The following comes from a July 3 story in the Napa Valley Register.
The Diocese of Sacramento has canceled the appearance of Robert Spencer, a controversial writer about the threat of Islam, at St. Stephen the First Martyr Parish — but Spencer is still scheduled to speak at the conference being put on by the Napa-based Kolbe Academy Home School.
The Northern California Catholic Family Home School Conference, taking place July 26 and July 27, has been moved to a new location, said Mary Rowles, director of the Kolbe Academy Home School program.
The conference will still take place in Sacramento but not on church property, Rowles said. She declined to provide more details.
“I’m not sure I’m ready to disclose the new location just yet,” Rowles wrote in an email to the Napa Valley Register.
Robert Spencer is the director of Jihad Watch, a controversial blog that focuses on terrorism and violence committed by Muslims. He has also written several books, including The Politically Incorrect Guide to Islam (and the Crusades) and Religion of Peace? Why Christianity Is and Islam Isn’t.
On Tuesday, Spencer said he was “saddened” by the bishop’s decision to rescind his invitation to St. Stephen’s, but he was pleased that Kolbe Academy had “not caved in” to the pressure to completely remove him from the conference.
In the 1990s, Spencer served as the director of Kolbe Academy’s national home school program. He also taught history, literature and religion at the Napa school.
The Kolbe Academy Home School program is a separate legal entity, with separate management, from Kolbe Academy & Trinity Prep — the pre-K-12 school located off Redwood Road.
Spencer plans to speak about classical and Ignatian education at the upcoming conference.
St. Stephen’s is a parish within the Diocese of Sacramento and is subject to Bishop Jaime Soto.
Spencer’s writings about Islam — particularly on his blog — have stirred up controversy around the globe. Jihad Watch was recently cited by the British government as a reason not to allow Spencer into the United Kingdom. A letter from the U.K.’s Home Office stated that Jihad Watch has been “widely criticized for being Islamaphobic” and that Spencer also co-founded the groups Freedom Defense Initiative and Stop Islamization of America, which have both been described as “anti-Muslim hate groups.”
In his defense, Spencer told the Register that there is “nothing hateful or false” about his work.
“My work is dedicated to defending the freedom of speech, the freedom of conscience, and the equality of rights of all people before the law,” Spencer wrote. “My work is factual and I stand ready to defend any assertion I’ve made in 12 books, hundreds of articles, and thousands of blog posts.”
To read original story, click here.
I bet CAIR had their dirty little hands all over this and Bishop Soto gave in to their demands to cancel Mr. Spencer. Funny how the religion of peace can put such fear into many people. The only thing Mr. Spencer does is tell the truth about Islam on his website Jihad Watch. Pray for Mr. Spencer
Actually, Janek, it’s been discovered by arab language spelling authorities that what had been thought to be ‘the religion of peace’ was in reality the ‘religion of pieces’. They apologized profusely for the error and suggested that all new translations of the koran now contain the updated spelling. Though translations of the koran are not accepted as authentic by muslimites they protest that they only come in peace, not in pieces and that they only break things up, such as heads and whole countries, when these vile infidels aren’t living by the koran. heh heh
Maybe now many of you who criticized those of us who tried to warn you about Soto will now listen to what many of us have to say.
I believe Spencer is a Catholic! If so, he will need many prayers to stay such after a “shepherd” has treated him so badly in the name of Allah!
Does Soto serve the Trinitarian God, or does he by his cowardice and acquiescence serve the Moon God Allah of Islam. I think we have a right to an answer to that question. As I knew him here in the Diocese of Orange, he served the God of accommodation and dialogue. He even praised two pro-abortion, pro-sodomite Democrat politicos as they spoke in an Orange County “Catholic” church and that I believe that same day appeared with a pro-life group. By my understanding, that describes a hypocrite and not a true shepherd. I believe we were warned of “Raven wolves!”
By the way, we Catholics in Orange County were just fed a story of a female who has had her breast removed, has a girlfriend, and is hoping to eventually have a fake penis installed. I say fake, because it is nothing more than a tube attached to her lower female organ (I don’t know if the clinical term would be acceptable on this Site), and it is hoping to adopt some poor children. I don’t say poor because of their finances but because of what they will be subjected to by it and the idiot female who hopes to marry it. What is worse is that their parish “priest” thinks all of this is wonderful and allowed it to be confirmed! Does anyone really wonder why the Novus Ordo church is losing so many souls?
Some will criticize me for calling it “it”, what else should I call it?
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
Lets send letters to Bishop Soto with charity….letting him know how disappointed we are in his decision. I don’t know why our Catholic church bend over backwards to please outside forces. It is really scandalous. So much confusion it brings forth.
A few years ago when my papa just had passed, we had a friend of one of our relatives come with them to our dad’s memorial dinner. The young woman announced to us that she use to be Catholic and was soon to enter into the Muslim religion….it was my dad’s memorial dinner and I only said a few words to her to let her know that she was making a big mistake.
This Bishop’s job is to help bring souls to Christ, his actions on this only show the opposite and it is very sad to say the least. God have mercy on us all.
What parish was this?
We do have some priests that make you wonder why they bothered becoming one. How about a priest saying he never heard of the Sins that Cry to Heaven for Vengeance or having a holy water fight on the altar or having more of a Baptist healing service during a Sunday Mass.
It’s enough to make you cry…..
Keep up the loudly vocal fight faithful Catholics in Calif. Look at Nigeria! The radical muslims just slaughtered 30 Christian Children, burning many ALIVE ! It’s alright for them to be Christian-phobic, to kill our unarmed soldiers at Fort Hood, to Kill thousands on 9-11, to kill & cripple in Boston, to BEHEAD a Priest in Syria.
The Soto’s Gomezes are WRONG & must be replaced!
Whoa…I think it is conjecture to know what the Bishops’ intentions were here (the scripture is quite clear that we should not pretend to know others’ intent–I respectfully and humbly submit that you could be wrong.) Remember Christ ate with sinners and was criticized by the Jewish leaders for being a traitor and imposter for doing so. Divisiveness and finger pointing does not preach the gospel (the scripture also warns us that a ‘party spirit’ (“us and “them”) is not of the Holy Spirit but the contrary spirit–you and I know that divide and conquer is the devil’s way. We have to be careful: you could be bearing a false witness against our Bishop unwittingly, my brother in Christ. Christ walked amongst all the people and preached and taught–is it possible you see accommodation in him when there is just a man doing his job as Christ and the Holy Spirit are calling him? I hope you will take this to prayer and discernment.
Most readers may not know that St. Stephen the First Martyr is a parish staffed by the FSSP with a large and vibrant contingency of traditional Catholics.
PJB,
What you wrote above is why many good priest have decided to go Independent rather than serve a hypocrite bishop!
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
I am sure CAIR had nothing to do with it. There are plenty of Catholics in the diocese who are so politically correct the Bishop would cave into or perhaps the bishop himself is pc when it comes to the truth about Islam. These days nothing surprises me except for a Bishop teaching and protecting the faith against the wolves and false teachers. Most bishops have no spine in defending the faith but they get all worked up when a Catholic speaker speaks the truth. Very sad state of affairs. The holy Father is concern with the type of car the clergy drive? I get what he means but he should be more concern with removing the homoheresy mafia/lobby out of the Church. When that is taken care of by all means go after the clergy who drive Mercedes and Lexus SUV’s. I will take a wild guess that once you remove this “lobby” the percentage of luxury car driving clergy lowers dramatically.
The good Bishop should be shamed for allowing, or disallowing such goings-on. Bobby Spencer is a hero; the ravenous IslamoRadicals are in control of the faith because they will kill you if you buck them.
Shame on you, good Bishop.
John Siple
I wish Bishop Soto cared enough to stop scandal and sacrilege within his own Diocese – by enforcing Canons 915 and 1399. Being the Bishop of Sacramento – there are plenty of CA “Catholic” politicians who could use his teaching, correction, and discipline.
He has nothing about reading the Bible or the CCC at home, either
Catholics should never be afraid of TRUTH.
When I updated my US Passport, I was told to take off my small cross for my picture – per the US State Department due to the laws of some Muslim countries, and I could be arrested. (I have no intention of ever going to a Muslim country, but that did not matter.)
US State Dept web site:
Saudi Arabia ” The government prohibits the public practice of religions other than Islam. Non-Muslims suspected of violating these restrictions have been jailed. ”
” Standards of Conduct and Religious Police: Islam is the official religion of the country and pervades all aspects of life in Saudi Arabia. Public display of non-Islamic religious articles such as crosses and Bibles is not permitted. Non-Muslims are forbidden to travel to Makkah (Mecca) and Medina, the cities where two of Islam’s holiest mosques are located.
Norms for public behavior in Saudi Arabia are extremely conservative, and the Commission on Promotion of Virtue and the Prevention of Vice (CPVPV), the religious police (referred to colloquially as the Mutawwa or Al-Hay’a), are charged with enforcing these standards on behalf of the CPVPV. Mutawwa are required to carry special identification and usually are accompanied by uniformed police; however, in some cases they have detained persons without police presence.”
I agree
Gee, can’t insult Islam can we? After all, they worship the same God we Catholics do, right?
Blessed John Paul II’s encylical only said that the Muslims PROFESS to worwhip the God of Abraham. It was very carefully worded not to say that they actually did so. As Robert Spencer wrote in his book, “Not Peace but a Sword”: “Although the Church affirms that Catholics and Muslims worship the same God, obviously this does not mean that we believe in the same God in every particular.” Deacon or Fr. Spencer is quite right about that. I find he is not “kooky” but just not so stupid to be unwary of many of their intentions. Also, the Coptic Christian websites are a good place to keep up on what is happening to Christians in Egypt. One Coptic priest was recently murdered by jihadists.
The word should be “worshipped” in my second line instead of “worwhip”. Sorry.
let us not forget a few years ago these extremest Muslim’s also beheaded a bishop!
Anne, We Catholics do not worship the same God, our God is a Triune God and Jesus is the Second Person of that Trinity. I have been very disturbed by some of John Paul’s and Francis’s statements and actions when it comes to the “Religion of Piece (Peace)! Francis even apologized to the local Immam and held a “Mass of Atonement” for Pope Benedict’s true statements he made in Germany about the Moslems!
Anne the priest was a Franciscan and he was beheaded with a kitchen knife, so was another Catholic with him!
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
Kenneth, the Muslims are monotheistic, worshipping one God. That is basically what Blessed John Paul II and Pope Benedict were saying. Nevertheless, their God is different from even the God of the Old Testament as the Israelites called God “Father”, and no good Muslim would ever call God father. Their God is a total dictator. Their theology is very “Calvinistic” in the sense of its teaching on predestination. Some Muslims might have moderated it when in contact with Catholics and other Christians.
Kenneth Fisher, I cannot find where you asked the question, but Robert Spencer is a Melkite Greek Catholic. Also, some are saying the Catholic priest was shot. There were three men who were beheaded with a medium sized knife, though, and one did look like Fr. Murad. So there seems to be some confusion there.
I’m greatly disappointed…how often we have pro-gay speakers and nothing is cancelled but this speaker is actually one that does speak the truth about Islam and here we have crookedness and his talks is cancelled. This is truly a disappointment!
Abeca, exactly! The Sacramento Diocese is in thrall by political correctness with support for Islam as well as Sodomy (whoops, bad word, although accurate). At some of the political ecumenical events in recent years, there is even an imam reading from the Koran. Would Jesus have found this acceptable? Based on my own observations from back in 1989 to the present, the Diocese bureaucrats and other libs are always at the ready to complain about traditional Latin Mass attendees . They are also ready to beat up on pro-life Catholics as well. It’s a sad Diocese – but then most of them are since Social Justice tenets as determined by the California bishops conference has replaced the Ten Commandments in what Catholics in the pew must follow.
I have no choice but to travel up in those areas soon and I hope to sprinkle holy water as I pass these areas and San Francisco…..God have mercy and protect us.
I agree what Skai kept saying when he said that our previous Pope kept asking his bishops to be holy. Skai is right to remind us readers the importance of holiness:
“Holiness must have a philosophical and theological foundation, namely, Divine truth; otherwise it is sentimentality and emotionalism. Many would say later on, ‘We want religion, but no creeds.’ This is like saying we want healing, but no science of medicine; music, but no rules of music; history, but no documents. Religion is indeed a life, but it grows out of truth, not away from it. It has been said it makes no difference what you believe, it all depends on how you act. This is psychological nonsense, for a man acts out of his beliefs. Our Lord placed truth or belief in Him first; then came sanctification and good deeds. But here truth was not a vague ideal, but a Person. Truth was now lovable, because only a Person is lovable. Sanctity becomes the response the heart makes to Divine truth and its unlimited mercy to humanity.”
― Fulton J. Sheen, Life of Christ
I’m keeping my word….sprinkling holy water tomorrow…Praise Be Jesus Christ…pray for the conversion of all sinners…
No big surprise our brethren are being persecuted by Muslims in the middle east, but Our so called Shepherds can’t even bear to listen to the Truth of what is Islam is and has been for the past 1400 years
The North American bishops are treating Islam a great deal like MANY (BUT NOT ALL) Germanic bishops before World War II.The motto, “If we can just get along, all will be well” has NOTHING TO DO WITH Christianity. If Western civilization followed this silly maxim, Spain and most of Europe would have remained Moslem territories. Because we are baptized into the Catholic faith (the only true faith founded by God), we are members of the Church Militant. As a result of our baptism, we have to constantly rage battle against the world, the flesh and the devil. Our Lord told us to be as innocent as doves, but as wise as wolves. It is wisdom to stay away from those who will harm our precious faith. By bending over backwards to the Moslems, we are betraying our faith, and encouraging these non-Christians to eventually enslave us.. A holy Sister who taught me in grammar school said, ‘It’s not want you stand for, but what you fall for.’ These words will haunt those who wish to placate the Moslems, while weakening the defense of the Catholic Church, and the eventual destruction of Western (Christian) civilization.
I could not agree with you more, Fr Karl, and I find it so ironic that the people most concerned with appeasement and political correctness regarding islam are invariably liberal and pro-same sex marriage, et al. , the very people that are held in such contempt and disgust in muslim countries. I think of little Hansel being fattened up in the witch’s house in readiness for her main meal. Everyday she would check his finger to see if he was fat enough yet. I suspect the muslims monitor the readiness of the plump victims-to-be (aka Americans) on a regular basis, and when the time is ripe the trusting, gullible flawns will fall like fat, juicy plums into muhamet’s little basket, and heads will roll.
Dana,
Go to the TFP Website and read about “The Siege of Chzestochowa” and other battles, many against Islam (one was in Portugal). All of them against one of us and the Mother of God is a defeat for them.
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
Dana again excellent comments! I applaud them!
Father,
The only exception that what you wrote in Germany was “the Lion of Munster”. We need such a Lion here in America!
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
I just may use Kolbe this year as an act of solidarity !
Yet this seems to pass diocesan muster in Sacramento’s cathedral: https://cal-catholic.com/wordpress/2013/01/06/news-alert-bishop-soto-honors-pro-abortion-pro-homosexual-assembly-speaker-perez-at-sacramento-cathedral-tomorrow/ . The cathedral is the home of the cathedra, the chair the bishop teaches from. What lesson did we learn here, boys and girls?
I wonder if one can find a cathedra occasionally at a Salvation Army thrift store.
When is the last time a bishop converted a muslim to Catholicism? Jesus is the light shining into the darkness, so why do the bishops insist on keeping us in the dark?
Why the surprise? Actually, Bishop Soto may have been “directed” to take this step by the USCCB or the Vatican. Islam has become a sacred thing to the mainline Catholic Church, for some reason. This is a religion of submission, and submission to a man that was a child molester and violent beyond all measure. Who could ever take this religion seriously? Certainly not women, who are sexual toys and slaves to Muslim men. Interesting to see many Egyptian women staying out of the “second revolution” over there; general fear of rape. If anyone cares about the future of young girls, they should do all they could possibly do to donate or take other steps to provide aid to groups seeking to permit young girls to go to school and to give their dreams and hopes a true chance to flourish. Bishop Soto is pretty much a run-of-the-mill corporate man, much like Cardinal Wuerl out here in Washington, D.C. These guys are simply craven to political power and popularity; no theological guts at all. And, no quest to find and to teach the Truth, either. They want you to shut up and pay, pay, pay, but avoid rocking their boat. The Pope would do well to look at his own House; but instead, we have foolish men, like Cardinals Muller and Levada, that want nothing more than to element Tradition from the Church (and any chance to reconcile with the SSPX). Demanding obedience to mediocre men is a major reason for the disenchantment of many many Catholics. Bishop Soto is just another one of these sorry “leaders” of the Church.
To try to give benefit of the doubt:
I think that the church has bowed down to this because they are led by fear too…they are fearful that our brothers and sisters who live in Muslim countries will be killed if word got out. Such a terrible thing to be controlled that way…This is suppose to be Christ’s church…we are not to be led by fear.
Wake up Abeca: Our brothers & sisters ARE being slaughtered in Nigeria & Egypt by these vermin !
