which simply determined that the people who brought suit in federal court had no standing. It, however, essentially allows same sex marriage in California because if the issue was put to a vote again, it would likely lose. The questions becomes, what do you/we do about the situation. We can fume to our hearts content, but the majority of people don’t agree with us. Any new version of Prop 8 would not pass a popular vote and if it did, it too would be overturned. I think we are between a rock and a hard place. What to do? It has been years since people took to the streets in this country. Could the Church gather one or two million people in DC to protest? What could we do to stop a train that is coming down the track at great speed? Any ideas beside lamenting?
You do not know that, Bob One.
Is there anything that Bob One does know? I have yet to see him post actual knowledge.
I give to Prop 8 whenever I can. That is one way to help stop the train wreck. Choo choo choo!
Over 500,000 march in DC against abortion every January.
The answer is in the voting booth.
Do not vote for politicians that support evil – abortion, same-sex marriage, euthanasia, etc.
Oscar,
Some of those very same “bishops” who attend and speak at the annual D.C. March for Life, refuse to enforce Canon 915!
May God have mercy on their souls. St. Augustine had a great deal to say about them, something about the pathway to Hell….
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
@Bob One what do we do?? be witness to Faith and for Christ unto Death how does that sound, because its only a matter of time before the sodomites and their allies in the State turn their sites on the Church and its teachings.. It will then be time to separate the wheat from the chaff….Know that this evil will be crushed in the end is extremely edifying …
Bob One, the fact that the petitioners have no standing in federal court in extremely significant. In states where voters can place issues on their voting ballots, they now have absolutely no recourse, if those in the positions of power in the state government refuse to accept the will of the voters. It’s a hard left turn towards totalitarianism.
Incorrect on two or maybe three fronts. First, Proponents DO have standing to defend a ballot initiative in California state courts. Secondly, California elects both its governor and its attorney general. So, if the people do not like how the administration defends ballot initatives in federal courts, they can take recourse at the ballot box. That’s called democracy. Beyond that, it begs the question of whether Prop 8 proponents appeared in court to defend it. They DID conduct a defense at the federal district court level….and they lost on the merits.
Court standing depends on the particular jurisdiction of the particular court, and the respective jurisdictions under which the plaintiffs and defendants function. For example, there are common law jurisdiction, admiralty jurisdiction and commercial jurisdiction, and maybe more for all I know. We are being fleeced as a nation by lawyers who know something about this stuff and yet manipulate and deceive so as to win their agendas.
Nonsense, Anon.
Scalia, in fact, joined in the standing decision, because he believes in the limited power of the judiciary.
That doesn’t mean no one can challenge the law. It only means that someone who is “harmed” by overturning prop 8 has to bring the case. Prospective harm doesn’t cut it to give “standing” to plaintiffs.
Scalia believes it is very important to limit the power of judges to determine the law ONLY WHEN NECESSARY to resolve an actual case. He considers it important to limit judges from actively seeking out legal rulings to proclaim according to their whims, because that allows them to become drunk with power.
The Homos fight incremental wars. After this Man-man and Gal-gal marriage triumph they will request Man-boy, Man-sister, Man-goat, Gal-dog and Gal-swan marriages. Once they obtain all of the above they will think of something else such as drinking, post-term abortion, or euthanasia for the elderly of economic means. Perhaps they might get a man who photographed and distributed his wedding tackle on Facebook elected as the next Mayor of the greatest city in the free world.
Gracias: your comment is so absurd, I am very surprised the editor posted it.
Stupid and ignorant gay Aaron, already some of these things are happening. England now is legalizing the joining of egg and sperm from three people to produce babies. You gays with your dumbed down minds and dull souls simply have no clue and can learn only the hard way … which is why you respond only to harsh treatment and not to the love of Christ in gentler modes.
Skai, it will only come back to bite them when these children grow up. Some from same-sex couples have already spoken out against how they were conceived. And the SSP (same-sex practicing) couples’s actions were all so deliberate.
I read the DOMA decision. It’s a fine piece of work of the Rebel Alliance (Scalia’s and Alito’s dissents) vs. the absurd Imperial Death Star of the majority. Too bad we don’t have bishops with backbone who would prevent the “Catholic” justices from receiving Communion for inflicting such atrocities against the common good. The majority opinion read like the illogical soulless documents one would expect of the UN or other ungodly bureaucracies that infest this world.
Bishops are furthering SACRILEGE, SCANDAL, HERESY, SCHISM, RELATIVISM, and confusion – when they do not do their own jobs.
Enforce Canon 915 and 1399.
Fr. Michael,
I know this will hurt, it does me as well, but why has the Pope appointed some of those responsible for this disaster to his advisory Board?
Viva Cristo Rey!
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
Mr. Fisher:
My experience as a parish priest, with priest friends of different dioceses and religious orders, is that the clergy (or at least bishops and priests) look at things much differently than the active laity (progressive and conservative alike). Rather than looking at things through a conservative/orthodox vs. progressive/heretical lens, the guys look at who works, who stays out of trouble (e.g. not getting letters at the chancery), who can raise money, ethnic differences, who is the “life of the party” at priest gatherings, etc. The spiritual realities of the priests’ ministries are unknown to their peers and often to their supervisors: a priest popular with his peers could be a lousy pastor, for example. I could see the same system playing itself out at the universal Church level: certain cardinals get the attribute for holiness, money raiser, reformer, etc. among their peers while their archdioceses may be suffering gravely.
This isn’t my Theory of Everything in the Church but it does make sense to me.
FrMichael, I think Pope Francis agrees with your assessment, which would explain why he has called for the laity (all of us) to resolve the problem of the gay mafia, ie corruption.
WHAT CAN ONE SAY BUT – “OH HAPPY DAY” – BE ASSURED, I AM ENJOYING YOUR RESPONSES WITH A DOUBLE MARTINI AND WAITING FOR THE SKY TO FALL, AGAIN!!! GOD BLESS AMERICA! HAPPY FOURTH OF JULY TO ALL!!!
TEM, You are not “one” but “many”; therefore, you should rather say, “What can many say … “.
As in ‘his name is legion’, Skai? You’re so droll!
“Droll”!!!???&&& Dana, this is like getting hit on the knot on the back of my head.
I thought he was being amusing, Abeca…and yes, he is cool and funny. If he wasn’t trying to be funny in this case, then I don’t know what he meant. Sorry! ;o) I’ve been discovering in late years that often when I think I’m communicating an idea, I leave out a lot of information because my brain tends to go from A to Z without the building blocks to fill in B, C, D and so on and so forth. I rather think it’s a bit late in the day to be able to change now. Fortunately I meet the occasional A to Z person who fills in the gaps and we’re on the same page so to speak. I can only hope not to be saying anything that is inconsistent. Yikes!
droll: amusing in an odd way; whimsically humorous; waggish
Exactly!
Dana what did you mean with droll? Skai is cool!
It’s one thing when the mainstream media puts out misinformation, but… some news reports are stating that the US Supreme Court let Prop 8 stand. It is still the law in California, and will continue to be so for years, because a new series of lawsuits will be necessary to overturn it, taking years, and they too will no doubt end up back in the US Supreme Court. All because Justice Kennedy joined the “wrong” four yet again, something he frequently does. Chaos and confusion, prime tools of choice for the left, since facts and logic expose them for what they really are. The darkness cannot stand the light.
That’s what I heard too, Gabe.
Gabe – You are not stating the facts here. The facts are that the District Court held that Prop 8 was unconstitutional and ordered that it not be enforced. The Supreme Court held that the appellants had no right to appeal the District Court ruling, and therefore, the ruling of the District Court stands. Marriages will begin in about a month in California, and you can thank two Catholic Supreme Court justices for that: Roberts & Scalia.
He is either misinforming you or lying, Gabe. Scalia dessented. In other words he upheld traditional marriage. Go to other Catholic websites to see.
All you have to do Gabe is read what is in the article above, Scalia dissented from the majoriy opinion, and other websites will tell you who the three others were who dissented also; one was Thomas, bless his heart.
There are several here Anne T that do not even know what truth is. Their whole lives are a lie. Truth to them is as flexible as a rubber band, and as long as you keep stretching and twisting it, it is malleable and usable for a long time until it snaps from being manipulated beyond its capability to surround.
Dana, if it was you who (accidentally, I imagine) posted anonymously at Anonymous says:
July 1, 2013 at 2:47 pm
Please keep in mind that in your earlier post, you accused people of lies when talking about the court cases, which you now admit you don’t understand. Since I was clearly in the line of fire of that accusation of living an entire life of lies, including somehow stretching the facts of the decision like a rubber band, I think you owe me an apology.
Thanks in advance.
Anne and Dana, you seem confused about the facts here. (Notice I did NOT say you are lying. Just misinformed).
There were two court cases decided last week. One overturned Prop 8, the other overturned DOMA. Because Prop 8 was overturned, weddings restarted Friday. The Chief Justice, a Catholic, wrote the majority opinion that allowed that to happen. Scalia joined in the majority opinion.
In the other case, the DOMA case, the majority found that it was a violation of the equal protection guarantee of the Constitution for the Federal government to burden a class of people that some States seek to protect. For that reason, for example, a married couple in Florida was able to obtain a Green Card for his spouse over the weekend. In THAT case, Scalia dissented. It was really quite a funny dissent that he wrote, in fact. He seems to have used his dissent to prove how easy it will be to get marriage nationwide because of the Constitution’s guarantee of equal protection.
I understand all this can be tough to follow, but it might help if you try to get all the facts before you start with crazy rubber banded liar conspiracy theories.
