As surging COVID-19 cases lead to new restrictions in the San Francisco area, Archbishop Salvatore Cordileone said the treatment of churches is discriminatory and violates the right to worship.
“[W]orship is both a natural and a Constitutional right. My people want to receive the Body and Blood of Christ; they need it, and have every right to be free to do so,” the archbishop said in a November 28 statement.
He criticized a new health order from the state of California placing San Francisco and San Mateo Counties into a more restrictive tier of coronavirus restrictions, resulting in a ban on indoor worship services.
The health order treats religious worship as a “non-essential” activity, while allowing hair and nail salons, massage parlors, and tattoo parlors to remain open, Cordileone noted.
“This is precisely the kind of blatant discrimination to which the Supreme Court gave injunctive relief in New York,” he said, referencing a decision Wednesday which blocked New York from similarly closing houses of worship while allowing secular retail venues to remain open.
Cordileone criticized the government for “demoting worship” by designating it as “non-essential.” He stressed that the archdiocese has been meticulous about following regulations regarding masks, social distancing, ventilation and sanitation measures. He said indoor worship services have not resulted in any known cases of COVID-19 transmission in San Francisco.
Full story at Catholic News Agency.
COVID cases are up 5 fold since the summer lows in San Francisco. Archbishop Cordieone, please take note.
99.97% survival rate. Please take note, YFC. The lockdowns are unjustified.
No, that 99.97% number is completely fake. I’ve covered this many many times. The overall case death rate is about 1.2% and among the elderly it is 5% and above. Please tell the truth.
The 99.97% survival rate is from the CDC in September. Even if your lower numbers are accurate, it doesn’t justify a lockdown. Please be reasonable. Deaths in 2020 are no higher than previous years. The coronavirus is not causing an increase in deaths. It’s all lies. Open everything up, and people who are afraid or vulnerable can stay home.
No, anonymous, the CDC never said any sort of thing. Where is the link to that statement?
It can’t possibly be true. There are 331 million people in the United States. There have been at least 268,000 fatalities in the US. To get the case fatality rate, we would divide the fatalities into the total number of cases, but just to prove a point, let’s divide it into the entire population. Almost one in every one thousand Americans has already died of the COVID. That is 0.1%. So the case fatality rate cannot be anywhere close to 99.97%. Deaths are MUCH higher than in previous years. You just spout off things that maybe you heard someone say they thought they heard the CDC said this and that….get the facts and save lives.
Again, I have never advocated for a new lockdown. Please find a quote anywhere where I advocate a lockdown. I advocate outdoor tented masses with heat, social distancing, and masks.
Please tell the truth.
+Yawn+
My county of 300 k souls. 4490 cases, 28 TOTAL deaths. 20+ deaths at Skilled or other Senior communites. +20 deaths all over 60 Y0.
I again encourage folks to better understand their own situation and risks.
Meanwhile, recent deaths attributed to covid have diminished, and the CDC Total Weekly Death rate is now at average baseline level, about 58,000 per week. OK, YFC, give it up, will you? End the continual promotion of covid. Go pitch your tent at DNC, where you belong.
This is not true. The rate of deaths is on a good trajectory, but the number of cases is going up which means more people will die from the virus. There were a million new cases last week and 11,000 new deaths last week. Cases are rising all over the country. While a great number, most really, don’t have severe symptoms they can give the virus to others. Dig deeper into the CDC dashboards. They don’t show normal deaths. The covid cases are in addition to the normally expected deaths per month.
We are not at any kind of baseline level. Average daily COVID deaths for the past week, before the Holiday data slowdowns are taken into consideration are standing in excess of 1500 deaths per day. That is more than two 9|11 per week, and will certainly grow when we get data after the Thanskgiving weekend. I provide links to data. Please do the same.
https://twitter.com/COVID19Tracking/status/1333573974404460546
So those that want to stay home from mass can. “My body, my choice”, should apply to mass.
Those that want to go, unless you have symptoms should be able to go. We take precautions at the grocery store and I admit I care more about my fellow parishioners then strangers at a store. Wear a mask and keep your distance from others. Mass is more essential then most other services. Period.
No covid cases have been linked to Catholic Mass, none, not a single one. People have been following the guidelines and attending Mass is safe in San Francisco and elsewhere in the Unites States. Stay home if you want, the rest of us will go to the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.
Geary, not quite so fast.
https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/They-defied-health-rules-for-a-storybook-San-15434220.php
Besides that, hundreds of cases have been linked to religious services. I’m very sure the virus doesn’t distinguish between the Novus order and any other religious service.