Dennis to what is it that I said that makes you think that I am not awake. I am speaking about why some in our church leadership may bow down to the Islam regime and it could be led by their fear, I am not saying it is OK but it shows how weak our leadership is…..being led by fear is not from our Lord….we need to stand up and speak the truth about Islam….read my other comments please….if you also have read any of my past comments from earlier articles from this website, you will see that I do not advocate Muslim religions at all. I have actually spoken against their regime…..hope that helps…blessings
PAX CHRISTI
My point was that it doesn’t matter what our ‘spineless’ leaders do or say the radical-muslims are slaughtering Catholics & other Christians daily, unabated. Soto & Gomez are typical effeminate, ethnic tokens. The Church must purge the homosexual-collective that has controlled the USCCB since the 60’s, until that is accomplished the scandals & corruption will continue. Their CCHD collection is a prime example, it is used to fund Anti-Catholic groups, they employ a Pro-Abortionist, Ralph McCloud, to distribute millions in Catholic charity dollars, they refuse to replace him ?????
An ordinary has not business “being directed” by other bishops. He reports to God. Well, that is what a bishop is meant to do. Council with others is good, but he is not obliged to servitude to even the pope … rather the popes are the servants of the bishops, as Christ serves His people.
People should really read the Koran, for it is an eye opener for what they do on a daily basis in the world, behead, bomb, hang, flogg, destroy, they only do what the Koran tells them to do. And no, they don’t worship the same god as we do, another false teaching from Vatican II. And if we did why should we remain Catholics if all religions are the same? So tired of hearing that Buddists, Hindus, Taosits, Jews, Muslims, all worship the same god, NO they don’t, enough already with that false garbage, Jesus Christ is our Lord and Savior not Budda, Mohammed, or any other pagan and false gods!!!!
JANEK: “People should really read the Koran, for it is an eye opener for what they do on a daily basis in the world, behead, bomb, hang, flogg, destroy…”
Hmm…sounds pretty much like our own Old Testament to me.
Nothing new.
I’ve never read the Koran, nor the Book of Mormon, but people sure do like to use their own religion to bop other people on the heads, if they get the chance.
Naturally, this has NEVER happened in the history of Christianity.
In defense of he Old Testament for its time and place, punishesments were mild compared to what the other cultures did around Israel for revenge. The Hebrews limited some of those punishments. An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth was a limitation. In other countries they was often no limitation on what could be done in revenge. Think about this: under Shariah Law now in many Muslim countries a man can have his right hand cut off the first time for theft, and his left foot the second time he does it. That was recently done to a Muslim man in Afghanistan or another Muslim country. Western protest is the main reason limiting it now in Muslim countries. A thief just had to give back something he stoled or something like fourfold what he had stolen if the goods were damaged, or be a servant until he paid it back in the Old Testament, basically like men and women in our prisions do now. Some of the Old Testament’s Laws were similar to the Koran, such as stoning for adultery or other sexual sins, because of no cures for STDs and no hospitals, and some were not as barabaric, and the Hebrews were certainly more humane than some of the cultures around Israel which had no limitations on what could be done for revenge.
Mike, it would obviously take more than a bop on the head to make you aware of pretty much anything if you think Christianity is like islam…why do you even show up here? What in the world does it take to awaken people like you to the evils taking place all around the world everyday perpetrated by, to, from, over, under and around by muslims, and none other (except by organized crime and needy drug addicts) and you have the stupidity and audacity to say religions are all the same? When was the last time a Christian blew off people’s legs, and arms because they were simply in a marathon? When was the last time a Christian sawed off someone’s head in broad daylight on a London street? When was the last time a Christian murdered a mother and two daughters for dancing in the rain? The list is endless, and people like you make me nauseous in your hatred of your own culture. Pathetic is too weak a word. Evil enabler comes closer to the mark.
Mike, this is a favorite device of Muslims – to quote the violent sections of the Old Testament as proof that Christianity is also essentially violent. First, it’s obvious that the New Testament is the soul and basis of Christianity. In the New Testament, Jesus ends the Jewish Law of the OT (an eye for an eye), and replaces it with “Love your neighbor as yourself”, and “If someone strikes you on your cheek, turn and give him your other cheek”, and “If someone demands your cloak, give him your tunic, also”. The other fraudulent device of Muslims is to quote Jesus, “I come to bring a sword!” Jesus meant that Christians will not force others to submit, but rather, that Christians can expect the sword of persecution, and Christian families will be slain. And that is true to this day – first the sword of the Roman Empire, and now at this time, the sword of Mohammed.
And it’s also clear in the Old Testament, that God frequently did not approve of the violence of the Jewish tribes, and often punished the Jews for their transgressions, for example, the destruction of Jerusalem, and then exile to Babylon. Also, God urges that the Jews take care of widows, orphans, and the foreign in their midst. “I desire mercy, and not sacrifice!” is God’s theme. The OT also is often a factual story of not only what was right with Israel, but what they did wrong, and how they erred. The Psalms are oft laments, begging forgiveness for sins. In a sense, the OT is a progression, showing how God’s people started out as tribes without God, and progressed to the New Testament, where by that time, Jesus came and the new era of mercy and kindness began.
To state that the Bible is comparable with the Quran is ludicrous. Mohammed never showed mercy – his theme was to conquer, and to slay the infidel, and to treat the unbeliever with contempt. This is still the major thrust of Islam to this day – not kindness to the Infidel, but rather the forced submission and conversion of unbelievers.
The Koran is evil, we can’t compare….
For another look at the roots of Islam and of Christianity, read the story where God makes two promises, one to each son of Abraham. God promises a numerous future to both Isaac and to Ishmael. There is a continuing extreme strife between the free born son and the son of a slave woman, between the son with land and the son without land. Islam has taken up with those of the line of Ishmael, and Catholicism with those of the line of the free born son of promise. These stories deal with the prophetic depths of human and divine, and not with some step by step instruction set. To deal with this story requires not some search for political resolution but is a reflective meditation on God and creation. The answer is Jesus Christ, and the practical step by step resolution is what the Pope said to the bishops, which is to stop with their hypocrisy and practice what they preach. The world needs the witness of Christ, and the hypocrite bishops keep this from happening; but not to worry because God is showing the world the difference between corrupt bishops and faithful Catholics.
Great and truthful post, Joe.
Often better than reading the Koran is hanging out with Muslims.
I tried that, but one “pushed my button” when she said Spain was once Muslim, and when she started saying something like “Blessed be” after the name of Mohammed — he who consummated his marriage to a child at about ten and he in his fifties, and who is considered the man to be followed in Islam — that did it. I hung around with them no longer. My stomach could not take it.
Mr. Spencer is a sincere worker in his field who, however, is sometimes faced as we all are with the temptation to rash judgment.
Perhaps those who are striving for self mastery in the spirit of humble obedience, in support of the Apostolic roles of Teacher, Ruler and Sanctifier, might allow that Bishop Soto discerned in prayer that Mr. Spencer’s appearance at SacFSSP was not in the interests of the flock for which the Bishop bears his unique burden.
“satan can mimic a humble person, but never an obedient one.” St. Faustina Kowalska
But pro abort pro homosexual politicians speaking in the cathedral are in the best interest of the flock? The obedience mantra needs to stop! It is getting pretty old and I am not fooled by it anymore.
Yes, maybe the bishop discerned something. Trouble is no one except God and he seems to know what it is. As far as I know he has not explained his action. We are simply left wondering and are asked to accept the pre-Vatican II dictum that “Father knows best”, and therefore no explanation is necessary, and no further questions should be asked.
Perhaps if you were dealing day after day with the realities of jihadists, sharia law and the consequences of muslim culture spreading like a cancer unchecked, you might be a tad more concerned (and are you any relation to the ’70’s ‘poet’ ?) and feel the urgency in trying to make western culture more proactive in dealing with the war against us. Rash? Gimmeabreak!
Homosexual lobby watch = Rod Mckuen’s mantra is very similar to k’s mantra. Distractions, excuses and enabling. Whoever this poster is, it has become increasingly clear that their mission on CCD is to have the laity openly accept homosexual priests as long as they “pretend” or “claim” they are chaste. k = anonymous and both names, (same individual) defended and enabled Father Michael Zampelli. This is not to say that there are not homosexual clergy who are chaste. Homosexuality IS incompatible with the holy priesthood. The second that a priest is defending the homosexual agenda then he should leave. The second that a priest wants to let others know that he is a homosexual he should leave. The reason they have not left is that there is no discipline and they are taking great advantage of destroying Church teaching will enjoying a free ride while lobbying for their agenda.
It seems like this confusing post is on the wrong article, but, even at the risk of being called a lobbyist, I must point out that Pope Benedict said about homosexuals in monasteries and among the clergy “Well, that is just one of the disturbing problems of the Church. And the persons who are affected must at least try not to express this inclination actively in order to remain true to the intrinsic mission of their office.”
Anonymous, Pope Emeritus means, when he says “at least” exactly this, that clerics have no business identifying themselves by their temptations. He is saying that any hint of gayness is grounds for being hustled down to the local bus terminal and being sent away. Why are you not taking the Pope’s words in context with all else he has said, such as same sex attracted men have no calling or business in seminaries or orders. Get the gays outta the Church is what the Popes are saying to us; open your ears.
No, Skai, that is not what this pope or the last pope or the pope before him said. Open your eyes.
Skai, your interpretation, while amusing, is not accurate.
hilarious and stupid to tell Skai to open his eyes while their own eye’s are closed …absurd!
It is a great sorrow to Jesus and Mary when a priest “leaves.” You wish to place thorns in their heart. “It is true that someone validly ordained can, for GRAVE reasons, be discharged from the obligations and functions linked to ordination, or can be forbidden to exercise them, but he cannot become a layman again in the strict sense, because the character imprinted by ordination is for ever. The vocation and mission received on the day of his ordination mark him permanently.” CCC1583
Lobbyist and Enabler….That permanent mark will increase their suffering in hell so all the more reason to leave if you cannot stop sinning or if you consistently want to defend homosexuality more than Church teaching.
Your cover is evaporated.
Taken from Catholic Answers
Full Question: Does laicization remove a priest’s powers?
I’ve heard that when a man leaves the priesthood, he undergoes a process called “laicization,” which takes away his priestly powers, making him a regular layman. Is this correct?
Answer:
It is only partly correct. Laicization is a process which takes from a priest or other cleric the licit use of his powers, rights, and authority. Laicization occurs automatically when a priest, deacon, or monk marries or joins the military without permission. Major clerics (priests and deacons) are directly laicized through their superiors by the penalty of degradation. The Holy See also has the privilege of laicizing major clerics.
Laicized clerics are forbidden to wear clerical dress or to perform ceremonies or to administer the sacraments ordinary to their former offices. Priests who are laicized are required to continue practicing celibacy, although dispensations from this discipline are frequently given. Otherwise, laicization renders a cleric for ecclesiastical purposes the equivalent of a layman.
The supernatural mark of holy orders and the powers connected with the sacrament (especially for the priest) remain even after laicization, although they cannot be used licitly. A laicized priest has the power to confect the Eucharist. Although to the world he may live as a layman, in a sense “once a priest, always a priest.”
Catherine, they are not going to hell for being gay. It is not a sin. Do you understand Christianity at all? Jesus Christ died so that sins could be forgiven. Even if a priest commits a mortal sin, he can be forgiven by Christ. Those who teach or rebel against their bishops (such as Father John Whitney of Seattle of the other story) are committing a serious wrong. They do need to repent. It is scandal. We are supposed to be praying and sacrificing for them; not condemning them to hell. We offend God when we do. It, too, is a temptation. Remember Jesus rebuked his disciples James and John for asking Him if he wanted to call down fire from heaven. The holiest practice, of course, is that of the Blessed Mother who, according to St. John Eudes, while in the womb of St. Anne would offer herself completely to God and offer to take the punishment of those who offend Him.
Anonymous, Jesus gave us a vivid example of what happens to gays in eternity. He utterly destroyed the gay strongholds of Sodom and Gomorrah, and all their little satellite gay communities. Gays are condemned by God and they go to Hell. If you identify yourself by your temptations, then you are Hell bound, dude. If you on the other hand identify yourself by Christ, then you have nothing to do with gay and you may make it to Heaven.
Skai, that is not Catholic.
Anony it is you who does not understand Christianity….stop belittling Catherine and Skai!
Pope Francis wants us all to get the gays out of the Church. Read what he says to us.
Skai, Pope Francis has never said that he wants us all to get the gays out of the Church. Please stop making things up.
I thought Pope Francis wanted to get the ENGLISH out of the FALKLAND ISLANDS. :)
Catherine, I pray that your obsessions cease clouding your better judgement. It must be a horrific thing to see homosexuality under every rock.
YFC, stop bullying Catherine. What a class AA schmuck you are.
Skai, I’m not bullying Catherine. But she turns every single page on this blog into a discussion of homosexuality. It is truly a sign of obsession. Honestly, look at this page and at many other pages in which Catherine is the very first person to contain a mention of homosexuality in her response. She is completely fixated on homosexuality.
I agree with Skai the pro-gay activists that come on here at a Catholic website sure bully many of the faithful and try to play victim as well….YFC stop bullying Catherine…you are on a Catholic website with devout lay faithful.
Skai and Abeca, you are also simililarly obsessed with homosexuality. This website is very little other than a forum for those who would bully gay people and tell them they are horrible liars, worthless gaystapo child molesters.
YFC such hypocracy…I recall a homosexual that normally posts here also calling Skai a liar and he is NOT! Plus you only see things through your eye’s that need more of Jesus truth! I will tell you why…it is not obsession that you see…it is something much more spiritual, something more….those who fear the Lord understand why we can not remain silent about immoral sins…..you are obsessed with worldly ways, we are not….that is why you view our convictions as such because you can’t possibly understand our relationship with Christ….once we walk with Christ, we also carry our cross here on earth and we can not participate in sin nor must we remain silent about sin either….
Well think what you want…..if that is how you feel…Just remember who was obsessed with salvation! JESUS was…HIS PASSION for us just to pay the price a high one….to open the gates of heaven…it was not so little thing He did for us. We must be HOT for Christ…perhaps that is why we are not lukewarm….think about it….you too can be HOT for our Lord….HOT not lukewarm….come on my brother…come to share with us the banquet, one that is honoring God in all that we do….HOT not COLD…but if you are COLD…maybe there is hope for you but the lukewarm ones…we must look out!
PAX CHRISTI
Abeca … What is hypocircy is saying your are upset about sin, but only comment about ONE sin, homosexuality. If you were truly against sin, you would similarly rail against people who demean and degrade others to make their points. You would rail against people who lie to make a point. You would rail against those who make things up in the name of Christ. You do not. You only rail against homosexuality, because of your hypocrisy and your obsession.
YFC you are complimenting us…Catherine was right when she thanked you for saying she was obsessed.
Those (IN BAD WILL) who are ungrateful and do not understand the ways of the Lord and His faithfulness…would say that Jesus was obsessed with bringing salvation to the world, some would say that Mother Theresa was obsessed with helping the poor, some would say that Bishop Fulton Sheen was obsessed with communicating the truth so well, some would say that Padre Pio was obsessed so much that he had the Stigmata, some would say that John Paul II was obsessed with communism, that he helped towards ending it in many places , ….it comes with the territory WHEN ONE HATES SIN.
I said hypocrisy because you said it was wrong to call gays liars while the gays call Catholics liars….that is what I meant with that. Please read my comments from July 15, 2013 at 9:45 pm. Also add Mum Angelica who helped started EWTN…some would call her obsessed as well when she was able…now (with her ailing health) we need to keep her in our prayers.
Anonymous,
If you truly believed what you wrote then you would have never undermined good priests. This makes your underhanded violations against good priests and others all the more serious. You are culpable. You know the truth but you choose to protect and enable sin.
Wicked leaders ARE our nations punishment for sin. Our hope lies in Jesus Christ. St. John Eudes said, “One of the surest signs of God’s displeasure with mankind is to allow them bad clergy.”
The disastrous domino effects of disobedient clergy and disobedient laity have shown a steady falling down into the dark abyss since July 25, 1968 with the rejection of Pope Paul VI’s Encyclical, Humanae Vitae.
“The rejection of Humane Vitae marked a pivotal moment in the Church’s life in the West.”…Carl E. Olsen CWR
Anonymous,
Pope Benedict XVI reminded us that homosexuality is incompatible with the priesthood and this has gnawed at your conscience and gnawed at the consciences of many clergy within the Church. I see that you are afraid for your own self and with good reason. The Holy Father even said it would be better for homosexuals to be honest and leave if you are leading a double life. For those who have paid close attention to your troubling posts over the last two years, you do have something to fear. You have been complicit in enabling sin.
Yes it is true that people who love God and obey God do not go to hell but this has not been the case in your many duplicitous posts. You have clearly enabled homosexual clergy and others in authority to undermine the teachings of the Catholic Church.
The Church has always taught that we are supposed to pray for our priests and to offer up sacrifices for sinners. You on the other hand have sacrificed the fullness of truth which enables and enabled our young children to be the innocent victims who were sacrificed to the false god of homosexuality. Your cover is evaporated and your passion is not for the love of Jesus Christ Crucified , it is for the love of protecting homosexuality and crucifying good priests and the faithful who reject sin and recognize that homosexuality is incompatible with the holy priesthood.
What priest did I undermine? What is an underhanded violation? What are you ranting about? What sin do I protect and enable? Did you mean writing to this website that is so full of schism and heresy and doubt, that you call a faithful Catholic website although I don’t blame the website for what the individuals who comment here write either. As for St. John Eudes’ quote, there are very good clergymen at my church and at the surrounding parishes. Whatever you are doing, please stop it so you can have good clergy like we do. You seem to think that I am a gay priest. I am not. I would urge you to actually get a copy of “Light of the World” so you will know what you are talking about instead of guessing about the Pope Emeritus’ comments. I am not sure what the rest of your post is referring to. I have not done what you say I have done. I won’t tell you what to do but perhaps you should worry more about what you write than what I write. What is an evaporated cover? You seem really confused and frightened. Just try to learn the Church’s teachings and God will overlook your mistakes. Blessings to you, young lady.