;p Thanks YFC. You’re right, but to be honest, I’ve avoided discussing the whole Supreme Court rulings because I don’t know diddly squat about any of it. I pretty much confine myself to related issues that I really care about or the long term consequences of decisions being discussed. There are myriad ways to see these issues and we all bring insights to the table that help to strengthen our own understanding or show how we may be in error. The terrible implications of what these decisions have wrought are what concern me. Look how they’re already unlawfully marrying in California because like the heretics after Vatican II, there are many lawless and unscrupulous people in this world that disguise themselves as virtuous and wise. That’s what I meant about stretching truth like a rubber band.
JonJ, you mention neo nazi rallies; so you are also calling gay day a neo nazi affair. This is a marked change in your presentation, dude. Good for you.
This is probably what must happen (whether we like it or not) – especially in CA and States where the elected official and judges support sodomy –
1) The Church should perform REQUIRED SACRAMENTAL marriages (for Catholics not in the state of Mortal sin only). It should be done in accord with all Church teachings only.
2) Catholics will also need to have a quickie marriage before a civil judge for civil legal purposes only. This would have to take place on the same day or the day after the Sacramental marriage.
This will avoid law suits against the Church by activist sodomites – sons of the devil.
I’m ok with this separation, and some countries have this kind of civil vs sacramental marriage separation, but in the US, for the purposes of avoiding lawsuits, it is unnecessary. Churches have never been required to marry anyone they don’t wish to marry. Priests don’t marry athiests, buddhists, and restrict severely a mixed Christian couple. They even refuse to marry some pairs of Catholics when they, as you say, are not in good standing. Now, could someone try to bring a lawsuit? Sure, anybody can bring a lawsuit about anything. But a judge would shut down the case immediately, and the plaintiffs would just be wasting their money.
YFC, BS its only a matter of time before priests are thrown in prison just for preaching against sodomite marriage and sodomy in general…
What a crock, Canisius.
I find it interesting how many people have to “make up” harms they are likely to suffer as a result of Walden vs. US. I am tempted to remark about how this fact serves as commentary about such individuals having a need to feel persecuted, in order to characterize the other side as evil.
However, there are too many real legal problems this string of decisions is likely to cause. Between state law non-discrimination laws, DOMA’s over-turn and states passing gay marriage laws, there are going to be real problems protecting the “outside of Church” activities of religious organizations.
I do see “hate speech” laws and Christian preaching as a possible area of conflict. I suspect that in Church sermons are clearly protected by the 1st amendment (just like Neo-Nazi rallies are protected). But, there will be many problems with “outside of Church” speech.
In Boston, Catholic Adoptive Services were forced to close because they were being forced by the State to provide Catholic children to homosexual couples.
My parents were married in Germany during WWII. At that time (and still today, as far as I know) they Church required them to be civilly married before they were sacramentally married. What they told me much later is that a city official in the Rathaus performed a civil ceremony and gave them a certificate of marriage and a complementary copy of Mein Kampf to read on their honeymoon. After that ceremony, they walked across the street to the cathedral, where they were they joined the wedding party and were married. Nobody is quite sure what happened to the copy of Mein Kampf, but my parents’ marriage lasted a lot longer than its author or his government.
I’m bringing this up as a reminder that governments come and go, but the Church has been around for nearly 2000 years. The best thing the Church can do is to live its own mission fully and as separately from the state as possible.
I agree Francis. And what is interesting is that I think it is far more likely that priests will not be able to civilly solemnize ANY marriage than that they would be forced to civilly or saramentally marry same sex couples. Because priests and ministers are essentially performing two acts at once (civilly and sacramentally marry a couple), people mistakenly believe the two are the same thing. If the two were separate, as you say they are in Germany, then I think people would be far less confused about DOMA and Prop 8.
Francis I could not agree with you more.
The quicker that the Catholic Church DIVORCES itself from the US Government, State Governments, and Local Governments, the better off we will all be.
The mission is to Save Souls.
The mission of the Church is not to divorce itself but to disciple the nations, ie the governments.
A complementary copy of Mein Kampf to read on their honeymoon? Well, that is kind of creepy. Interesting story.
Well said, Francis. Thanks for sharing your story. It wouldn’t surprise me if the copy of Mein Kampf was promptly thrown in the garbage! :o)
Chris,
I agree that the Church should not marry anyone in the state of Mortal Sin, but have you been to a so called Catholic Wedding at a Novus Ordo Church lately. The very wedding attire the women wear are occasions of Mortal Sin. When the priest allows it, he himself is contributing to that Sin. How can anyone expect Our Lord to bless a ceremony at which His Mother’s very warning at Fatima is ignored! I have witnessed marriages between two ostensibly very Catholic individuals that ended in horrible divorces, guess what, the women were wearing strapless gowns. Even gowns with straps are to be so that two fingers only can be placed between the neckline and the gown!
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
Mr. Fischer, there is no “Novis Ordo church.” There is only ONE, holy Catholic and apostolic Church.
Sugar, you would not understand what Kenneth Fisher is saying unless you were accustomed to the theology and liturgy of the traditional, EF, Mass. Then it would stand out like a sore thumb. Your argument also defies history and the current legal conditions involving the Church.
Skai thank you for your reply to C&H….I hope people would stop saying things that are illogical…we need to understand one another and clearly C&H lacks that knowledge of know how….I am still trying to understand it as well but I have become more in the usage of terms just to try to convey what I want to convey….whew….that was hard..
This is correct. Both Forms of the Mass are HOLY, when done correctly.
(All Ordinary Forms of the Mass must be done according to GIRM.)
Those of you who have seen abuses in the Ordinary Form of the Mass (Novis Ordo), and done nothing to report it to the Diocese Bishop are guilty of aiding and abetting.
So all you complainers out there who have done nothing to make the appropriate corrections – are equally to blame (along with the offending Priest or Laity.)
CCC: ” 1868 Sin is a personal act. Moreover, we have a responsibility for the sins committed by others when we cooperate in them:
– by participating directly and voluntarily in them;
– by ordering, advising, praising, or approving them;
– by NOT DISCLOSING or not hindering them when we have an obligation to do so;
– by protecting evil-doers.
Must like bestiality, fornication, polyandry, ect. has no place in the life of a faithful Catholic, we also should not indulge in the abomination of attacking the Norvus Ordo ceremonies as somehow less valid than Traditionalist ceremonies.
I have no problem with people favoring Traditionalist Latin masses and ceremonies. But, the constant attempt to attribute mythical (and almost magical) benefits from saying the rights words on the part of Traditionalists is pathetic.
How much of this is about faith and how much is simply the human desire to set themselves above others, and grabbing onto the Latin Mass as a way to signal moral superiority?
No JonJ you are pathetic and your contempt for the TLM is evident….
Canisius, I am contemptuous of TLM because I have no problems with people attending it and favoring it?
I am contemptuous of the TLM because I consider it no more “valid” than a Novus Ordo Ceremony—which, btw, is the official position of the Church’s magesterium?
Am I contemptuous because I don’t consider people who like the TLM automatically morally superior beings that gain grace from heaven because they like to say “domine” a lot?
Notice that Adolf Hitler was raised catholic, and was once an altar boy. He, presumably, attended TLM services and yet they did not prevent him from committing mass racial genocide. The attitude of seeking God that we bring to the mass, and the choices we make in life are far more important
to our moral standing with God than what mass we choose to attend. (See pope francis’ comments about atheists who perform good works being welcomed in heaven)
Do you really think changing back to TLM will suddenly make the entire culture devout? Nonsense.
Instead, the people who have a desperate need to have a tangible badge to set themselves above others will find some other “filter” to demonstrate that status. Whether it is the TLM or wearing a beanie with a propeller and learning to recite the Lord’s Prayer backward while juggling with your left hand—needy people will always find some arbitrary activity which they can use to say they are better than others.
If you like the TLM and you think it helps you connect with God, great! By all means go to TLM services. But don’t act like good people can’t go to Novus Ordo masses or that people who go to TLM are automatically morally superior.
That reveals your true reason for “liking” the TLM. It’s the same reason Satan preferred ruling in Hell over serving in Heaven.
Let’s not overlook the possibility of marrying people who have no idea we even exist. For example, find a billionaire and marry him/her, and then collect financial benefits. Let’s all marry Obama and collect his benefits.
Sounds good to me, Skai, and then let’s dump him before the consumation of the “marriage”. (Lots of laughs.)
I have jokingly suggested to my two Christian roomates that we get married on paper so we can get all the benefits the sodomites will now be given!
Dump him, sounds too mild for me. Summary Courtmartial sounds better.
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
SKAI, I like your idea. We should all marry Obama and collect HIS benefits for life.
If we “love” each other there is no moral authority to keep us from marrying many people at the same time, and no moral authority to keep us from marrying the pets that we also “love”.
After all, its our civil rights to “love” whomever and whatever we please.
Do you people really think that is funny? Would any of you be embarrassed to have President Obama’s daughters read your comments on this Catholic news site?
PA stop fretting…Obama was once heard saying that if one if his daughters were to get pregnant…that he was OK with an abortion or something like that…..how about that …can you imagine what they are feeling knowing that their dad doesn’t mind if one of his grand kids were aborted….
think before you post PA…..we see you bad will.
Abeca Christian, I agree with you that Obama’s comment that you mentioned was a horrible thing to say. It would have been better to say that he hoped that his daughters would be married before they had any children. I would hope that he would love any grand-child, no matter how conceived. I think Obama’s views are tempered by the fact that he had a disinterested father that he hardly knew.
