The following comes from a September 18 OC Catholic article by Meg Waters:
In 2011, the Diocese of Orange was blessed with the opportunity to purchase what is now called Christ Cathedral. According to Cathedral Rector and Episcopal vicar Father Christopher Smith, “We hope that everyone who comes to this campus will experience the love of God in their lives, by how they are treated, by what they see and by what they experience.” Even though the renovations are a few years from completion, the mission to serve as a center of Catholic life is already happening. Every weekend, 12 Masses are celebrated in four languages and attended by as many as 12,000 people. The campus ministries are thriving, and growing.
The initial design concept unveiled in the winter of 2015 for the renovated worship level of the cathedral was a reflection of the team’s “wish list” of amenities and finishes, but the wish list was bigger than the budget. Bishop Vann decided that, while the Cathedral was a significant asset for the diocese, its renovation had to stay within the prescribed budget. “To achieve what we need in order to create a center for our faith in Orange County and lift up the people who worship here, cannot come at the expense of our many other equally important ministries.”
Windows and walls
The iconic glass structure was in need of significant repair and maintenance from simple caulking to complete reglazing or replacement. The original building was not air conditioned, which was often a source of complaint, and the flat glass surfaces contributed to challenging acoustics. The renovations will add a very sophisticated system of quatrefoils of polished steel, which will deflect UV rays and heat from the glass. This system will allow the building to be air conditioned at a reasonable cost and improve acoustics without compromising the beauty and appeal of the glass structure.
Utilities
Mechanical, electric, plumbing and air conditioning are located in a basement. To free space the initial concept moved all the utilities to a separate area outside the worship center, however, this proved too costly and inefficient so the new state-of-the-art systems will be located in the current basement area.
Baptistery
Under its previous incarnation serving a Protestant congregation, the cathedral did not feature a prominent area for baptisms. That will change. The conceptual design included building a 30-inch pool for baptisms but would require significant structural improvements to support the weight. Consequently the baptistery pool will be just as elegant, but much shallower, negating the need for additional structural support.
Altar
Originally, the altar was envisioned to be at the center of the worship area. Again, this was costly in terms of structural changes and reduced seating capacity. Consequently, the altar has moved back with the seating in a radial fan shape, similar to many of the newer parish churches in the Diocese – maximizing seating capacity and sight lines.
Finishes
The design shared last year contemplated a variety of exquisite finishes in marble, wood and stone, many imported from proprietary quarries around the world. The final design has equally beautiful finishes from sources within the U.S. and other less-costly sources of equal quality.
A little fiscal sanity goes a long way!
It’s hard to tell from the illustration: are the elevated human figures behind the sanctuary art or the choir?
If that’s where the choir will be, the worship space needs to be completely redesigned again. No choir or group of musicians should occupy that space, elevated and centered behind the altar.
So no tabernacle behind the altar, but an elevated group of musicians? Really poor design. I’m disgusted with it. I can’t believe that any quality director of liturgical music would be pleased to work with such an arrangement.
If the choir is going to be elevated, it should be in the position of traditional choir lofts: behind the assembly, not located so prominently as to detract and distract from the sanctuary.
Welcome to…
“Sawyer,” as usual, excellent commentary. However, B. Vann does not particularly care about things being “Catholic” in an orthodox understanding of the word. Get that there will still be a “submersion” pool type of baptismal structure, and the “stage forward” kind of “sanctuary” so that all can see “the show.” What a ridiculous waste of time and treasure. The Crystal Cathedral was built for Protestant’s and will always seem like it. But, it is not likely that B. Vann is too concerned about it, as the locals in OC continue to be fed the thin gruel of “Vatican II Spirit” Catholicism.
In fairness to Bishop Vann, he was stuck with the purchase of the property. The transaction was completed while Bishop Brown was the ordinary.
Sawyer, the choir is not supposed to be in the “loft” at the back of the church. The Cantor and the Choir generally are at the side of the altar or behind it where they can more easily lead the congregation in singing praises to the lord, to help us pray twice as the saying goes. The altar is supposed to be the center of the church, the main feature if you will. The place where the sacrifice is offered, for all to see, and where the communion elements are consecrated, for all to see.