“Catherine, I pray that your obsessions cease clouding your better judgement. It must be a horrific thing to see homosexuality under every rock.”
YFC,
Do you live in the Diocese of Orange California? Did you read the initial John Jay report. ( not the cover your dark tracks revised report) for the REAL reason behind the horrific sex abuse scandals that were committed against children? Yes, indeed, you are right….there are still many rocks to be lifted.
Once again, thank you for the compliment. What you call obsession, I call rejection of sin. I am pleased to see that you finally admit that homosexuality is a “horrific” thing. You are also correct when you clarify that all homosexual acts are covered in sinful darkness under a rock. When you lift a rock and let the light of Christ shine on that darkness, all living creatures…. humans…. animals….. and even the tiniest little insects, will scramble in fear and run for more dark hidden cover. This is what you are doing YFC. You are scrambling for dark cover because the faithful on CCD will not sanction your rock of dark cover. YFC, All sins offend God but sodomy cries out for vengeance and if anything deserved to remain hidden because of it’s “horrific” ugliness, it IS homosexual acts. YFC I commend you for recognizing that you should be ashamed. YOU are the one who rightly used the word “HORRIFIC” so your guardian angel is still appealing to you to stop hiding under rocks and follow the Light of Christ.
In response to all your “darkness” issues, Catherine: Not so fast. YOU are the one who finds darkness under every rock, and you name it homosexuality. Please don’t put words into my mouth. Your own obsessions seem to prevent you from understanding the difference between the truth and the false, and between what I say and what I don’t. I hope you find healing. Truly.
YFC your devoutness towards homosexual lifestyles are the ones filled with darkness and it breaks your relationship with the Lord…that could explain why you think so little of Catherine…..Open your eye’s and ask Jesus to help you see….I suggest that for everyone…it is Jesus who sets us free.
as Fulton Sheen once said “”Show me your hands. Do they have scars from giving? Show me your feet. Are they wounded in service? Show me your heart. Have you left a place for divine love? ”
YFC here is a quote I offer to you and others….for I take these words seriously and truly seek our Lord’s sanctifying grace as I desire it for you and all, this is from Fulton Sheen “”Nothing is more harmful to a man than his resistance to Grace.”
Hey Catherine-
You do get it, don’t you, that when you convert every conversation into one about homosexuality, as you are doing here, that you play into the hands of folks like YFC and other homosexual advocates? You do get that right?
They LOVE the fact that you obsess about them. They live for it. If you would just leave them alone, and forget they ever existed, they might just go away. But the more you name them, the more you call them out, the more they feel the need to defend themselves. Let it go! Let them fly away!
-GR
Getting Real,
Which poster are you? Why are you afraid or unwilling to be recognized by your faithful posts? When you addressed me, you have the advantage or according to you and our lobbyists, the disadvantage of recognizing a history of posts to reference to. You know that I accept the teachings of the Catholic Church because I defend Church teaching. I don’t recognize your name but I do recognize what you are asking.
GR, Do you really think that if you ignore sin that it goes away. Do you deny that there is a chokehold and denial of truth in many a diocese due to this particular sin? Are you also trying to silence CCD when they post homosexual topics? Do you think that all homosexuals are beyond hope for God’s mercy and conversion and this is why you want “them” to fly away? GR has ignoring sin made people fly away in our chanceries, in our parishes or even in the Curia? Please give me a specific example besides the beautiful acts of prayer and fasting where you have “gotten real” on this website so I may value the peculiar request of what you are asking? GR, I do realize that it is *only Jesus* who converts hearts. It is not your job or my job to convince anyone to stop sinning. It is your job and my job to tell them that what they are doing is sinful. I see that I have “annoyed and irritated” you as much as I have “annoyed and irritated” our lobbyists and enablers. Would you please cite an example on this website where you have gotten real and addressed a poster by dialoguing with him or her about the importance of the relationship between God and man?
Yes GR, You are right about the homosexuals loving the attention but it is not the attention that they are seeking that is important. What is important is if we pay attention and address falsehoods and lies when they are taught as Catholic truths. When I face God I want to know that I was not ashamed to tell others how much they should love and obey God first before they turn away from God and love their sins first. If we deny God before men, we will be denied our inheritance.
The Gospel of Matthew Chapter 1o Douay-Rheims Catholic Bible
[31] Fear not therefore: better are you than many sparrows. [32] Every one therefore that shall confess me before men, I will also confess him before my Father who is in heaven. [33] But he that shall deny me before men, I will also deny him before my Father who is in heaven. [34] Do not think that I came to send peace upon earth: I came not to send peace, but the sword.
GR Please let me know if you agree with these words and teachings in Catechism of the Catholic Church .
CATECHISM OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH
PART ONE
THE PROFESSION OF FAITH
SECTION TWO
THE PROFESSION OF THE CHRISTIAN FAITH
CHAPTER ONE
I BELIEVE IN GOD THE FATHER
ARTICLE I
“I BELIEVE IN GOD THE FATHER ALMIGHTY, CREATOR OF HEAVEN AND EARTH”
Paragraph 7. The Fall
385 God is infinitely good and all his works are good. Yet no one can escape the experience of suffering or the evils in nature which seem to be linked to the limitations proper to creatures: and above all to the question of moral evil. Where does evil come from? “I sought whence evil comes and there was no solution”, said St. Augustine, 257 and his own painful quest would only be resolved by his conversion to the living God. For “the mystery of lawlessness” is clarified only in the light of the “mystery of our religion”.258 The revelation of divine love in Christ manifested at the same time the extent of evil and the superabundance of grace.259 We must therefore approach the question of the origin of evil by fixing the eyes of our faith on him who alone is its conqueror.260
I. WHERE SIN ABOUNDED, GRACE ABOUNDED ALL THE MORE
The reality of sin
386 Sin is present in human history; *any attempt to “ignore it” or to give this dark reality other names would be futile.* To try to understand what sin is, one must first recognize the profound relation of man to God, for only in this relationship is the evil of sin unmasked in its true identity as humanity’s rejection of God and opposition to him, even as it continues to weigh heavy on human life and history.
387 Only the light of divine Revelation clarifies the reality of sin and particularly of the sin committed at mankind’s origins. Without the knowledge Revelation gives of God we cannot recognize sin clearly and are tempted to explain it as merely a developmental flaw, a psychological weakness, a mistake, or the necessary consequence of an inadequate social structure, etc. Only in the knowledge of God’s plan for man can we grasp that sin is an abuse of the freedom that God gives to created persons so that they are capable of loving him and loving one another.
GR, The most faithful and holy priests that I have and had the privilege of watching as an example of Christ, send out active Legion of Mary members to bring back many different sinners back to the fullness of truth. Many of these different sinners happened to be homosexuals and many of these repentant sinners wept and thanked the priests for not giving up on them and ignoring them and for repeatedly sending out visitors who reminded them and helped them to restore their baptismal inheritance.
GR, When you have witnessed such joy, it is impossible to contain, becasue Christ died for all sinners, including you, me and our lobbyists. GR, You’ve got it pretty easy here. It takes great confidence in God or great faith, great hope and great trust to ring the doorbell of a total stranger or someone who you are aware of the fact that you are initially most likely irritating and annoying. If I followed your counsel and advice instead of the Gospel, the Catechism and the advice and example of faithful priests then there would not have been more rejoicing in heaven for restoring the inheritance of the one lost lamb. Can you still not see the value of loving Christ first before worrying or paying attention to what sinners and fearful men think? GR, These holy priests taught many to block out fear, self and pride when reaching out to restore even one soul. Wouldn’t we have a different world if each bishop in each diocese had required each priest to “get real” as you curiously call it. If we can’t bear to take the time and address someone even in the comfort of a chair in anonymity with conversation from a safe keyboard then I cannot believe that you are truly interested in GETTING REAL When an unrepentant sinner was riding his last journey on a cart to the gallows, should we not follow the example of the heroic saints of the past who implored them to repent before they faced God? Did the martyrs and the saints remain silent or joyful when they recognized that an individual sinner was going to hell even if the sinner deserved hell by choosing sin over God? No, they were not silent or joyful, they forgave them and they still spoke the truth. Please GR, help me to better understand what the empty sounding words or phrase such as “getting real” means to you. Please don’t tell me that you place yourself in the category of those who remain silent when given the living opportunity to speak the truth in season or out of perceived season on this website or in daily life.
If you cannot see the harm you do by converting every conversation into a forum about homosexuality, even ones that have nothing to do with the subject, then more of us should start getting real with you. You put yourself up on a very high pedestal when you see yourself as standing in the way of all evil in the world. But go ahead, knock yourself out with yet another 2000 word diatribe.
“But go ahead, knock yourself out with yet another 2000 word diatribe.”
GR, No one is on a pedestal but Almighty God! Snap out of your own insecurity! Stop behaving like a petty jealous female who is silently pouting in the corner counting my 2000 word diatribes that are posted. “Get real” and use your God given goodness and your God given intellect to defend “all” of the teachings of the Church.
8 great reasons to tell the truth
Telling the truth lets everyone know what really happened. There’s less chances of misunderstandings, confusion, or conflict.
Telling the truth protects innocent people from being blamed or punished.
Telling the truth allows everyone to learn from what happened.
You usually get into less trouble for telling the truth than for lying (and getting caught).
Other people trust you more when you tell the truth.
You don’t have to tell more lies to keep your story straight.
You gain a reputation for being truthful – a trait that most people value.
Telling the truth helps you feel secure and peaceful inside.
getting real you are not real because the reality is that we have many here who call themselves gay and well….
Yes, tell the truth. The whole truth not selected distorted tidbits of gossip.
Getting real you are unreal…they do not go away…we only pray that they stay only when they truly seek to be pleasing to our Lord but many are activists…they are here to stay…the activists are to spread their own free will not our Lord’s…that is why they hate us…for we seek to speak our Lord’s will and teachings…….
In fact Fulton Sheen once quoted “Those who hate Truth and fear Goodness are not far from the kingdom of God. They are fighting against it, and yet they know theirs is a losing battle. The more violently men hate truth, the more they think about it; the more they fear the goodness that demands perfection, the more they know it is what they really seek.”
What’s happened to k Catherine? She used to post all the time. I hope she’s alright?
Dana don’t be surprised if she is sometimes posting as Anony…..that is my suspension now….I feel it…
Oops, I mean Rod McKuen: How is it that you know that Bishop Soto is obedient? This “obdience” thing is really a scam, Rod. The Pope is calling bishops to holiness, to stop being hypocrites, and here you’re pushing the idea that one of them is actually obedient. When people start up with the “obedience card”, you should always realize that you’re about to be had if you go for it.
Skai,
“When people start up with the “obedience card”, you should always realize that you’re about to be had if you go for it.” Once again you hit the proverbial nail RIGHT ON THE HEAD!
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
Mr Fisher you are coming up as Anony….just to let you know in case you may want to correct that…glad that you post your name in the post so there won’t be any confusion….God bless you! : )
We are to be obedient to our bishops in everything except for sin. I never attended the Traditional Mass until it was okayed by my bishop. Now it does not have to have the approval of the bishop when the Vatican has approved such orders that serve such Masses.
That is regarding Church or diocesan related things not in everything of course.
And it does not mean that we cannot attend Robert Spencer’s speeches in non church related buildings.
Anne T., if one does not sin, then what is the point in following bishops? Also, reflect carefully on the trite cliche, “We are to be obedient to our bishops in everything except for sin,” which makes no logical sense. If a bishop is not holy, then why would anyone in their right mind follow him anywhere? Jesus guarantees the Church, and not the bishops. Who drummed up that line, anyway, do you know?
Skai, the bishops has the right to say what takes place on Church property in their dioceses unless one of them is actually going against Church teaching, That is all I am saying.
Anne T., I have nothing to do with any bishop, so I cannot see how I have any obedience issue with any of them. Way I see it, the bishop has to obey God; most of them are severely challenged in this regard. Thus there is no point in listening to these, no matter what they babble about. It might mean searching for a parish with a holy priest, but no bishop has any divine authority to regulate that. They have cooked up so many rules it makes the pharisees look like saints.
My real motive here, Anne T., is to explore the issue of obeying a corrupt bishop. A corrupt bishop is a deceiver, whose father is not God but the devil. His corruption exists because people obey him. Many might do this because they hold obedience to bishops to be more important than obedience to God. The Catholic Church in England was lost because of this.
Skai, no bishop is perfect. They are human beings. They are men. You are correct in saying that they need to strive to be holy but you go to far in your rhetoric. Saying that their father is not God but the devil is the talk of scandal. Even if these men are not perfect you should still show some respect. You are only human too and not a perfect judge of who is corrupt and who is not.
PA that was good and charitable. You do say things that are charitable from your post of July 11, 2013 at 3:49 pm….maybe we can back off personal attacks on the bishops as to go as far as to saying such things about the devil. Maybe Skai is just speaking from a scandalized heart, he is probably brought down from reading all the negative stuff that is being allowed or not allowed by the Bishops….a good confession may help with this as well.
Thank you for reminding us to remain merciful and to not judge as harsh as saying that they come from the devil. That could lead us into sin especially since we know not their hearts…..especially this Bishop Soto…I don’t know him personally to make such a harsh judgement but I can be disappointed in his leadership and can judge if something he does is known to be wicked in offending our Lord or not doing what he is suppose to be doing….he is a man and imperfect as well with many flaws just like the rest of us…but he is one that has some power over in what is allowed or not allowed in his diocese….so yes we do hold him accountable for that position.
Abeca, I’m speaking from what the Popes have been saying and what I’m perceiving from observation, news, study, and history having to do with bishops. Centuries ago, for example, all English bishops save one, were so corrupt that they helped the English king transition all Catholic property and the Catholic religion over to the English throne. The western bishops of today are exceptionally weak for the most part, and the most recent six popes have been addressing this sad issue more and more strongly. They obviously have some support by bishops but not enough to quickly end the potentially catastrophic problem.
@ Skai from your reply of July 12, 2013 at 10:31 am, glad you replied, I now understand and when I just read your reply I found this from Fulton Sheen and you made more sense to me, thank you dear friend in Christ. God bless you…..
”Eternity is without succession, a simultaneous possession of all joys. To those who live toward Eternity, it really is not something at the end; it is that which influences every moment of the now.”
― Fulton J. Sheen
Abeca Christrian, thank you for your comments. Skai, your words of hate say more about you than they do about me.
replying to your post of Juls 12, 11:28am from PA you did say charitable comments but that does not mean that I am on board with you in regards to gay agenda’s idea’s…..but Skai just explained that he only wrote what some of the earlier saints have said so…..let us all reflect. Take care.
PAX CHRISTI
Jesus hates the devil, PA, and you push the gay lobby agenda which Pope Francis, a Catholic, wants us to get rid of. Your number is up, either shape up or ship out.
The devil hates Jesus.
God hates. So, PA, we should hate. The hard part is directing our hate to the just object, such as evil ones, evil and those who mock Christ by teaching that gay is good.
1 John 4:7-12:
“Let us love one another, because love is from God; everyone who loves is born of God and knows God. Whoever does not love does not know God, for God is love. God’s love was revealed among us in this way: God sent his only Son into the world so that we might live through him. In this is love, not that we loved God but that he loved us and sent his Son to be the atoning sacrifice for our sins. Beloved, since God loved us so much, we also ought to love one another. No one has ever seen God; if we love one another, God lives in us, and his love is perfected in us.”
Perhaps Bishop Soto is thinking of the safety of his flock, Abeca Christian. I do not know. We need to remember that Pope Pius XII was falsely accused of backing Hitler because he had to think about the safety of Catholics in Nazi territory, but all the while he was hiding innocent Jewish people and others right there in Rome. We might not know everything that is going on here. I like Robert Spencer and do not think bishops should give in too much to radicals, but perhaps it is better that he give his speeches elsewhere than churches. Perhaps it is a prudent decision on the bishop’s part. People can buy Robert Spencer’s books and go to his speeches elsewhere, or donate to Jihad Watch.
And you and others certainly have the right to peacfully and charitably protest to the bishop in writing or by phone.
We can also donate and buy products from the pesecuted Chrisitans in other countries. I try to do that as often as I can.
Anne T., how do you know if products are made by persecuted Christians in foreign lands?
The Christians of Bethlehem, especially Arab Christians, make many religious items out of olive wood and sell them over here, especially around Christmas time. You can also get on the websites of Byzantine and other Catholics and Christians in Egypt, Syria, etc. and find out what they have for sale. Quite often such products can be bought on e-bay or Amazon also. Donatios to the persecuted Church in the Near East can help them too.
Oops! that should be “donations” in my last line not “Donatios”.
PA, Jesus tells us to follow Him. So there is no point and no obligation to follow any bishop; therefore, bishops have no reason for existing. But Jesus created bishops … He created imperfect beings, you’d say, right, because He also created gay people and bank robbers? He created, therefore by your reasoning, a Church of tainted people which really has no point in existing, because its people are no different and can be no different from anyone else. PA, your reason also leads to God being imperfect because He has no ability to perfect anyone. PA, you are truly a demon worshiper, because all your reasons, as I’ve outlined above, are false and yet you preach them in the face of God, and you are a false prophet because you say your false preaching is God’s word and the doctrine of the Church. Furthermore, you disrespect the Pope who told the bishops to practice what they preach … PA, according you your stupid and demonic doctrines, the Pope is silly and says stupid things that contradict God. PA, you represent the dim conscience talked about by St Paul, when he informed us about the consequences of sodomy … whether or not you practice same sex activity, your mind and imagination are filled with the lust of it, and thus your day to day life is one of a sodomite and same sex activist. But in your dim mind you actually believe it is ok because it exists. You, PA, have no moral compass and no spiritual foundation other than the shifting sand that Jesus talks about in the Gospel. Your baptizing of false foundations makes a mockery of Jesus and of His Gospel, PA. You have no shame because you have dimmed your conscience.