Anony I don’t know…or maybe he is just indoctrinated in his liberals views…who knows….thanks for agreeing with me. God bless.
Obama is the one who supports abortion, and promotes sodomite marriages.
He will be portrayed to the world the way he is – a very immoral man.
Mark, I was not kidding. Pologamy, and beastiality are next. According to the “gays” – its peoples civil rights to marry those they “love” – regardless of being perverted.
That’s pretty much what Klavan was saying, MAC on PJmedia’s discussion with Bill Whittle. Both men are very smart and funny and call themselves Christians but believe that the gov’t has no say in who can marry who or what and that they’d be perfectly okay with whatever happens as long as ‘no one got hurt’. This is pretty much the feelings of ALL mainstream ‘Christian’ people. These are politically conservative views!! They’re really not much different on this issue from the most liberal sex addicts to the left of the Marquis de Sade. And they all find this utterly amusing! With the advanced methods of distributing porn, eliminating consequences of one’s choices (the innocent babies…the nobodies who aren’t ‘hurt’ by all this, the innocent children who may have been spared being aborted but whose biological parents live only for their own pleasure) the approval of tv, movies and the press, the ability to suppress dissent and silence conscience and morality will lead this country down probably one of the darkest roads ever seen in the history of man. Right now we can kill literally millions and millions of people (unless you don’t think babies are human) and consider ourselves a God-fearing country and that Hitler and Stalin were the REAL villains. We can have on-going wars that no one has the least idea why or where they’re leading us, we can force countries in Africa and Asia to accept birth control and abortion with financial blackmail, and a host of other evils that truly boggles the mind and yet we write here as though this latest activity by the court is shocking. I was raised in day and age when not one of these things was acceptable and was considered barbaric and evil. This country is already gone, to be frank… we’re just running on fumes. All China needs to do is call in her debts…all we need is for homosexuals to begins their lawsuits for supposed hate crimes…there are some here whose whining is just a prelude to this activity and waiting for their hate to be fanned into prosperity at the expense of ‘evil and hateful Christians’. All their little ducks are lining up in a row it would seem. Fortunately, we are on the winning side. As for me and my house ‘I will serve the Lord”. Each heinous act that ‘succeeds’ is searing what hope the neo-pagans may have had to live with our beautiful Lord and Savior in eternity. Can you imagine throwing that away? Sometimes I imagine what it will be like living forever in darkness and despair, utterly frozen in immobility with no recognition of a friend, no hope. I wouldn’t wish that on anyone. I think everyone who thinks homosexuality is fine should read again what Jesus says about Hell and ask themselves “Is this really worth risking my soul for all eternity?” Do you think Jesus was lying?
Yes PA we are allowed to mock our leaders, the great Obama has not outlawed that yet….
Oh, please Mark PA. If he has as much as told his daughters it is all right to kill any child they might conceive in a “mistake”, I am sure they have heard much worse from him — including to go buy contraceptives. Are you really so naive. He does not cared if he corrupts other people’s daughters by forcing the taxpayers to pay for their contraceptives, so they can have sex outside of marriage. Get real, Mark PA. He is no innocent.
Clarification: “kill by abortion”.
On the other hand, I do see what you mean Mark PA, I should not have used the word consumation, I meant it as a euphemism, but it did not come out that way. Nevertheless, this man has no respect for anyone else’s under-age daughter as he is against parental notification for under aged girls regarding abortion and contraceptives. If he wants us to respect his parental right, then our should be too.
Yes, PA; it is belly laughing funny. Obama thinks he has consumated his marriage to the nation, but in reality he has consumated it only with the gays.
Skai I have bad news for you buddy…Obama won’t marry anyone else…
Abeca, that’s good news : )
haha that’s true Skai….lol
Now that is a really depressing thought. haha Can you imagine being married to Soros? Being exposed to his spiritual halitosis is mind boggling to contemplate. It’s difficult enough to live with my own. ;o) Also, I have to say in regards to dear old tommy miles that he’d better make his martini a double if he finds this discussion amusing…but then again, maybe not as his understanding is already pushing the blotto emergency needle to danger level. ‘Warning! Warning! Aging male religious dichotomy alert! Approaching the dead zone!”
LOL
I am in stitches laughing, Dana, please do not bust my sides. For all we know TEM could be AKA Moonbeam Brown.
Well, Skai, you might find someone to marry if the other party didn’t have a say in the matter.
However, I still think “consent” is going to be a pretty important part of marriage even if same sex ceremonies are legally recognized.
@JonJ ___ MEOW! (and they say women are catty!)
@ JonJ ….. now come on….Dana is right….MEOW!
Wouldn’t have come across as so catty, were we outside this forum and was said inside of a “boys club”—like say, a poker table.
There I would not have used “marry”. It would have been said something like this, “If they did that, even Skai could get XXXX if he didn’t have to convince someone else to say “I do””.
But, looking at that again, I can see why you ladies would react that way. Sounds like something a woman might say at a baby shower about some mutually disliked rival.
LOL (ok that was funny) JonJ now I’m lost…..so how would you know what ladies say at baby showers?
Lets see…When Virgin Mary went to Visit Elizabeth to care for her during her pregnancy……..
Depending on the set of women who gather…..in a baby shower the decor was Noah’s ark…..a prayer was said before it started giving our Lord thanks for the gift of life, grace was said before everyone ate…and at the end people were given a baby’s booty with a cross in it. hmmmm I don’t know what you are talking about Jon J
OK I admit the Meow thing was well maybe not something I would have said but gotta admit Dana is funny and you kinda asked for it…..
I know many Catholics are upset that DOMA was overturned, but a reminder to all: the USA is NOT a theocracy. The USA has a secular government that must serve and protect ALL its citizens. The Catholic Church is unaffected by this court decision. Priests will NOT be obliged to perform gay marriages. Your traditional marriage is unaffected, just as in Spain, which adopted gay marriage ~6 years ago. In Barcelona, where I live, traditional religious rites of Holy Matrimony are held every day; in our neighborhood alone, there are literally thousands of baby prams on the sidewalks, and endless streams of little kids! Life will go on for Catholics, just as before.
Aaron,
How would you feel if you owned a business and were being sued by someone because you did not want to cater to their sinful ways. FYI, it is happening here in the USA!
Kenneth ~ Should an anti-Catholic business owner be able to refuse to provide services (flowers, cake etc.)for a Catholic wedding because he or she holds a religious belief that the Pope is the Antichrist?
Oh, please, most Catholics go to Catholic bakers or make their own wedding cakes.
It is putting two men or two women couples on the cake that would be offensive to them, or having to put Steve and Michael or Alice and Jane on there. If it comes to that, I suggest bakers stop decorating wedding cakes period, except for non controversial things. It is easy to get a decorating kit and add what one wants.
No Catholic I know would force a non Catholic baker to put the Ave on a cake if it was a Protestant owned bakery. We would buy the cake as is and add anything else we wanted.
Neither would I force a Jewish baker to make a distinctively Christian cake. I would go to a Christian bakery for that or decorate it on there myself. Homosexuals and Lesbians can do the same. That is just the way life is. None of us can have everything we want.
Anne T, I can’t imagine that any protestants in a bakery would take issue with baking a special cake for a Catholic occasion such as a First Communion or Confirmation. Many bakers see their work as producing works of art and it seems strange to me that any would take issue with baking cakes for Catholics. Who knows the religion of the bakers that they go to have a cake made? I would think most bakers are happy to bake cakes for happy occasions and baking them for religious occasions wouldn’t bother anyone. We are a diverse society and most people have mutual respect. A lot of the grocery stores here make cakes and their employees surely belong to various religions.
Mark PA, sometimes that is the case and sometimes it is not. Following the Golden Rule, “Do unto others as you would have them do unto you,” means that we should never force someone of another religion to go against his or her conscience. That does not mean, though, that a bishop, priest or minister does not have the right to enforced behavior in his own church. I have noticed that when a Jewish sing makes a Christmas CD, there is most often a declaimer on it that says the company and/or singer does not agree with everything on the tape. I am sure there are some Jewish singers who will not even sing Christmas songs unless they are secular holiday songs. Tennesee Ernie Ford was a Protestant singer who sang a lot of Gospels songs on the radio and television and sold tapes, and he did not sing the Ave Maria. I heard him sing it one time, but he said he would make that one exception because it was not according to his religion. What happened later in his life, I do not know. Jewish and Muslim stores do not have to serve pork unless they want to do so, there are some such as Costco who will, but there are Kosher meat markets and restaurants which I am sure do not sell it. That is their right under the freedom of religion clause, so no bakery should have to make cakes for same-sex “marriage” specifically if they do not want to do so. I am sure they would sell the cakes they usually make to anyone.
Greg Smith should businesses be compelled by the state the violate the religious beliefs???? this is where we are
Greg Smith –
The answer is “yes”. I would appreciate knowing the truth if any business was anti-Catholic, so that I could take my business elsewhere.
Why should I financially support any business that stands for the opposite of my beliefs? It’s that simple.
Kenneth, this stuff about protecting Catholic bakers is simply a side show. The Church and NOM and those opposed to marriage equality are saying that my partner and I have to suck it up every single day of our lives because the intolerant baker might be chosen on ONE of those days to bake a cake. This is just silliness, and this rhetorical device is backfiring for the Church. There were many ads cut featuring bakers and the like who didn’t want marriage because it might mean that they might have to actually BAKE, and you know what…those ads don’t really convince anyone. They can see right through how silly that is.