Bob, of course that is preferable. I had stated that “if” the choir is going to be elevated then it should be in a rear loft. Space constraints probably preclude the choir being at floor level in order to seat a decent number of congregants; otherwise, why would the choir have been elevated above the assembly in the first place?
I am not familiar with any Catholic church in which the choir and musical ensemble has been given an elevated location behind the sanctuary, as is the case in the artist’s conception. The OC cathedral’s design seems to me to be unique in that regard, and uniquely bad.
You guys are making good points. Most of the time, I don’t agree with various comments on here that have to do with the “wreckovation” meme, and in general it looks like they are making this into an amazing place of worship, but I agree that having the choir elevated and over the altar seems a bit person-centric to me. I suppose they are supposed to be a “choir of angels”, but the risks that the Mass becomes a performance piece seem “elevated” by this design, pun intended. Well, maybe they will use this format for concerts, which might be fine, but have the choir sit somewhere else for Mass.
May this all turn out well for God’s glory vs a glass elephant.
A ‘White Elephant’?
A space unlikely to engender prayer.
It isn’t designed for prayer, but for “sharing and caring”.
This place is a train wreck ghastly and NOT Roman Catholic, enough with this nonsense of Vatican II, return the Traditional Latin Mass to all of our churches the Great Springtime is OVER! Clowns, altar girls, hand holding, kiss of peace, felt banners, dancing girls in leotards, lesbian nuns screaming for “social justice” guitars, drums, polka, mariachi, folk music, put this crap to rest already.
Really, Janek, you left out the puppets. What is “church” without puppets?
https://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2016/03/the-real-francis-effect-collapse-of.html
This is an image from a Mass presided at by then-Cardinal Bergoglio at the Buenos Aires Cathedral in 2010. We love puppets at Mass, and so does P. Francisco.
By the way, the article also documents the collapse of vocations that occurred under the leadership of then-Card. Archbp. of Buenos Aires (1998-2013), Jorge Maria Bergoglio. Just the facts. And a puppet thrown in.
It has been over 50 years since the disaster called Vatican II and yet we have missal changes, verbage change, you cannot make the Novus Ordo missal work, the TLM is about Our Lord and the Novus Ordo is about the people in the pews.
Facts don’t lie, before the council 77% Mass attendance, convents and seminaries FULL, Catholic schools and hospitals by the thousands, belief in the REAL PRESENCE, liberals cannot argue with facts so they resort to name calling, always present the facts to liberal Novus Ordonarians and the name calling will start.
We the laymen have to take back the Church we have no choice, the bishops are corrupt and part of the problem, support the F.S.S.P. S.S.P.X. Institute of Christ the King their seminaries are PACKED WITH YOUNG MEN AND HAVE WAITING LINES just to get in, while Novus Ordo seminaries and convents are closed or closing since the 1960’s. Facts ladies and gentleman facts facts and more facts.
J, Your facts = The truth, truth and even more truth. Thank you! God Bless!
Janek: Do wake up, and that goes for the rest of you. Your beloved FSSP, SSPX and ICKSP priest can NEVER supplant your ordinary diocesan or religious priest in generosity of service and willingness to serve the MAJORITY OF CATHOLICS. These “traditionalist” clergy DO NOT offer the Mass in the Ordinary Form which is where the majority of Catholics are and which the majority of Catholic prefer. Why don’t these traditionalist priest want to offer the OF? Who knows. They say it’s not their “charism” but what does that mean? The regular Catholic who loves the OF is not deserving of their ministry? They abhor Vatican II? The don’t like the Mass in the OF? Their reasoning is specious. Again, I say this as a supporter of the TLM…
Therefore, the generosity of your regular diocesan seminarian/priest, in his willingness to serve the OF (and if he is deposed to learning the EF, even better) is MORE APPARENT than say your a priest of your beloved FSSP who will only serve a MINORITY OF CATHOLICS! Rather than your beloved SSPX, you should be even more in awe and in praise of a diocesan seminarian/priest who not only knows the OF, but has taken the time to learn, appreciate, and love the EF. This is where the future is.
“…This is where the future is.” You sound like Masala in Ben Hur trying to convince Judah that “Rome” is the only way of the future.