Oh Good Lord!
“Caholic”?!?!?! Have you morphed, YFC? Is “caholic” part of gaycaholic?
Skai, Mark from PA is the exact kind of person that Christ likes. He is the one most likely to be a saint of all who post here. He does exactly what Christ has asked people to do. The false comments you made about him are a new low for you. Just because you have a lot of issues with Church hierarchy and the teaching of Church doctrine and prefer your own theology to that of the Church, that is no reason to attack a faithful Catholic. He has lived a lot better life than most of those who criticize him.
Angelu’s post reminded me of an old joke where the little boy brings his teacher a written excuse for his absence from school.
“Deer Mrs. Jones,’
Bobby mist skool yestiday becuz he wuz sik.
sinserly,
my mom
Dana you are right about Angelu’s comments. His comments are deceptive. Christ warned us about false teachers and Angelu just fell for the false one! God have mercy on his soul. Skai keep up the good job in Christ! Maybe Angelu is another of those trolls who are actually pro-gay rights crowd. Be careful for those ones….
abeca, the troll is whoever brought up the subject of homosexuality or its activists on a thread about homeschooling and jihadists. I know you love her and so do I , but Catherine is the number one troll on this website. She doesn’t care about anything but homosexual priests and the gay lobby and she always tries to turn the discussion into that, usually by assaulting a person about something they wrote on another article. We all should help her learn not to do that, either by ignoring it or telling her it is better suited to another article.
“Annoyed and Irritated” writes ..” but Catherine is the number one troll “
I am sorry that I annoyed and irritated you, Cathy. But thanks for not arguing.
And…the Lord never sleeps.
Catherine a troll tromper, yes; a troll, no.
Skai in reply to your comments from July 15, 2013 at 1:18 pm…way to go…you are right, she is a troll thumper but not a troll…yahoo way to to go Skai! Love that, that was a good comeback!
If she was a troll thumper she would say “this is off topic.” And return the comments to the original subject, wouldn’t she? A troll is someone who hijacks a thread. Say I came on and wrote “Obama is the greatest president, ever” knowing how people feel about Obama here and the whole comment sections turned to comments about Obama. She would say “No trolling. We are not going to discuss Obama on this article about homeschooling.” That would be a troll-thumper.
Anonymous = O ye of little faith or perhaps even no faith.
You consistently enables lobbyists. You are certainly free to write something equally worthy of pulling attention to your points of the topic or to the topic. The lobbyists often write something pertaining to the topic but it completely contradicts a great lie that they just tried to sell on another thread. Those lies should be connected and called out for their inconsistencies and for their lying patterns. You certainly have not lost confidence in your writing ability or communicating skills so you are giving yourself away. You do not want those lies to be called out because you are both a silent and active enabler of sin. This has everything to do with remaining “on topic” but enablers do not consider remaining faithful an “on topic” priority.
anonymous asks: “abeca, what sin are you accusing me of that you think I need to confess?”
Response…..Eight out of nine is very sinful.
Nine ways of being an accessory to another’s sin.
1.By Counsel * by counseling PA that he is faithful
2.By Command = You have no leadership skills to command. Leaders do not hide.
3.By Consent * by consenting with PA’s dissent
4.By Concealment * by concealing Pa’s lies
5.By Defense of Evil Done * by defending the distorted lies of PA
6.By Partaking * by partaking in PA’s agenda
7.By Provocation * by provoking others to also enable sin
8.By Praise* by praising PA for his dissent
9.By Silence * by silence when lobbyists distort Church teaching
Taken from Catholic Answers
Accessory to another’s sin
We all have a responsibility for the sins of others. When we cooperate in them, we are an accessory to these sins, and this is possible in nine ways: By Counsel, By Command, By Consent, By Concealment, By Defense of Evil Done, By Partaking, By Provocation, By Praise, By Silence.
As practicing Catholics and Christians, we are not merely compelled to avoid sinning. We are compelled to avoid the occasion of sin, to avoid the temptation of sin and try to live by the example that Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior, gave us.
It is not enough to avoid evil but we must also avoid the appearance of evil as well. It is not enough to merely avoid wrong-doing but to speak-out against any wrong- doing. We are all called to defend our faith and God’s laws.
If someone is aware of an evil committed, there are nine ways that we can end up being guilty by our participation, or omission, regarding another’s sin. Unfortunately, “Silence” in face of evil, is common, when we choose to be silent we allow sin to occur and in by doing so, we too sin.
Quote for those who use the name “anonymous” in order to hide and enable sin.
“Lord forgive me for what I have done and what I have failed to do”
I have not done any of that, Catherine.
Catherine, I do not know Mark from PA but I take him at his word that he is a lifetime Catholic, active in his parish, married with a son, who takes care of his elderly father, recently lost his mother. If he is a lobbyist, I don’t know about it. I assume that he must commit some sins because perfection is not given in this world. I don’t know what sin he has committed that you think I am an accomplice to. Do you mean going to a website called queering the church? If that is a sin, then you did it too. I did not understand the first part of your post at all. I don’t use the name anonymous to hide and enable sin. I think you might be falsely accusing Mark from PA. Your post just does not make sense. I just really do not understand you at all. Is this one of your gay things again? If it is then please understand that I do not think that Mark from PA has committed those sins and I certainly would not be an accomplice to it if he has. Catherine, honestly, this is crazy.
Anonymous, you have no clue what a troll thumper is, because you’re a troll that gets thumped all the time.
Well it is true that I am not on the topic of jihad or homeschooling, but no one has said anything about it.
@ Anony your comments from July 13, 2013 at 9:09 pm, you need to go to confession for attacking a faithful Catholic such as Catherine…I ask you to apologize to her, if not….you need to repent and go to confession….
abeca, what sin are you accusing me of that you think I need to confess?
Abeca Christian, you said that what I said was good and charitable. Skai gave a response in which he demonized and dehumanized me. And you said to him, “Keep up the good job in Christ!” ??????????????????
@ PA in reply to your comments of July 15, 2013 at 4:38 pm….no that is not it…stop twisting my intentions….PA I am truly sick of this game you play….it is insulting to me because I do not condone what you accuse me of…just because you are in bad will and do not get it..does not mean that in which what you accuse me of is true….sorry that you do not get it….I don’t think i have enough patience to keep this going with you because if I say something else…you will only twist it.
Let me give you an example that I heard over the weekend at out Catholic Conference from a speaker…its just an example so stop reading malice but ask God to speak to your heart so that you may understand it because I have a clean heart in Christ!
The speaker said that something like this, can’t recall exactly but I’ll tell it to you like I understand it:
He said that even when miracles happen that the secular won’t see it they will twist the truth and they will disregard the miracle….here it goes…IF THEY SAW Pope Francis walk on water, the current Media will report saying something like this instead: HEADLINES The POPE Can’t swim!
Sorry to troll but did you see the article on the lifeless newborn baby who was laid in a chapel by a nurse who didn’t want to send the baby’s corpse to the morgue. When the grandmother and the mortician arrived to take the baby’s body to the funeral home 3 hours later, the baby kicked. The nurse said it was just a spasm but then the baby opened her eyes and began breathing. Doctors who had tried to resuscitate the newborn for an hour after her heart stopped were absolutely sure that the baby was dead and was miraculously brought back to life. The baby is in ICU and doing well.
Abeca Christian, you need to re-read what you wrote to me in your post of 7/1, 6:16 PM. It was very nice and charitable. I find it interesting that when Skai dissents from Catholic teaching, as in rejecting the teaching authority of the bishops, and distorts Catholic teaching; you don’t tell him he is in a “bad will.” It seems that you and some of the other posters here are afraid of crossing him. Skai “owns” a lot of the discussions here and people cross him at their own risk.
Abeca, your Pope vs media example is one heck of a thumper … thumps PA like he was one of the Three Stooges.
If you are implying that Mark from PA and I are the same poster, you could not be more wrong. Mark from PA would never write glowing things about himself; he is too humble. I am just a reader who remembers Christ’s words on how to discern his disciples.
PA is the opposite of humble, Angelu. You gays have nothing but vanity. You have no knowledge or understanding of Catholicism. Your slack manner betrays your evil ways. Anyone who’s been around a few gays for a while knows they cannot be trusted.
PA always posts “glowing things about himself”, Angelu; he has been posting on this site for years, and we know what his ulterior motive is, and we explain it often. He is a gay apologist who refutes Catholic doctrine.
And exactly what are those words of Christ that you refer to, Angelu?
John 13:35 By this will all men know you are my disciples, by your love for one another.
Angelu, you desparatly need to find out what love is all about, because the sense of your posts reflects something other than love. For example, Jesus tells us He is Love. He also tells us that no man has greater love than to lay down his life for his brother. God is Love, if you can believe St John: and God is recorded as having done a fair amount of smoting back in the day. God also allows Hell to exist … God provides us with instruction on how to not only stay out of Hell but also how to save others from Hell, especially those who, like PA, are clueless and cannot understand what the Church teaches because he defies true doctrine.
How did Christ discern choosing His disciples, Angelu? I don’t think I’ve ever heard anyone speak on this.
I don’t get why you all are attacking Angelu, whose only crime was to say nice things about someone. What nastiness has to do with being Catholic is beyond me, and frankly, turns off anyone who would venture into these waters. This is ugliness beyond ugliness.
False, Angelu; PA preaches false doctrine, as he has demonstrated over and over. Try to realize that PA has been pushing false doctrine on this site for many years. Pope Francis has asked us all to get the gay lobby out of the Church. PA is gay lobby all the way. The Pope wants him out or to repent from his gay advocacy. You gay apologists have nothing to do with Christ but torment.
Skai, if you think there is a moment in which the Pope asked us to get the “gay lobby” if there is one, out of the Church, then you should provide the reference. What he said about a gay lobby was a private communication that was leaked, and in it he said there was a gay lobby and that presents issues for us. But he didn’t say he was going to get rid of gays, he didn’t ask US to get rid of gays, and frankly, the report he was referring to talked about the issues of those STRAIGHT prelates who were using the ISSUE of homosexuality to BLACKMAIL the others. If you have a different reference, please cite it, or else stop making up your own version of what the Pope asks of US.
Pope Francis asked all of us how we can get rid of the gay lobby. Taken in context with other papal statements on this topic, beginning if not prior to Pope Paul VI … the papacy has informed the world that the devil has infiltrated the hierarchy of the Church. The obvious conclusion, make clear by Pope Francis, is to excise this evil from the Church. The gay lobby is the label … why? Because the sodomites are the sign of the devil’s work. YFC, your twist will only fool those who have distanced themselves too far from the Confessional. They are the weak calves that you wolves are attempting to cut out of the flock.
Here is what Fox News reported about the “gay lobby” comment by Francis. Nowhere NOWHERE, Skai does it say that Francis intends to get rid of gay people in the Church, let alone ask you to help him do that:
” In private remarks to the leadership of a key Latin American church group, Pope Francis lamented that a “gay lobby” was at work at the Vatican.
It was an apparent reference to allegations in the Italian media that blackmail was taking place within the Vatican against high-ranking prelates who are gay.
The Latin American and Caribbean Confederation of Religious — the regional organization for priests and nuns of religious orders — confirmed Tuesday that its leaders had written a synthesis of Francis’ remarks after their June 6 audience. The group, known by its Spanish acronym CLAR, said it was greatly distressed that the document had been published and apologized to the pope.
In the document, Francis is quoted as saying that while there were many holy people in the Vatican, there was also a current of corruption. “The `gay lobby’ is mentioned, and it is true, it is there … We need to see what we can do …” the synthesis reads.
The Vatican spokesman, the Rev. Federico Lombardi, said Tuesday the audience was private and that as a result he had nothing to say.
In the days leading up to Pope Benedict XVI’s Feb. 28 resignation, Italian media were rife with reports of a “gay lobby” influencing papal decision-making and Vatican policy through blackmail, and suggestions that the scandal had led in part to Benedict’s decision to resign.
The unsourced reports, in the Rome daily La Repubblica and the news magazine Panorama, said details of the scandal were laid out in the secret dossier prepared for Benedict by three trusted cardinals who investigated the leaks of papal documents last year. Benedict left the dossier for Francis.
At the time, the Vatican denounced the reporting as defamatory, “unverified, unverifiable or completely false.”
The initial reporting has never been precise on what exactly was meant by a “gay lobby,” but Repubblica and Panorama went beyond saying there was merely a homosexual subculture at the Vatican. Rather, they raised allegations that high-ranking prelates were being blackmailed because they were gay.
Read more: https://www.foxnews.com/world/2013/06/12/pope-francis-says-gay-lobby-at-work-inside-vatican/#ixzz2YylHqljE
YFC, to the contrary, here is a Papal quote from the article you posted (btw, are you sure you’re a professor? I wonder because your reading skills beg the question sometimes.) “The `gay lobby’ is mentioned, and it is true, it is there … We need to see what we can do …” OK, YFC, do you see where the Pope says, “We need to see what we can do” … about the gay lobby. Very clear, YFC, that the Pope intends to have us all get rid of this gay lobby corruption. The article mentions “private audience”: sure, and little elves make gifts in the off Christmas season in Santa’s workshop at the north pole, too.
YFC, you should study the scene that has reared its head for decades behind the papal constraints. Intimidation is the obvious translation … and guess who the intimidators would happen to be … yep, you got it, the gay lobby. Pope Francis is telling the world that it is time to minimize the gay agenda and that there are holy men and women in the Vatican more than willing to get on with it … but they need our the help they can get.
Skai there are no real quotes from the meeting. It was all reconstructed after the fact. Besides which, you may recall that “we” means “I” in pope-speak. And if he wanted to ask you to get rid if gays he certainly has the intellect to ask you more directly and clearly.
Also, I want to thank you for your continued attacks upon me and my skills. I wear your insults as the wounds of Christ, through whom I shall see the face of God.
YFC, now that I see that your post indicates you’re in the mood, I have a bridge to sell you. Send the money first, and then I’ll tell where to pick up the bridge.
I wouldn’t look for Pope Francis to take on the gay lobby anytime soon, Skai. He’s already on another topic, like condemning what cars priests and religious drive and updating laws in the Vatican. Did he do anything about it in Argentina?
Dana, in Argentina they all eat cake.
Angelu, I am humbled by your kindness. I thank God for His mercy. God bless you.
MarkfromPA, You know very well that “Angelu” is a fellow homosexual lobbyist. Why are you taking credit for your humility when you have been rejecting Christ’s love and betraying Christ’s Church on anti-Catholic websites for quite some time. You and fellow lobbyist Angelu are still betraying Christ and it should be far more important for the both of you to be humbled by Christ’s redemptive sacrifice on the Cross. You are only humbled by your mutual admiration and respect of homosexuality. That is a fleeting and meaningless goal. Your goal should be heaven.
California Catholic Daily upholds all of the teachings of the Catholic Church and there are many homosexual trolls who know this so they support your homosexual activism with homosexual heresy. Christ died on the Cross for all sinners. Christ knew the terrible sins that man could inflict upon each other and upon oneself. Mark you are inflicting sin upon yourself.
Would you have ever asked Jesus Christ to “lighten up” when he showed the world just how much he loved us in order to redeem us from all sin. Mark, Christ did not suffer the agony in the garden, the scourging at the pillar, the crowning of thorns and the carrying of the cross and the crucifixion for no reason. Christ suffered and died on a cross for our cumulative sinfulness. You are in essence telling Angelu that it is good to “lighten up” about the seriousness of certain sins. It is a mortal sin to call yourself a Catholic and also claim that Christ’s true Church on earth needs “Queering Up” and the fact that you are attached to this abominably named website is a very serious matter.
The regular lobbyists and enablers of sin, such as yourself, and the trolls that are visiting CCD are anti Catholic. You do not want to reform your lives. You want to reform Christ and reform the Church that Christ founded. You will lose. Lucifer thought that he could reform Christ too and you are his newest workers. Lucifer has used your weakness to attack Christ’s Church from within. You have been terribly misguided by many wolves in sheep’s clothing from within the Church. Some have been very high ranking wolves who have caused many to think that they are following a good path. The angels who initially were good but then chose to follow Lucifer are now joined with him in hell. Be wary of the name “Angelu” and where that darkness comes from. How fitting for another Judas to also choose to distort the beautiful word Angel to disguise his evil agenda. Mark I would like you to be more humbled by the sacrifice of Christ for all sinners. It is you and “Angelu” who are mortally sinning against Christ’s hospitality to mankind when suffered an agonizing death in order to redeem sinners. You are turning homosexuality into the god that will bring happiness and redemption. That is a lie.
Mark the Catholic Church is the Mystical Body of Christ. How very sad must Our Lady be when her most favored sons are leading souls directly to hell with false teachings and false hopes that are not based on a love and obedience in giving thanksgiving to Almighty God for sending his only begotten Son to redeem us.