No YFC its not a side show… This is way the gay mafia intends to do to the rest of us… YOU WILL FORCE US TO ACCEPT YOUR PERVERSION….I promise you this… I will violently oppose you and them… BURN THE RAINBOW FLAG
Once again, Canisius, you are inciting violence. Please stop inciting violence.
Stop persecuting bakers, YFC. A cream pie in your face, dude!
LOL skai. HOnestly, I can’t imagine why someone would even want to employ a homophobic baker. It makes no sense to me.
The news on my computer a few days ago had an article about a homosexual couple who was already trying to force a Christian owned or Catholic owned bakery to make a wedding cake for them. Homosexuals and lesbians have plenty of money to start their own bakeries or go to a bakery who does make such cakes.
Right – just like when he promised that if Obamacare passed that no one would be forced to pay for abortions.
Now thanks to OBAMA’s Executive Order – all taxpayers regardless of religious beliefs will have to pay for other peoples abortions, contraceptives, voluntary sterilizations, (and eventually euthanasia).
It’s really sad when we have to take our own government to Court for our Freedom of Religion.
WHich executive order is this? I’d like to look it up.
Aaron, this is a government giving its approval to something that is harmful to the bodies of those who engage in it, rectal cancer, torn body canals, dieases, etc. when this same govenment tells us how large a coke we can buy at a time in some places because we might gain a little weight. Go figure!
NO sorry, please go back to civics lessons. The Federal government has determined through the Supreme Court that consensual private relations ought to remain private and not be the concern of governments. The NEW YORK CITY government decided that cokes ought to be limited in size. Different governments.
Civics lesson 101
Let’s all of us go to a homosexual bakery and buy cakes and then start a food fight. Isn’t that what the gays in a spiritual dimension are doing by going to Mass and receiving Holy Communion?
Skai you are right, that is what they are doing….
Google: Church Militant TV
Breaking News Special Report : Gay Roman Clergy 06-27
The obvious has now become the evidenced. There is an OT phrase for it, “temple prostitution”. This is de facto what Mahony was doing, using pervert priests to haul in money, instead of throwing them to the wolves. This is temple prostitution, where the religious authorities use sex to gain money. The details of how they do it are variable, but the fact that sex is traded one way or another for money is the game they play. Pope Francis has a reason for not settling down in the papal apartment … probably one reason is his safety, and another is to try to bring the popular forces of Catholicism to bear against the evil corruption, the smoke of satan, that infests the Vatican bureaucracy.
God gave everyone a free will. By their own actions individuals choose Heaven or Hell.
Everyone who reads posts on this web site have been told by many that the Bible and the CCC must be read and adhered to. There is no excuse of ignorance.
Jesus gave His Church (the Magisterium) the power to loose and bind on earth and in heaven. – Mt 16:18-19
Jesus said:
“Do not judge by appearances, but judge with righteous judgment” – John 7:24.
“You have rightly judged.” – Luke 7:43;
“Why do you not judge for yourselves what is right?” – Luke 12:57
For those who advocate DISOBEDIENCE and/or EVIL in their postings:
Jesus said:
” I tell you, on the day of judgment men will render account for every careless word they utter;
for by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned. ” – Mt 12:36-37.
Good post,Catherine…but will anyone listen? I feel so badly so few here really believe that the Catholic Church is the one true faith. I often feel discouraged because there’s so little genuine, honest-to-goodness conviction that being a Christian is the only way to attain salvation through Jesus Christ…it’s as though they believe that muslims and hindus are just as good and will all go to heaven anyway. With such attitudes it’s no wonder the Church is flailing about. People have lost their way. They don’t really believe!
Dana, it is clear that everyone posting on this site is NOT Catholic, but pretending to be.
Anyone who bad mouths the teachings in Holy Scripture, the CCC, or the Mass in either Ordinary or Extraordinary Form according to Church requirements is not Catholic or a Catholic heretic or schismatic.
We can not judge who will get to Heaven, and who will go to Hell since we do not know the State of their individual Souls at the immediate time of death. This is what Jesus alone judges.
I agree, MAC and that was a controversial point the pope made recently. I am basically speaking about Catholics only. Once we’ve heard the good news, we have no excuse and as we all know, Jesus told us specifically “, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.” We can blame the bishops, the Church and point the finger at everyone else, but we’re all held accountable for the way we discipline our behavior and our thoughts, what we choose to read and see, relationships we choose, causes we support etc. I encourage everyone to read this week’s column (June 30) by Fr.George Rutler on ‘Evil be thou my good’ oursaviournyc.org/pastors-corner/from-the-pastor-1
I’m finding that too often in the popular Catholic media they tend to avoid being ‘confrontational’ as I’m sure Bishop Sheen would be considered today. Oh, how I miss the straight, open talk that people used to use! I’m so utterly tired of the namby pamby pudding hearted pap we hear these days from too many ‘experts’ that are too interested in selling the next book, keeping their show on the air or getting a following or afraid of sounding judgmental to speak the hard truths. Somebody’s got to do it, for pete’s sake. There just always has to be someone willing to be like Harry Truman and say “The buck stops here.” Real leaders are as rare as hen’s teeth, though the Lord seems to raise up the right people at the right time. Blessed Bishop Sheen, pray for us!
MAC, I responded, but forgot to put my email etc. and it fell in the trash pile of cyber space. Sorry.
Dana,
Thank you for your response dear sister in Christ and thank you for Googling Church Militant TV, Breaking News Special Report: “Gay Roman Clergy.”
Michael Voris is exposing the homosexual corruption that Pope Francis spoke of. Now we even read that a priest has also been arrested for money laundering. Poor Jesus! His OWN Church is suffering the passion, a passion that is being doled out in the droves by wolves in sheep’s clothing from within. These wolves have scattered Christ’s sheep and the have harmed the faith of many. Last week the Supreme Court’s wicked decision also let’s us know how far down society our society is falling.
I copied a post from Catholic Answers. It was beautifully written at that time by a recent convert to the Catholic Faith. Dana I agree with you. It is very sobering to watch the method that the devil has used to attack Christ from within his own Church and also in society. We know that the Catholic Church is the bride of Christ and the Pillar of truth., but wolves in sheep’s clothing have worked hard to attempt to tarnish her teachings for many years. As the Church goes… the world goes. Many within the Church have completely veered away from the Wisdom of the bride of Christ. These wolves also teach that all religions are all equal as long as you say you love God. I remember a Baptist pastor asking me, “What is happening to the Catholic Church, it used to be viewed as the pillar of society?” Dana, he was sincere, yet he was shaken by the weight of the vast sex abuse scandals which are still being exposed. This Baptist pastor was not saying that other Churches were exempt from this because he knew that is not the truth either. This Baptist pastor was expressing a kind of fear and sadness for the world because the pillar of truth was being shaken to the core. We see with the recent decision of the Supreme Court that many have lost their way and this will continue as long as people reject God and remain stiff necked. This is why Sacred Scripture prepares us in Luke 18: 8 s “When the Son of Man returns, do you think that he will find faith on earth” We are being shaken right to the very core and when that pillar of truth keeps being shaken we will always return to the Core of our faith which is Jesus, Himself, truly present in the Most Holy Blessed Sacrament. Body , Blood, Soul and Divinity. Jesus founded his One. True, Catholic and Apostolic Church on earth. The Wisdom of her teachings has continued for centuries and the gates of hell will rock and rattle but the gates of hell will never prevail. Men and women will unfaithfully abandon God but God will never abandon his faithful sheep. During the coming turbulent trials our healing confidence will always come from Christ’s loving words, “Do This in Memory of Me.” This is why the devil has worked so very hard to destroy Catholic priests and how the world perceives Catholic priests. When the devil is successful in bringing down one priest, that one priest brings down thousands of souls who either lose their faith because of the actions of that priest or they listen to and follow his personal charisms and his personal lies. Make no mistake. The real target of the devil’s hate is Jesus Christ, FULLY PRESENT in the The Most Holy Blessed Sacrament and our centuries old tried and tested belief in the Real Presence will be our comfort and our strength. This test of faith, hope and trust has been going on since the early Christians in the coliseum and although Christ is allowing the purging out of the wolves, Christ and his Catholic Church will prevail today, tomorrow and always.
Here is the sweet post that I copied.
Dec 7, ’05, 2:11 pm
Donald45
Regular Member
Join Date: May 3, 2005
Posts: 647
Religion: Catholic (since 2001)
Re: Do this IN MEMORY OF ME
The earliest written account of the institution of the Eucharist is found in 1 Cor. 11:23-26. The phrase “Do this in memory of me” appears here, as well as in Luke 22:19. The Greek word (anamnasis) is the same in both cases. According to one scholarly source: “The word indicates to call back again into memory a vivid experience” (Rienecker & Rogers, Linguistic Key to the Greek New Testament, p. 426).
The important question, however, is this: What is the “this” that we are to do “in memory of Him?” In other words, what is the nature of the Eucharistic sacrifice?
What actually occurs when a priest performs “this” Eucharist in His memory? In Catholic doctrine, the term “transubstantiation” has been coined to describe what it is that we are to do “in memory of Him.”
So, we are instructed by Christ to “do” something in His memory, and this something involves the true body and blood of our Lord.
