The following comes from a June 14 story in the Los Angeles archdiocese newspaper, the Tidings.
Five men who have modeled their lives after the example of Jesus in serving their church and community have been selected as the 2013 Distinguished Alumni from St. John’s Seminary in Camarillo.
Archbishop George Niederauer, Monsignors Gary Bauler, Terrence Richey and Jerome Schmitt, and Dr. Paul Ford will be honored at the fifth annual Distinguished Alumni Dinner to be held Sept. 30 at St. John’s. All five received theological formation at St. John’s Seminary Theologate and/or College, and have served the church in the priesthood or — as with Ford, professor of Systematic Theology and Liturgy at St. John’s — as teacher.
Proceeds from the event support ongoing formation at St. John’s Seminary, which educates and forms priests for service in the Archdiocese of Los Angeles as well as other dioceses.
Archbishop Niederauer’s selection marks the fourth consecutive year that a prelate from St. John’s 1961 or 1962 classes has been honored at this event, joining Cardinals Justin Rigali (2010), Roger Mahony (2011) and William Levada (2012), whom Archbishop Niederauer presented at last year’s event.
Like Cardinal Levada, Archbishop Niederauer grew up in Long Beach and attended St. Anthony High School before going to St. John’s, and was ordained in 1962 for the Archdiocese of Los Angeles. He served in several parish and teaching assignments, and was spiritual director and then rector of St. John’s Seminary before being named in 1995 as bishop of Salt Lake City, Utah.
In 2006, he was named the eighth archbishop of San Francisco, succeeding Cardinal Levada who in 2005 was named the prefect of the Vatican’s Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith. Archbishop Niederauer retired last year as head of the San Francisco Archdiocese.
To read the entire story, click here.
I hope this article doesn’t lead to endless attacks on Archbishop Niederauer, a good man, nor on Dr. Thomas Ford, a brilliant and dedicated man who gives a great deal to the Catholic community in Camarillo. St. John’s Seminary, much maligned in this publication, and for good reason in the past, is such a wonderful asset to Southern California. Beautiful mosaics have been quietly elevating the wonderful chapel from deeply satisfying visually to silently stunning as well as spiritually thrilling. If you can’t make this special celebration, make it a point to attend next year’s Open House and meet the wonderful seminarians there from around the world as well as the dedicated people who have elevated St. John’s in every other way as well. If you are doing more for the Catholic faith than these men, by all means, do cast the first stone, if you find any real justification for it after all these years of contributing so significantly to the work Jesus asked all of us to do on His behalf.
CATECHISM OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH SECOND EDITION
LIFE IN CHRIST
THE TEN COMMANDMENTS
“YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF”
THE TENTH COMMANDMENT
You shall not covet . . . anything that is your neighbor’s. . . . You shall not desire your neighbor’s house, his field, or his manservant, or his maidservant, or his ox, or his ass, or anything that is your neighbor’s.317
For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.318
2534 The tenth commandment unfolds and completes the ninth, which is concerned with concupiscence of the flesh. It forbids coveting the goods of another, as the root of theft, robbery, and fraud, which the seventh commandment forbids. “Lust of the eyes” leads to the violence and injustice forbidden by the fifth commandment.319 Avarice, like fornication, originates in the idolatry prohibited by the first three prescriptions of the Law.320 The tenth commandment concerns the intentions of the heart; with the ninth, it summarizes all the precepts of the Law.
I. THE DISORDER OF COVETOUS DESIRES
2535 The sensitive appetite leads us to desire pleasant things we do not have, e.g., the desire to eat when we are hungry or to warm ourselves when we are cold. These desires are good in themselves; but often they exceed the limits of reason and drive us to covet unjustly what is not ours and belongs to another or is owed to him.
