Archbishop Cordileone
Earlier today it was reported that in a new documentary, Francesco, Pope Francis stated, “Homosexual people have the right to be in a family. They are children of God. You can’t kick someone out of a family, nor make their life miserable for this. What we have to have is a civil union law; that way they are legally covered.” AP Story
Archbishop Cordileone responds: “In our bishops region’s audience with Pope Francis last January during our ad limina visit (the visit diocesan bishops make every five years to the Vatican), the topic of civil unions came up in conversation. The Holy Father clearly differentiated between a civil arrangement which accords mutual benefits to two people, and marriage. The former, he said, can in no way be equated to marriage, which remains unique.
“I would add that a civil union of this type (one which is not equated to marriage) should be as inclusive as possible, and not be restricted to two people of the same sex in a presumed sexual relationship. There is no reason, for example, why a brother and a sister, both of whom are unmarried and support each other, should not have access to these kinds of benefits. Marriage is unique because it is the only institution that connects children to their mothers and fathers, and therefore is presumed to be a sexual relationship. Indeed, the sexual relationship that marriage is presumed to involve is the only kind by which children are naturally made. The nature of marriage, the place of sex within a virtuous life, these great teachings of the Church come to us from God, are illuminated by reason, and do not change.”
The above comes from an Oct. 22 statement from the San Francisco archdiocese.
Cardinal Burke
The worldwide communications media have reported with strong emphasis, as a change of course, the news that Pope Francis has declared that persons in the homosexual condition, as children of God, “have a right to have a family” and that “no one should be thrown out or be made unhappy because of it.” Moreover, they write that he has declared: “What we have to create is a civil union. In this way they will be legally covered. I have defended this.” The declarations were made in an interview with Evgeny Afineevsky, director of a documentary, Francesco, premiered on October 21, 2020, on the occasion of the Rome Film Festival.
First of all, the context and the occasion of such declarations make them devoid of any magisterial weight. They are rightly interpreted as simple private opinions of the person who made them. These declarations do not bind, in any manner, the consciences of the faithful who are rather obliged to adhere with religious submission to what Sacred Scripture and Sacred Tradition, and the ordinary Magisterium of the Church teach on the matter in question. In particular, the following are to be noted.
1. “Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity, Tradition has always declared that “homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered” (Catechism of the Catholic Church, no. 2357; Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Persona humana, “Declaration on Certain Questions Concerning Sexual Ethics, no. VIII[1]), inasmuch as they are contrary to the natural law, closed to the gift of life and void of a true affective and sexual complementarity. Therefore, they cannot be approved.
2. The particular and sometimes deep-seated tendencies of persons, men and women, in the homosexual condition, which are for them a trial, although they may not in themselves constitute a sin, represent nonetheless an objectively disordered inclination (Catechism of the Catholic Church, no. 2358; Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Homosexualitatis problema, “Letter to the Bishops of the Catholic Church on the Pastoral Care of Homosexual Persons,” no. 3[2]). They are, therefore, to be received with respect, compassion and sensitivity, avoiding any unjust discrimination. The Catholic faith teaches the faithful to hate sin but to love the sinner.
3. The faithful, and, in particular, Catholic politicians are held to oppose the legal recognition of homosexual unions (Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Considerations Regarding Proposals To Give Legal Recognition to Unions between Homosexual Persons, Diverse questioni concernenti l’omosessualità, n. 10[3]). The right to form a family is not a private right to vindicate but must correspond to the plan of the Creator Who has willed the human being in sexual difference, “male and female He created them” (Gen 1, 27), thus calling man, male and female, to the transmission of life. “Because married couples ensure the succession of generations and are therefore eminently within the public interest, civil law grants them institutional recognition. Homosexual unions, on the other hand, do not need specific attention from the legal standpoint since they do not exercise this function for the common good.” (Ibidem, no. 9[4]). To speak of a homosexual union, in the same sense as the conjugal union of the married, is, in fact, profoundly misleading, because there can be no such union between persons of the same sex. In what regards the administration of justice, persons in the homosexual condition, as all citizens, can always make use of the provisions of law to safeguard their private rights.
It is a source of deepest sadness and pressing pastoral concern that the private opinions reported with so much emphasis by the press and attributed to Pope Francis do not correspond to the constant teaching of the Church, as it is expressed in Sacred Scripture and Sacred Tradition, and is guarded, protected and interpreted by the Magisterium. Equally sad and concerning is the turmoil, confusion, and error they cause among the Catholic faithful, as is the scandal they cause, in general, by giving the totally false impression that the Catholic Church has had a change of course, that is, has changed its perennial teaching regarding such fundamental and critical questions.
The above comes from CardinalBurke.com via an Oct. 22 story in LifeSiteNews.
Trying to put the toothpaste back into the tube.