Mark how lost and how far must one fall to not see that a website titled ‘Queering the Church’ is not demonic? You would not have stood at the foot of the cross and looked up and told Jesus Christ to lighten up his stereotypical pleas for us to stop sinning as he was hanging on the cross dying but you ARE doing this today with the help of like-minded individuals who enable you to still betray Christ. Mark, you are not being humble when you attack Christ and call Christ’s salvific mission, stereotypical. You are deceiving yourself and you are being deceived by those who post lies that enable you to continue your betrayal of Christ. Mark do not be fooled by Cardinals or Bishops that would join you in calling Christ’s pleas for us to stop sinning “stereotypical” for they are the modern day Judases who have sold their souls. This is what Our Lady of Akita meant when she said that many priests had compromised the faith. Will you follow Judas or will you finally repent and tell God how sorry you are for calling Christ “stereotypical” for not wanting you to lose your eternal life? Mark, God does not bless disobedience. How would it have sounded if Judas said “God Bless You” to Christ right as he was betraying him for 30 pieces of silver. That is what you did in your post below. You are praising a man for living in mortal sin and then saying God Bless you for living in mortal sin. You are demonstrating the diabolical disorientation of our time. Mark you and Angelu are both offending God.
Taken from Queering the Church
Mark from PA
December 30, 2010 at 9:06 pm
That is so nice. Thanks for sharing “Grandpa.” Too bad you can’t post this one on California Catholic Daily. Some of the people there truly need to lighten up. I get so annoyed by the prejudice and stereotypes sometimes. One picture is sometimes worth a thousand words. God bless you.
Catherine, just to let you and other readers know, when I read and remarked on “Angelu’s” posts, a strange feeling manifested. I’ve experienced something similar in the past, maybe more than once. I associate it with spiritual darkness. I think I’ll apply some holy water because of it.
Skai when you wrote,
“Catherine, just to let you and other readers know, when I read and remarked on “Angelu’s” posts, a strange feeling manifested. ”
I understand what you mean! The devil never sleeps.
Epistle of St. Paul to the Romans Chapter 5
[19] For as by the disobedience of one man, many were made sinners; so also by the obedience of one, many shall be made just. [20] Now the law entered in, that sin might abound. And where sin abounded, grace did more abound….Douay-Rheims Catholic Bible.
Creepy spying on fellow CCD posters like this Catherine does, and reading him like that for something he wrote 3 years ago in a completely different context.
You obviously go to the same website you are criticizing him for going to. You are then guilty also. In fact, Catherine, your sins are graver than his. Take your own advice and repent. Also, you wrongly characterize me as a homosexual lobbyist. I am a client of the Blessed Mother. My name is not evil. The Lord is losing patience with you and the others who exploit His Church, His Name, His Holy Word and His Saints to rip the flesh of your neighbor. The time is as short for you as it is for all of us. Repent soon. Confess all these things that you wrote here.
Dana, Mark apparently said (3 YEARS ago mind you) that readers and commenters of this blog need to lighten up. He didn’t say Jesus needed to lighten up. I know you think highly of yourself, but don’t you think that goes a bit far? And from this comment, you deduce that Mark and by extension Angelu reject Christs’ love and betray the Church. Really?? “Lighten up” seems to be the least of what you need to do.
Where did I say that Mark should lighten up, YFC? My goodness, I was defending Mark and you scold me! My comment about laughing at oneself and levity was directed at Francis, because of my goofy joking about his writing a book. Mark doesn’t have to lighten up. And ironically, I don’t think ‘well of myself’ as you implied. I’m sorry if I come across that way…nothing could be further from the truth. Being the youngest of five means developing a thick skin or getting lost in the shuffle, but one is never conceited, believe me! Are you sure you were referring to one of my posts?
Dana perhaps there was some confusion. Mark was recently referenced here on ccd as having 3 years ago for wishing that posters on ccd would lighten up.
YFC, what would you expect PA to be saying, other than to persuade people to lighten up so’s he could then stick it to them?
Dana I am not seeing a post where you defend Mark and his comment from 3 years ago. If I missed it, can you please refer me to the reference so iI can offer apologies if I misinterpreted something?
Sorry Dana, I meant this post for Catherine. My apologies.
Catherine, Terence used to post here regularly. He hasn’t posted in a long time. I believe I was referring to a picture that he posted of himself with his grandchildren. I thought that perhaps if some of the posters saw the picture that they would think different of the man. I have commented on that site many times but not as much as here. I have never had an unkind comment directed at me at that site. Never. I think of people according to how they treat me. I have been very fortunate in my life in that people I know have always treated me with respect and kindness, with only very few exceptions. At times I have been treated with disdain by strangers, but my thought then was, who are you to judge me. I thank God for my blessings.
Do you know the two indulgenced morning prayers?
Angelu, the tone and “feel” of your post suggests that you might be sociopathic or paranoid. Which of these is the case?
I am neither. I feel like you should tone it down. It is heartbreaking to see this kind of sinfulness on a Catholic website.
Angelu, read Jesus in the Gospel, and see that He is not Mr. Milktoast. Babies in Christ need milk; adults need meat. Not so good to mix the two together, so seek and you shall find Jesus.
If you’re still here, Angelu, don’t give up. It was kind of you to defend Mark. He is certainly not an evil person. He is very sweet and reminds me a bit of Liberace who always had a big smile on his face, even while he was talking. I really don’t like censorship or silencing people when they try to express how they feel. Sorry for the joke…brevity before levity must be my new motto. ;o) I’m find that very people like laughing at themselves. I suppose that’s why I have always loved Jane Austen’s novels…she gets the joke.
Dana, thanks for calling me sweet. I don’t know if I smile much, I am kind of serious, I wish I was good at smiling. For some reason I find the comparison to Liberace somewhat creepy though. I am not flashy like he was.
Angelu, Mark PA encourages so-called same-sex marriages. One who does that is not a saint by any means.
“no bishop is perfect. They are human beings. They are men”: PA, your nun teachers must have inculcated the fable in your then young mind that women are good, men are bad and that is all she wrote. But, like with the rest of your Calvinist fatalism in Catholic form, your posts gradually begin to reveal your Mannichean dualist theology, condemend by the Church, especially via St Augustine, Doctor of the Church. Your persistent passive denial that the Holy Eucharist has anything to do with God and man uniting is your central problem. If you ever get around to professing the Church faith on the Holy Eucharist, then all the rest of your false doctrines will crumble away and you’ll finally experience what authentic Catholicism feels like.
Skai, I believe what the Church teaches about the Holy Eucharist.
Mark, I don’t know why he did that. I think a lot of people who post here don’t like that sort of thing and just stay silent. It’s too bad he has to do that. Maybe he thought other posters would believe him and start to attack you too. God bless you. How is your dad and your wife?
Thank you, Anonymous. My dad is hanging in there. He sleeps a lot but doesn’t mind the heat. I wish that I could get him to eat better, he doesn’t like to eat, but he didn’t eat well for my mom either and she was the best cook. She really waited on him hand and foot, I now realize. I miss my mom’s cooking. My dad is in better shape than I would be if I ate and drank what he did. My wife is doing OK. She is on disability and this has been good for her health. I feel bad because she cut her finger the other day. The heat bothers her though so we are waiting for it to cool off here. Glad I don’t live in Arizona, Texas, Florida or someplace where it is really hot. I think San Francisco is nice this time of year but I have never been there either.
Is her finger OK? Did she have to go to ER? I will pray for them and you. Will you pray for one of my family members who is trying to transition to assisted living and has several serious diseases, please?
Her finger just looks nasty. It bled a lot and she had to keep changing bandages. I just said a prayers for your family member. Blessing to you.
Mark from PA, thank you. I hope your wife’s finger heals quickly. God bless you, your dad, your wife, your son and all those who you love and all those who love you.
Thank you so much, Anonymous, you are so kind. I was praying for you today.
I do see your point, but at times you get a little carried away by putting them all in one basket. I do not always vote the way a bishop might want in my area either if a far more knowledgable or holier bishop disagrees with him, especially the Bishop of Rome.
Skai, we repectfully asked for a bishop to allow the Tradintine Mass (Extraordianry Mass) in our area when the Holy Fathers John Paul II and Benedict left the decision up to the bishops. Ours allowed it, so I wrote a letter thanking him for do so. We must treat the office of bishop with respect, even when we might disagree on something that is not criminal.
Anne T., “office of bishop” is a fiction; there is no such thing except in the imagination.
See the Decree concerning the Office of the Bishop on the Vatican website.
Sorry, Skai, but that “office” of the bishop is in the Bible.
Anne T what we are discussing here is the crookedness…they don’t cancel controversial speakers that are pro-gay or abortion….but this they do? Come on Anne give Skai some slack here…..aren’t you reading all the common sense here?
Anne T., how would a corrupt bishop know what is opposed to Church teaching? I think that would be impossible.
Skai, I understand that you are a self-taught Catholic and I understand that you came to the Church through evangelicalism which is antagonistic to the hierarchy. You do not really understand yet why God desires this. Do you know that there is a hierarchy in heaven? Do you understand the 9 choirs of angels? Priests are required to obey their bishops in all things except sin. Bishops don’t usually give commands to the laity in general. They may request or encourage things. If a bishop excommunicates someone, they need to obey. Same with an interdict or a private or public communication that one needs to refrain from receiving communion.
Anonymous, you’re in the ballpark, but rather vaguely. Let me ask you here: How many hours would you say that you’ve spent studying Saints, Doctors of the Church, Scripture, other Magisterial documents? I’m guessing maybe a few hundred hours, judging from your post. But maybe something I posted has you wondering … and this is my objective.
No, Anonymous, I’m not a “self taught” Catholic; rather I’m a “self learned” Catholic. I prefer to believe that the Holy Spirit has had something to do with my Catholicism. Of course there are also the Saints: Anonymous, do you believe the Saints and angels have anything to do with the lives of the faithful, or do you believe that they are more like museum pieces?
I believe in the Communion of Saints. I believe in the ministry of angels. I think you are wise to understand that the Holy Spirit is necessary to understand Catholicism.
When Cardinal Dolan was gushing over his first visit to a mosque and muslim school a few weeks ago, saying things like: “You love God, we love God and he is the same God,” — the veiled muslim mother of a 2nd grader that he greets says to him “actually my mom and my dad are both Catholics.”
I can just see it, Dotty! How amusing!
And if she leaves Islam now, she can be killed by jihadist. By Shariah Law anyone who leaves Islam can and should be killed. These people are playing with fire and have no idea that they are.
Why am I not surprised about Cardinal Dolan…sad to say that I feel that he is lukewarm and maybe lead by fear……too much negative stuff….we need a break and need something positive to move us and refresh us in the right direction…God have mercy!
You’re right, Abeca. Time for a rosary break or some Bible reading. Yikes! Too many negative thoughts can make us ill, and I’m just recuperating. Tornado went by about a mile from our house yesterday, black as night in afternoon. Now that puts things in perspective, believe me!
Dana, glad you are safe and getting over illness. Rosary, Bible and Year of Faith devotions (praying the Creed and the Act of Faith, learning the CCC and the history of the Faith.)
Dana I agree..time for a break and time for prayer time…..keeping our focus on Christ’s love and mercy…..
I agree with you and I am grateful that you and your family are doing well. God bless you and protect you. Whew let us realize how blessed we are to be safe…let us not take for granted.
I think a lot of this decision has to do with the fact that Robert Spencer’s life has been threatened by jihadists.
If that is the case then we should all be hiding out in caves. The radical jihadists consider all of us Christians, infideles and if we don’t submit to Islam (their version) then off with our heads! We live in the USA not some Islamist country at least not yet. Sorry not buying or considering that was Bishop Soto’s reason. Church leaders must not acquiesce to the pc crowd. Too many men especially in the Church have been made into cowards.
While Robert Spencer’s heart may be in the right place, his facts are often inaccurate and in the end he destroys the credibility of his basic message. And he ends up getting written off as a kook which is unfortunate.
Catholic Answers printed his most recent book and he is a frequent guest on Al Kresta’s radio show and other prominant Catholic venues. I suppose the secular culture trys to pawn off what he says as kookie but no one I know or respect feels he is in anyway rash, kookie or lacks credibility. Obviously you show your own prejudice. From Wikipedia: Spencer received a B.A. in 1983 and an M.A. in 1986 in religious studies from the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill. His masters thesis was on Catholic history. He has said he has been studying Islamic theology, law, and history on his own since 1980. He worked in think tanks for more than 20 years, and in 2002–2003 did a stint as an adjunct fellow with the Free Congress Foundation, an arm of the Heritage Foundation. Spencer named Paul Weyrich, also a Melkite Catholic, as a mentor of his writings on Islam. Spencer writes, “Paul Weyrich taught me a great deal, by word and by example – about how to deal both personally and professionally with the slanders and smears that are a daily aspect of this work.” Spencer’s first book on Islam was published in 2002.
Your slur and sly innuendo DaveN are repellent but unfortunately VERY typical.
PS Anyone who reads many of my posts (God help you ;o) ) know I quote Robert Spencer all the time. He’s one of the few voices addressing what I see as one of the foremost threats facing our current day and age. If Catholics cannot see that our faith is the only true way to salvation and that islam is in direct opposition to that, then we are in more trouble than they can possibly know.
DANA AMEN! Your pretty much summed it up well….we love you and appreciate your care for the truth and our faith!
Thank you Abeca…I appreciate your support since I think the ‘we’ is just thee. heh heh I checked out the debate that Jay recommended on youtube (goodmuslim/bad muslim) between Peter Kreeft and Robt Spencer, hosted by John Zmirak ( Bad Catholic guides) at Thomas More College and it is really excellent. I hope many here watch it, as it is very thought provoking. Dr. Kreeft is so brilliant and kind but was no match on debating islam, nor did he claim to be. One thought came to me toward the end of the debate when they were talking about how muslims believed in having 4 wives, etc. and it reminded me of a point I’d made in another discussion about how I believed the homosexuals were being used to promote someone else’s agenda and then I saw it as clear as day. The WhiteHouse occupier is backing same sex marriage because nothing would bring about the demise of traditional one man/one woman marriage than this…and who would profit from this most of all? Very few homosexuals are that interested in marriage…it is the muslims who would gain. As it is, it is currently illegal to have more than one husband or wife. By negating traditional marriage, anything goes, and the muslims won’t have to enforce sharia law…they’ll be able to openly live with multiple wives and legally get welfare etc. for all of them and their children. It boggles the mind how all their ducks are being put in a row. According to Dr.Spencer, the muslims are at the tipping point or even more and we will see ever more violence.
Dana, I have been thinking that all along, but you know who will be guarding those rich men’s harems as you know whats? Don’t you? Yep, the very men who helped get rid of the one man one woman marriage laws. It will come back to bite them.
Excellent insight, Dana. But it has me thinking … what if I win the mega lotto? I could support many wives … and concubines … hmn.
Great posts Dana!
Thank you sister in Christ! I feel such a burden about this. Every where I turn I see the muslim influence anymore…I was trying to download CBC (canadian broadcasting) app and what came up was a free muslim tv app! What is that? You watch the news and all the media covers is the middle east. You would think no other geographical area even mattered anymore. I think if they want to cover the middle east then they should focus on the poisonous spiders are spinning in saudi arabia…the epicenter of the whole terror thing. What we’re doing in Afghanistan is anyone’s guess.
Dave N.
Don’t b.s. us. If you have some alleged facts that Spencer has quoted, give them to us, other wise shut the heck up!
May God have mercy on all compromisers with evil.
Kenneth M. Fisher
Have you ever read the Koran or hadiths from Muslim sites on line, Dave N.? I doubt it.
Name one example, Dave N.
What is very troubling about the Church’s stance on Islam today is reflected in Pope Francis’ comment: “I also think with affection of those Muslim immigrants who this evening begin the fast of Ramadan, which I trust will bear abundant spiritual fruit. The Church is at your side as you seek a more dignified life for yourselves and your families. To all of you: o’scià!” (7/8/13)
How can there be spiritual fruit in a false religion? In a religion that is killing Christians left and right? Thanks to the ‘spirit’ of Vatican II, the popes, bishops and priests are no longer courageous enough to declare the truth. False ecumenism obviously is to be favored over the truth. We are in very dark times indeed. Domine, miserere nobis. +JMJ+
Agreed. If the Church leadership is keeping quiet on many “political” issues in order to avoid losing their tax exempt status, they most certainly will lose it when Sharia takes over and they’re required to pay the dhimmi tax in order to avoid extermination.
Two points: First: I don’t think a religion kills people, Clinton, though people may kill in the name of religion. Catholicism, for instance, doesn’t kill people, but certainly people have been killed in the name of Catholicism.
Second: Catholicism is not the sole source of truth. It may contain the complete truth (though I admit, I struggle with this doctrine of faith) but it is not the only place to find truth. This fact was not only emphasized by the Second Vatican Council but one that has been asserted for at least a millenia, going back to the scholastics, and even St Thomas, Doctor of the Church. Pope Francis is seems to be emphasizing the fact that fasting is good for the soul. I think we can all agree that fasting, and prayer, and alms giving (three of the five pillars of Islam) are essential good.
Is Islam perfect? I wouldn’t say so… or I would be a Muslim. But I can certainly see that there is goodness and truth to be found their – even if it is incomplete.