2536 The tenth commandment forbids greed and the desire to amass earthly goods without limit. It forbids avarice arising from a passion for riches and their attendant power. It also forbids the desire to commit injustice by harming our neighbor in his temporal goods:
When the Law says, “You shall not covet,” these words mean that we should banish our desires for whatever does not belong to us. Our thirst for another’s goods is immense, infinite, never quenched. Thus it is written: “He who loves money never has money enough.”321
2537 It is not a violation of this commandment to desire to obtain things that belong to one’s neighbor, provided this is done by just means. Traditional catechesis realistically mentions “those who have a harder struggle against their criminal desires” and so who “must be urged the more to keep this commandment”:
. . . merchants who desire scarcity and rising prices, who cannot bear not to be the only ones buying and selling so that they themselves can sell more dearly and buy more cheaply; those who hope that their peers will be impoverished, in order to realize a profit either by selling to them or buying from them . . . physicians who wish disease to spread; lawyers who are eager for many important cases and trials.322
2538 The tenth commandment requires that envy be banished from the human heart. When the prophet Nathan wanted to spur King David to repentance, he told him the story about the poor man who had only one ewe lamb that he treated like his own daughter and the rich man who, despite the great number of his flocks, envied the poor man and ended by stealing his lamb.323 Envy can lead to the worst crimes.324 “Through the devil’s envy death entered the world”:325
We fight one another, and envy arms us against one another. . . . If everyone strives to unsettle the Body of Christ, where shall we end up? We are engaged in making Christ’s Body a corpse. . . . We declare ourselves members of one and the same organism, yet we devour one another like beasts.326
2539 Envy is a capital sin. It refers to the sadness at the sight of another’s goods and the immoderate desire to acquire them for oneself, even unjustly. When it wishes grave harm to a neighbor it is a mortal sin:
St. Augustine saw envy as “the diabolical sin.”327 “From envy are born hatred, detraction, calumny, joy caused by the misfortune of a neighbor, and displeasure caused by his prosperity.”328
2540 Envy represents a form of sadness and therefore a refusal of charity; the baptized person should struggle against it by exercising good will. Envy often comes from pride; the baptized person should train himself to live in humility:
Would you like to see God glorified by you? Then rejoice in your brother’s progress and you will immediately give glory to God. Because his servant could conquer envy by rejoicing in the merits of others, God will be praised.329
II. THE DESIRES OF THE SPIRIT
2541 The economy of law and grace turns men’s hearts away from avarice and envy. It initiates them into desire for the Sovereign Good; it instructs them in the desires of the Holy Spirit who satisfies man’s heart.
The God of the promises always warned man against seduction by what from the beginning has seemed “good for food . . . a delight to the eyes . . . to be desired to make one wise.”330
2542 The Law entrusted to Israel never sufficed to justify those subject to it; it even became the instrument of “lust.”331 The gap between wanting and doing points to the conflict between God’s Law which is the “law of my mind,” and another law “making me captive to the law of sin which dwells in my members.”
The last time I was at St. Johns Seminary was to protest Doug Kmiec being honored at that dissent filled Seminary, even some of the Seminarians were upset about it and were glad we were there. Maryanne do you remember who Doug Kmiec is? He is the traitor who betrayed the pro-life movement for Obamanation lies.
Since when do ” Beautiful mosaics have been quietly elevating the wonderful chapel from deeply satisfying visually to silently stunning as well as spiritually thrilling.” make a good faithful Seminary?
I was blessed to be friends with the late Bishop Austin Vaughan who had been the Rector of an orthodox Seminary (I think it was Emmitsburg). He could tell you what makes a good Seminary. True enough ascetics can aid in making a good Seminary, but it takes sound moral and dogmatic theology to really make a good Seminary, and from what I know, St. John’s is really not there at this time. Arcbishop Khai who I served as his American Secretary, had also been the Rector of his Seminary and he also could tell you what Bishop Vaughan would tell you.
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
Sins of omission are still sins.
San Fran was left a confused, scandal ridden, disordered Diocese as far as the Faith goes.
Bishops will be held to higher standards than that of the Laity. They have the responsibility and the power to teach, and correct & discipline those in obstinate grave and public sin (Scandal). They have the responsibility to lead their flocks to God. (He did not correct the public statements of heretic Nancy Pelosi.) He did not teach his flock that voting for immoral people, immoral political parties, and immoral unions is wrong. Etc., etc, etc, etc.