In Christ,
Don
__________________
Fides supponit rationem et transcendit eam
(“Faith supposes reason and goes beyond it”)
Tiber Swim Team ~ Class of ’01
There is more to “memory”, Catherine, than one might at first see. Let me provide an example for a moment prior to providing some official name of the phenomenon: I once had a dog who was my best friend, who had protected me three times from muggers. He grew old and died. Later that year as I was simply day dreaming and walking around the outside of my house, and came to the high wooden gate where he would always be sitting on the other side of … I looked over it and saw him, and not only that I could hear him … but what really shocked me is that I could smell him … he was real to those three senses. But mentally I knew that it he was not really there, but only in my memory. People are capable of bringing a great deal of memory into their conscience; many examples can be brought forth. The point I’m getting at is the transition from memory to reality that is made possible in the Holy Eucharist. In this process, we may or may not experience some vivid lifelike phenomenon, but through the accidents of bread and wine, Jesus moves us into a relationship with God that is not possible any other way, except perhaps martyrdom. The error of protestantism is to clip or attenuate the memory of Christ in the bread and wine, thus not allowing Christ to fulfill the nature of the sacrament. In the real Sacrament, the temporal memory is transitioned into eternity, ie an account of partial reality is made by God to transcend to the ultimate reality. There is a phrase, “already and not yet”, which means that we’re in a process of transitioning from earth to Heaven, a process that may take a lifetime. Another way to seek some comprehension of this sacrament is to abstract the essense of it from both time and space. Take away the time and space dimensions and you still have something left … that is probably about all we can ever “see” of this sacrament.
Dana I understand your concerns….we must stay strong and faithful….supporting one another in Christ. This will help us to lift up one another in the truth.
Amazing posts, Catherine, Skai and Abeca! I can’t speak for anyone else, but you’re faithfulness and love of ourLord touches my heart deeply. This is the strength and comfort that comes when brothers and sisters can openly share their faith and insights to uplift one another and strengthen those who lose their way. Any Carholic who can’t agree with what you wrote is in great spiritual danger.
Dana God bless you. Keep us in your prayers…as we do for you and all others here as well.
The gays THINK they have won? Think again! There is ONLY ONE winner, and that is GOD ALMIGHTY! HE, and ONLY HE will win! This world has it coming! God’s wrath can’t come soon enough for me! Gays, it’s God’s turn! Watch out! You lose! If His wrath isn’t in your lifetime, it will be in the next! Repent now while you can! YOU AND THE DEVIL HAVE NOT WON!
It only took a couple of days to restart homosexual marriages in California. Today, Friday two Lesbians were married by the Mayor of San Francisco. No judicial obstacles for Evil. Amazing.
The reason that the country is changing so quickly, against the teachings of the church, is very much the way the Bishops have fought the battle. If we continue to fight the battle based on contraception, sexual relations, gay marriage, etc. we will continue to lose. I seldom agree with all that Fr. Fessio say, but a recent comment by him resonated with me: “It is absolutely critical to focus on religious liberty and not on the immorality of contraception,” Fr Joseph Fessio, founder of Ignatius Press, told Aleteia. “Trying to persuade the public at large, even the subset of Catholics, that contraception is immoral is futile at this time. If that is the focus of the opposition to the HHS mandate, there is no chance of prevailing. But if can be shown that a constitutionally protected freedom is being violated—and it is—there is at least a possibility for wide public support.” I agree that we need to get off of our current war plan, and fight for our religious freedom. If we can win back our religious freedoms, the others will follow. But, it is too late to fight the fight of contraception, same sex whatever, etc. Our freedom is at stake. We need soldiers and leaders in every state house in the country, every county office building and people working the White House and Capital in DC to protect our religious freedom. If we don’t win that fight, we will lose everything.
Bob One, I completely agree.
The minimum a catholic requires from a legal system is the freedom to practice catholic faith. In fact, I think the Church has historically been too use state force to compel others to conform to catholic beliefs.
The mandate of The Great Commission is to teach the truth to the rest of the world. Seizing worldly power to compel the rest of the world to obey what we believe is God’s will is NOT part of The Great Commission (no matter what Skai thinks).
Both you men are just too much…..your ideals are flawed.
Cumbaya
Agree with what, JonJ? Bob One holds forth no firm positions, and so there is nothing that he posts that can be agreed upon.
I agree that the Church should focus its position on how its Freedom of Religion is being constrained.
This is a serious problem with the DOMA ruling. Trying to fight on basis of contraception and sexual morality in the battle for mainstream culture is butting your head against the wall. If the Church wants to turn culture more in its favor, it needs to focus on winning some cultural battles rather than continuing to invest resources mourning over battles that have been lost.
The beauty of emphasizing a “Freedom of Religion” strategy, is that public school indoctrination does support this idea. The church could use some cultural victories rather than defeats. Here is stronger ground, as well as abortion (which is increasingly seen in a negative light).
To me, the religious freedom battle is much more important. With contraception, abortion, and gay marriage ect, a faithful catholic can choose to live according to catholic values with minimal interference from government IF you have religious freedom.
It’s more important to protect that position, rather then trying to convince the state to use its power to compel the entire society to live in conformity with catholic values.
Seizing worldly power, Jon? Are you nuts? All the Catholic Church has been doing is teaching Catholics what is morally right and true. Religious freedom is a trap because it implies that it is granted from the government. Once you establish that, then it means they also have the right to take it away. The whole religious freedom issue is granting the government never before power over the Church. The government will also tell us as obama has already begun doing that all religions are equal, that there is no one religion that has all the answers and that this is not a nation based on Christian Judeo values. You’re all falling right into line with obama’s trap. Wake up. God is the only source of religious freedom…no one has the right to grant it or take it away. I’m sorry, but I think Fr. Fessio is wrong on this issue.
Nothing should be added or taken away from the constitution…we’re already protected. By agreeing that we need to make new laws to protect religious freedom means the constitution isn’t true or complete and it’s just another ploy to make inroads on devaluing and negating the constitution. Wake up people!
Dana, that’s not all the Church has been doing. When you attempt to codify religious values into law, you are tapping into the worldly power of the state. This is not always necessarily wrong, but you do need to understand that this is more than “teaching the truth”.
Law is ultimately based upon force and compulsion. In the end, statutes are enforced by SWAT teams and imprisonment (think what happens if you refuse to pay taxes). Thus, when you codify religious values into law, you are compelling people to conform to that behavior by force.
Let’s take contraception for a moment. Nearly 50 years ago, contraception was illegal in many states until Griswold vs. Connecticut. Now, that meant you were doing much more than TEACHING the truth, you’re using force to compel obedience. When the Church convinces the beast called “the state” to use its brute force in the Church’s favor, it is seizing worldly power.
Now, in some cases, state force to compel obedience is justified. But, if my neighbor decides to use contraception, that does not harm me or compel me to use contraception myself. To my mind, this is an area where the proper behavior is to win support by preaching the truth rather than persuading the state to bully the populace into conformity.
Conversely, if the state compels Catholic employers to provide and pay for contraception, now this DOES objectively harm others—because those objecting employers are prevented from practicing their faith.
To my mind, the Church should not attempt to use the wild, rutting beast that we call the state to force citizens to conform to catholic values. It should only attempt to persuade the state to make laws that allow people to CHOOSE to live in conformity to God.
That respects personal free will—which I believe is implicit in how Christ behaved while on earth. Rather than using his divine power to compel obedience to his perfect word, he instead taught the truth and allowed people to choose.
Bob One used his postings at CCD to get Barack Hussein Obama reelected. Hussein helped get US where we are today.
What??????????????????
this is too funny….
Bob One writes: “I SELDOM AGREE with all that Fr. Fessio say, but a recent comment by him resonated with me: “
Bob One, Here is what resonates in your post. Unless you meant casual conversations with Father Fessio about topics such as golf or St. Ignatius or your fidelity to the ACLU…..WHAT ???????? did that statement mean? Father Fessio accepts and upholds “all” of the teachings of the Catholic Church, so thank you for finally admitting that you seldom agree with the teachings of the Catholic Church. If my post is inaccurate then could you please clarify what specific Church teachings do you seldom agree with? That post certainly explained a lot. As far as religious liberties are concerned. CCD did post this very important story. ‘Stanford Law School launches nation’s only religious liberty clinic
Helped by Becket Fund”
JANUARY 16, 2013
We should pray for the success of this clinic which was designed with just that in mind. Defending our religious liberties.
Taken from The National Catholic Register
Stanford Inaugurates Nation’s Only Legal Clinic for Religious Freedom
Stanford’s top-rated law school already provides clinical education for its students, and, on Jan. 14, it announced the establishment of its new Religious Liberty Clinic, directed by James Sonne, a former professor of Ave Maria School of Law. During each academic term, 10 students will complete 12 weeks of “hands-on” experience representing actual plaintiffs and dealing with a range of free-exercise cases.
The Clinic’s Focus
Based at Stanford’s Mills Legal Clinic, the training program focuses on two types of cases: plaintiffs seeking “accommodation” of religious beliefs and practices and plaintiffs engaging with the public square, possibly to secure access to public facilities or obtain approval for building houses of worship.
“Real-time” cases include a prisoner who converted to Judaism and now needs permission to be circumcised and zoning approval for a mosque.
Sonne said that students will work on cases that were less likely to be entangled in partisan politics, avoiding, for example, legal challenges to the HHS mandate or free-exercise cases arising from opposition to same-sex “marriage.”
“The primary purpose of the clinic is to teach students how to practice law. Working on religious-liberty cases is a fun, exciting, dynamic and deeply human way of dealing with complex issues, personalities, fundamental principles and culture,” said Sonne, during a Jan. 13 telephone interview.
The Becket Fund for Religious Liberty has represented plaintiffs from many religious traditions, and Sonne suggested that the public interest group’s “vision fits in well with an academic environment that offers a different perspective: Whether you are representing a mosque or an evangelical church, the question is whether they have the freedom to act in accord with their conscience.”