I find not St. Peter’s comment a tragedy of more confusion…..this is why we need this speaker to continue doing his work and more to support him. What is discouraging is these comments “Is Islam perfect? I wouldn’t say so… or I would be a Muslim.”…….no man made religion is perfect, but only Christ’s Christianity is but not man. So we follow Christ knowing that His church us run by imperfect people. Take a look at Christ’s disciples….one denied Him 3 times, one betrayed Him and He was chosen as a disciple. We are know Christ through those imperfections to find the real Him. It is Christ who picks up the sinner and makes new. NO one else can create something out of nothing. Since we are not perfect ourselves, but we can discern this by persevering in Christ’s church and continually seek to bond with Him more and more daily. That is why we are to approach our Lord like a little child. Seeing things in an innocent path, one that helps one submit self to what our Lord says….
You dare call yourself St.Peter when you sound like Pontius Pilate? He didn’t know what truth was either but at least he didn’t call himself St.Peter. Call a spade a spade, judas. There is only one truth and it is not a thing but a person…Jesus is the way, the life and the Truth. Can you say, “Jesus is Lord?” Try saying it out loud.
Dana and Abeca, perhaps I was unclear. Everything I said was orthodox, and has been considered orthodox for hundreds of years, so perhaps I should clarify what I meant.
While it is an article of faith to believe that capital “T” Truth can be found in its totality in the Catholic Church, elements of this Truth can be found elsewhere as well. If a Muslim – or Jew or Hindu or Parsi – finds that she believes in one God who is Creator of Heaven and Earth, is this not an element of the Truth that she shares with Catholicism? If a Muslim – or Atheist or Taoist or Sikh – finds that he believes it is good to love your neighbor as yourself, is this not an element of Truth he shares with Catholicism?
In his Summa Theological, Thomas Aquinas famously presents 5 ways in which anyone can examine basic philosophical concepts like cause and effect and come to the conclusion that God exists. This exercise is an affirmation that elements of Truth are accessible to ALL people, despite their faith.
I therefor contend that, while Islam (or any other religion) may not be perfectly True and perfectly good, it is certainly not utterly false nor utterly bad. One must try to recognize the good in all things, because then one can find where God resides in all things.
Yes, and I can see your problem…it’s a complex idea that has to really spelled out, no? Michael Voris talked about that very issue today on Militant TV on Cd. Dolan’s recent controversial statement to the muslims. He pretty much reiterated what you said. Thanks for explaining…such a relief! ;O) Also, I agree with Hilaire Belloc that islam is a Christian heresy and that many elements are taken directly from Christian teachings and Hebrew scriptures, so there’s bound to be truths to be found. I hope you can find the time to watch the debate that Jay had recommended. You sound alot like Dr. Kreeft. God bless.
S.P., try to work your way through your stage of naiivite’, no matter how many years it might take you.
If you happened to follow the BBC program “Garrow’s Law” you would know that protestant England in the late 18th century was far more cruel than anything in the Old Testament. Hanging 12 year olds for petty theft, for one example. And many innocent people were trapped by professions “theif catchers.” Perhaps the bishop was afraid the church would get bombed. That has happened. Followers of Islam can be very violent.
ann r,
You didn’t mention St. Margaret Clithrow who was PRESSED along with the in the womb child on London Bridge by those nice Protest-Ant Church of England followers. I would describe what PRESSED means but many of you could not stand it.
By the way, she predicted that Henry VIII would spread his guts over England. Guess, what he burst his guts when he died and the stench was so bad that no one could go near for a long time.
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
St. Mgt. Clithrow was such an amazing woman and saint. Thanks for sharing that, Kenneth!
Mr. Spencer wasn’t allowed to speak on church property in the Diocese of Worcester not long ago, too. And it seems the militants have a petition to have the bishop where Mr. Spencer lives strip him of being a deacon, as well.
Seems like he is doing something right, but it also points out how many of the bishops have no backbone.
It’s sad isn’t it, Bob? Our hearts should be heavy for all the lost souls in islam, and like St.Francis, we should be trying to convert them to the truth and love of our beautiful Church built on the rock of Peter…the Bride or Christ, whose love enfolded all sinners. Shouldn’t we all feel a burden for these people that live in such darkness? First we must identify that their faith is one of darkness , which is why I’m always stridently condemning the religion but not the people. They are the same as all of us, equal in the eyes of God…why do we feel it’s okay to accept their errors? Everyone should seriously read what the koran really teaches. Would you want your children to accept this? Is it Christian love to leave people in darkness? We have lost our way from the time of the great missions. We no longer really believe that Jesus is the Way, the Truth and the Life and that only through Him may we come to the Father, apparently. We have bought into the lie that we must respect other faiths as equal to our own…satan must be gloating that we are tying our own hands and enabling his dark works to grow exponentially.
I remember watching a YouTube not long ago where a bunch of Christians were carrying signs at a Muslim get-together in Michigan (which has the greatest concentration of Muslims in the U.S., I’ve heard). The cops came in and rousted the Christians, did something with their camera and moved them away from public streets while the Muslim crowd seemed about to lose control. There was another incident somewhere else a few years ago, too.
The point is, the police are more than willing to take action against Christians and everyone is supposed to make nice and accommodate Muslim wishes (there was the school district in Michigan that has allowed Muslim children to say prayers in school and wasn’t there a Catholic college that has a Muslim prayer room?) that having (more) one-sided laws protecting whatever they say and do will be legally protected.
What’s wrong with a room for Muslims to pray in?
Shouldn’t we be encouraging prayers?
It’s the content and direction of the prayers that are critical, dude, not the fact of praying.
“Shouldn’t we be encouraging prayers?”
You are not interested in prayer. You are interested in creating doubt, confusion and turmoil.
Matthew 16:23 Douay-Rheims Bible
Who turning, said to Peter: Get behind me, Satan, thou art a scandal unto me: because thou savourest not the things that are of God, but the things that are of men.
Not St. Peter…..is that all you got from those comments….what is wrong with people’s common sense today….I see there is hardly any.
Skai, I agree the content and the direction of prayer is very important. The typical daily prayer prayed five times a day (and translated into English) would begin like this:
“God is the Greatest!
Praise and glory be to You, O God.
Blessed be Your Name, exalted be Your Majesty and Glory.
There is no other god but You.
I seek God’s shelter from Satan, the condemned.
In the Name of God, the most compassionate, the most merciful.
Praise be to God, Lord of the universe,
the most compassionate, the most merciful!
Master of the day for judgment!
You alone do we worship and You alone do we call on for help.
Guide us along the straight path,
The path of those whom You have favored,
Not the path of those who earned Your anger, nor of those who went astray.
Amen.”
Will all their prayers be Orthodox? No. They don’t believe Jesus is the Christ, but merely a prophet, they deny the triune nature of God, and other basic elements of Christian faith.
But the content of this daily prayer: primarily praise, and the direction of this prayer: God – seems a good way to start the day.
What’s wrong with a room for muslimsto pray in..when Christian students can’t even wear a cross or hold Christian meetings after school? Is it only muslims that warrant this? I think the point Bob was making was there’s a bizarre trend in favoring muslims, who are truly not interested in American values ( and if you believe they are, you are really gullible, and as Abeca just said, lacking common sense) as opposed to persecuting Christians in our own country, in our own schools built on Judeo-Christian values. Muslims can even opt out of obama care. All the good that muslims do is for themselves, ‘St.Peter’, all their prayers are for themselves, their entire construct system is centered around themselves and believe me, we’re none of us in their radar except as victims if we don’t submit. I guess I retract my relief I expressed earlier. You think you’re being such a good person by seeing all the good in islam but friend, we’re called to be Christian soldiers…that’s why we’re called the Church Militant, and it’s our watch and we’re supposed to be alert and on duty 24/7 and the views you express have no place in the war against evil and defense of Mother Church. You are aiding and abetting the enemy.
St. Peter, Muslims do not need a room of their own in a public school or anywhere else for prayer. Many teachers go to the lunchroom, an empty classroom or their own empty classroom room to pray and meditate quietly. Students usually can find a quiet place outside during lunch or recess to sit down and pray or meditate. If there is a meditation room for prayer in any secular public building, it should be for everyone to go there and quietly read their Bible, Koran or another book of meditation,or silently pray their beads. No other religion is given its own prayer room. espeically in public schools, so Muslims do not need one either. It would not be fair.
S.P., we Catholics pray in the Name of Jesus. Have you ever considered the heart? What does the Muslim prayer you quoted have to do with directing a soul to God? Jesus is the way to God. I had a renter who was a devout Muslim, originally from Palestine. He was holed up here while on the outs with his wife. Three grown kids. He was eager to explain Islam to me, but his ear was not open even a crack to hear anything having to do with Catholicism. The Islam prayer might serve to awaken the seeking instinct in some souls, but not all, not even most. You evidently are acquainted with Islam only hypothetically. Go forth and try to engage a Muslim in conversation that includes Catholicism. Then tell us what you found out.
Skai, this is a long response, but I hope you have the time to read this as I am trying to address your points.
First, I am well aware that Muslims don’t pray to Jesus, nor in the name of Jesus, and most faithful Muslims consider Christianity’s greatest flaw the belief that Jesus was not only a human but God, because it offends their understanding of the unique Oneness of God. But I have, as you say, considered the heart, and have come to the conclusion that only Christ can judge the heart.
I also know what I have read in the Gospels. In this case, I look to Matthew and Christ’s parable in which, on the Day of Judgement, the righteous and unrighteous are separated. “The Son of Man” tells the righteous that they are welcomed into the Kingdom of God because, “I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, I needed clothes and you clothed me.” The righteous are shocked, saying they had never done anything of the sort. Christ corrects them and declares that when they did it for the “least”, they did it for Christ. I conclude, as has the Church, that one can pray to Christ in the form of corporal mercy without even knowing that one is doing so.
One last point. I *have* engaged Muslims in dialogue, including dialogue concerning faith. I have prayed in Churches with Muslims. I have prayed in Mosques with Muslims. I have gone to a monastic retreat with Muslims. I have worked in a Catholic school in which a fellow educator – who was Muslim – was a greater supporter of the mission, Charism, and faith of the school then a number of the professed Catholics. I have met some who are very hostile to Christianity, many who care very little either way about Christianity, and some who find much that is good in Christianity.
This is what I have found out from these engagements: it is dangerous to assume that all Muslims (or protestants, or Hindus, or gays, or republicans, or Canadians, etc., etc.,) act as a monolithic whole.
Amen to what Catherine, Dana and Skai said….
Lot of souls lost in other groups besides Islam. We should pray for all souls. The issue is the dispute between the western concept of freedom and the Muslim concept of oppression. Some people prefer one and others prefer the other.
Bishops would be motivated against home schooling since it cuts the possible attendance in their church schools. All about money … Corrupt bishops push the world, the flesh and the devil.
It’s good we have a Jihad Watch. Now we need, and have needed for a long time, is an AIPAC Watch.
“AIRHEAD” Watch ?? Oh, I misread it. Must be some kind of bishop watch. But that would be like watching the grass over a grave grow and reflecting on what the streets of Hell are paved with.
Gutless.
There is a fascinating debate on YouTube between Robert Spencer and Catholic philosophy professor Dr. Peter Kreeft. It’s entitled “Good Muslim/Bad Muslim”. I encourage everyone to check it out.
I have read both their books on the subject, Jay, and although I like Dr. Peter Kreeft, I find him somewhat naive on the subject of Islam. I go with Hellaire Belloc and G.K. Chesterson when it comes to that subject. “Walk with them where they are right and part with them were they are wrong”, and keep an eye open realizing that many of them do not have good intentions. I was born a “Doubting Thomas”, even though I was born in California, I should have been born in “The Show Me State”.
It’s a two hour debate, I began it and will watch the rest as time permits. Very well done debate.
This is what Robert Spencer says on his blog:
“There is a great and growing divide. On the one side, we have Muslims increasingly victimizing and persecuting Christians, including bishops, in Egypt, Nigeria, Syria, Iraq, Pakistan, Indonesia, and elsewhere. On the other side, we have bishops like Robert McManus of Worcester, Massachusetts and now Jaime Soto of Sacramento, California, both of whom canceled me from speaking because I speak honestly about that persecution and what causes it.
Ironically, Soto canceled me just as the National Catholic Register was calling me “perhaps the foremost Catholic expert on Islam in our country.” This also illustrates the divide. To some people I am a racist, Islamophobic villain; to others, an honest exponent of the truth about Islam and jihad. To some Catholics I am unacceptable to speak on these issues; to others I am the foremost expert on them in the country.
I do not know how this divide can or will be bridged; I do know that one side is trying to bridge it not through discussion and debate, but through defamation and demonization, so that my point of view is not taken up and examined, discussed and accepted or rejected, but simply marginalized. And Bishop Soto, apparently uncritically and without examination, took the bait. He caved in to a highly defamatory smear campaign led by the stalker Nathan Lean, a man who works for a Board member of a front group for the Islamic Republic of Iran. Soto did this without giving me the courtesy of a chance to address the accusations against me. Nor did he acknowledge the petition signed by 1,500 people, asking that he allow me to speak. (Many, many thanks to all who signed and who wrote to him.) Nor did he seem to notice that I wasn’t even slated to speak about the topic — Islamic jihad — that has the enablers of jihad so desperate to silence me.
Jaime Soto is kowtowing to the heckler’s veto and doing the bidding of those who want to silence people who speak out against the persecution of his fellow Christians. This would scandalize me more than it does were it not for the fact that so many bishops in our own age and throughout history have participated in or winked at monstrous evils. It is clear that a bishop’s mitre in the Roman Catholic Church (and other Churches) doesn’t confer wisdom, discernment, or — as is clear in the case of both McManus and Soto — even basic Christian courtesy. But bishops were complicit in the sex scandals that have wracked the Church in America for decades now; bishops were complicit in the monetary scandals in the Vatican in the 1980s; saints from Athanasius to John Fisher and before and after both were persecuted by bishops — the moral cowardice of Jaime Soto and Robert McManus is a small thing in the annals of bishops behaving badly.
That said, Kolbe Academy is made of stronger stuff. The conference will go on as planned, albeit in a new venue where the bishop cannot quash it. Meanwhile, the smear campaign goes on. I published in the Napa Valley Register today yet another response to a piece praising Soto and calling on Kolbe to cancel me altogether. They’re getting desperate, as is evidenced by the shrill tone and outright lies in the piece to which I was replying, “Kolbe Academy, Robert Spencer and religious liberty,” by Lawrence Swaim.
How odd that they’d be desperate when the cowardice and myopia of so many in authority are enabling them to rack up victories everywhere. But there is one weapon I have that they fear above all, and that they know that all their power and influence, and all their pumping-out of their Big Lies cannot counter: the truth. And that is why their desperation is only going to increase.
Here is my piece in today’s Register:
Why so desperate to silence me?
by Robert Spencer
It is remarkable to see the furious anxiety in certain circles that my upcoming speaking engagement at Kolbe Academy’s home school conference has engendered, and their willingness to spread outright lies in order to prevent my speaking.
In the July 7 Napa Register, Lawrence Swaim (“Kolbe Academy, Robert Spencer and religious liberty”), of the ironically named Interfaith Freedom Foundation, characterizes Stop Islamization of America (SIOA), an initiative of the organization that I lead with Pamela Geller, the American Freedom Defense Initiative (AFDI), as a “shrill and increasingly violent hate group.”
In reality, not only is AFDI/SIOA not “increasingly violent,” it is not violent at all. We have never advocated or condoned violence. No member of our group has ever been convicted, charged, arrested or even accused of committing any act of violence.
We have made our agenda clear in numerous public statements, calling for legal and political action to protect the freedom of speech and equality of rights of all before the law.
It’s bitterly ironic that at a time when millions of freedom-loving Egyptians and Turks are taking to the streets to protest against the Islamization of their governments and societies, that Swaim would tar an organization with the same goal in this country as “anti-Muslim.”
Millions of Muslims prefer not to live under the strictures of Islamic law, which mandates death for those who leave Islam, institutionalizes inequality for women and non-Muslims, and criminalizes criticism of Islam. We stand with those Muslims and for equality of rights. Does Lawrence Swaim, and his “Interfaith Freedom Foundation”?
Swaim’s claim that our group is “increasingly violent” is, in short, an outrageous libel, as is his claim that I pose “a clear and present threat to religious liberty.”
In reality, Islamic law mandates second-class status for non-Muslims, as has been made abundantly clear in recent years by the increasingly precarious position of Hindus in Bangladesh, Bahais in Iran, and Christians in Nigeria, Egypt, Pakistan, Indonesia and elsewhere in the Islamic world, as the provisions of that law have been reasserted (often violently).
In contrast to all that, we stand for the First Amendment protection of religious liberty for all people — including Muslims who accept U.S. law and are not working to implement the Muslim Brotherhood’s stated goal (according to a captured internal document) for the U.S. of “eliminating and destroying Western civilization from within and sabotaging its miserable house.”
Lawrence Swaim, by contrast, is no fan of the First Amendment at all, as is clear by his applause for the bishop of Sacramento for caving in to a disingenuous smear campaign, ignoring nearly 1,500 signers of a petition asking that I be allowed to speak, and canceling my appearance.
Kolbe Academy Home School is the one to be applauded, for showing that the freedom of speech extends even to those with views that the politically correct left may dislike, and now Swaim wants them to cancel my appearance as well.
Noteworthy, however, is that while Swaim claims that my “hateful rhetoric makes a mockery of the values that most Americans cherish,” he doesn’t adduce even a single example of this supposedly “hateful” rhetoric. He can’t produce a single “hateful” quote from me, even though I’ve published 12 books, hundreds of articles, and over 40,000 blog posts at JihadWatch.org.