Sins of omission are still sins.
“Not everyone who says to me ‘Lord, Lord’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.
On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’
And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me you evildoers. ”
Lk 12:48 …Everyone who has been given much, much will be demanded; and from the one who has been entrusted with much, much more will be asked. ”
Pray for our Bishops and Priests.
I agree Andrea…we need to continue praying..
” Beautiful mosaics have been quietly elevating the wonderful chapel from deeply satisfying visually to silently stunning as well as spiritually thrilling.”
Maryanne, Are you the gifted artist that is responsible for contributing to the beautiful mosaics? I would love to see these works. Perhaps you can send CCD some photos for the readers who are not able to travel.
Maryanne you can’t have it both ways. You state that past critiques of St. John’s are valid. I concur. If George Niederauer was Rector at that time, with Gabino Zavala as his “enforcer,” as dean of students, then let the opprobrium flow! Countless vocations were destroyed, and those who survived the process still had to deal with the education they received, or more properly the education they did not. In the private sector you frequently meet corporate types who are “resume builders,” everything triangulated from how it effects their promotability and not the company’s bottom line. The church is rife with these “corporationists” and a few have just been honored by St. John’s.
I know of several very fine young men who were forced to leave St. John’s because basically they were too Catholic!
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
So St. John’s Seminary in Camarillo, is proud of – Cardinal Roger Mahony and Archbishop George Niederauer – neither of whom instructed literate Catholics to read the ‘Catechism of the Catholic Church, Second Edition’, and did grave harm to the Church and especially their own Diocese of LA and San Francisco respectively – through sins of commission and/or omission. And they both refused to publically correct and discipline those who were publically obstinate in grave sin through Canon 915 and Canon 1399. (Pelosi lives in the San Fran Diocese.) They neglected to teach their flocks not to vote for evil politicians at local, state and federal levels.
The Seminary needs to learn that just because someone has rank within the Church does not make them holy or a shining example of what Seminarians and Priests should aspire to be.
Does St. John’s still refuse to use the CCC as one of their required texts?
Mahony and his ilk are some of the most shocking examples of wayward clergy imaginable…Mahony, Lavada, and Zeimann…the unholy triad from St. John’s…read the book… “Goodbye,Good Men”…sadly these 3 amigos stayed, (wished they had said goodbye) and we know the legacy of horror they have produced!…God willing, this “seed plot” for seminarians has turned around, it was a cesspool of homosexuality for years…don’t get me started on the modernist’s that poisoned this place…
Sadly I had a friend like this…he believes that when a priest puts on a collar or bishop grabs his Crozier, it means he is now HOLY and CATHOLIC…NOT!…if that were the case we wouldn’t have miscreants like Mahony and Ziemann, to reflect on…right?
Msgr. Gary Bauler is the Priest who gave me instruction and welcomed me into the Catholic Church in 1969. He still helps out at our Parish from time to time by celebrating Mass, assisting with Confessions and helping me to laugh at the things a Pastor needs to laugh at. Archbishop Niederauer taught us English Literature in the Seminary in the early 1970s. His sense of humor, the way he prayed, his example of Christian love were wonderful. I am so glad that they have been honored along with the others, whom I do not know nearly as well.
Thank you, Fr. Higgins for contributing your experiences. I’ll probably avoid reading the rest of the comments because so many seem needlessly negative.
Yeah…the truth is shocking and often negative…denial is so much more convenient…right francis?
Francis, Code of Canon Law –
” THE OBLIGATIONS AND RIGHTS OF ALL THE CHRISTIAN FAITHFUL”
” 212 §3. According to the knowledge, competence, and prestige which they possess, they have the right and even at times the duty to manifest to the sacred pastors their opinion on matters which pertain to the good of the Church
and to make their opinion known to the rest of the Christian faithful, without prejudice to the integrity of faith and morals,
with reverence toward their pastors, and attentive to common advantage and the dignity of persons. “
Obviously your definition of needlessly negative is that they insists on God’s truth and not the fairy tales taught by you modernist.
May God have mercy on your soul,
Kenneth M. Fisher
Curious- what are the things a pastor “needs to laugh at” ?