Again, YFC, so what?
California has a population of almost 40 million souls and you are holding up “hundreds” of cases (even allowing for that number’s accuracy) as reasons to close off religious services and businesses?
Dude, if you want to wrap yourself up in plastic, go ahead. The rest of us can read and make decisions for ourselves.
I think we’re more at risk of increase suicides and abortions than the low fatality rates of the wuflu.
Dude Keith, As I have said many many times, I think religious services should be held outdoors in tents with heaters. I’m not sure how many “souls” you want to die of this disease, when so simple a thing as outdoor services suffice for both sacramental and health needs. At this point, there are commenters on this website who swear they will never even where a mask while in a Church. If wearing a mask and sitting in a tent to save lives are too much of a cross to carry, then I might respectfully suggest that the faith of the faithful might be lacking. Please remember that when you say “the rest of us can read and make decisions for ourselves”, does that include the decision to put at risk the lives of the innocent people you must interact with….your doctors, your food suppliers, your family? When do they get to make a decision for themselves?
“…does that include the decision to put at risk the lives of the innocent people you must interact with….your doctors, your food suppliers, your family? When do they get to make a decision for themselves?”
Same advice for them. If you want to wear the mask, go ahead. If you think that is protecting you, go for it. As I’ve told you many times, if you are elderly, obese or any of hundreds of other infirmities, stay home. That goes for all the people that you cited. If I am able to research these facts, so are they and you.
If not, stay at home and wrap yourself in bubble wrap. Your fear and lack of common sense doesn’t rule over me and mine.
The fatality rates are so low that the mitigations put in place by the so called authorities are putative and not based on any common sense or logic. You paint with a large brush with no backing data or science.
Keith W, the logic behind your statement is identical to supporting a person who drinks and drives.
Sure, the person most at risk is the drunk driver himself, but he endangers others along the way. We might as well say to all the sober drivers, “stay home…wrap yourself in bubble wrap.”
The case fatality rate among seniors, those most likely to attend our churches is 5%. Which two of the 40 gray hairs at your Church would you like to pick out for extermination?
Agree. Many dioceses around the country have been open for indoor Masses since late June. Haven’t heard of a single case. YFC is paranoid and full of fear. It just indicates that when one is in this state they have to bring everyone into this and scare them to death. Stay home YFC and stop scaring people. Maybe if you really cared about others think about the ones who are being wiped out every day (over 4,000 little girls/boys in their mother’s womb) and help out there. Let’s not forget it’s not just the babies but their mothers who are deeply wounded from this violence.
If a quarter of a million dead people doesn’t scare you, I’m sure I won’t either. A quarter million dead people. So far.
And 60 million dead girls/boys just in our country alone. Billions or trillions around the world who will never know how to live, love and enjoy life and all those mothers who are so wounded by this violence not to mention husbands, boyfriends, grandmothers, grandfathers, siblings. .And locking people up is making it worse with all the suicides, not getting health care, loneliness, depression, etc.
If AB Cordileone doesn’t order his priests to keep churches open and celebrate public Mass in violation of state health authority edicts, then he doesn’t believe what he’s written; he’s just virtue signaling. Empty talk from the AB? We’ll see… and if he just exhorts his faithful to more prayer and rosaries and consecrations without opening up the churches so they can exercise their natural and Constitutional rights, then he’s doubly virtue signaling.
One of the few Roman Catholic bishops with any guts to teach the Faith!!!
Last week the US experienced an increase of covid-19 case of 4 million new cases bringing the total to 13.6 million. We had, last week 11,000 new deaths attributed to covid-19 bringing the total to 268,000 deaths so far. The death rate has flattened for some weeks now: good news. The bad news is that a 2% death rate of an increasing number of cases is not a good thing. In California, we have had 1,212,000 cases and 19,141 deaths reported. That is a lot of dead people. The smart thing is to not put oneself in a situation where they could contract the virus. Social distance and wear a mask around others and stay at home as much as possible.
Overall deaths in the country for 2020 are not higher than previous years. Most of those who died “from covid” (debatable) were probably going to die this year anyway if covid had never existed. To say covid is causing an increase in deaths is a lie.
YFC and Bob One, why continue on with this seemingly endless inflation of covid deaths. it has been stated repeatedly in guidelines, that deaths due to pneumonia and influenza, and any other disease that occurs simultaneously, are to be counted as covid. This is called PIC, please reference and confirm this. In plain English, almost any death of any type can be counted as a covid death. For a much more realistic estimate, the correct data to look at, is the CDC data table which shows “US Total Deaths from all Causes”. This data cannot be fudged or inflated, because it comes directly from death certificates.