God bless Cardinal Burke. Like past Pope Benedict XVI, he writes and speaks with great clarity.
Traditional Catholics follow the words of the Holy Father. Simple.
The “words of the Holy Father” in a television interview are not the teachings of the Church (or even of the papacy).
When the Pope was asked about which player of the Argentine soccer team he prefers, Lionel Messi or Javier Mascherano, Pope Francis said “I wouldn’t know what to say because I cannot distinguish the style of the two.”
Are you following those words? When the 2020 Olympics are held next year, would it be a sin to root for the American team or should we all follow “the words of the Holy Father?”
The Vatican reports that the Pope indicated his favorite foods are Argentinian empanadas, sirloin steak and and dulce de leche. Follow that?
Admittedly, this is a bit of hyperbole regarding a serious issue. But, I am questioning your logic.
Another personal opinion of the pontiff that we are free to ignore. Very reckless of him to say such things given his position as it will cause scandal and lead souls to perdition, not to the Holy Catholic Church, apart from which there is no salvation.
Archbishop Vigano has an interesting understanding of what’s going on, here is the link:
https://www.lifesitenews.com/opinion/archbishop-vigano-responds-to-new-film-in-which-pope-endorses-homosexual-civil-unions
The bible is clear, even if the pope isn’t because Sodom and Gomorrah was destroyed on account of the practice of homosexuality. There’s nothing a pope in his fleeting time as vicar of Christ can change about God’s commands and we must ask out loud why Francis substitutes his wisdom for God’s.
Burke and Cordileone approach this from a position of scripture and tradition while Francis talks feelings. Since feelings can change often, his comments aren’t rooted in anything other than transient sentiments. The Church can’t be led by such flimsiness if we expect to have the Lord’s blessings upon us.
The problem remains: we have a pope who seems not to understand, believe, nor support Catholic doctrine. You can say or write all you want about how what the pope said doesn’t alter anything from a technical theological standpoint, but it’s still demoralizing for the faithful to have a pope such as this. Imagine being on a soccer team whose coach hated the game and discouraged his players from playing correctly and said that other sports were better and that players ardently devoted to playing soccer well had psychological problems. That’s what it feels like to be a Catholic these days under Pope Francis.
The fact remains that Catholics are bound to oppose civil unions, as Cardinal Burke pointed out. So for the pope to express approval of civil unions is nothing short of a total disaster. His private opinion is an unCatholic opinion. What does that tell you about the pope?
It used to be a throw away line made to highlight the obvious, to ask “Is the Pope Catholic”. Not so funny anymore…
Great analogy-Kevin!
The homosexual director of this documentary was just given an award and honored in the Vatican gardens for this latest work. Money the Vatican collected from Peter’s Pence were used to finance the recent movie about homosexual entertainer Elton John. Francis met privately with and hugged in a show of support, a same sex couple from Argentina and entertained homosexual promoter Fr. James Martin in the papal apartments. He gushed over a same sex couple who baptized the baby they somehow got, knowing they couldn’t possible bring up the child in true Catholicism. His behavior and commentary are beyond mercy and compassion, which would call for reconciliation and repentance, go and sin no more. The question that begs to be asked is why a Catholic pope is so down with homosexuality.
Are most of these comments coming from protestants? I have no experience with true Catholics bad mouthing the Pope. Or are some of you guys proposing schism?
It is not schism to point out when the pope strays from Church teaching. The infallibility of the papal office only takes place when the pope speaks ex cathedra, which he is obviously not doing here. He is merely stating his opinion here, and the good bishops are pointing out his error. No schism or bad mouthing when commenting on the opinion of another person.
Why would you make fun of my name?
Maybe he liked it Jose. You are easily sidetracked, read James de Jesus from near Fresno and marvel at his wisdom.
No offense of your name intended. My name is James and I consider myself a follower of Jesus and I live near Fresno. I apologize if you took my comments as derogatory.
.
Exactly right James, “true Catholics” can reject the personal opinion of anyone, even the pope himself without hint or threat of schism. Unfortunately, this current pope has expressed many opinions that must be vigorously opposed and doing so does not turn a well meaning Catholic into a protestant.
Go into the archives of this site, lots of good Catholics expressing opinions on this pontiffs actions and statements, “bad mouthing ” ? no , calling for correction and clarification.
Jose,
Catholics expect the office of Pope to be a full time job – not just a day job.
Often, when there is confusion, it seems a return to the sources is helpful. Below is a link to the Church’s teaching regarding legal recognition of unions between homosexual persons. This was issued by the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, when Cardinal Ratzinger (before he was pope) was head of the CDF. It was issued with the approval of the pope at the time, Pope John Paul II.
Maybe a silver lining to this cloud of confusion is the opportunity to read (or re-read) the Church’s teaching on this matter.