Abp Niederauer was neither horrible nor superb in SF. Although that prett much correlates to sins of omission.
AnnAsher: I would guess a pastor “needs to laugh at” some of the stuff coming at him from parishioners, given what I’ve seen people jump on our priests for after Mass!
Everyone with a rosary thinks they are an expert on liturgy, theology, decorations, pronunciation, morals, etc. — so if the priests didn’t get together and laugh at some of the nonsense they get pelted with, they’d go nuts.
Sort of like parents comparing their “kid stories.”
Don’t give us crap. Give us real examples of things parishoners have complained about to their pastors. You modernist love to blame things on those with their Rosaries. Well I have been with real Saints, one, Fr. Aloysius Elacuria, CMF has his cause now opened. Guess what, he was seldom without his horrible NOT Holy Rosary, he often fell asleep on my shoulder saying his Rosary. Archbishop Khai would very seldom go to bed without Mass and the Rosary. He too often fell asleep on my shoulder saying his Rosary.
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
Changing the liturgy to entertain and validate one’s ego is not a “laughing” matter…disobedience, recalcitrance and modernism aren’t either….
Didn’t Neiderauer have a “switch-hitter’s ball, at a parish in his archdiocese last year?…seem’s to me he was pretty tolerant of this type of revolting activity amongst actively homosexual men…hate to be a detractor, but does anyone remember this little event?
Zeimann was guilty of embezzling millions of dollars from the Church in Santa Rosa years ago…most of it has disappeared, never to be seen again…some of it was used to pay off his homosexual lover, who was black-mailing him at the time…another of Mahony’s likely lads….another sterling product of St. John’s Seminary
Bishop Mark Hurley, the predecessor to Zeimann probably died when he did because of the pain Zeimann and his crowd caused him. How do I know this? Bishop Hurley was one of our treasured advisors, and he became such by choice.
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
Archbishop Niederauer apologized for giving the Blessed Sacrament to the Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence in full regalia because he “failed to recognize them”. Anyone who has had the misfortune of seeing the Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence in full regalia can appreciate the absurdity of his apology.
he probably forgot that SOME religious orders of nun’s STILL wear their habit!…he’s so used to seeing religious in street clothes, he figured everyone wore street clothes, including most priest’s
Well, if you think Levada and Niederauer were strange, now Archbishop Cordileone is going to turn the Shrine of St. Francis of Assisi into a “pet cemetery,” which I had never heard of before. Maybe he got the idea from the Protestants?
I was at Mass there just recently with my dog for the Blessing of Animals and the priest announced this turn of events:
“Father Coiro admitted the columbarium would also help generate money for the upkeep of the shrine. He said the church hadn’t determined the fees for housing pet cremains, although the brochure was seeking donations to the project in the $1000 to $40,000 range. Coiro said he was moved by his childless sister who considered her dogs family, and was distraught when they died. ‘I understand for many, many people, their animals are very dear to them,’ said Coiro.”
You gotta love the way these Italians know how to make money…
Jerry S and Ron, right on target. As for Abp. Niederauer, I have seen and reviewed over and over the video of the former Abp. giving communion to the despicable ‘Sisters/Perpetual Indulgence.” 1st of all, Abp. N. before the moment of giving communion had lots of time to inspect the congregation during the Mass and see them (the ‘Sisters’) present in their unmistakeable attire; he could have had one of his assistants approach them before they got to him in the communion line and dissuade them from coming forward. But when the moment came, he clearly focused on each one and deliberately acted to impart communion to each of them in succession (there were two of them at this event). At the very least, Abp. N’s judgment should be roundly and forever called into Q. for this matter, and his weak response of admission occurred only when the video surfaced contradicting his prior denials of knowledge of the situation. Do people outside of the San Francisco Bay area know that abstinent homosexual Catholics, and in fact many ‘gay’s’ besides Catholics ones, find the “Sisters” abhorrent and pornographically anti-Catholic? Do you know they view them as retrograde to the homosexual community’s earning respect? Do you know they (the ‘Sisters’) wear sex-toys attached to their ‘robes?’ They are unmistakeable (as I have seen them) from literally a block away! Then cast off the blinders, you mistaken defenders of dogs who will not bark and shepherds who will not shepherd the flock.