So, looking at this data, it is immediately apparent that the US total deaths from all causes has dropped and has been at the average level, that is 8000 deaths daily, or 56,000 weekly, for at least a month or more. Of course, this value varies as to weather or other problems, but please, go look it up on the CDC table, where you will see that it is at this average value.
And also, over and over and over, showing a positive cv test, does not mean that person will be hospitalize or die, and that cv deaths are mostly age related.
Also, now huge numbers of people have already had covid, and are finally getting tested after the fact. It’s time to cease the hysterics, and get back to normal. We have a flu or virus every single year, although perhaps different types with other names. We cannot continue to damage our society and young people with this continued state of panic. It must be accepted as a fact of life – influenzas and similar diseases occur every year, without exception, and some years are worse than others. Your choice – what are we to do, if we have a serious new type of flu or virus, this winter, or next winter, or the winter after that? Your decision, Bob One and YFC – keep on with the masking and hysterics? Or return to Normal life?
anon, we have told you over and over and over again, COVID is included in PIC, but it is not PIC that we are talking about. COVID – not flu- is causing excess deaths. In fact, flu deaths the last season were down quite a bit from prior years. “Almost any type of death” cannot be a COVID death. You are simply making that up.
We have told you over and over and over again that death certificate data is 2 months old and reflects infections that happenned 3 months ago. The surge that has been occurring since about halloween would not be reflected in CDC death certificate data.
We cannot return to normal life, at least not until the vaccines (which some here have disparaged as well) have a chance to work their miracle. All we ask is that people mask, distance, stay outside, don’t congregate with people outside your household, and test frequently. Is that really so hard? Is that really worth continuing to lie about the statistics? Trust me, when the death certificate data catch up with current infection trends, you are going to have one big red face. I’d love to save you that shame.
No, YFC, you are not correct. It is stated by CDC, that PIC means that pneumonia and influenza deaths may be counted as coronavirus deaths (and MDs were asked to include, as covid deaths, any deaths that they feel involved covid). So a person dying of cancer, and very weak, gets covid and dies. The MD is allowed to call that a Covid death, and so it will be counted as a covid death.
The reason given is the belief that covid is much more dangerous than most flus, so it must be counted as the cause of death, even if the person is dying of a much more serious problem like cancer or heart disease.
This does have drawbacks, since covid data then gets mixed in with other diseases and it is more difficult to follow the course of covid, for example, whether it is increasing or decreasing over time.
A second point is that death certificates often arrive within a few days, and so the counting starts immediately that same week. CDC states that as more and more certificates arrive, the total for one week, is approximately correct after about 8 weeks. Some certificates dribble in, over a year, but generally, 8 weeks is good for an approximation.
Next, “Total US Deaths from all Causes”, must include covid, so if covid is increasing at all, this must show up as an increased total death rate. QED. But Total Death rate for all causes, has not shown this for about two months now. There were two peaks, and then a decline to usual baseline values around 56 to 58 thousand weekly deaths per week, where it is now.
The last point is whether this new wave of positive covid tests will increase the total death rate.
This is again going to be muddled in the upcoming months, because winter always shows an increase in pneumonias and (other) flus…
It isn’t easy then, to accurately assess what is happening, but you should at least accept that covid deaths have dropped to baseline value for the last two months, so there is a good chance it is abating.
Anonb you keep saying things that you imagine CDC says yet you fail to provide links or quotes. You seem to misunderstand what CDC says. PIC deaths cannot be considered to be COVID deaths. PIC means Pneumonia, influenza and COVID. You just keep imagining what CDC says without actually letting CDC speak for itself. Where is your link?
Here is another link which will demonstrate to you that excess deaths spiked when COVID was out of control in New York, then returned to a more seasonal level during the summer after our severe lockdowns, but are spiking again after we began opening up. It correlates very very well with the number of confirmed COVID cases. Again, I provide links to hard data, you provide ridiculous spin. Let’s be prolife together and start telling the hard truth.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/04/21/world/coronavirus-missing-deaths.html?action=click&module=Top%20Stories&pgtype=Homepage
Anonymous just look at the source YFC put up. The NY Times which has a history of putting out misleading information and fake news.
Ronnie…Yep, just look at YFC’s source – The New York Times !!!
Can’t stop chuckling. Such a fair, objective, balanced newspaper.