There are also dozens of talks I’ve given and television appearances I’ve made over the years available on YouTube. All that material, and Swaim can’t produce a single example of my “hate speech.” Why? Because there isn’t any actual hate in what I write.
Swaim claims that at a recent conference in Tennessee “Geller and Spencer’s SIOA followers cheered at the mention of a mosque that was burned down.” We were actually at this conference, and saw no such cheering. Nor do we call for or condone the burning of mosques, which is what Swaim is implying. In reality, we have consistently condemned any targeting of innocent people and any vigilante action.
Nor, for that matter, were the people at that conference our “followers”; they were citizens from that area who were concerned about efforts to criminalize honest discussion of jihad terrorism — an effort that the Organization of Islamic Cooperation (OIC) has long been pursuing, and to which the FBI has shown itself to be increasingly open.
Swaim quotes Abraham Foxman of the Anti-Defamation League claiming that we promote “a conspiratorial anti-Muslim agenda under the pretext of fighting terrorism.” Actually, if anyone is pushing a conspiratorial agenda, it is groups like the Muslim Brotherhood and its allied groups in the U.S. such as the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR) and the Islamic Society of North America (ISNA).
It was not Pamela Geller and I, but Brotherhood operative Mohammed Akram, who declared that the Brotherhood organizations’ U.S. goal was “eliminating and destroying Western civilization from within,” as quoted above.
Swaim likens our efforts to the anti-Semitism that led to the Holocaust — another wild smear charge. Nowhere have we ever advocated that any innocent person be harmed in any way. Nowhere have we advocated anything like the anti-Semitic laws that National Socialist Germany adopted in the run-up to the Holocaust. The Jews in pre-World War II Germany were innocent victims of slanderous attacks.
There was no analogy to the 9/11 attacks, the Fort Hood jihad massacre or the Boston Marathon jihad murders among them. To claim that we cannot fight peacefully and lawfully against the ideology that led to those attacks because other people were falsely accused and persecuted decades ago is not just monstrously foolish and wrong-headed; it is also giving aid and comfort to those who perpetrated those attacks.
“By blaming all Muslims rather than the minority who are terrorists, hate-mongers like Spencer would deprive us of our best partners.” But Swaim does not, and cannot, adduce a single quotation from me in which I blame all Muslims for the minority who are terrorists.
In fact, since October 2003, I have had this notice at my website Jihad Watch: “Any Muslim who renounces violent jihad and dhimmitude is welcome to join in our anti-jihadist efforts.”
“Religious liberty is for all people,” says Lawrence Swaim, as he smears and defames me, tries to deprive me of the freedom of speech, and, with libelous false charges, paints a giant target on my back. The crowning irony is that in the midst of all his vitriol, he lectures us about compassion.
One wonders why he is so furiously anxious to make sure I don’t speak — even about a topic that has nothing to do with his charges against me. Why are he and his cohorts desperate to discredit and silence anyone who dares to enunciate truths he finds inconvenient? Why not meet me in open debate and refute me on level ground?
But that, of course, would expose his falsehoods to the light. Smearing me and running is easier.”
May we all rejoice that once again God has turned an evil into a positive — now more people know about Robert Spencer and his work. May God continue to bless him and his work. And may the Holy Spirit enlighten Bishop Soto and teach him how to be a true shepherd of the flock entrusted to him.
Thank you for posting this excellent column from Mr. Spencer, Brian. Wow, it makes me so sad, not just for our Church but for courageous Catholic men like Spencer who are not only NOT getting support from bishops, but are being betrayed by them. Who picks these bishops? What attributes are looked for when assessing who is to be chosen? When leadership is so needed in the world today, it would seem that those who are chosen are far too often yes men who lack inner conviction and act as business executives of a large corporation and not men of courage and spiritual strength, though some bishops certainly have those gifts. Michael Voris is another who is constantly being condemned by bishops, and he is so faithful to Church teachings. Let’s keep Mr. Spencer and his important work in our prayers, and ask that the Holy Spirit would begin to soften the hearts of so many of those lost to darkness, and who call the darkness light.
Pope Francis is condemning bishops for being hypocrites and gay lobbyists, and he is asking the laity to help get rid of these spiritually toxic pied pipers.
Hmm I can’t find any reference to that Skai. Is it in the same article as gene pooling and Muslims acting all persecutionally?
Looking at this censoring from another viewpoint, it could be that the reason for Bp Soto cancelling Spenser is that Spenser talks forever and would run up the electricity bill way too high for the bishop’s budget.
So tedious.
Reminds me of the anti-Catholic nonsense that comes from Protestants and others who see us as “foreign” and “dangerous” and “alien” and “weird.”
Who needs some character promoting “Jihad Watch” to come and speak?
What’s next…?
Papist Watch?
Jew Watch?
Mike, you’ll need more than slogans and sound bites to make any sense. This site actually uses facts, revelation, faith and reason, not to mention charity. Sans these, you make yourself look like a toadstool on a cow pie.
haha. Skai! Such vivid imagery !
MIKE I have to say I am disappointed in your comments. We are to educate our brothers and sisters….let us not forget that many leave the faith because they have been bought by the lies of those whom want to break them away from the real faith.
Skai is correct in his analogy of your comments….usually you speak the truth but this one just lost my attention. Please reconsider your view on this and seek the truth. Islam is a very dangerous religion and to me I consider it a cult!
I can see why some men would not protect the Islam religion…..after all they preach about dying and having orgies with tons of virgins….sick!
A very brave man indeed as is Ms. Pamela Geller.
These statements from Pope “Jorge” as he prefers to be called need to stop, is this man the leader of the Holy Roman Catholic Church or is he an Imam?? As for these defenders of the false faith called Islam, try living in Saudi Arabia for a week and tell me what you think! No rock music, alcohol, dancing, mixing of the sexes, bikinis, smoking, public kissing, hand holding, gay parade marches, women running around with short shorts, free speech, and of course no churches whatsover. Come on give it a try and tell me all about that religion of “peace” founded by a mass murderer and pedaphile. Islam is the state and the mosque it is a total way of life, it will never ever conform to western civilization!!!
I recently returned from visiting my daughter in Belgium. This (still in many ways) very Catholic country, where nearly no one works on Sunday, and even in the Flemish northern half, Catholic churches and wayside shrines dot the historic countryside everywhere, this country is however at a cross-roads. Not yet as far-gone as France: but in heavily Muslim-populated areas (like Hasslet, Genk, central city-Brussels, other towns), Catholic churches have to have sturdy metal-screen fences around them to keep them from being vandalized, graffiti’d, windows broken, or (occasionally) arsoned. Can you imagine if Catholics were to vandalize a mosque ANYWHERE how the media would headline that story? But our churches and shrines, toujours manure. On several occasions when we were approaching Muslim (distinguishable by their attire) people on the street, my daughter and son-in-law warned me only to speak German or Flemish, but not English: if they found out we were Americans, we were in for serious trouble. But you know, they are a religion of peace. You know. So, pipe-down, Mr Spencer: you are scaring the children.
Steve, the problem might not have been one of nationality but of thugs. Even if there were no religious or ethnic issue, those same thugs would likely be thugs anyway. Thugs look for the easiest prey.
I don’t agree Skai. It has nothing to do with thuggery or nationality but everything to do with blind obedience to what is written in the koran that promulgates violence against Jews and Christians. It is written in plain Arabic.
But, Dana, some or even many Muslims do not act violently or persecutionally towards westerners or Catholics. Although perhaps even these believe totally that fate would have mankind be either Muslim or Jimmuhtood. Hard to say, but the whole question is kind of moot with evil bishops leading Catholics and the world into evil snares, thus weakening the faith in Christ. If you compare the day to day life styles of most Catholics, Protestants, Jews, Buddhists, and Muslims you won’t find much difference. The evil bishops have dumbed down Catholicism to the level of the world, the flesh and the devil … in other words, the evil bishops have railed against pope after pope, saint after saint, and God to the point that not only the Church but the West is endangered by various groups of thugs.
Well, you have your work cut out for you, Skai. Have the bishops always been so weak or is it a malaise of recent origin? I know nothing of the role of bishops in the history of the Church but I do know they sure let down the Church in England under Henry VIII so apparently they’ve always been a problem. What is happening to the Church now is truly a scandal and I especially get rather heated whenever I think of a certain prince of the Church who seems to be a mastermind of playing the jolly, hail-fellow-well-met while at the same time allowing all sorts of egregious things to take place throughout the various churches in his keeping. I’d like to think his sly cunning is merely the result of bovine cupidity and not malicious intent. Blessed Bishop Sheen, pray for us.
Steve good comments…thank you for commenting the truth and what you have seen….I hope it wakes up people.
Abeca and Skai, that is the point that Robert Spencer makes in one of his books when he writes, “The only good muslim is a bad Muslim,” meaning the only good Muslim according to Christian thinking is one who does not follow the Koran and hadiths totally, especially about such things as marrying extremely young females.
Skai, I think it does need to be explored. My experience with the “conservative Catholics” who preach this obedience mantra, by the way I would call myself a conservative Catholic to differentiate myself from liberal Catholics. These “conservative ” Catholics and their apostolates are preaching the obedience mantra for one reason only and that is to keep their business in buisness. Most of these lay people derive their income from being able to work in dioceses. They have to look the other way when the bishop is allowing liturgical abuses and the homoheresy lobby runs wild. When a faithful Catholic or group of faithful Catholics speak out on these things they start with the obedience mantra and if that doesn’t work,they say and write uncharitable things to marginalize them. It is a very sick thing that they do this and justify it sometimes by misinterpreting what a particular saint said on the topic of obedience. It makes me sad that these otherwise good catholic organizations use such tactics. I stopped supporting them financially and volunteering. It just broke my heart what I saw. There are very few lay apostolates that actually aren’t afraid to speak the Truth even when fellow Catholics publicly attack them. If you can support these courageous faithful organizations, do it and join them. You probably will be attacked for doing so but we need to ban together to save the Church in the USA and save our country.
Excellent post Susanne!
Obedience is humility in action.
Humility: Wikipedia, “Humility (adjectival form: humble) is the quality of being modest or respectful.” Free Dictionary, ” modest opinion of one’s own importance or rank; meekness”. New Advent, “Humility in a higher and ethical sense is that by which a man has a modest estimate of his own worth, and submits himself to others.” So, Anonymous, you need to exercise some humility if you can find any and revise your stilted and arrogant doctrine. Study St Paul in his letter about “doulos” (greek) which means slave or servant … “serve”. We serve the Lord, Anonymous, not some corrupt, wicked, evil and n’er do well sorry excuse for a bishop: What do you think the Popes have been saying about these wolves in sheep’s clothing, Anonymous? Turn away from your stupid and mindless “pray, pay and obey” mantra and look into real Catholicism.
I agree with Catherine, Susanne. Thank you for your insights. I hadn’t realized this was going on.
Susanne, attacked?! You think so? I can hardly wait.
I had been planning on going to this Catholic Homeschooling Convention because 1) it was Catholic 2) it was about homeschooling 3) I’d get to visit St. Stephen’s (a very orthodox, traditional FSSP parish) as an added bonus.
I did not understand why Mr. Spencer was a speaker. Jihad Watch doesn’t strike me as being either Catholic or a homeschooling resource.
Now instead of obeying the bishop who wanted them to pull one speaker, they’re moving the whole convention off of diocesan property and to an undisclosed location (i.e. holiday inn or wherever they can get at the last minute) so that they can do whatever they wish without that pesky magisterium poking around.
Catholic? Hardly. About homeschooling? Sure doesn’t seem like it any more.
I’ll be skipping it and going to the Valley Home Educators in Modesto instead. With 80+ vendors and tons of speakers, it will definitely be about homeschooling, not just bashing someone’s faith. Catholic? Nope, but as protestants, at least they’re upfront about the fact that they don’t listen to the Church.
Please Note: I am a stereotypical Catholic homemaker/ homeschooling mom with a van and tons of kids who loves the Tridentine mass and homeschools because the local Catholic schools are too wishy-washy about the faith. I am not saying I agree with the bishop’s decision. I am not attacking the speaker. I am not defending Islam. I am saying that a Catholic homeschooling convention ought to be a convention about homeschooling that is faithful to the Church. I think we can do better than this.
Well, God bless you Homeschooling mom…what you’re doing is so important and I hope you find resources that will help in your work. Do you ever use Ignatius Press materials? They have a wonderful program to help homeschoolers and I hope you will keep reading the various articles on CCD. You’re right about Mr. Spencer not being especially helpful in homeschooling but I can’t agree that what we’re discussing here is about dissing someone else’s religion so much as emphasizing the importance of defending our own. It would be so lovely if everyone could live out his or her own faith in peace and encouragement, wouldn’t it?
Actually, I will be starting with the Ignatius Press faith and life curriculum in the fall with my kiddos (had just been using the little St. Joseph press books until now). I did not know that Ignatius had a special program for homeschoolers. Thank you for letting me know! I will have to look into that. Thanks again!
Mr. Spencer is very helpful and most qualified to speak on homeschooling, I believe he was a teacher at Kolby Academy. I guess some who post in here are terrified of controversial topics. Even though Mr. Spencer is not speaking on Islam. Another reason for the church being in the mess it’s in. I wish I lived closer to Sacramento because I would attend this conference.
Dissapointed Homeschool mom,
Instead you should be scandalized by what Bishop Soto did to put doubt in people’s mind about Mr. Spencer’s reputation as a Catholic and Catholic speaker. Did you just post on here to pat yourself on the back for saying your disappointed with those organizers of this conference courage to not be intimidated by a bishop who lords his authority like some pharaoh to persecute an orthodox faithful catholic? Is the bishop giving out gulable obedience awards? Or are you really not a homeschooling mom but just some paid hack of the Sacramento diocese.
By the way I am a homeschooling mom with a ton of kids and drives a van who attends the Tridirine Mass every Sunday.
I find it hard to believe that you are what you claim, but if you are it just goes to say no wonder the church is in the disgusting mess it is in. I do hope and pray that you see the errors of what you are saying.
“I find it hard to believe that you are what you claim” “Or are you really not a homeschooling mom but just some paid hack of the Sacramento diocese.”
Yes I really am a Catholic Homeschooling Mom. I thought I would get responses like this for doing anything but bashing the bishop. That is why I gave the explanation of my background. I don’t go to, work for, or live in or near the Sacramento diocese. If you don’t believe me, that’s unfortunate.
I will try to be clear. I am disappointed in this conference because it does not appear to be focused on either Catholicism or homeschooling at this point.
Homeschooling mom, so your purpose was to post on here so you can get fellow Catholics to disagree with you? Wow! Really you seriously expect us to believe you think the homeschooling conference is not about Catholicism or homeschooling? My opinion is that you are here to spread disinformation. For reasons only you truly know. But you need to be aware that this is what Communists have done and still do. I am not calling you a Communist so don’t get your feathers all ruffled up. I am just making an observation on your comments you posted here. Maybe the mess in the church needs to get messier for you and your family in order for you to see the mistake you are making in not defending a fellow Catholic who speaks the Truth in season and out of season.
“Homeschooling mom, so your purpose was to post on here so you can get fellow Catholics to disagree with you? ”
No, I did not post to sow discord. I posted on here because I was disappointed that the conference was relocated outside of the church instead of changing one speaker. I also wanted other homeschooling parents to know that there were more options for homeschoolers available for that weekend.
“Maybe the mess in the church needs to get messier for you and your family in order for you to see the mistake you are making in not defending a fellow Catholic who speaks the Truth in season and out of season.”
My family is not influential, least of all myself. I doubt that I’d be able to defend anyone to a bishop, or that a bishop would give a rip what I have to say. From what people have posted above, Mr. Spencer seems to be defending himself quite well.
I decided recently that I need to focus on the things that I am responsible for i.e. my vocation as a wife and mother. I am focusing on making the best domestic church that I can have, because in that sphere I do have a great influence.
Am I ignoring the messes that the Church often finds itself in? No, but there is little I can do to change the situation outside of prayer. I can write letters and make phone calls to complain until I am worn out and I will have done nothing but neglect my vocation. As it is, I have been wasting too much time being defensive on here because of my own foolish pride.
My focus needs to be on my family, my home, my little domestic church. In it’s current state, I don’t see how the conference in Sacramento will be helpful to me.
Grace and peace to you, dear sister in Christ. May our Lord bless you and your family.
Roman Catholic Homeschooling Mom, Good Work! Scotland Yard has just telephoned. Congratulations! YOU’RE HIRED!
Speaking of uncovering clever schemes. Here is some very interesting history on the making of Scotland Yard. History certainly is repeating itself.
Taken from Smithsonian.com
Scotland Yard Making the Force
The London police force was created in 1829 by an act introduced in Parliament by Home Secretary (similar to the U.S. Secretary of the Interior) Sir Robert Peel—hence the nickname “bobbies,” for policeman. The new police superseded the old system of watchmen. By 1839 these men had replaced the Bow Street Patrols, who enforced the decisions of magistrates, and the River Police, who worked to prevent crime along the Thames.
The responsibility of organizing the new police force was placed on Colonel Charles Rowan and Richard Mayne, who occupied a private house at 4 Whitehall Place, the back of which opened onto a courtyard: the Great Scotland Yard. The Yard’s name was inspired by its site, a medieval palace which housed Scottish royalty on their visits to London.
The staff of Scotland Yard was responsible for the protection of important individuals, community patrols, public affairs, recruitment and personnel management. When the Yard sent out its first plainclothes police agents in 1842, the public felt uncomfortable with these “spies” on the streets. But the force’s role in several important cases, and the charisma of many of its detectives, helped it win the people’s trust.