It may even be appropriate for your older children who are exposed to the agenda of the LGBTQ+ lobby.
https://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20030731_homosexual-unions_en.html
Thank you, Deacon Anderson, for posting this link. I am printing it out, underlining the most important parts and will show it to anyone who tries to claim “homosexual unions” have the approval of the Magisterium, which they do not.
The following link is to a CNA article in Catholic World Report which strongly suggests that the Pope’s words were due to a massive cut and paste hack job from a previous interview. It appears that the Pope was actually talking about how families should deal with homosexual children – it had little to do with gay marriage.
https://www.catholicworldreport.com/2020/10/22/pope-francis-homosexuality-comments-heavily-edited-in-documentary-no-vatican-comment-on-civil-unions-2/
Agree or not with homosexuality, why deny civil unions to these people? Why allow the tax law to discriminate against civil unions? As a married heterosexual, I personally have no issues with these civil unions.
Because civil unions cause scandal (give bad example) by giving legal cover and legitimacy to an intrinsically evil relationship, making same-sex unions seem comparable to real, natural marriage. The social and legal benefits and status afforded to real, true marriage are due to the goods that marriage brings to society, most important among them being a mother and father having and raising children to continue society. Homosexuals in same-sex unions bring no such goods to society, so they deserve no benefits in taxes or otherwise that are given to natural families. Legal recognition of same-sex unions is society saying, “this is good.” But those unions aren’t good, so they deserve no recognition and no benefits. The Pope doesn’t seem to understand that, and neither do many catholics.
I just noticed you gave a comment about this expressing my feelings very well and better than I ever could. Covered all the bases. Thanks!
Excellent point Kevin T!
Then you haven’t thought about it enough
Mike, let St. John Paul II and the CDF spell it out for you, especially in the Conclusion of the document he signed. Click on the link Deacon Andersen posted and read the whole thing for yourself.
mike m. Acts of sex perversion are sternly condemned by Almighty God! They are a great evil in any society! America’s legal system, brought from England in colonial days, originated from both Biblical and ancient Greek and Roman sources. God ordained Marriage between one Man and one Woman, and they are to bring forth children, which God will send. The human family is like the Holy Family– reflecting the Blessed Trinity. Human Marriage is of God! In our Catholic Faith, it is a holy Sacrament, a vocation, to which God calls you, to love and serve Him on earth, as a spouse and parent — and to purify your soul, to prepare the soul for Heaven. Christ’s unseen Divine Love reigns, in the Sacrament of Matrimony– it is holy, and belongs to Him.
More weaponized ambiguity from Rome! Being a Francis apologist has to be one of the toughest jobs around. I think it is probably one of the reasons that Patrick Coffin left Catholic Answers.
No, I think the main reason Patrick Coffin left CA is because he was offered his own daily show on Immaculate Heart Radio, which he had for a little while. But then the merger with Relevant Radio came, and a bunch of shows on IH Radio had to be dropped, including his.
I’m feeling a bit schismatic myself now.
With all due respect to Archbishop Cordileone, a civil union as a facsimile of a marriage cannot be approved even given that other arrangements might be covered by it, unless it is a “civil partnership”. It’s clear Pope Francis meant the civil union law to apply to homosexual couples, as a form of union. This is wrong.
There is no such thing as marriage lite, if so the Church would have validated living in sin. No homosexual union can ever be sanctioned by the Catholic Church regardless of what it’s called. Even if there’s a wayward pope, the gates of hell will never prevail against her.
The producer of the documentary is relevant. Evgeny Afineevsky is not a Catholic. Afineevsky has previously created a comedy work about homosexuality entitled Oy Vey! My Son Is Gay!!. One of the main characters in this documentary is Juan Carlos Cruz. Cruz, who is gay, said that during his first meetings with the pope in May 2018, Francis assured him that God made Cruz gay. Is this a documentary or propaganda?
Should a Catholic, especially a Pope, allow a non-believer to edit and tell his story?
Sometimes words have meaning. Back in the mid to late ’90’s the gay community in San Francisco tried to pass a city law legalizing civil unions. The story goes something like this: The Archbishop would have none of it. The Mayor was summoned to the Chancery (that happened back then) for a discussion. The negotiation ended with a new definition of civil union. I then included whomever one might depend on for, let’s say, health insurance. A single woman and her mother could apply for civil union status, a man supporting a needy son could apply for civil union status. In other words, the law included more than just gays, and the law passed. So the gist of the story is that not all civil unions are just for gays. Words have meaning.
Bob One perhaps you need a remedial course in language arts, the Pope was directly referring to gays. The gist of story is once again you are trying to give cover to a view that is anti-Catholic.
Christiane Amanpour to Father James Martin S.J. October 21, 2020: “This must be a good day for you. You have been lobbying the Pope for thisand you’ve been wanting to see something like this.” Father Martin nods.