And on a different note: Yes, St John’s Seminary Chapel is exquisitely beautiful and uplifting. But isn’t it notable that Abp. N. and Card. Mahony and the late Bp. Patrick Ziemann all graduated from St. John’s about 1962—and they were all ordained priests in the old Tridentine ordination rite? Isn’t it notable that this artistically and architecturally stunning gem of a chapel was a product of the Mass of Trent? Isn”t it worthy of comment to observe that all 3 of these bishops turned their back on all this—for what? Lex orandi, lex credendi. And so, what do we have now — and I am not speaking of just architecture?
One thing I will say in defense Archbishop Niederauer is he did help us get Prop 8 passed.
Excuse me, Fr. John Higgins, but Msgr. Gary Bauler is a rank modernist priest who while he was pastor of St Peter Claver parish was a subscriber to “NATIONAL CATHOLIC REPORTER,” in my view a very heterodox newspaper, and frequently left his copy in the vestibule of St Peter for ALL TO READ! This kind of drove me crazy, but he wouldn’t change this habit. Also, his homilies were frquently repetitious, boring and hardly EVER touched upon the burning issues confronting practicing Catholics today, such as the UBER-FRQUENT use of contraceptives, including abortifacient contraceptives, by WEEKLY MASS-GOING CATHOLIC WOMEN. It’s an open scandal that this goes on so it’s hardly news. But it’s very shocking to see it go on today some forty-plus years after the encyclical of PP VI, “Humanae Vitae.” In fact this may be the really 5-ton ELEPHANT IN THE LIVING ROOM within the circles of so-called practicing Catholics. The scandal of so many Catholic women who REFUSE to follow the teachings of the Catholic church in this regard. And it’s been the constant teaching for roughly 2,000 years; remember the “DIDACHE?” NOW WE KNOW WHO THE “WIMMIN” WERE WHO VOTED SO ASSIDULOUSLY FOR HUSSEIN OBAMA. Ersatz “Cathoic” women. What a disgrace! GOD BLESS ALL, MARKRITE
Have many pondered how Popes who openly professed to believe in Fatima refused to do what Our Lady of Fatima commanded? I certainly have, and the conclusions I came to are not very happy ones.
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
lets be charitable towards our bishops, even the lukewarm ones that try to be good.
Our Lords commands to “admonish the sinner” applies as well to bishops as it does to the laity!
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
Oh my gosh, no – these mosaics appear to be from the hands of masters, not from me. Gosh, I am astounded that anyone would think I would praise in any publication works that I had done. I do not have photographs of the mosaics, although I have always wanted to ask permission to photograph them. The chapel feels so sacred to me, I wouldn’t dare do such a thing without explicit permission and a justifiable purpose. I’m sorry if my mentioning that I have sold some of my work that some may think me self-promoting. I actually prefer to keep my favorite pieces or to give them to loved ones, as it is excruciating to hear people discuss my work, even when praising them. I’ve noticed that the works I’ve sold have been my most disliked efforts, the ones that have become too showy, too grand, and a few steps beyond admirable restraint. I was glad to be rid of them but embarrassed that they were ever seen, much less chosen. No such problems seem ever to have existed for the past masters who executed the work in the chapel. It is understated but thrilling work, perfectly suitable to express the joy and wonder of the proper exaltation of the major tenants of our faith, work that is bound to be pleasing to God as well as our human eyes when we love Jesus and venerate Mary and the other saints in heaven. I wonder if those who open the seminary to the community once a year would be willing to have these works photographed and shared here, or would they perhaps be reticent out of fear of turning such sacred space into a much-trampled, tiny virtual museum? No photograph I am capable of taking would do this work justice, and calling too much attention to such worldly pleasures might be seen as detrimental to the sacredness of this almost hidden place of worship.