Truth is where the future is, despite what any “feel”. As for “should” regarding awe, you cannot manufacture it. That’s the biggest problem with the faulty rite that pretends human agency will somehow manufacture what can only come from grace.
That’s why the awe is duly fixed on they who will shun what seems popular and opt for that which is true. That’s what Christ did when He spoke the truth about His Body and Blood. He let those who wouldn’t take the hard teaching walk away.
It is loving God and the people of God that leads men to choose being thought less of by those who would have…
Are you paid by the Vatican, “jon?” Your nutty comments are so wrong that time does not permit a full response. However, it is enough to go in time about 50 years or so; the TLM was beloved, and everywhere, and all priests said it (and all cardinals and bishop attending VII went to the TLM every day). The, with little warning (there was no internet and the like), the TLM was virtually eliminated by stealth, without any consideration of the “feelings” of then current Catholics. Catholics, very obedient then, were pretty much told, “we made a mistake’ with the Mass so get used to the new one. The result, of course, is well known: near empty churches (and getting emptier) show the “love” that people have for the N.O.
The fact remains SChris that there are more Catholics going to the OF than in the EF, and the traditionalist priests WOULD NOT minister to the majority of Catholics by offering the Mass in the OF. You did not even address that, did you.
Me? Paid by the Vatican? They can’t pay me enough to come here and read posts like yours and respond. This is purely an act of mercy on my part for instructing the ignorant is a spiritual act of mercy. It’s the Year of Mercy if you didn’t know.
Your comment continues to make no logical sense. Of course — today, after the revolution where the TLM was and is effectively suppressed — bishops will not permit the young to be taught any Tradition. That could change again in one generation. You forget that the Novus Ordo was foisted on the active Catholics, who accepted out of obedience and then largely left the Church. So, the vast majority of Catholics do to Mass as they were directed to do two generations ago. But it is still wrong. Catholic Tradition is the only way to save the institutional Church. Watch out SSPX. It is not likely that Francis wants you to be you within the Church. He wants to turn you, by threats or blunt force, to love Amoris Laetitae and all the other…
The big error in your point SC is to derive causation between the establishment of the Mass of Paul VI and the people leaving the Church. WRONG! Correlation does not necessarily mean causation. There could be other factors involved. You have to be more precise in your analysis rather than just figuring out whatever on hand to denigrate the sacrament of the Church.
St Christopher, I’m not aware of any evidence that the people who were practicing Catholics before the NO was introduced subsequently left the Church because of the changes. Do you have any such evidence? If anything, there was a significant enthusiasm after the NO was introduced. It wasn’t until the religious right started its ascendancy in the 1980s that people started to leave because they rebelled against the co-mingling of religion and politics, and then in the 1990s when the priest sex abuse scandals erupted. It accelerated in the 2000s when the Church refused to treat LGBT people with respect and tried to interject itself into all manner of family life including those of non-catholics. I have data for those points. Do you have any…
“I’m not aware of any evidence that the people who were practicing Catholics before the NO was introduced subsequently left the Church because of the changes.” – Your Fellow Catholic
Then you are not aware of the abundant records, interviews, and accounts of the Catholic exodus because the Mass and entire system changed. The Immaculate Heart Nuns’ story, or William Coulson, PhD’s account (“We overcame Their Traditions” cf. EWTN.com) , or just this one from Rorate Caeli:
https://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2016/04/no-reservations-about-supporting-this.html
The Rorate Caeli story, “No Reservations..” 4/27/2016, is echoed again and again on the Native American Reservations, and this tribal elder could be the voice of hundreds of thousands of Catholics:
“It was really easy for Indians to be Catholic. There was so much that came natural to us. Like a priest praying to the East, we’ve been praying to east long before the Black Robes came to us.” He also went on to say, “Then in the 60’s the Church changed, and a lot of people left the church because they felt that the Church had lied to them. They said this was important and a part of God, then all of sudden it didn’t matter anymore. Our people felt lied to, like the the white man has done so many times before.”
“…Why don’t these traditionalist priest want to offer the OF? Who knows.”
Because the rite itself is open to gross deficiencies by its very design.