(er, ah, what???)
Just Look at the NYT Global Warming articles, for example, which claimed
the Arctic Ice would be melted, decades ago, and that there was not a single
good arising from increased CO2. (How about increased crop yields – a proven fact!)
Anyways,
YFC: Do a little of your own work. Yes, it is useless reading newspapers, they are so
politically oriented, one sided, and usually lack even a faint attempt at objectivity.
Even CDC data can be very tough to work with. A table that should be referenced,
is buried under 4 deep URLs. And very often CDC discussions aren’t much different
from newspapers, rather general and scattered. And many CDC very important discussions like
how MDs are to label covid deaths are too general and confusing.
So yes, it isn’t easy to get at reasonably accurate data.
But you can’t continue referencing newspapers, or you will be just repeating their biased comments,
It is so difficult to understand the Media now. Where are the Media workers searching data and forming
objective conclusions, to report to the public?
Sorry, they just aren’t there – the Media is only into gossip and opinions, as exemplified by Maddows…
New York Times is known as the journal of record for a reason. So while you disparage the best journalism in the country, you offer no alternative. Why do you work so hard to avoid the hard truth of people who die? We are now near three times the number of COVID deaths every week that happenned on 9-11. How can you be so callous?
YFC You can’t make this up: the “journal of record”! Of what lies? Callous? Callousness is stopping people from living their lives and to control their lives as they see fit. Totalitarianism is more like it!
The unanswered question in all this is who are the ones getting sick? What age demographic? What activities area spreading the virus? This is not a one-size-fits-all problem. It stands to reason that those contracting the Wuhan virus can probably point to occasions where they put themselves at risk. I suspect large family gatherings, convalescent homes, extra-curricular rioting and other political demonstrations, careless behavior around others is largely to blame. Where is the evidence that churchgoers with masks and properly distanced, are spreading the virus and causing people to die? Prove to me this is happening and I will join the choir. Absent this, let them come to church with appropriate caution.
Dan you raise a lot of good questions and points. One of your best points is ” This is not a one-size-fits-all problem”. It is not as though Churches are the only place where COVID transmission happens – far from it. But we know from the data that speaking is about 10 times more likely to produce the kinds of aerosols that transmit the virus than simply sitting quietly and breathing. Singing is about 40 times more likely. Inside places allow the virus to collect, while outside places allow the virus to disburse until it dies. Scientists believe that small amounts of virus probably don’t cause serious disease, but think the more virus we take in at one time, the more likely we are to get sick.
The other is, where is the evidence that churches are to blame. Well, we have a slight problem here. County and state health departments are bound by HIPAA to not disclose personal information. And the press is generally pretty good about keeping information out of the press that would violate people’s privacy. So just because we don’t hear of outbreaks doesn’t mean that outbreaks didn’t happen. And any situation is safe, as long as no one in the setting has the virus to spread. We do have many examples of places where choirs rehearsed in Churches while maintaining social distance. Basically half of the choir got sick, even though no one entered the place feeling sick. This choir tried to do the right thing. They distanced, they didn’t hug one another, yet many many of them got sick.
There are ways to mitigate the risk but in a study by Johns Hopkins last June (on whether social distancing works), they found that those who attended Church in the 2 weeks before the study were 16 times more likely to be infected with Coronavirus
I’m afraid John Hopkins has been censoring people. Why?
It is always wise to scrutinize those who give you information and asking why they might want you to have that information and believe it. I wish people did that more often.
My purpose in the comment was simply to give the information so that people can make an informed choice and as a response to the comment by Dan asking for evidence. (It does not, however, answer his question well.)
If John Hopkins is censoring people, you should ask why. If you are referring to the article on Covid-19 deaths that ran in an independent student newspaper, it was not censored by Johns Hopkins. It was retracted by the student paper itself because they believed it was wrong and that it was being used to bolster Covid-19 skepticism that they view as dangerous.
You can find all this online.
Here is the article: https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/johns-hopkins-university-censors-lecturer-responds-with-critique-ignoring-cdc-data
Will be going today once again Bob One, just to defy you and rest of the Left.
Bohemond I am really concerned for you. You seem to be utterly filled with rage and hatred. You seem completely out of touch with the love and mercy that Christ offers to each of us. I wish you peace.