Sonne added that the decision to select less incendiary cases for the clinic docket did not signal a retreat from a strong commitment to religious liberty: “We think that religious liberty is a natural right. The kind of cases we will handle will manifest that belief, regardless of the issue.”
Read more: https://www.ncregister.com/daily-news/stanford-inaugurates-nations-first-legal-clinic-for-religious-freedom/#ixzz2XliwE8sU
Catherine:
I suspect “religious liberty” may not always be what you think it is. Here’s the list of cases the clinic has taken on since its inception. I’ll be interested to hear which of these cases are to your liking:
* Legislative advocacy regarding a proposed statewide limitation on the possession of religious texts in California prisons. [Hint: in most cases, we’re not talking about bibles here.]
* A comprehensive evaluation for a faith-based family camp that faces religious discrimination in the use of its property.
* Negotiation for a Jewish family seeking religious instruction alternatives for their child under a California public school “release time” program.
* Agency work in California for a non-denominational church that faces zoning challenges to continuing its ministry to the homeless.
* Agency (and possible trial-level) work in Florida for an inmate who returned to his parents’ Jewish faith in prison but whose request to be circumcised has been denied.
* Agency (and possible trial-level) work in California for a Muslim inmate who was restricted in his right to wear a kufi, even though Jewish inmates wear yarmulkes without similar limitations.
* Agency (and possible trial-level) work in California for Sikh employees whose employer refused to accommodate their requests for workplace accommodation.
* Trial-level work in California state court for a mosque association with land-use challenges.
* Trial-level work in California federal court for Seventh-Day Adventist employees whose employer took adverse action against them based on their need to observe the Sabbath on Saturday.
* An amicus brief in the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Fifth Circuit for a Christian advocacy group in support of a Texas inmate’s challenge to a ban on his Native American religious practices.
* An amicus brief in the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Seventh Circuit in support of a family Bible camp project facing obstacles to construction.
* An amicus brief in the U.S. Supreme Court in support of a petition for certiorari arising from a Montana ruling forcing a small religious community to participate in the state’s workers compensation program.
“accepts and upholds”: whew, what a relief to read these words instead of “adhere”!!!
Francis,
You suspect wrong and you aware of even less. Try not to gleefully *froth* too much in your ill fated post that attempted to undermine the purpose and goal of this fine clinic.
Definition of Froth: The bubbles caused in fluids or liquors by fermentation or agitation; spume; foam; esp., a spume of saliva caused by disease or nervous excitement.
Any empty, senseless show of wit or eloquence; rhetoric without thought.
Light, unsubstantial matter.
To cause to foam.
To spit, vent, or eject, as froth.
To cover with froth; as, a horse froths his chain.
To throw up or out spume, foam, or bubbles; to foam; as beer froths; a horse froths.
Yes Francis, Your very untrue colors are shining through. It is a sign of unfaithfulness that has you frothing with a hangman’s delight. You should have known by now but you obviously don’t. Never underestimate the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart!
Antiphon. Who is she that comes forth as the morning rising, fair as the moon, bright as the sun, terrible as an army set in battle array?
“Sonne added that the decision to select less incendiary cases for the clinic docket did not signal a retreat from a strong commitment to religious liberty: “We think that religious liberty is a natural right. The kind of cases we will handle will manifest that belief, regardless of the issue.”
Catherine:
At 1333 characters, that was a “frothy” reply to my simple query. If indeed you are pleased by the range of cases the RLC has taken on, though most relate to non-Christian religious liberties and none relate directly to Catholic issues, I have underestimated you.
Francis writes, ” I have underestimated you”
Regarding this clinic Francis, you have completely underestimated the supernatural power that comes from cooperation with God and Supernatural Grace. Evil does not have God on it’s side. You have shown your lack of trust, your lack of knowledge and a terrible lack of faith in God and you are underestimating the Mother of God’s love for her children that are consecrated to her Immaculate Heart.
“In the End My Immaculate Heart Will Triumph.”
Skai,
There are certain words and certain phrases that cradle Catholics who value their faith will always love. The word adhere is one of those words and it is a good word. Certain words and certain songs takes us back not only to our sweet days of exemplary Catholic education but also to Sacred Scripture. I was just talking about this to a gentleman after Mass on Sunday. He told me that whenever he hears the song ‘Holy God We Praise Thy Name’ he tears up because it brings him back to his wonderful childhood and his memory of his good Catholic parents and good Catholic education.
Actually, the word adhere is better than to say you have accepted something. We can say that we accept the fact that we have to pay taxes but this does not mean that everyone adheres to that rule and pays their taxes.
Timothy Geithner accepted the fact that he had to pat taxes but was careless in failing to pay $34,000 in Social Security and Medicare taxes earlier this decade but declared “I have paid what I owed.” He apologized to Congress. Had Mr. Geithner “adhered” in paying his taxes he would not have been placed in hot water for all to see the hypocrisy.
We see from the turmoil within the Church that many accept the fact that the Church will never change her teachings so they do not NOT ADHERE to those teachings and create their own gospel or teachings or their own rules. We would never want a loved one to say, ” I accept the fact that I am with you.” Everyone, but most importantly Jesus would rather hear us say, ” I am adhering to you like glue.”
adhere. cling – cleave
·here verb \ad-ˈhir, əd-\
ad·heredad·her·ing
Definition of ADHERE
intransitive verb
: to give support or maintain loyalty
: to hold fast or stick by or as if by gluing, suction, grasping, or fusing
4
: to bind oneself to observance
transitive verb
Gratias. May I ask you please, is there any reason to repeat the President’s middle name, except to emphasize the Muslim influences in his life? You wouldn’t be islamaphobic by any chance would you?
If one is not a complete idiot, YFC, one is always going to be extremely suspicious and disgusted at a religion that openly condones murdering anyone not wanting to subscribe to their political agenda (I don’t say religious, because basically it is a complete political and tyrannical system that excludes philosophy or any thought processes opposed to their boxed in, evil and corrupt view of the world) I’m not surprised that you would defend them because it is all part and parcel of your worldview. I’m sure you feel no sadness or anger at the wonderful Syrian Catholic priest recently beheaded by muslims who were openly celebrating and taking videos of their savagery. I’m repelled and yes! deeply afraid of a whole belief system that promotes such terrible terrible evils. I don’t know how any woman could possibly want to be part of a society that stones a woman to death for adultery when she is raped unless she has 4 witnesses to the crime.
Though they practice sodomy frequently, you may not be aware that they do not treat open homosexuals at all well, either YFC and often subject them to death. The entire Mediterranean area was Christianized before the muslims came and civilization was far from crumbling, even though Rome’s power had been diminished by the Huns and Goths et al…but it was the muslim barbars that succeeded in destroying that culture by constant attacks on shipping…they kidnapped literally millions of Christians, especially children to be come slaves and would put them at the forefront of battlelines making Christian armies have to kill their own people to battle with the cowardly barabarians. If the Christians didn’t convert they were beheaded…something they’re still doing…especially to those who want to leave their ‘peaceful’ religion. I’m unapologetically against muslimism and have no respect for it, but only a healthy scepticism and dislike. I hope that really annoys you!
Dana, you obviously reject Deuteronomy then.
Deuteronomy 22:23-24
“If there is a girl who is a virgin engaged to a man, and another man finds her in the city and lies with her, 24 then you shall bring them both out to the gate of that city and you shall stone them [n]to death; the girl, because she did not cry out in the city, and the man, because he has violated his neighbor’s wife. Thus you shall purge the evil from among you.
I guess you don’t accept Biblical authority after all.
JonJ, notice the qualifying words that describe the “virgin” as a ho? No, you missed it because you rewrite everything into your own preconceived strawman pieces.
Dana, Islam defines sodomy not by the act but by the participants. This is a system we call hypocritical.
JonJ that is horrible how you used that scripture passage to try to corner Dana….Are you forgetting that Dana is Catholic, who follows Christ, Jesus came and was done with those severe punishments. But sin is still sin, wrong is still wrong.
That is why the church has confession. It’s foolish, your argument is one that many who want to dissent will use. For instance even in biblical times they did ask to kill those who committed sodomy….of course we know that we won’t do that because we follow Christ but we know that through those passages how our Lord did not approve of those impure sins. Be grateful that Jesus saved us and He is more merciful to give mankind time to repent…..praise God for the sacraments……you were trying to prove a point that in a way is irrational to me, of course Dana knows better,,,,,She is confirmed in the Holy Ghost and is lead by the faith. We all try to but some struggle more but telling from her many posts….she is headed on the right track.
Like in the old testament God’s people couldn’t eat pigs and other foods but with Jesus in the new testament we are allowed to eat pigs etc. Don’t insult Dana’s intelligence, I know she understands better than you would have her. PEACE. PAX
Sorry Jon, but that old chestnut won’t get a rise out of me…such specious reasoning is not worth using up the cyberspace. ;o)
I would strongly recommend that you go to lifesite news, however, and read how Russia has just outlawed giving any homosexual materials to children, has outlawed homosexual parades, and a huge fine and imprisonment to any who desecrate Church property or use hate speech against the Church. I would say the Fatima consecration was authentic.