Some appear to like the building. Some want to start demolition tomorrow. In either case, I commend the Bishop for insisting on tight fiscal controls on the project. What glory flows to God with a gilt-edged church building but a church treasury which can’t meet legitimate needs of the homeless, the sick, or the elderly.??
(Part Deux) “. . . garbage that comes out of the Vatican.
You see, “jon” the Vatican no longer believes that the Catholic Church is the One True Church and that its sole duties are to teach the Gospel and to lead Mankind to Salvation. Nothing more. The TLM, developed over centuries but always building on its predecessors, was Heaven on Earth. But, you Entertainment-Tonight-Hand-Holders will never listen, or want to learn.
It’s sad that the diocese is ruining the award-winning architecture of the Crystal Cathedral. What a waste of money. The structure should have been repaired and changed as little as possible to accommodate the reverent celebration of the Mass.
As it is, egos got in the way, costs have run rampant and the inside of the catherdral will look unlike its designer ever imagined. Sad.
“jon”: as the Mass is the center of Catholic worship, its change is the essence is what has “gone wrong” after Vatican II. Pride by establishment bishops, many/most of whom are homosexual or homosexual enablers and were schooled in a soft and anti-Catholic intellectual tradition, will not let the Church revert to Her true nature, Her Tradition. Ever think about “lex orandi, lex credendi, lex vivendi, “jon”? How we worship reflects how we belief, our very faith, and influences how we live. The obliteration of the TLM is precisely why the institutional Church is in shambles. Think before you write, next time.
“The obliteration of the TLM is why the Church is in shambles.” Wrong on a number of points. First, the TLM Is not obliterated. That’s hyperbole on your part. It is here. It may have been discouraged, but it was never abrogated, as Benedict had written. Secondly, that the institutional Church is in shambles is unproven by you. Shambles? Where? It’s still functioning. Again, hyperbole and exaggerations.
“…It may have been discouraged, but it was never abrogated, as Benedict had written.”
Indeed, it was treated as if it was abrogated. Why? There are reasons for the bishop’s overreach, and pretending there was/is not is to reject the requisite engaging of the intellect.
That the Church is not in a shambles has been unproven. And mere “functioning” is no proof of health.
St. C, you may have gone over the edge in this last blast from your keyboard. Its one thing to state that you disagree with a lot of the present church, but to call most bishops homosexuals and people of anti-Catholic intellectual tradition is over-generalization at best and libel at the core. In addition, it is very anti-Catholic in its approach to discussion. Shame on you!
“YFC” — Of course you have “statistics,” brought to us by what source? The disaster of the post-Vatican II Catholic Church looks like Europe immediately after WWII: ruins, with millions of dead, and with a defeat of the soul. Your reasoning is a real laugher: listen to me, no one, no one, has left the Church because of its treatment of LGBTQ folks, unless they were orthodox Catholics that could no longer abide the simpering “rainbow” masses and the feminized priests that prance around saying that the Church needs to apologize, to “welcome” sodomites, etc. People that want this should leave, as it is sinful and can never be made acceptable within Catholicism.
Here ya go, “Saint” Christopher. Have at it: https://www.prri.org/research/prri-rns-2016-religiously-unaffiliated-americans/
SODOM AND GOMORRAH TOLD GOD TO “HAVE AT IT,” TOO! SO LET THE PAID TROLLS RELY SOLELY ON THEIR MAN MADE POLLS! THEY ACCUMULATE FOR THEMSELVES TEACHERS TO SUIT THEIR OWN LIKINGS!…. MAN PROPOSES BUT GOD DISPOSES!
Douay-Rheims Bible
I say to you, that he will quickly revenge them. But yet the Son of man, when he cometh, shall he find, think you, faith on earth?
2 Timothy 4:3 For there shall be a time when they will not endure sound doctrine but, according to their own desires, they will heap to themselves teachers having itching ears.
“Notably, those who were raised Catholic are more likely than those raised in any other religion to cite negative religious treatment of gay and lesbian people (39% vs. 29%, respectively) and the clergy sexual-abuse scandal (32% vs. 19%, respectively) as primary reasons they left the Church.”