The chapel is sacred Maryanne…this is consecrated ground…and the Blessed Sacrament is housed in the tabernacle…sadly, and sorrowfully, this makes the history of this seminary all the more harrowing, and a grave shock to a Catholic’s sensibility. The shame of some of it’s seminarian’s and ordained clergy, not to mention the scandalous bishops who were “formed” at this seminary, has caused so many parishioners and faithful to question their own faith. Mahony, Zeimann, Levada and a slew of known “pederast vermin” began their journey and developed their vocation through these hallowed halls…it is so tragic and overwhelming, it makes me numb…almost in disbelief it’s so incongruent and paradoxical…
Taipan I am so ignorant about what goes on in these seminary’s….your comments make we aware of the concerns that many have. I can’t give my opinion because I know not but I can sympathize with those who know more facts. Telling from your concerns I agree with you on your strong distaste.
“I am astounded that anyone would think I would praise in any publication works that I had done.”
Maryanne please don’t be astounded. You have often spoken up about charity in speech and action. You can see that several posters have found questionable inconsistencies in your posts lately. I am only asking because you previously inferred that you are disappointed in the Catholic Church’s treatment of women. Once again I ask you to specifically what you meant and clarify which teaching are you inferring to that shows discrimination. If you answer none, which is correct, then there should be nothing to criticize the Church for in that regard. You make these statements that women are not valued but you never clarify why you are critical of the Church’s treatment of women. Maryanne, Church teaching is a clear as a ringing bell. So are inconsistencies. This is why several posters are writing what they are.
You seemed to be so thrilled about these mosaics so I thought that you might be wanting others to value your work. I was willing to do that Maryanne but I know that you would agree that we should not value any human accomplishment more than the accomplishment of remaining faithful to all of the teachings of the Catholic Church.
Maryanne I think perhaps you meant that men in the church may have mistreated women? But as you can see the church never has….with Christ, I have always felt safe and felt important. He loves us so much. He died for the church, to cleanse us of our sins. I know that the flaws of humans have created so much chaos. I know that you as I do, seek to love the Lord and seek to please him as well…we all have our flaws…lets hope to overlook those unimportant flaws and seek to continue to perfect what our Lord needs us to perfect. I think Catherine is just trying to reach clarity…..with clarity it may help correct the flaws in our thinking.
Growing up I had those few moments when I use to think lent was a hardship, maybe because I had to also teach my kids to give up things and such….it was my lack of understanding as to why we had the season of lent, the church repeated the why, maybe the way the NO parishes taught it was more confusing to me when I was a child or it was the watered down Catholicism that didn’t help me, but as I grew more spiritually, we are still growing and learning, that I appreciate the season of lent more. But I persevere as many sinners do who seek to better them selves in Christ…being human means having flaws….I don’t like my flaws that is for sure….but I try not to be scrupulous and try to have a balance so I can stay focused on what really matters so I can grow more in the Lord.
I often see how easily we human beings are tempted…some times we are well aware and avoid them but there are times when we fall trap to those temptations….God have mercy and praise God for our work out…to help us add some spiritual muscle through the lent season! I know that this has nothing to do with you but I just wanted to share…..
ChinuaOkwonkwo what did Jesus say about being lukewarm? We need to follow His teachings not of men.
The gay clergy is attempting to redefine charity, aka love, according to their intrinsically disordered souls. Over a century ago there was a movement that began which attempted to redefine Jesus according to the development of historical criticism. This movement has spawned all sorts of new Jesuses, and the gay one is the big wool hood that they’re trying to put over our heads now. Once they can get the hood on the Church, then they’ll trot out the knives and begin the sawing movement. Any pope who might not side with them will be the target of head lopping off also. So, reader, if you can follow this scenario, then you’ll see that what the gays are after is the head of the pope, ie the papacy. Interesting that the new Pope has stepped aside from the butcher’s block, aka the papal apartments, no?, which perhaps had been rendered into a “John the Baptist type of dungeon” … whose head was removed. At that time, St John the Baptist was the visible head man of the upstart following of Christ. Jesus called John the Baptist, “the greatest among men”, and the papacy is the greatest throne among men. The analogy points to a certain reality in the spiritual war between the devil and God. The gays are members of the devil’s hordes, as obvious in their attempt to redefine Jesus, aka love, aka charity.