One such personality, Inspector Charles Frederick Field, joined the force upon its establishment in 1829. He became good friends with Charles Dickens, who occasionally accompanied constables on their nightly rounds. Dickens wrote a short essay about Field, “On Duty With Inspector Field,” and used him as a model for the all-knowing, charming Inspector Bucket in his novel Bleak House. Field retired as a chief of the detective branch in 1852.
In 1877, four out of the five heads for the detective branch were brought to trial for conspiring with criminals in a betting scheme. In an effort to repair the force’s tarnished reputation, Howard Vincent submitted a restructuring proposal to the force. Soon Vincent was appointed director of criminal investigations and he reorganized Scotland Yard.
I thought RCHM sounded like you.
Anonymous writes…. “I thought RCHM sounded like you. ”
Thank you for the compliment…sorry to disappoint you. Once again, you thought wrong.
DCHM, you said nothing wrong. I can’t believe what RCHM wrote to you. Also, the jihad gentleman was going to speak about homeschooling although if you don’t use the Kolbe method of instruction (which is pretty difficult for us younger people who weren’t taught in those kinds of schools), I don’t know how helpful it would be.
“Well, excuse DCHM for living…and do it before you approach the altar”: Fasten your seatbelts … You call that living?! Second point: We should all stop using pen names or real names and use “Anonymous”. Third: “jihad gentleman”?!! This phrase wins the prize for best new phrase. Fourth: WWPAS, since he is the guru saint of sensitivity and pleasantry and meaningless babble promoting chief gay lobbyist on this site (eat your heart out, YFC, but PA has you beat hands down).
So, you cannot even support your claim with any kind of explanation? It “appears” to you that the conference with a talk on Islam is not Catholic or homeschooling … Where do you obtain your information? From the web info, it appears rather that the home schooling conference has to do with home schooling, which could be one reason Bp Soto opposes it. Another is that there is a lot of corrupt political pressure being put on Spenser, eg by the British government, not the most friendly govt to Catholics … you should know this from history, Disappointed Catholic Homeschooling Mom. Education includes major historical and contemporary events involving the Church. Islam is one of these, and conquered by fire and sword the Catholics in North Africa and the Middle East fourteen centuries ago, and Spain for 800 years … If Professor Spenser has nothing to do with Catholic education, then neither does the Church. Disappointed Catholic Homeschooling Mom, you’re not for real but some sort of propagandist on someone’s payroll or extortion list, or else you’re severely educationally challenged and prefer to be that way and to inflict it on others.
Well, excuse DCHM for living…and do it before you approach the altar.
It always amazes me how easily readers of this site call others “liars”. Christian charity that knows no bounds. How about giving people the benefit of the doubt, which is actually what the CCC demands of us?
Well, YFC, it is said that we’re all liars and thieves, and so this being the case it is critical to always try to rise above our weak nature. You should try this some time too.
You sound like a great wife and mom…God Bless…
Oh, you believe that the bishop is magisterially good to go, do you? Why don’t you read what the Popes are saying? What is it about bishops and pedophilia that you don’t understand? What is it about gay clergy don’t you comprehend, even when the Popes tells us we need to get rid of them? If you want Catholicism you have to do more than fantasize about the prospect.
PS. If my recent post questioning your harshness shows up, Skai, it’s from me as I didn’t have my email address listed. Oops, again.
You don’t think the topic of Islam is a part of education? One thing though that can be inferred from your post has to do with the fullness of what Jesus said, “Man does not live by bread alone but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God”: Catholics have the “Bread” but sadly not so much the “Word” yet the Protestants often have a great deal of the words that proceed from God, even though they are short the “Bread”. So, why not grab it all, Sacrament at Catholic Church and word at Protestant church?
Skai, we have the Word at the Catholic Church too.
Not much of it in many parishes, PA. Like the Devil tempting Christ by quoting Scripture but mixing it with subtle seductions, many parishes are warping the Word of God.
We have good sermons at our parish, Skai, but they probably wouldn’t be your cup of tea.
It would be an insult to the Body of Christ to attend both Catholic Mass and a Protestant service on the grounds that you weren’t hearing enough of the Word of God at a Catholic Mass. I do not think people should follow your advice.
“J&M”, good post; glad to see your inner sense of the need to transition your faith from child to adult Catholic is disturbing your calm waters.
Home schooling mum it is about home schooling…I use to home school and learning the truth about Islam(contrary to how the secular is) is educational especially when it is not bias and it is teaching them the truth. It is a great resource for home schooling families especially since the public school systems have boycotted any of this valuable information about Islam……with home schooling there is always that great opportunity to enrich our children with materials that actually tell the truth more than with what he public schools have to offer, public schools are more politically correct and have stooped so low now to not teach accurately…
DCHM, you sound more like a rival marketing agent than what you present yourself as being. Do you have bonnets for every role you play?
Why are you being so unpleasant Skai? Disappointed was merely expressing her disappointment about the venue of the conference. Surely a person can is free to contribute here without criticism directed at their veracity or relevance? I’m really surprised at your harshness. I would love to see more people like Disapointed contribute here because homeschoolers are one of the strongest agents of preserving Catholic culture for one thing. I hope Disappointed will keep sharing here views here. Also, I think I was confusing Ignatius homeschooling materials with the humanities courses she mentioned. Oops.
Anonymous, Jesus might have sounded unpleasant to your ears when he called many people “yours is the father of lies”, or “you have the devil for your father”, or “he who harms one of my little ones is better off with a millstone around his neck and dropped into the sea”. Anonymous, you mush headed obsolete flower power people simply let your vanity get between you and the search for truth. What possible reason would anyone have for blogging pleasantries? Such a thing as you imply should be done is disgusting and a waste of time. Seek the truth and the truth shall set you free. Nowhere does Jesus teach us to be pleasant. He tells us to love one another and His Gospel gives many accounts of what this means … no account I can recall harps on being pleasant.
Another thing you seem naiive of, Anonymous, is the fact that there is a devil, a world and the flesh, and that these things constantly strive to deceive the faithful. Maybe you’d best pull up the movie Samson and Delilah and watch a demonstration of being pleasant. A soul who prefers comfort, aka pleasant, over love, truth, justice, and other virtues is a lost soul and needs to do something about it other than whine. Faith can withstand any discomfort, Anonymous. If you can’t stand it, then strengthen your faith. Read the Gospel to find out what Catholicism consists of, because you do not indicate that you know or comprehend. Meditate on the Cross instead of dismissing it like the feel good religions. Catholic faith gives souls the ability to be joyful in the midst of pain … If you cannot feel joy while experiencing pain, then the solution is to meditate on the Cross and ask Jesus to give you faith. There are many ways to say this, but this is how I’m saying it now. Perhaps you do not know it because you’ve preferred pleasantry all your life and have never taken up your Cross and followed Jesus. Now is the time to begin.
Did you understand that the anonymous who posted that was Dana?
That was really sweet, Skai! You remind of the old time evangelists . But I draw the line at watching Samson & Delilah…Victor Mature was never a favorite of mine! ;0)
Being unpleasant, me? See excuse number 5 on the Great Book of Excuses: “It wasn’t me; it was the other guy”, or number 8 “It’s not my fault; I’m innocent; the other guy did it” :)
… or number 13, “the devil made me do it”, or 19 “an identity thief put my name on it”. “Unpleasant”, you say? Hmn, I’ll look up that word to see what it means and then get back to you … yeah, that oughtta do it.
Thanks, Anne T., for putting excellent points in your posts. I’m not intending to attack you, rather feed off those points.
This is so beautiful from what I have read from Bishop Fulton Sheen, it really gave me hope:
“The nearer Christ comes to a heart, the more it becomes conscious of its guilt; it will then either ask for his mercy and find peace, or else it will turn against Him because it is not yet ready to give up its sinfulness. Thus He will separate the good from the bad, the wheat from the chaff. Man’s reaction to this Divine Presence will be the test: either it will call out all the opposition of egotistic natures, or else galvanize them into a regeneration and a resurrection.”
― Fulton J. Sheen, Life of Christ
Catholic Homeschool mom,
Ye of such little faith. Perhaps this was an opportunity from God for you to make a leap of faith ,to give more of yourself and your family and stand up with a faithful Catholic(s)To show your children courage in the face of perhaps losing your reputation in your association of group of homeschooling families and or relatives. Instead you resort to your comfort zone and turn against your fellow Catholics who do take the leap of faith. It would have been better for you not to comment in here and not waste your time you could of had with your family or other important things as you say. So that is why I am still not believing you and your claims. But so be it. Maybe it will just take more time and something personal done to you to make you see the error you are making.
I’m just incredulous at how Christians go to the mat against each other.
Where is the love in this community?
Well, bless your heart, Incredulous. I was tempted to say we need someone to do the countdown for a knockout, but I’ve gotten into enough trouble today with my sallies. It may be that everyone’s a bit cranky from discussing so many dark and terrible events every day. If we were all just sharing our daily spiritual walks with one another, we’d be showing an entirely different side of ourselves, I believe. There is every variety, size and shape of Catholic that contributes here, and I think it’s a microcosm of the schism that is taking place everyday around the world. I find a great deal of love here, every day. Maybe not always directed at one another, but for Mother Church, or a priest, or a cause. Feel free to share your love and witness to the mercy of Christ. Are you willing to go to the mat for what you believe?
Love bears all things, according to St Paul. Not a few verses from the Wisdom Books encourage us to press one another to the limit … training for spiritual warfare. Spiritual couch potatoes lose.
Amen Skai. I can’t add anything to that.
When PA preaches that “no bishop is perfect”, he also adds that this state is ok with Christ. But this is a kind of fatalism, worked up pretty good by John Calvin, and we call it Calvinism. Calvinism, aka PAism, views man as depraved and nothing can change it; thus, Calvin and PA preach that it does not matter if a bishop is corrupt because he cannot change himself nor will Christ change him. Those who believe PA are not theologically Catholic but Protestant like Presbyterian or Lutheran. Catholicism teaches that man is redeemed by Christ, and that this is effected through the Sacraments. Anyone who has bothered to read the posts by PA for years can see that he never ever pushes redemption, but always apologizes for maintaining a life of sin. He also claims that as a boy he was pure and never committed a sin. PA is a kind of cheap imitation of St Thomas Aquinas of whom it is said he had the innocence of a six year old boy. PA is not this at all. PA is slyly attempting to convince people that holiness is being so innocent that one has no need to turn away from any sin … hence he always says that whatever bishops do is ok because they are only men or only sinners like all of us. PA never claims that Catholicism demands we be repentant sinners, sinners in the process of transitioning from sin to glory. As St Paul tells us, the faithful transition from “glory to glory in Christ Jesus”. This is the Catholic Church, not some organization which has no intention to turn from sin.
Skai, if I gave you that impression that as a boy I never committed a sin, I apo0logize for this. Of course I committed sins, I said that I was innocent, not that I was without sin. I remember as a child going to confession every month. I had my faults and failings for sure and I still do. I said that as a teen I was pure of heart, but after puberty I was not pure in a physical sense, I don’t know how many boys are. I actually felt defective in a way as a teen. In my comments, I was criticizing things that I thought you said about bishops that was going too far. I never said that whatever bishops do is OK. So I can agree with you that Catholicism demands we be repentant sinner. I am a repentant sinner, in life I stumble and fall but am dependent on Jesus’ mercy. As humans we are not perfect. Jesus is the only human who is perfect and that is because He is God in the second person of the blessed Trinity. Only God is perfect.
So, PA, you are innocent of the sins you committed … makes complete sense … of course … we’ll just have to trust you on this one, PA, as it is one of those matters that only the can be understood by those who are innocent and sinful at the same time.
Skye, I didn’t say I was innocent of the sins I committed. I said I was innocent in general. I suppose you don’t have any children. Ask any of the mothers here with young children if they consider their children to be innocent. Lots of kids are innocent but after the age of reason they also commit sins so they can be innocent and also commit sins. I remember when I was a young teen I would confess forgetting to say my prayers when I got up, talking back to my mom, not doing as I was told right away, but I was still innocent in general. Also at the age of 15 or 16, I didn’t really know the “facts of life” so I didn’t really have impure thoughts since you can think about something you don’t know about. With sex education in schools now, there are surely very few kids that age today that are as innocent as I was.
Correction, you can’t think about something you don’t know about.
Skai and MarkA, this is sort of related to what you were talking about. Last year in a Bible study of Revelation, we were asked if we had ever turned to the darkness rather than the light and I was the only one who said yes…they all made faces at one another that the thought of turning to the darkness was like, so weird. It really shook me up that I was sitting at a table with 7 women who were saying in effect that they had never sinned. I was floored. What are the odds of being the only sinner at a table of eight?
And Abeca Christian, Skai and Canisisus, haven’t you figured out what the LGBT Community trolls do here. They do as the U.S. Marines do in a bar brawl. They first send in the supposedly innocent smaller guy to pick a fight with the opposing side, then when he is about to get globbered, them send in the bigger far less innocent ones to brawl.
Anne T., yes, it’s one way to get their attention. And yes again, Jesus tells a couple parables about this.
I hope everyone will check out this article!
https://cnsnews.com/news/article/bishop-catholic-mom-murdered-gay-man-died-martyr-her-faith
I caught this article the other day, Dana. Bishop Paplocki aims to put forward the cause for this woman, whom he ardently is defining as a martyr, the type of martyr whom the Church elevates to Sainthood. Hopefully CalCathDaily puts it on this site. There is also another article where a priest has called for the adoption of a Down’s boy, still in the womb, to save him from being aborted. This priest’s own brother was Down’s and their father died saving that kid’s life. So, what we’ve got here are two souls, one a martyr for Christ who chose the red pill, and the other a mere hero who demonstrated what Jesus teaches by literally laying down his life for his brother, in that case it being his Down’s Syndrome son. That heroic act also falls under the parable that Jesus tells about it being good to break the Sabbath rules to pull a neighbor’s ox out of a pit … this man literally pulled his drowning son out of a pit, out of the cesspool by their farm house. But it cost him his life, while holding his son up so he could breathe until help arrived. Symbolically, this father did what Jesus did, God descending into the mire of sin, the filth of fallen creation, and raising his son so that all could see him live in spite of the hardships and degradation. Both stories are, I think, posted on CNS News site.
Thanks for your comments, Skai. These stories attest to the fact that ordinary people are capable of great acts of self-sacrifice. The secular press focuses on the depravity of people, and all the dark aspects of life:car accidents, murders, kidnappings, et al. By bringing in all this darkness into your lives, you begin to think it’s much worse than it is, which is the whole point of the so-called news. Of course we need to know what is happening, but not in the sensational manner in which it is presented nowadays. It’s become sadistic entertainment and I think CNBC, The Blaze,et al are no better than The Star or other sleazy news outlets. People’s appetite for horror and shock has become insatiable. ugh!
Still, accidents do unfortunately happen. Last night the communications director from the national organization for marriage was in a very serious car accident and he is in critical care. My prayers will be with him today, as will many readers of CCD.
Sorry…forgot to add my name yet again.
Basically, Skai, I buy from Christians all over the world when I can –American, Filippino, Vietnamese, Mexican, Russian, Greek, Serbian, Estonian, English, African and on and on, especially Religous goods.
Skai, I do not know which anonymous you are asking how many hours they have spent studying Saints, Doctors of the Church, Scripture, other Magisterial documents? For myself, it would be as a broad guess, not counting Mass and prayer times, I came up with almost 17,000 hours. And I have barely scratched the surface.
I apologize for I am the anonymous that replied to Catherine’s post thinking it was a mistakenly placed post. I did not realize what she was up to. I will be more careful in the future not to get sucked in.
Good grief, Catherine, it is embarrassing that you keep feeling the need to bring my name up as you did in your post of 2:15 PM. I get the message, you don’t like me but is it so important to you that other people don’t like me or agree with me too? You are like a girl in high school who is angered when people talk to and are nice to someone that she doesn’t like. “Don’t talk to the queer, or you aren’t my friend.” I wasn’t exposed to much of that in high school and I find it odd that some adults feel the need to act like this. You seem to feel that badmouthing people that you dislike is some kind of virtue. That is sad. Ever hear the statement that you know someone is a Christian by the way that they treat others?
Upon further reflection over YFC’s interpretation of the quote he furnished which quote is a translation from some wire service alleged to be what the Pope said: YFC, I notice you do not deny what the Pope is reported to have said. However, you butcher it, and what is even more egregious (time to use this word, as I have not seen it in print for months perhaps), you talk it into oblivion. But beyond that, your fatal mistake is refusing to acknowledge the critical factor that there is a context, which could be called a “living context” in that it consists of the people in the Vatican. You also probably believe it when you read media reports which say the source cannot be identified because they’re not supposed to flap their lips. YFC, you might excel at constructing those little two by two genetics boxes … which no doubt you while away your time with between classes and while waiting for your meal at some swank gay bistro in Frisco … but literarily, well, maybe you could take one of those online course in introduction to logic, you know, where they teach you to identify all the essential facts before drawing a conclusion. Go to some online education site, say, maybe at the middle school level. I know you’re writing on the assumption that the best level for mass communications is 8th grade, so maybe you only need a brushing up on what you may have forgotten, you know, from how you’re so busy with those little punnet squares.
Catherine, another poster offered to sponsor a day of CCD if you would spend a month correcting the errors in things posted on this website. You spit in their face. So for you to call anybody else an enabler or an accomplice to sin for being silent in the face of sin is complete hypocrisy.