The Archbishop should hold masses and file for federal injunctive relief based on the 14th Amendment as to equal protection under the law. We lose our rights when we fail to assert them. Simply because a rule is made or a law is passed, that does not mean it is constitutional. There are some in government who are simply opposed to freedom of religion and the clergy and laypersons need to assert their rights through peaceful resistance as well as through the courts. The Thomas More Society can help Hopefully the Archbishop will show courage and bring the issue to the federal courts.
Some Bishops have more courage than others. At the far southern end of our state there is a bishop who is kneeling to the secular left.
Bob One,
I am pastor of a large parish near Los Angeles. Not one person in my parish has died of COVID. I know of one parishioner that had it, but probably because he was out late at night with friends (he’s young) and was at demonstrations for “Equality”.
It’s my tiny opinion that attending Mass with social distancing, masks and people who are told constantly not to touch each other, not to touch the priest’s fingers at Communion and to take other safe measures is the very least of our problems.
The way the diocese outfoxed those fake Indian maidens who toppled and defaced a Serra statue, it’s sure to make short work of the big boys.
Very few, if any, are getting COVID at churches. I’ve gone to masses indoors, outdoors, received on the tongue, in the hand, with priest masked and unmasked and not gotten it. I have had cancer minutely 3 times, but try to eat healthy, less junk food or drink. I take vitamins and do not take lots of prescription drugs because I keep blood pressure down with low sodium diet & cholesterol down with smaller meat, fish, poultry & cheese intake. Use more fresh fruit, veggies, whole grain & legumes. Prepared foods – boxed dinners, cans, have more sodium & sugar content. Low fat means more sodium. Exercise! Mask, distance if needed.
Anne TE, I’m really glad you are taking care of yourself. I follow the same guidelines, yet I find myself on statins and blood pressure meds none-theless. I’m sure if I didn’t do exactly the things you said, I’d be on much higher doses.
But that doesn’t negate the fact that you might someday go to an indoor mass in which the person next to you – completely innocently and unbeknownst to them – harbors and spreads the virus. They didn’t mean to do it. They didn’t even have any indication that they had the virus in the first place. All of the low sodium diets in the world won’t protect you from inhaling the virus-laden aerosols she might be sending your way.
Go to mass – demand outdoor masses especially in places in California where we can do so relatively comfortably as long as we have a tent over our heads to protect from sun and rain. It might be chilly. Gosh, I remember going into unheated Churches in the east coast when I lived there and you thought you’d die of the cold. Why can’t we take care of ourselves and each other by eating wisely, exercising regularly, masking, distancing, and staying away from others that we don’t live with. Put on an extra layer to keep warm. We have only a few months until the vaccines make this nightmare go away. It’s really pretty simple to save lives in this case. Lets do it!
YFC, I have never heard you tell those who go to “Pride Parades” such things, but you certainly love to tell those who go into a church with distancing and most wearing masks they are going to get it.
I do not panic if someone in a store, etc. is not wearing a mask and I am, unless they are coughing. nearby. We are exposed to COVID germs everyday when we bring in the mail. The idea is to limit exposure, and I am not going to live the rest of my life in fear. I never want my grandchildren to be told they killed grandma because they happen to walk by her without a mask either.
Another thing. COVID usually kills because it turns into pneumonia. There is an ethical pneumonia shot already being used that contains no fetal tissue. If you are so afraid, get it. It come in two shots about a year apart.
And I do not find that the pneumonia vaccine used the aborted fetus cell line either.
YFC Again Churches have been open since late June in other dioceses without any new cases. Brooklyn even won at the Supremes & what’s happening in California is an outrage. And please do not send any fake news links .
No, YFC, let’s not, no more giving power to unaccountable and incompetent politicians and political hacks who are loving every minute of this.
Bohemond, I am wondering if you have lost your livelihood?
Oh! and don’t vandalize, without masks and distancing especially. Nature has a way of being its own punishment. I am sure a lot of vandalizers have gotten COVID and other diseases. Don’t go to bars at night nor wild parties. It is a good way for women, and even men, to be drugged, raped or kidnapped — or blackmailed since cameras are all over the place. Have a glass of wine, beer, etc., with your dinner — at home — in moderation or none at all. Be smart, be safe.
Another good thing to do is to use mouth wash after brushing in the morning and night, and to brush well ones teeth and listen to ones dentist. Take a baggy with toothbrush, toothpaste and bathroom cups to work and brush teeth at least morning, noon and night after eating.
Using saline nasal solution to wash the nasal passages is also a healthy thing to do. I do not buy the box of packages that one has to mix with sterilized water as I do not have to use that much. I simply buy the small nasal saline bottles, wash the tip with soap and water after use, and only use it for myself.