Catherine, I don’t want to enter into debate with you on these subjects. There is a bit too much bite in your comments to make discourse with you interesting and/or pleasurable, and I’m trying to have a lovely life here. Perhaps we agree in a great many ways, but it feels as if you are gunning for me personally, seeking to find the cracks in my personal armor rather than to exchange thoughts in a respectful manner. Kinda funny, because you’re one of this site’s brainiacs, and I agree with you so often, but your manner of addressing me feels like you’re looking for a personal fight rather than truly wanting to exchange ideas. There also seems to be a vast array of litmus test strips in your quiver which people must pass before you are willing to consider them worthy of friendly exchange of views with you, and I get frequent messages that I just am not up to muster with you, since I dare to think for myself and report what I’ve observed. You have a way also of twisting people’s words and seem to be looking for a fight with most of your comments. How about taking a few moments to consider if I have anything to offer you with this comments? A little less sting in your arrows might make me feel a little less like a bug under your microscope and a lot more like exchanging ideas. I’ve read your comments for quite a while now and generally don’t find them intellectually wanting, but there is often an acidic touch that makes me aware of your seeming to be waiting to pounce on people. Although we share a faith, your style suggests we are not on the same team. I guess I just don’t feel like coming out and playing with you today, so you will have to forgive my failing to respond to your direct challenges to me lately. Sorry. Am planning to enjoy my day today insofar as possible and want to keep an eye out for how I can make this world a teensy bit better place today for my contributions. I hope this effort is successful, even with this post, for which I apologize if it hurts you. Please let’s just make things lots less about attacking individuals and lots more about exchanging ideas, okay? Assuming by my reporting feeling moved by mosaics in a chapel in a seminary that I am promoting my own works as a mosaics artist, for example, almost feels like you are questioning my character, or at least assuming I have a hidden agenda that advances my own self-interests. The thought never entered my mind, or even my post. This is an example of how, even in subtle ways, I feel you are gunning for me personally. I don’t know why you would be, but it is not an environment that leads to enjoyable discourse. Let’s elevate things a bit, what do you say?
Thank you for your response. I am quite sure by now you do feel that you are being microscopically examined, especially if you are consistently ascribing uncharitable motives on my part. Please don’t look at it that way dear sister in Christ. That will be a misconception on your part. Maryanne, Who doesn’t want a lovely life? Wouldn’t it have been so much easier to just say that you accept “all” of the teachings of the Catholic Church? There are no teachings that devalue women or men. There should be nothing to hide if you accept all Church Teaching.
Speaking of lovely lives, life has certainly just been made more difficult because of yesterday’s ruling from an unfaithful Catholic on the Supreme Court.
Maryanne, I am trying to elevate the conversation. I would like you to reflect on some thoughts and you do not have to respond if you do not choose to. You have shared some incredibly painful stories about your life with us on CCD. You even once mentioned that you have considered writing about your life. The reason that I have often challenged you is that I do see the fullest potential in your ability to write and express yourself. I do not mean by any stretch of the imagination in the same sense that God knows our fullest potential. When I reflect on some of the stories that you have shared with us, I am always at a loss to understand why someone with your history of suffering at the hands of disobedient clergy gives what seems like a very generous free pass to other disobedient clergy who helped develop and harvest the foul petri dish of disobedience that created an environment for people to be harmed, such as yourself. You obviously disagree with something because you say that you do not want to get into a debate. What is there to debate? Are you trying to change a Church teaching? I am not. Top that off when you posted support and potential canonization for a clergy member who does kind acts for gang members but tears down the teachings of Christ’s Church. Rampant disobedience is why we had yesterday’s ruling. That ruling stemmed from many years of plain collective disobedience to Church teaching. When the laity gives a pre-canonization free pass to terrible disobedience because the person showing disobedience is charismatic in other ways, then disobedience flourishes.