YFC.. are you PC Thug by any chance
Thanks Abeca, sister in Christ. This is off the subject but I really do feel bad for Jon’s experiences in his early school years. Kids can be so cruel and scar us for life. The thing Jon and Canisius and so many others need to remember is that forgiveness is the answer. We only hurt ourselves when we hold on to anger and grudges. “Forgive us OUR trespasses as WE forgive those who trespass against us.” Also, I knew what YFC”s response would be to my post about muslims…with the superior pompous tone of one who is talking to a mental incompetent…I know all the tedious ploys used by liberals to appear ever so knowledgeable and the rest of us are so inferior. I sincerely regret that they create this barrier to communication because it only serves to further alienate them from humility and common sense. It’s like putting one more stone in the wall that separates us from growing emotionally and spiritually. I admit my weakness and errors…I won’t deny I know very little about the world. ( and to be frank, I don’t think most of here do) But I am smart enough to listen to people with great knowledge about certain topics, and one of them is the deadly effect of Islam on Christians and Western culture…something that I feel liberals are ignorant of to the point of utter imbecility. God bless you Abeca, and all who post here. Lord have mercy on us!
Thank you Dana,
The shame is truly on the homosexual lobbyists who will often refer to themselves as fellow Catholics but they seek to undermine the teachings of the Catholic faith. YFC is a homosexual lobbyist who now defends the religion of Islam. YFC does not defend the Teachings of the Catholic Church. The reason for this is he does not accept the teachings of the Catholic Church regarding homosexuality. Homosexuals are executed with the cooperation of their corrupt governments in many Islamic countries. This truly points out the very disordered logic and thinking of YFC’s many posts. YFC claims to be a professor. How illogical for a homosexual lobbyist professor to teach students to support countries that sanction the murdering of other homosexuals. Is YFC just a troublemaking troll who stands for nothing?
Please pray for the family of the Catholic priest who was murdered by jihadi activists.
“Syrian Catholic priest Francois Murad killed last weekend by jihadi fighters was beheaded, according to a report by Catholic Online which is linking to video purportedly showing the brutal murder.
As TheBlaze reported last week, Murad, 49, was setting up a monastery in Gassanieh, northern Syria. Last Sunday, on the Christian leader’s Sabbath, extremist militants trying to topple President Bashar Assad breached the monastery and grabbed Murad.
While earlier reports suggested Murad may have been shot to death, Catholic Online reported Saturday: “The Vatican is confirming the death by beheading of Franciscan Father, Francois Murad, who was martyred by Syrian jihadists on June 23.”
Dear Dana. Dear Catherine.
1) Islam in most parts of the world does not condone murdering non-believers.
2) Barack Obama is not a Muslim. He is a Christian.
3) Thanks again for the slams, ad hominems, and false insults against me. I just want you to know that calumny is a sin.
YFC is a professor?? And he recently revealed that he, in his field of genetics, had never heard the term “gene pooling” … where are these people educated, anyway? Please do not tell me that it’s in Catholic schools.
I can’t remember where I read it Catherine, but someone wrote that rather than pray for Fr Murad he was going to pray to him to pray for us, that he died a martyr for the faith. I pray I will attain faith like that! We’re so blessed to be part of a family that shows what true holiness is. Thanks for sharing that and being such a support. Abeca’s quotes were really good too! I loved Bishop Sheens quote on right and wrong, especially.
YFC I have been to Muslim countries and will tell you that you do not want to be a Christian in Muslim country and you certainly dont want to be gay…LOL
Professor YFC writes,
Dear Dana. Dear Catherine. ” Islam in most parts of the world does not condone murdering non-believers.”
Response: Run students!….Run! Ask for an immediate refund!
Health › Diseases
HALLUCINATIONS VS. DELUSIONS
“Hallucinations are false or distorted sensory experiences that appear to be veridical perceptions. These sensory impressions are generated by the mind rather than by any external stimuli, and may be seen, heard, felt, and even smelled or tasted.
A delusion is a false belief based on incorrect inference about external reality that is firmly sustained despite what almost everybody else believes and despite what constitutes incontrovertible and obvious proof or evidence to the contrary. The belief is not one ordinarily accepted by other members of the person’s culture or subculture (e.g., it is not an article of religious faith).
A hallucination occurs when environmental, emotional, or physical factors such as stress, medication, extreme fatigue, or mental illness cause the mechanism within the brain that helps to distinguish conscious perceptions from internal, memory-based perceptions to misfire. As a result, hallucinations occur during periods of consciousness. They can appear in the form of visions, voices or sounds, tactile feelings (known as haptic hallucinations), smells, or tastes.
Delusions are a common symptom of several mood and personality-related mental illnesses, including schizoaffective disorder, schizophrenia, shared psychotic disorder, major depressive disorder, and bipolar disorder. They are also the major feature of delusional disorder. Individuals with delusional disorder suffer from long-term, complex delusions that fall into one of six categories: persecutory, grandiose, jealousy, erotomanic, somatic, or mixed.”
Come on Skai, you got completely refutiated by many posters in your notion of gene pooling. The Reference you gave then to gene pooling doesn’t even contain the word.
YFC:
This discussion has degraded to the point of coming unglued from reality. To your points:
1) You are obviously a Muslim, therefore your statements about Islam are not relevant.
2) Obama’s religion is not your business. And anyway, Bob One warped the elections by duping Vatican II Catholics into voting for him.
3) You’re welcome. Calumny is not a sin if directed against somebody who really deserves it. And it isn’t even calumny if committed by those who don’t understand what “calumny” means.
4) Bonus comment: If professors like you weren’t hiding the Truth about genetics, a Google search on “gene pooling” would return a lot of results, rather than re-directing to the gay-friendly term “gene pool”. You and your cabal of Google-istas obvously hacked all occurrances of “gene pooling” and replaced all 30,800,000 of them with “gene pool,” an well-known code name for “Google empirical new-age extreme-dissident promoters of orthodox liberation.”
Stay cool during the heat wave!
LOL Francis. If I weren’t a god-hating socialist muslim liar-sodomite, I might even have looked forward to celebrating the Fourth of July. Instead I’m just going to play with my rubber bands which I use every day to twist the words of Jesus into something resembling a compassionate teacher whose love was so deep that he gave his own life so that we might live.
Here it is again, YFC: Google up “gene pooling” and the first entry is Wikipedia: “The gene pool is the set of all genes, or genetic information, in any population, usually of a particular species. This also proves to be the basic level at which evolution occurs.” So, whatever you’re saying only demonstrates why you don’t get a lot of obvious things, denial; you see something that is clearly obvious to almost all people and you deny it. I had a dear beloved uncle who did that: He was a body builder, a cryptic steroid user, had apparently lost a great deal of the strength normal to his build, and flatly told me that what I had just lifted while he was watching per my request was not what I lifted … I counted the weights for him but he refused to take note. Also, my late father who was not afflicted with any bizarre issues, would from time to time deny what was right before his eyes: the common denominator is what the Church demonstrated centuries ago by denying science … vanity. Gays are noted for their vanity, YFC. Lose your gay dimension (Jesus says “deny yourself, pick up your cross and follow” Him), YFC and your science will become real instead of an imitation you cop from other sources, and filter in bizarre ways. You can do it if you can muster the guts, ie the faith in Christ, YFC.
For those readers who don’t know, gene pooling is what dog breeders do, what any animal or plant breeders do, what humans do when they pool up traits in a population that are different from corresponding traits in another population. The three classic examples are: Christmas Island people, European “blue blood” aristocrats, and the “bird head” people from Appalachia. You can also read about it in the story of Jacob in the Old Testament, and then also in the story of Noah, whose sons went in three geographic directions roughly corresponding to the three major races … Race is a result of gene pooling, even according to the current evolution theories. So, for YFC to say that he, a geneticist, has never heard of it boggles the mind. But I ran into professors in my long university life who were afflicted with various and sundry incredible blindnesses and denials. The Church, which is perhaps the most notorious of examples, denied Gallileo’s science: What the problem is, is that science is rational, explained with logical argument and only a bigot can deny it. Yes, the Church at that time was bigoted to the point of self induced blindness to natural law, nature and the study of nature … get this, even after three and a half centuries of studying how to reason things out taught by St Thomas Aquinas. We have the same problem now in the hierarchy of the Church … yes, bigots … fools who refuse to believe in Christ and prefer to believe in the gay idol, the money idol, the stupid idol and the pervert idol. The Pope wants us to get them outta there, and has asked us how to do it. At least YFC has stepped up to represent the bigot hierarchy and so we can explore ways to get him out of the pit he is snared in.
Beware of those who’ve jumped into the shallow end of the gene pool.
Right on, especially since Bob One’s middle name is “Minion”.
The Pope told the bishops to practice what they preach, and the Pope Emeritus told them to become holy; so why do you incessantly drivel away with irrelevant minutia? All you’re really preaching is Freudianism, in which you’re trapped. Become holy and get free of that delusional seduction garbage.
Mortal sin is mortal sin – no matter what society says or does.
Mortal sin is mortal sin – no matter how corrupt politicians, judges or society is.
When Bishops teach according to Holy Scripture, and the CCC they are doing their jobs. Their job is to Save Souls.
You should never criticize them for preaching about mortal sin.
This is when they are doing God’s work.
Bishops themselves however should not be involved in politics, through their Bishops conferences or themselves. This is the role of the Laity (whom they should property teach to have a Catholic conscience).
Bishops and Priests should teach the Laity very effectively and also encourage Church members to be active in politics, in education and every aspect of society to promote a sound and moral society.
Christ involved himself in politics and so did Saints Peter and Paul; Maddie, Jesus said clearly to go and disciple the nations … now how would this be done without the bishops involving themselves in politics? Get real. Stop grazing in the weird fields of fantasy, namely the false idea that the first amendment says separation of church and state. Even if it does, it is not a magisterial doctrine, but a secular proto example of Vatican II speek.