I’m afraid that people in the post-1960s modern era, are strangely used to being indulged with babyish, emotional “reasoning” and comfortable, “convenient,” outright, scandalous, babyish lies! Whereas in older eras, (such as when I was growing up) this nonsense would not be tolerated!! People were used to learning to think in true and exact terms, very maturely, from school days, and babyish thinking and reasoning was a sign of immaturity, corrected by adults. No one worried about “hurting your feelings,” with stating the truth– which, of course, is the reason that many weak leaders of today, go overboard and fall into the deep blue sea– coddling the wayward with lies, and trying to give them acceptance and love– the wrong way! The best leaders of religion and society are those who are strong with truth, well-developed in good character, and compassionate with sin and human weakness– and help the “wayward” grow in maturity and strength, with the help of God. You cannot run a family, or a church or a country, on lies, indulging human weakness, and sin, coddling the wayward (and coddling juvenile delinquents and criminals)– disaster results! Compassionate, “tough love,” strength, and honest, truthful, mature thinking and behavior, as well as mature leadership and guidance– are essential!
Pope Francis, an elderly Jesuit Pope, trained and ordained well before the Council– has never reflected true Jesuit formation and training! The Jesuits, born during the Counter-Reformation era, were once powerful, top-notch, rigorous, highly-skilled intellectual thinkers and educators, and their schools were highly-respected, worldwide! They were top-notch defenders of the Faith and of the Pope! After Vatican II, they fell into heresy and immorality, and a sharp decline.
Looks like it’s to the laity along with a remnant of a few good priests and bishops to save the Church!
Bob One, you misremember. It wasn’t about civil unions. It was about a city requirement to extend health insurance equivalent to what was offered to spouses of employees to same-sex companions of employees if an organization did business with or received money from the city; it was an early attempt to coerce businesses into treating same-sex partners as equivalent to spouses. The compromise that was reached between the city and the archdiocese said that an employee could designate any one household member to receive health insurance benefits equivalent to the spousal benefit; there was no specification of a particular relationship between employee and designated beneficiary other than they be domiciled together. That shifted the discussion away from homosexual unions to a general expansion of health benefits.
But beyond that, what you conveniently overlook is that the pope’s comments about civil unions were squarely and solely in the context of talking about homosexuals. So only homosexual unions were being referred to.
Kevin, Your memory is better than mine. t was an interesting time, though.
The Pope was only changing a noninfallible prudential judgement not a doctrinal statement (authoritative, si; infallible, no) of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith.
No, he did make a prudential judgement, he gave his personal opinion which changes nothing but the conversation. A man surrounded by homosexuals cannot help but be influenced by them and here is the rotten fruit of such accompaniment. His views are on the subject are beyond the bounds of Catholic moral teaching and the faithful have the right and duty to question him to his face.
The Pope has not changed anything.
to me, seem like you gotta stand
on yo’ head to square the pope’s
words with what the Church teaches
how can this man be the Vicar of The Man
who say:
“Let your yes be yes and
your no be no” ???
What most people find wrong is the word “union” as in most cultures that signifies a sexual union. Better that word left out, and single people deal with each situation on his/her own, without the rest of us being forced to approve.
For instance it is easy for anyone to go to a stationary shop, other store or on line to get a directive to fill out for ones health care. It is also easy to find documents for leaving ones property to whomever ones chooses. Usually all that is involved are two unrelated witnesses and a nortary public to witness and put an official stamp on it. Otherwise pay an attorney to fill out documents.
Re: my last post, single people should not get the same benefits as far as health insurance as a heterosexual married couple, as those laws were designed to encourage men and women to stay together in marriage to support any children they have, or might have, who have the right to the support of both a mother and a father.
Single people can always find a way to get insurance on their own. If one does have a child, then of course, they are entitled to tax deductions for the benefit of the child, but not benefits for some live in lover. Giving benefits to those who have no right to them, encourages heterosexual divorce.
Correction to second line from the last in my previous post: “If one does have a child, then of course, he or she is entitled to tax deductions for the benefit of the child”.
Unchaste homosexuals, uncommitted to Our Lord, in the clergy and laity– may as well give themselves up to the Lord! They are all cheating their souls out of Heaven– which Christ suffered and won for them, on His holy Cross!
I agree with the Cardinal that these represent the private thoughts of an individual catholic, not a change of doctrine. I do find it interesting though that an Archbishop who has never once done anything to recognize the legal rights of LGBT people or of “unmarried sisters and brothers’, suddenly thinks we should have civil unions. Let’s just be clear: BOTH men have done whatever they could to do degrade and damage LGBT people. They have both made a namve for themselves by degrading LGBT people and separating them from their civil rights.
Joe Biden officiated at a same sex wedding, that’s not Catholic. YFC, do you support same sex marriage?