You wrote: ” I am more concerned about my life being devoted to the highest possible use of which I am capable. Folks, no need to attack me or change my thinking; it’s a bit too late. I’ve decided who I am and what I stand for, and I’m satisfied with it. There’s still lots of hope for helping Father Boyle on his journey toward sainthood. This is a man worth saving. All of us can be influenced by good thinking and teaching. Go see what you can teach him, and go see what you can learn from him while you’re at it. Go in love, and go in peace.”
Maryanne, You are the one who said that you and your husband were very good friends with this priest. Why have you relegated that teaching part to others while you get to bask in the lovely comfort of just praising him while looking the other way and asking others to tell our disobedient and lax clergy how much they are wounding the Body of Christ? I will look forward to reading your book one day. You are a beautiful survivor because of your Catholic faith and when God gives someone the gift that he has given you, it is never to too late, it is never to be wasted and tossed to others when having to deal with obedience to Church teaching. Perhaps you have had conversations with this priest and God bless you if you did! If we always seem more enamored with thrilling mosaics and the things that people do for gang members while at the same time betraying Christ, then our book of life will not be the Masterpiece that God intended it to be. You ARE more capable than that! The highest possible use of your gifts will shine the brightest when your emphasis is on faithfulness and obedience. I am truly looking forward to reading your book one day. Talk about a best seller.
We can always teach others how to work with gangs or feed the poor but it will not be that easy to place the evil that was unleashed yesterday back into the pits of hell from where it originated. God will accomplish that with the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart but meanwhile it is never too late while we are living on this o earth. This evil was groomed by many compromises and by many terrible sins of omission within the Church. This evil has been gaining momentum through years of disobedience to Christ and the Magisterium. Would you agree with that?
Maryanne no disrespect but Catherine charitably make excellent points. I tool the time to read your response and hers and I have to say that you are blessed….to have someone like Catherine point out unpleasant things that some may consider…it’s like having a true friend, one to treasure. Even if it’s over these posts.
We come here share our thoughts, our prayers, our cares, concerns and how can we not expect anyone to, who truly cares, comment. I think that it’s how one views it….setting pride aside and applying more humility…I think that her question was asking you for clarity. How are women mistreated? With anything we do know that there are abuses in the church but it doesn’t represent what the really church really stands for…..we can expose the mistreatment of women by individuals or certain parishes but in the church, as a whole, the body of Christ….they are not mistreated.
I took not tool and in the beginning of my sentence I made not make…sorry for my typo’s…..It just shows I need to rest not comment too much…God have mercy….my apologies
Maryanne its just Catherine’s style, she is more honest and to the point, but at least she truly cares and I appreciate you kindly letting her know you didn’t want to answer her simple question directly…I don’t think she wants to fight with you either, it’s not like she is re-inventing things, she just didn’t get nor do I why you felt that way but I’m sure it can come off strong as if she was magnifying your sentiment but it must have stood out to her and well what can we say, maybe just giving her the answer to your sentiments may help who knows….but everyone has their own style.
Like you, you have admonished YFC in the past and you were right to do so but I think he doesn’t agree with you. I agree with you and was cheering you on because you are right to enforce church teachings and to correct him.
Maryanne one thing I do know is that I felt you were harsh on Catherine….it was just a question to clarify( you did take the time to post a long reply without answering it, maybe answering it would have been shorter???)… you most likely felt attacked….setting aside those feelings lets focused on the depth….that is what helps humble me too…..maybe it was her delivery but it still is as simple as that simple question….
What I notice about Catherine, MIKE, and Skai and some others that have a zeal to defend the faith, is that they challenge the readers from their posts to think? MIKE doesn’t always directly respond if someone disagrees but Catherine and Skai usually do. I know some don’t like the delivery but the depth of it all is that it is a genuine effort to unite one with the church and the truth. Some may argue that they don’t hold all the answers, no, that is true but they sure seem to know well a lot on the faith and I always notice that Catherine posts only church teachings from either the CCC, the Doctors of the church, scripture etc….she is not inventing things or twisting….it’s her genuine effort….it is raw and uncensored. It’s more lovely and becoming more rare comparing to what is now acceptable as the norm….I don’t like the norm….