Bob One, the birth control pill is a carcinogen (cancer causing). It is helping to kill women by cancer and other medical problems. I doubt Fr. Fessio said that, but if he did bishops and priests would be wrong if they did not speak out about the dangers of the Pill. Also, it is an abortifacient (causes an abortion) at times. I would have been dead over twenty years ago if I had taken the garbage.
By the way, Pope Francis is a master chemist who taught chemistry in Argentina. He is against the Birth Control Pill. He should know about its bad effects if anyone does.
I agree with Pio, Skai and dana…you guys are realaly taking Jon J to the woodhsed!…this guy is definitely NOT catholic!
You are Really God’s Little Child
My poor child, how short this life on earth is! It is always an unfinished symphony. Do you realize your home is elsewhere?
Why do you continue to cling to the things of the earth?
The other life is tomorrow. Are you not longing to see Me?
To know Me better? Ask Me for this desire.
I can give you everything you lack. You don’t ask. Above all do not be afraid of wearying Me or annoying Me. You are my little child. Nothing that concerns you ever tires Me….Don’t be afraid then. Just ask. Yearn for Me. Call yourself: God’s little child…it will give you a new feeling.
I have to agree with Bob One and JonJ regarding the following –
Because many US Bishops have refused to do their own jobs – by not teaching everyone to read Holy Scripture, the CCC, and the Code of Canon Law, there are many practicing Catholics who do not know their Faith.
These same Bishops have not been teaching about MORTAL SIN, and the consequences of HELL for the unrepentant.
These same Bishops refuse to excommunicate those Catholics who commit scandal and are obstinate in mortal sin (Canon 915 & 1399). This puts
these Bishops in a situation of aiding a abetting the sinful by the sin of omission or commission.
This is why there is so much: SACRILEGE, SCANDAL, HERESY, SCHISM, RELATIVISM and DISOBEDIENCE within the Church today. Too many people are simply doing their own thing – whatever that may be.
Souls are being lost.
Catholics are Voting for evil politicians who appoint evil judges and evil administrators who believe as they do.
It is the job of the Laity to affect laws by their voting power. When people are weak in their Faith or do not know their Faith – they fail and do not have a “Catholic” conscience.
However BobOne and JonJ – NEVER, NEVER, NEVER tell any Bishop or Priest or Lay person to TOLERATE sin of any kind, especially the MORTAL SINS of abortion, contraception, euthanasia, embryonic stem cell research, voluntary sterilization and the MORTAL SEXUAL SINS of adultery, fornication, homosexual acts, pornography, and masturbation,
It is each Bishops’ job to teach and includes educating about MORTAL Sins.
And they are right stating that we should not have to violate our Religious beliefs by paying for these mortal sins committed by others.
Let everyone pay for their own sinful behavior.
Again Bishops and Priests must start teaching within their own Diocese, not by writing to Congress. Christ never intended them to be a Lobbying group.
Because NY, CA and some other Bishops have caved in to Union demands to pay for contraception and other mortal sins at the State level within their own Diocese, it seems to me that they have some cleaning up to do.
Get the log out of your own eye. Stop spending Faithful Catholics money for immoral purposes through employee insurance plans.
According to a CBS report, the bells of the National Cathedral and several other churches in Washington rang continuously for 45 minutes to an hour in celebration of the Supreme Court decision regarding same sex marriage. Mercifully, the bells of the Catholic Basilica remained silent…..
For those interested the National Cathedral is an Episcopal Church located in Washington, D.C.
The Episcopal Church of today violates teaching in the Bible including that of sodomy (same-sex marriage), much like their founder King Henry the 8th started the Episcopal Church so he could commit adultery with 6 different known women.
PooS, Please note I didn’t condemn Muslim people as they are made in the image of God, love their families, promote living virtuous lives etc. and I have personally known some really great Muslim people. I am as usual guilty of generalizing about the religion itself that has and is brought so much pain and suffering into the world. The murder of Armenians at the beginning of the 20th century by Muslims simply because they were Christian is a prime example and what is taking place daily around the world (the genocides against Christians and other peaceful groups in Africa by Muslims) is a prime example. The huge protest going on in Egypt show that peace living Muslims are sick and tired of the repression and subjugation of a cruel regime fostered by Barack Hussein Obama as many banners in the protest pint out! Hence my long roundabout way of defending the use of the middle name of B. Hussein Obama .
Correction, Dana: Adam and Eve were made in the image of God; the rest of us were not, but were made following the Fall, and thus were made only in a semblance of the image of God. In other words, everyone other than Adam and Eve has a belly button.
Pps. Sorry for all the typos! My iPhone is not good for this .
The typos may not be yours, Dana, but derive from govt agents monitoring your iPhone (I can only hope here that YFC, JonJ, et al take me seriously on this, and launch another attack :)
haha. I hadn’t considered that those chicken hearts at the NSA are causing me to ‘fowl’, Skai!
From the Nat’l Review, dated April 7, 2012 by Andrew McCarthy…
In October 2010, on the eve of the Islamic revolution that the media fancies as “the Arab Spring,” the Supreme Guide of the Muslim Brotherhood called for jihad against the United States.
You might think that this all but unnoticed bombshell would be of some importance to policymakers in Washington. It was not. It is not. This week, the Obama administration quietly released $1.5 billion in foreign aid to the new Egyptian government, now dominated by a Brotherhood-led coalition in parliament — soon to be joined by an Ikhwan (i.e., Brotherhood) luminary as president.
It is not easy to find the announcement. With the legacy media having joined the Obama reelection campaign, we must turn for such news to outlets like the Kuwait News Agency. There, we learn that, having dug our nation into a $16 trillion debt hole, President Obama has nevertheless decided to borrow more money from unfriendly powers like China so he can give it to an outfit that views the United States as an enemy to be destroyed.
Tertullian
“[A]ll other frenzies of the lusts which exceed the laws of nature, and are impious toward both [human] bodies and the sexes, we banish, not only from the threshold but also from all shelter of the Church, for they are not sins so much as monstrosities” (Modesty 4 [A.D. 220]).
Cyprian of Carthage
“[T]urn your looks to the abominations, not less to be deplored, of another kind of spectacle. . . . Men are emasculated, and all the pride and vigor of their sex is effeminated in the disgrace of their enervated body; and he is more pleasing there who has most completely broken down the man into the woman. He grows into praise by virtue of his crime; and the more he is degraded, the more skillful he is considered to be. Such a one is looked upon—oh shame!—and looked upon with pleasure. . . . Nor is there wanting authority for the enticing abomination . . . that Jupiter of theirs [is] not more supreme in dominion than in vice, inflamed with earthly love in the midst of his own thunders . . . now breaking forth by the help of birds to violate the purity of boys. And now put the question: Can he who looks upon such things be healthy-minded or modest? Men imitate the gods whom they adore, and to such miserable beings their crimes become their religion” (Letters 1:8 [A.D. 253]).
“Oh, if placed on that lofty watchtower, you could gaze into the secret places—if you could open the closed doors of sleeping chambers and recall their dark recesses to the perception of sight—you would behold things done by immodest persons which no chaste eye could look upon; you would see what even to see is a crime; you would see what people embruted with the madness of vice deny that they have done, and yet hasten to do—men with frenzied lusts rushing upon men, doing things which afford no gratification even to those who do them” (ibid., 1:9).
Basil the Great
“He who is guilty of unseemliness with males will be under discipline for the same time as adulterers” (Letters 217:62 [A.D. 367]).
“If you [O, monk] are young in either body or mind, shun the companionship of other young men and avoid them as you would a flame. For through them the enemy has kindled the desires of many and then handed them over to eternal fire, hurling them into the vile pit of the five cities under the pretense of spiritual love. . . . At meals take a seat far from other young men. In lying down to sleep let not their clothes be near yours, but rather have an old man between you. When a young man converses with you, or sings psalms facing you, answer him with eyes cast down, lest perhaps by gazing at his face you receive a seed of desire sown by the enemy and reap sheaves of corruption and ruin. Whether in the house or in a place where there is no one to see your actions, be not found in his company under the pretense either of studying the divine oracles or of any other business whatsoever, however necessary” (The Renunciation of the World [A.D. 373]).
No more words need to be spoken the Doctors of our church have spoken….we need to stand firmly. We will face what we have to face, this wicked world will only entertain it’s desires but we must still remain loyal and faithful to our Lord and not sell ourselves short. No insults just the truth quoted by precious saints.
Augustine
“[T]hose shameful acts against nature, such as were committed in Sodom, ought everywhere and always to be detested and punished. If all nations were to do such things, they would be held guilty of the same crime by the law of God, which has not made men so that they should use one another in this way” (Confessions 3:8:15 [A.D. 400]).
The Apostolic Constitutions
“[Christians] abhor all unlawful mixtures, and that which is practiced by some contrary to nature, as wicked and impious” (Apostolic Constitutions 6:11 [A.D. 400]).
Bishop Sheen once said about right and wrong – “Right is right, even if no one is right. Wrong is wrong, even if everyone is wrong.”
St. Thomas: “Just as the ordering of right reason proceeds from man, so the order of nature is from God Himself: wherefore in sins contrary to nature, whereby the very order of nature is violated, an injury is done to God, the Author of nature. Hence Augustine says (Confess. iii, 8): ‘Those foul offenses that are against nature should be everywhere and at all times detested and punished, such as were those of the people of Sodom, which should all nations commit, they should all stand guilty of the same crime, by the law of God which hath not so made men that they should so abuse one another. For even that very intercourse which should be between God and us is violated, when that same nature, of which He is the Author, is polluted by the perversity of lust.’ “